Milk Price- Please read Mod note in post #1

freedominacup

Timmaay wrote: »

Kowtow explained before what is wrong with the processor system in Ireland fairly well, the co-ops should be fully decoupled from the processing side of things, a co-op should just be a collection of active dairyfarmers who team together to try and sell their milk at the best price, the processors would essentially bid for each co-ops milk. That in some sense sounds like what you have in France dwag? Where the processors are looking for milk off the farmers? What we currently have in Ireland are corporate monsters like Glanbia/dg, who have tied us all into 5year contracts, try force us to buy from theirown merchants, try to be our banks also, basically a one stop shop, but ultimately it's primarily interest is to make a profit for its shareholders.

Having said all that, talking to a self employed friend of mine the other night, we both concluded that chasing payment was the most soul destroying part of being self employed, and that's where I had a huge one up on him!

Chasing sales is if anything harder.

trixi2011

visatorro wrote: »

Never happen unfortunately. Iv said before paddy is a gob****e and doesn't seem to care what price he/she is getting. The amount of litres produced is all that matters. Glanbia know this.
Was told before that if nestle ever get into this country, forget about farming as a way of making a living

That's a strange one in the UK most milk producers would give there left arm to have a Nestl contract. The last few years Nestl contracted farms have had a top class milk price and also offer education opportunities for farmers and employees on there farms.

Farmer Ed

http://hopecentric.com/why-i-stopped-buying-kerrygold-butter/

Was only a matter of time before this started to happen. All this bull about quality assurance and not focussing on what really matters to the decerning customer. Just wait until the Germans cop that Kerrygold is not in the GM free fridge

Buford T. Justice XIX

Farmer Ed wrote: »

http://hopecentric.com/why-i-stopped-buying-kerrygold-butter/

Was only a matter of time before this started to happen. All this bull about quality assurance and not focussing on what really matters to the decerning customer. Just wait until the Germans cop that Kerrygold is not in the GM free fridge

So there was no problem with any allergy issues until they discovered that it wasn't 100% GM free and then there was a difficulty?

I'm wondering about what issues are actually present:rolleyes:

jaymla627

Farmer Ed wrote: »

http://hopecentric.com/why-i-stopped-buying-kerrygold-butter/

Was only a matter of time before this started to happen. All this bull about quality assurance and not focussing on what really matters to the decerning customer. Just wait until the Germans cop that Kerrygold is not in the GM free fridge

Out in spain here the last 5 days and what they pass as butter you'd rather use stork, blandless/tasteless/watery crap would be a good description, wouldn't be to worried 99% of people buy it for taste and aren't part of the vegan/anti-gm brigade

Dawggone

Timmaay wrote: »

Kowtow explained before what is wrong with the processor system in Ireland fairly well, the co-ops should be fully decoupled from the processing side of things, a co-op should just be a collection of active dairyfarmers who team together to try and sell their milk at the best price, the processors would essentially bid for each co-ops milk. That in some sense sounds like what you have in France dwag? Where the processors are looking for milk off the farmers? What we currently have in Ireland are corporate monsters like Glanbia/dg, who have tied us all into 5year contracts, try force us to buy from theirown merchants, try to be our banks also, basically a one stop shop, but ultimately it's primarily interest is to make a profit for its shareholders.

Having said all that, talking to a self employed friend of mine the other night, we both concluded that chasing payment was the most soul destroying part of being self employed, and that's where I had a huge one up on him!

Not entirely correct on the French Coops Tim.
The system that you describe was attempted by the French farmers but the Coops lost the rag and took it to court. The court ruled that Coops owned quotas and not the farmers. This has led to 'production rights' and the Coops now control the milk supply. However, the Coop separates the milk as a single entity and then sells it to its own processors that are actually it's subsidiaries iykwim....

That's the reason I get a milk price 3mts in advance.








Btw, the most soul destroying work I've ever done was going around trying to collect money from (dairy) farmers.

