CYMC Hall Philipsburgh Ave D3 turning to pub?

Andre Salmon

A neighbour told me that there are rumours there is a pub license being transferred to the CYMC hall and it will be changed into a "super pub".
Was news to me although I noticed work being done outside recently.
I don't like the sound of this, Live very close by so potential noise & nuisance.
Also after all the trouble with the players lounge down the road.

Anyone heard anything?

Mr Simpson

I really doubt it, I haven't heard anything about it either.

Andre Salmon

It sounds far fetched alright.

schemingbohemia

Presumably they would have to apply for planning permission for change of use? So have a look at the dublin city council online planning applications?

Mr Simpson

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Presumably they would have to apply for planning permission for change of use? So have a look at the dublin city council online planning applications?

Good idea, there's nothing on DCC site about it

Andre Salmon

schemingbohemia wrote: »

Presumably they would have to apply for planning permission for change of use? So have a look at the dublin city council online planning applications?

Thanks, Good idea. Nothing showing up so.
Maybe its not the end of the Billie Barry's after all!

pcasso

I have heard, second hand, that the Super in Clontarf Garda station said that there had been an application for a pub licence for the CYMC.
I would be very worried about it becoming a venue similar to the way Westwood was used as a niteclub.

Mr Simpson

As said, there would need to be a planning app, before a liquor licence could be applied for, there hasn't been one.

pcasso

Perhaps because they are only looking for a change from club to pub licence there isn't a requirement by law to seek a planning application.
I don't know, just speculating.
I don't doubt that the Super in Clontarf said this to my friend.
He may have been wrong somehow I guess.
Something is definitely going on there though

Andre Salmon

If they were transferring a pub licence from a country pub to the CYMC would it mean they don't have to apply?
Seemingly the club had a small bar there . I never went in

Westwood 2, yikes. That's worse then the thought of the players lounge

Mr Simpson

You always have to apply. Its not a case of transferring. Its just an existing licence must be exchanged for a new licence to be issued.

To apply for a licence, planning permission for change of use must be granted. Fire Warden must also give certificate, and the local Gardai must not object to it either.

Andre Salmon

I met someone who lives across the road from the cymc and asked them did they have any info. They said someone bought the building, was planning to open a pub of some type. They had builders already working on it.
The application for licence went in today but was immediately opposed as a few local residents had already formed a committee of sorts.
They were talking to one of the builders today

pcasso

I am not crazy about the idea of it being converted to a pub but if it is just a "local" then I guess it could be a lot worse.
I do worry though, that at a time when pubs are struggling to get the punters in, and with the area not exactly suffering from a dearth of drinking establishments, it will end up being something more than a local.
The local residents committee is very active and vigilant and I would expect them to oppose any significant change of use of the CYMC

January

Is it possible they were looking for a temporary licence? I don't know the area very well and have only had reason to be there recently because my father in law is in a medical facility around the area but it doesn't look like the best place for a pub!

pcasso

January wrote: »

Is it possible they were looking for a temporary licence? I don't know the area very well and have only had reason to be there recently because my father in law is in a medical facility around the area but it doesn't look like the best place for a pub!

As you say it is far from being the ideal location or building for a pub.
I think that is why people locally are concerned as they are worried that the end result will be something a lot more than simply a local.
The lack of communication from the developer is only fueling the concerns

bbbbb

Some more background here:
http://www.fairview-marino.com/fairview-cy-changes

Mr Simpson

Hmmm, thats a strange one, thanks for the update.

Apply for licence, then seek planning. Smacks of someone trying to keep it quiet imo. Also strange, as your licence needs to be approved by the fire officer, and the officer would have to approve it as the layout it will be operating under.

pcasso

Thanks for the further information bbbbb.
Nothing I have read so far allays my concerns as to the intentions of the new owner of the CYMC and what the premises will eventually become.
I am assuming that it will be a late night pub at the very least and will attract ongoing problems for local residents similar to those associated with "Bar Code" when it was operating in nearby Westwood.

spurious

I wouldn't under-estimate the power of the Phillipsburgh Avenue locals in terms of objecting to planning permission, change of use, parking restrictions etc..

This one could run and run - and those people vote, so watch the TDs and councillors scurry.

Rascasse

I wondered why they were chopping the tree's down when drove past the other day.

I very much doubt anyone would get a license to turn it in to a nightclub as it's in a residential area (and probably far too small anyway). The place already has a bar and does 21st's etc in the hall, are they a problem now?

pcasso

The occasional birthday party celebration is a far cry from the late night bar revelers spilling out onto the street every Thursday Friday and Saturday night.
The hall, spread over two floors, is substantial enough already with I would estimate enough room to accommodate a couple of hundred people easy enough and with loads of room for expansion if required.