Farmer Ed

jaymla627 wrote: »

Out in spain here the last 5 days and what they pass as butter you'd rather use stork, blandless/tasteless/watery crap would be a good description, wouldn't be to worried 99% of people buy it for taste and aren't part of the vegan/anti-gm brigade

I wouldn't dismiss it so likely and if you were to think about it l logically, because we feed so little grain anyway, relative to other countries we have a competitive advantage if we were to complete for the GM free market.. Yes most people may buy on taste but people that buy kerrygold also pay a nice premium for it.

Timmaay

Dawggone wrote: »

Btw, the most soul destroying work I've ever done was going around trying to collect money from (dairy) farmers.

My self employed friend is in the construction business, the amount of money he is still chasing was scary 2bh. Builders going bust to wipe their hands free of their debts, and back up and trading afew days later, either cash in hand or working under mates tax clearance etc! The family dairyfarmers here in general tend to have a good reputation for paying up from what I've heard in general on the ground, always the few bad apples but ya get that in every business!

Dawggone

Timmaay wrote: »

My self employed friend is in the construction business, the amount of money he is still chasing was scary 2bh. Builders going bust to wipe their hands free of their debts, and back up and trading afew days later, either cash in hand or working under mates tax clearance etc! The family dairyfarmers here in general tend to have a good reputation for paying up from what I've heard in general on the ground, always the few bad apples but ya get that in every business!

When you're last and second last on the payment list (straw and silage contractor), grovelling and squirming become a way of life. Fact.

I wouldn't go back to that shyte even if it was profitable...

Addendum. I also grovelled in front Dunnes, Musgraves et al.
Bast*rds.

Doesn't happen here thanks be to feck.

Sold a round baler yesterday (first season, 3k bales) to a complete stranger from the Swiss border, took a cheque without even giving it a second thought. Priceless.

whelan2

Water John wrote: »

Very simple, the business exists for the benefit of management and shareholders, not suppliers of raw materials.

Not forgetting the farmer board members on 85k a pop. Handy money to have in your back pocket in a bad milk price year. Was talking to a dairy farmer today who reckons we need to get rid of these farmer board members and set up a 5 person price negotiating commitee who are on expenses only like the Lakelands farmer board members

OverRide

Well I had a repairman collecting his bill yesterday
He charged labour for two days because he was two days at it he said
Yeah I said 3hrs Thursday afternoon and 3hrs Friday and you did at least 2 other call outs both days aswell,did you charge them a full day's pay too I asked


Remind me again how much labour we charge our dairy processors for supplying them with milk?

Bass Reeves

OverRide wrote: »

Well I had a repairman collecting his bill yesterday
He charged labour for two days because he was two days at it he said
Yeah I said 3hrs Thursday afternoon and 3hrs Friday and you did at least 2 other call outs both days aswell,did you charge them a full day's pay too I asked


Remind me again how much labour we charge our dairy processors for supplying them with milk?

What did he charge and what did he do for you.

OverRide

€300 for work done on a baler,I got the parts myself
That's about €50 an hour...

Farmer Ed

OverRide wrote: »

€300 for work done on a baler,I got the parts myself
That's about €50 an hour...

Sorry for repeating myself but it all comes back to the fact that milk price has not kept in line with inflation. All our costs are rising but not milk price. If we were to get the same price now as 1989 when inflation is taken in to account, we would be getting 66cl in today's money.

Dawggone

Farmer Ed wrote: »

Sorry for repeating myself but it all comes back to the fact that milk price has not kept in line with inflation. All our costs are rising but not milk price. If we were to get the same price now as 1989 when inflation is taken in to account, we would be getting 66cl in today's money.

Dream on.


In '89 quota vastly skewed the market.


This is 2016, and intervention is vastly skewing the market, again.

Spoiled rotten...


Just to add...I'm going to see a 350ha tillage farm that's for sale this afternoon. Three years of low prices and hit with a double whammy this year...supposedly over 500ton of pink (fusarium) wheat dumped in the dungstead.

visatorro

OverRide wrote: »

€300 for work done on a baler,I got the parts myself
That's about €50 an hour...

Tbh that's the going rate for the likes of that. And I wouldn't blame a fella asking 50/ hour for routing at machinery on site.
It wouldn't be worth his while working otherwise.

Bass Reeves

OverRide wrote: »

€300 for work done on a baler,I got the parts myself
That's about €50 an hour...

That would be around the go of it. If he is VAT registered there is 6 euro in vat included. Even if not allow for an hour travel time both days that is an 8 hour. Then allow for his cost associated with tools, workshop ( even though he did not use it in your case) and van.

Farmer Ed

visatorro wrote: »

Tbh that's the going rate for the likes of that. And I wouldn't blame a fella asking 50/ hour for routing at machinery on site.
It wouldn't be worth his while working otherwise.

As I said we have just not kept in line with inflation and not just with milk. As farmers our work is not valued as skilled. The policy of cheep food is one that expects us to produce at below cost and be greatful for what ever social welfare payments we get from the Eu. Unfortunately by and large as dairy farmers or social welfare payment is generally not as large as other sectors as traditionaly we didn't need it. The big elephant in the room for all sectors is unlike others in society who depend on public money for survival, bfb Is not indexed linked.

At what point does it become impossible for us to pay the guy fixing the baler? The trend is undeniable. The economics of it are simple.

yosemitesam1

Farmer Ed wrote: »

As I said we have just not kept in line with inflation and not just with milk. As farmers our work is not valued as skilled. The policy of cheep food is one that expects us to produce at below cost and be greatful for what ever social welfare payments we get from the Eu. Unfortunately by and large as dairy farmers or social welfare payment is generally not as large as other sectors as traditionaly we didn't need it. The big elephant in the room for all sectors is unlike others in society who depend on public money for survival, bfb Is not indexed linked.

At what point does it become impossible for us to pay the guy fixing the baler? The trend is undeniable. The economics of it are simple.

The biggest problem for prices is there is too much land in the world for the amount of people to be fed, so unless you make a link to the end market it will always be a race to the bottom

Farmer Ed

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

The biggest problem for prices is there is too much land in the world for the amount of people to be fed, so unless you make a link to the end market it will always be a race to the bottom

I think you could be right. So maybe we need to think of ways of boxing more clever. I actually think that a lot of farmers and especially a lot of our supposed reprentitves suffer from the following condition, to the detriment of all of us. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grandiose_delusions

We need to wake up fast and come up with a better plan. Otherwise this year will not be a once off.

leg wax

when the farmer cant pay for the baler to be fixed he will go out and buy another because he thinks scale is the way to go more balers.......simple:o

Farmer Ed

Dawggone wrote: »

Dream on.


In '89 quota vastly skewed the market.


This is 2016, and intervention is vastly skewing the market, again.

Spoiled rotten...


Just to add...I'm going to see a 350ha tillage farm that's for sale this afternoon. Three years of low prices and hit with a double whammy this year...supposedly over 500ton of pink (fusarium) wheat dumped in the dungstead.

OK so the guy who had the farm lost his shirt and your thinking of buying it? You must have got great money from the baler you sold up near the Swiss border two days ago? Or did you win the lottery?

Dawggone

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

The biggest problem for prices is there is too much land in the world for the amount of people to be fed, so unless you make a link to the end market it will always be a race to the bottom

Exactly.

There was a lecturer from UCC on tv lately and he was saying that the planet is producing enough food for 9 billion (or was it 10?) people today.

If you're in the commodity game it's always a matter of scale, no matter what you're at...milk, oil, wheat, whatever.
So scale up or get out...or link up to the end user and produce something that they actually want.

Farmer Ed

Dawggone wrote: »

Exactly.

There was a lecturer from UCC on tv lately and he was saying that the planet is producing enough food for 9 billion (or was it 10?) people today.

If you're in the commodity game it's always a matter of scale, no matter what you're at...milk, oil, wheat, whatever.
So scale up or get out...or link up to the end user and produce something that they actually want.

So it would appear you are choosing the former. You better get a move on if your going to look at that farm. I suppose you could easily milk an extra 1000 cows if you buy it. No point in doing the same thing as the last man. That tillage seems to be a total loss maker when you exclude the Bfp

whelan2

visatorro wrote: »

Tbh that's the going rate for the likes of that. And I wouldn't blame a fella asking 50/ hour for routing at machinery on site.
It wouldn't be worth his while working otherwise.