Andre Salmon

I bumped into a guy I know over the weekend who has previously owned pubs and restaurants. I was telling him about the situation and he said in his experience the fact that there is already a bar licence (for the club). The application will be allowed even with objections. Hopefully not.

pcasso

I have contacted my local representatives and one of them has informed me that a licence has been applied for through the courts, with a new hearing in May and is not being opposed by the local Gardai.

pcasso

Just a little bit more background information for anyone interested.

Basically the CYMC club at an EGM in Febraury voted to dissolve their club as and from March 31st.
The pitch and putt section of the old CYMC has reconstituted itself into a new club.
The land that the pitch and putt course is on, was leased from Dublin City Council in a ninety nine year agreement signed in 1984. The old CYMC club had asked to surrender the lease back to DCC and the newly constituted Pitch and Putt club have asked to be granted the use of the grounds on a new lease.
However the owner of the CYMC hall is disputing this, claiming that he/she in fact owns the entire property, lease and all.
This appears to be contrary to the terms of the original lease signed in 1984.

The owner of the CYMC does indeed plan to tun it into a pub, taking down the railings at the front, providing a number of parking spaces there and establishing a new entrance way at the front into the building.
Interestingly, according to the map from the original lease, the side vehicular access to the rear of the building does not belong to the hall but the pitch and putt grounds. The ownership of it and the pitch and putt grounds are as already said seemingly under dispute.

Having comunicated with a local Councillor he is of the opinion that it is quite possible that the ultimate intention is to convert the old CYMC hall into a late night pub not unlike the old Bar Code in the Westwood complex

Andre Salmon

Thanks pcasso. Another bar code style place is very worrying indeed.
I contacted the residence association to add my name to objection list.
As the next hearing is mid May I suppose we will find out soon enough

Bungy Girl

pcasso wrote: »

taking down the railings at the front

Probably so we've nothing to chain ourselves to :rolleyes:

I live nearby and would be very concerned at the intended changes. I have contacted the residents association to add my name to the list of those opposed. The more locals that know about this the better - I can't imagine anyone being in favour and hopefully the courts will take that into consideration. I wonder is there even a precedent for establishing a full-licence pub in an existing residential area ? The closest houses are only metres away.

Imagine the scenes on GAA match days :eek:

cson

Bungy Girl wrote: »

Imagine the scenes on GAA match days :eek:

I don't know if you'd get that big a crowd, its well off the beaten path. Maybe Dubs might go but I'd be willing to bet anything no country folk would. The Quinns/Ryans/Big Tree trinity is well burned into the psyche there.

pcasso

There was a meeting about this last night in the Fairview parish hall.
It was poorly attended but I suspect that was down to poor publicity and few knew about it.
I wasn't able to go myself but my wife went.
There was little new information given out at the meeting other than to confirm what we already know.
It appears that the owners of the former CYMC hall have substantial funds behind them as they have engaged Constance Cassidy, who is apparently the top licencing barrister in the country, to represent them.
There was some speculation as to who the new owners are and a name that cropped up was one of the few that seems to be making profits and expanding within the pub industry in Dublin.
If you think about it for a while you will probably get it right.

It is going to be one hell of an uphill battle to prevent this superpub/niteclub from going ahead. There was a feeling at the meeting that once the pub is up and running it will be next to impossible to close. They cited the example of Bar Code in Westwood which apparently operated for eight years without a proper licence.
There is another meeting at the same venue next Wednesday at 8.15pm. A big attendance would I feel send out a strong message to the developers and the planners.

cson

pcasso wrote: »

There was some speculation as to who the new owners are and a name that cropped up was one of the few that seems to be making profits and expanding within the pub industry in Dublin.
If you think about it for a while you will probably get it right.

Wow, that's bad news for you if it is who we all think it is. Licensing laws don't appear to apply to his other ventures in town so you assume this'll be no different.

Strange place to put a #2 version of the oft famous niteclub though. Close to Croker maybe? I'm struggling to find a genuine reason to lamp a late bar or nightclub in a mainly residential area.

pcasso

cson wrote: »

Wow, that's bad news for you if it is who we all think it is. Licensing laws don't appear to apply to his other ventures in town so you assume this'll be no different.

Strange place to put a #2 version of the oft famous niteclub though. Close to Croker maybe? I'm struggling to find a genuine reason to lamp a late bar or nightclub in a mainly residential area.

Well apparently when they were asked as to how they expected to generate business when most of the local pubs were struggling to attract customers the reply was that the customers would be bused in.
So it seems that the location is irrelevant, it is simply about having the venue.
I am very pessimistic about the local's chances of stopping this happening.
Having lived here for twenty five years it will probably be enough to make me move.

Andre Salmon

I attended the meeting, there were some good suggestions as to how to proceed and inform more people in the area.
Lack of information is very frustrating. I missed the comment about who the publican might be, still unsure.
Maybe Constance Cassidy's own legal woes might distract her from this.