Fair enough if the job is done right, was charged 170 euro labour here by a main dealer a few years ago. I would say 2 minutes he was in the yard and assumed I wasnt here, he didnt even do the job. Got a local guy to do it for 40 euro. I didnt pay the 170 euro, dealership said that it was an internal invoice sent to me by error:D

6270red

Dawggone wrote: »

Exactly.

There was a lecturer from UCC on tv lately and he was saying that the planet is producing enough food for 9 billion (or was it 10?) people today.

If you're in the commodity game it's always a matter of scale, no matter what you're at...milk, oil, wheat, whatever.
So scale up or get out...or link up to the end user and produce something that they actually want.

Your constantly banging the scale up or get out drum. You do realise this is Ireland not France.
How do you scale up if you are surrounded by farmers thinking the same thing. Where is a guy milking 100 cows going to get the money to buy another 100-200 acres of land to scale up as you say. Wouldn't be long going bust then.
Then you come on blowing about how your going to buy a tillage farm. Last month you were being offered a dairy farm with a big calf rearing unit. You then post that other people are talking rubbish when they disagree with you.
You can take offence to this post if you want some of your posts are excellent but your constant poo pooing of everyone else's opinions is starting to become a pain. No one likes a know it all.

yosemitesam1

Dawggone wrote: »

Exactly.

There was a lecturer from UCC on tv lately and he was saying that the planet is producing enough food for 9 billion (or was it 10?) people today.

If you're in the commodity game it's always a matter of scale, no matter what you're at...milk, oil, wheat, whatever.
So scale up or get out...or link up to the end user and produce something that they actually want.

If you were young and starting out again would you go down the same road or focus on low volume high price or avoid farming altogether?

Farmer Ed

6270red wrote: »

Your constantly banging the scale up or get out drum. You do realise this is Ireland not France.
How do you scale up if you are surrounded by farmers thinking the same thing. Where is a guy milking 100 cows going to get the money to buy another 100-200 acres of land to scale up as you say. Wouldn't be long going bust then.
Then you come on blowing about how your going to buy a tillage farm. Last month you were being offered a dairy farm with a big calf rearing unit. You then post that other people are talking rubbish when they disagree with you.
You can take offence to this post if you want some of your posts are excellent but your constant poo pooing of everyone else's opinions is starting to become a pain. No one likes a know it all.

This would be one way of scaling up.
http://www.bigfishgames.com/games/2466/virtual-farm-game/?pc

Waffletraktor

He says scale up or get out because there is no future for 75-90% of Irish farms.
In 20 years just like every other developed country you will have larger farms, part timer lifestyle blocks and abandonment of upland in productive areas unless some heavily subsidised enviro fund is in place.
Change is always a decade slower in Ireland, this is nothing new.

Farmer Ed

One things for sure if I didn't have my own farm no way would I work for another farmer.

Timmaay

6270red wrote: »

How do you scale up if you are surrounded by farmers thinking the same thing. Where is a guy milking 100 cows going to get the money to buy another 100-200 acres of land to scale up as you say. Wouldn't be long going bust then

Another 100/200 acres obv the extreme end, and will quickly make ya go bust, however how many farmers paid 10k+/ac for the likes of 30/40 acres over the last few years, if they are relying on agricultural return only to pay this back they are basically slowly going bust also!!

I've pushed on milk output the last few years here, up about 40% now. Stocked at 2.8lu/ha overall at the min, so simple as is more land is needed for any further expansion. Buying land at 10k/acre is the utterly last way that I will expand however, but there is plenty of tillage farmers around me who can grow maize/whole crop etc, alongside a reasonable amount of standing crops of silage. Expansion here will be achieved by stocking the milking block to the likes of 3.5cows/arce, and buy in all the winter fodder, alongside feeding in the shoulders when grazing is difficult and grass not up to scratch anyways. This, alongside increasing per cow yield to about 6500l will all allow me to increase milk output by another 80% on this year's figures. This will be a total increase of about 150% on our quota milk output, with no purchase of extra land. Do I want to go fully down this road I don't know ha (depends on the average milk price over the next few years, alongside labour etc), however I know by now that my two best options are either the likes of this, or just get out of dairying.

freedominacup

Waffletraktor wrote: »

He says scale up or get out because there is no future for 75-90% of Irish farms.
In 20 years just like every other developed country you will have larger farms, part timer lifestyle blocks and abandonment of upland in productive areas unless some heavily subsidised enviro fund is in place.
Change is always a decade slower in Ireland, this is nothing new.

I don't know if you're right waffle tbh. I thought the same thing twenty plus years ago and I've been proved wrong continuously since. We haven't got much beyond half the average UK herdsize in '96 at this stage. We're heading towards 70 now they were at 120 then. We did work exp back in the early nineties. Every second herd on the list was 300 cows. The small guy was milking 90 of the highest yielding cows in the UK at the time.

There's no doubt that at least 75% of farms have no viable future as commercial entities but that has been true for decades but nothing much has changed so far. Increases in farm size are going to take a while in areas like my own. The elder statesman dairy farmer is in his late fifties early sixties. Average herdsize is over 100. Farm size over 150acres owned and as many guys under forty running farms as over it. No one is going anywhere in terms of selling or retiring. But funnily enough it's hard to get much over 6k per acre for land when it comes up.

Waffletraktor

Farmer Ed wrote: »

One things for sure if I didn't have my own farm no way would I work for another farmer.

You should try working for someone who has no interest in farming their own farm then, if you have the required skill set. Or just play fs 2017... Or become bitter blame grandad for not buying you a bigger farm

Farmer Ed

Waffletraktor wrote: »

You should try working for someone who has no interest in farming their own farm then, if you have the required skill set. Or just play fs 2017... Or become bitter blame grandad for not buying you a bigger farm

No point being bitter. But no way would I work all hours for poor pay if it wasn't my own business. Easier ways to make a living. Large scare farming can only survive on cheap labour.

Waffletraktor

freedominacup wrote: »

I don't know if you're right waffle tbh. I thought the same thing twenty plus years ago and I've been proved wrong continuously since. We haven't got much beyond half the average UK herdsize in '96 at this stage. We're heading towards 70 now they were at 120 then. We did work exp back in the early nineties. Every second herd on the list was 300 cows. The small guy was milking 90 of the highest yielding cows in the UK at the time.

There's no doubt that at least 75% of farms have no viable future as commercial entities but that has been true for decades but nothing much has changed so far. Increases in farm size are going to take a while in areas like my own. The elder statesman dairy farmer is in his late fifties early sixties. Average herdsize is over 100. Farm size over 150acres and as many guys under forty running farms as over it. No one is going anywhere in terms of selling or retiring. But funnily enough it's hard to get much over 6k per acre for land when it comes up.

You will have pockets that are different but the tide is going one way only difference is the speed.
In the new reality for dairy, price will get back to a liveable amount but the peaks won't go so high or the dips as low when it settles down with variation being odd weather events etc.
There is absolutely no future in producing most your output for the bottom end of the market, in Western Europe or costs have gotten too high. We are entering a new space where max output doesn't equal max income until tech balances the equation or everyone else's gets more expensive

6270red

Timmaay wrote: »

Another 100/200 acres obv the extreme end, and will quickly make ya go bust, however how many farmers paid 10k+/ac for the likes of 30/40 acres over the last few years, if they are relying on agricultural return only to pay this back they are basically slowly going bust also!!

I've pushed on milk output the last few years here, up about 40% now. Stocked at 2.8lu/ha overall at the min, so simple as is more land is needed for any further expansion. Buying land at 10k/acre is the utterly last way that I will expand however, but there is plenty of tillage farmers around me who can grow maize/whole crop etc, alongside a reasonable amount of standing crops of silage. Expansion here will be achieved by stocking the milking block to the likes of 3.5cows/arce, and buy in all the winter fodder, alongside feeding in the shoulders when grazing is difficult and grass not up to scratch anyways. This, alongside increasing per cow yield to about 6500l will all allow me to increase milk output by another 80% on this year's figures. This will be a total increase of about 150% on our quota milk output, with no purchase of extra land. Do I want to go fully down this road I don't know ha (depends on the average milk price over the next few years, alongside labour etc), however I know by now that my two best options are either the likes of this, or just get out of dairying.

It's being a good few years of grass growth but buying in winter feed in this country is a risky game and eventually you'll get burnt.
It's being a bad period price wise. **** happens, I'll get through it like everyone else. I have no intention of going back to the job. You seem to have a lot of doubts about your profession, you mention on most posts about getting out.
How many years will you hang around because it'll come to a stage when going back to the job won't be an option.

farmerjj

Haven't read this thread in a long time, and it seems to me now that its no longer about milk price, it seems people just wanna ram there thoughts on what they predict the future to be down peoples throats, its a bit of a sham calling this thread milk price, should be moanie h**e corner, would suit it better at this stage

Waffletraktor

Farmer Ed wrote: »

Waffletraktor wrote: »

You should try working for someone who has no interest in farming their own farm then, if you have the required skill set. Or just play fs 2017... Or become bitter blame grandad for not buying you a bigger farm

No point being bitter. But no way would I work all hours for poor pay if it wasn't my own business. Easier ways to make a living. Large scare farming can only survive on cheap labour.

Skilled labour will ALWAYS be in demand and well paid, it depends who it is that is setting the mark at what they think skilled is

Farmer Ed

Waffletraktor wrote: »

Skilled labour will ALWAYS be in demand and well paid, it depends who it is that is setting the mark at what they think skilled is

IMO food production should earn at least amount of respect as pharmaceutical production. Show me a farm worker who is better paid and have a shorter working week than a pharmaceutical worker? If farming can't pay the farmer a good wage then it's unlikely a farmer can pay employees a good wage for any sustainable period of time. Each to there own but I couldn't see a lucrative future in it. the only successful farm managers i know have all moved on to bigger and better things.

Dawggone

6270red wrote: »

Your constantly banging the scale up or get out drum. You do realise this is Ireland not France.
How do you scale up if you are surrounded by farmers thinking the same thing. Where is a guy milking 100 cows going to get the money to buy another 100-200 acres of land to scale up as you say. Wouldn't be long going bust then.
Then you come on blowing about how your going to buy a tillage farm. Last month you were being offered a dairy farm with a big calf rearing unit. You then post that other people are talking rubbish when they disagree with you.
You can take offence to this post if you want some of your posts are excellent but your constant poo pooing of everyone else's opinions is starting to become a pain. No one likes a know it all.

Use the ignore button...

Dawggone

yosemitesam1 wrote: »

If you were young and starting out again would you go down the same road or focus on low volume high price or avoid farming altogether?

Avoid.

But then I'm a sucker for punishment.

Timmaay

6270red wrote: »

It's being a good few years of grass growth but buying in winter feed in this country is a risky game and eventually you'll get burnt.
It's being a bad period price wise. **** happens, I'll get through it like everyone else. I have no intention of going back to the job. You seem to have a lot of doubts about your profession, you mention on most posts about getting out.
How many years will you hang around because it'll come to a stage when going back to the job won't be an option.

I suppose I'm eternally on the fence and an optimist about my future prospects outside of farming ha. In terms of going back to "the job", I know for one I'll never take another 9 to 5 office job working for whatever souless company, but there are several other areas that I'll happily get my teeth stuck into. Then again I'm not tidy down with family etc which obviously makes a huge difference. On buying in fodder, I'd disagree, you build up loyalty over time with afew different fodder suppliers, I had a deal done for 21 acres 1st cut next year already, I always have the pit of silage carried forward also as insurance, if I'm going to get burnt it will be a small fraction of my winter supply. This obviously isn't for everyone, but it's certainly a very viable expansion option once you are some way off the 3.5cows/ha on the grazing block, and alot better than having to snap up land at 10k/acre.

Dawggone

Waffletraktor wrote: »

There is absolutely no future in producing most your output for the bottom end of the market, in Western Europe or costs have gotten too high. We are entering a new space where max output doesn't equal max income until tech balances the equation or everyone else's gets more expensive

Exactly.

Any commodity producer works on volume and a small margin.
Half the milk I produce goes for a fairly high end cheese that's consumed by the natives, the other half goes for baby formula to the Chinese market.

Only 61ha of commodity wheat this year (zero next year) the rest was milling. All maize is either for home use or is grown on contract for an end user...

Water John

I have a 'mental' ignore button which I have activated long ago for some on this thread.
A dairy farm unit of the farmer plus contracting in services must be a viable entity. That is not a 90 hour week.
That is the optimum size.
It needs an average milk price of at least 35 cent including solids to justify.

Back to the old song, getting larger is not equivalent to getting efficient.
One just needs a certain size to be viable.

Dawggone

Water John wrote: »

I have a 'mental' ignore button which I have activated long ago for some on this thread.
A dairy farm unit of the farmer plus contracting in services must be a viable entity. That is not a 90 hour week.
That is the optimum size.
It needs an average milk price of at least 35 cent including solids to justify.

Back to the old song, getting larger is not equivalent to getting efficient.
One just needs a certain size to be viable.

+1.

But if you're producing milk that's being processed into a bottom end commodity, you're going to need either 1. a very simple lifestyle or 2. an extremely low cost of production.

Water John

I accept the cheese angle in your case Dawgone but the infant formula is not a commodity product either.
For many in Ireland half their milk is going into infant formula but farmers are only getting base commodity price. Every one else in the chain is declaring high profits each subsequent year, no matter what the product price is.

6270red

Timmaay wrote: »

I suppose I'm eternally on the fence and an optimist about my future prospects outside of farming ha. In terms of going back to "the job", I know for one I'll never take another 9 to 5 office job working for whatever souless company, but there are several other areas that I'll happily get my teeth stuck into. Then again I'm not tidy down with family etc which obviously makes a huge difference. On buying in fodder, I'd disagree, you build up loyalty over time with afew different fodder suppliers, I had a deal done for 21 acres 1st cut next year already, I always have the pit of silage carried forward also as insurance, if I'm going to get burnt it will be a small fraction of my winter supply. This obviously isn't for everyone, but it's certainly a very viable expansion option once you are some way off the 3.5cows/ha on the grazing block, and alot better than having to snap up land at 10k/acre.

You might have that fodder now but I still have nightmares about the line of tractors outside the coop waiting for €100 bales of straw in 2012- 2013.
When **** hits the fan some ruthless lad will pay more then you for that silage.
Better looking at it then for it.

rangler1

Timmaay wrote: »

I suppose I'm eternally on the fence and an optimist about my future prospects outside of farming ha. In terms of going back to "the job", I know for one I'll never take another 9 to 5 office job working for whatever souless company, but there are several other areas that I'll happily get my teeth stuck into. Then again I'm not tidy down with family etc which obviously makes a huge difference. On buying in fodder, I'd disagree, you build up loyalty over time with afew different fodder suppliers, I had a deal done for 21 acres 1st cut next year already, I always have the pit of silage carried forward also as insurance, if I'm going to get burnt it will be a small fraction of my winter supply. This obviously isn't for everyone, but it's certainly a very viable expansion option once you are some way off the 3.5cows/ha on the grazing block, and alot better than having to snap up land at 10k/acre.

Hard to see a margin for the silage supplier, wonder what does he reckon as to how much fertiliser is going out the gate in 21 acres grass,
Will he look back in five tears and say WTF happened my field

Dawggone

Water John wrote: »

I accept the cheese angle in your case Dawgone but the infant formula is not a commodity product either.
For many in Ireland half their milk is going into infant formula but farmers are only getting base commodity price. Every one else in the chain is declaring high profits each subsequent year, no matter what the product price is.

Very true.

We're suckers for punishment...

6270red

Dawggone wrote: »

Use the ignore button...

Maybe take the friendly advice.....