Recorded without consent

fatboypee

I was recorded on a conference call today by a 3 rd party project manager employed by a client.The call recording was then used by his employer who emailed it to my boss.

The recording was of a call that got quite heated on both sides. I was in no way rude or used bad language and although angry I was not disrespectful. Boss is right behind me but I'm incensed about this.what makes it worse I still have to work with this guy to close out the project. Right now I'm thinking of asking if I'm being recorded next time .. part of me wants to talk to a solicitor about it. Am so annoyed.

What would you do ? Let it blow over ?

Thanks


Fbp

Chattastrophe!

What difference does it make that you were recorded. You said what you said; you can either stand over it or ... not.

If anything, it's a good thing that the discussion was recorded. No one can put words in your mouth.

Why would it make any difference that, in this case, what you said was recorded?

Dicky Pride

Tlachtga wrote: »

What difference does it make that you were recorded. You said what you said; you can either stand over it or ... not.

If anything, it's a good thing that the discussion was recorded. No one can put words in your mouth.

Why would it make any difference that, in this case, what you said was recorded?

Well I can think of two reasons. I can assume that the OP doesn't like the person who went to the bother of recording the call so he'd like nothing more than to throw a solicitor's letter in his face.

And he'd be within his rights because recording someone's conversation like that, without their consent is illegal under the 1983 Postal and Telecommunications Services act.

crazygeryy

i think it does make a difference.you should have been told this conversation was being recorded.i wouldn't say there is much you can do about it now ,but by all means no one can object if you ask am i being recorded the next time.and its good that your boss is on your side.

every customer service number you ring now always says this conversation is being recorded for training purposes.it's not just for training that's for sure.

i don't know the law on it but I'm sure you should have been told it was being recorded.

mari2222

I think it would be worth an initial consultation with a solicitor - after all, the person who recorded you ,without permission, subsequently broadcast the recording to other people and this broadcast being so selective, your reputation may have suffered. Nor do you know what future use may be made of the recording - it could turn up on a website for instance....

whomitconcerns

a 3rd party that you dont work for recorded a conversation you had with them and then tried to use it for/against you with your boss....I think I would be getting legal advice depending on exactly what i would gain/lose and what was in the call...

JustAThought

3rd part project manager recorded your call & it was heated & Your boss is right behind you - well that's a good start-keep him/her onside.

Recorded calls are iinadmissible ( to demonstrate points) in the Employees Unfair Dismissal Tribunal.

I'd be wondering who this third party was stealth recording & why they felt it necessary to record a call . Maybe they've been in big trouble before? hardly professional or normal work behaviour.

I'd keep work & the project onside & not be compromising the project. You don't want anyone saying you're difficult or that the working relationship is unworkable .
I'd look to make a light but firm complaint by email to your boss about this 3rd party & their work practices - particularly given they made video?/ audio recordings without your permission & without you being notified & having the option to withdraw. Ask your boss to communicate with their boss to ensure this unorthodox & highly unsavoury work paracice is stopped & ask for a copy of the tape or confirmation that it & all copies have been destroyed. You are also asking for confirmation that this work practice is stopped and not repeated as it is a breech of your trust and dignity at work & is highly unwelcome & irregular.
( they will know its illegal - just don't go shouting this as it will make you sound irrational & difficult- irregular will cover it).

Don't go down the road of solicitors. Put your complaint quietly in writing to your boss so s/he can use it. However bear in mind that the project and costs spent on it already may be much more important to someone higher than two PMs who are having conflict. And the 3rd party will loose a lot more financially by being wrong so will fight a lot harder.

It kind of depends on lots of things how this is resolved - involving a solicitor won't make you a winner .
You need to appear reasonable & professional & capable of continuing to work with this 3rd party who along with you I assume are providing a needed service to deliver the project. Write your email , cc yourself and send a copy later to your home email in case you need it. The contractor sounds like a bit of an idiot but scared- maybe they're terrified of loosing their job/contract or are too inexperienced to know the consequences of what they did.

Irish_Elect_Eng

A couple of points:

Many if not all good teleconference services offer a single click recording service for teleconferences. There are many reasons for this, anything from making it easier to minute meetings afterwards to recording decisions made for legal reasons.

I use a service that offers this facility,but rarely use it as I don't have the time to listen to 4-hour meeting in my free time:-) But occasionally I will use it if a key meeting attendee is not present to share the meeting with them.

I think that the use of this sort of recording is covered in the T&C of the service itself, but I also inform people in the meeting invite if I am going to record the meeting for distribution to an absentee. This is completely acceptable in the company that I work for. But it may vary from company to company.

Also,if the third part was in another country then it may be totally legal at their end.

Stay away from the legal route, it may make you feel good for a short while, but it may have long term impact on your career if you cannot be seen to work with people, even difficult ones then that will not look good for you career-wise as a project manager.

Use this as an opportunity to show your boss that he was right to back you and be a professional in closing out the project, bringing money into the company.

LegacyUser

I understand how you feel about this. If your boss is behind you I would not worry about the guy who did this. At least you did not tell this guy to f*** o** or something of this nature.

Your boss knows what you did and said here. You can show your boss that despite what this guy did, that you still have the ability to deal with him and bring in the business to your company.
I would just say to your boss I was not aware that he was recording me and I know that he should have asked me could he record our call. Your boss may be in a position to say something to this guys boss but your better off letting them say something about this.
This will show your boss that can deal with a hard customer/bring in the business.

If your boss is happy with you at the moment you need to keep it this way.
Going down the solicitors letter route will get back to your boss and could lose the company business. Your boss will then think what will you do next if I send him out to x,y,z?
If things get tight or the work volume falls you don't want your boss thinking now is my chance to cut (your name) hours or to let you go if they had trouble with you in the past.

You have to consider also that if you want to move on in the company or to another position at a later time you don't want to burn your bridges now. Also you never know where you will meet people again.

RainyDay

Dicky Pride wrote: »

And he'd be within his rights because recording someone's conversation like that, without their consent is illegal under the 1983 Postal and Telecommunications Services act.

I wouldn't be so sure. It may not have involved an Irish telecoms line. It could well be a VOIP over private networks. Does that Act apply to such services?

Regardless, it is ridiculous to suggest going down the legal route at this stage. First question to ask is what is the relationship between the OPs company and the 3rd party's company. Is one side customer of the other side? This has a big impact.

There is a trust issue here for future team working. Any team needs to be able to trust each other on basic issues like this. There should be a simple, clear protocol up front about how calls are managed, including recording or not.

Mrs OBumble

JustAThought wrote: »

... this unorthodox & highly unsavoury work paracice is stopped & ask for a copy of the tape or confirmation that it & all copies have been destroyed. You are also asking for confirmation that this work practice is stopped and not repeated as it is a breech of your trust and dignity at work & is highly unwelcome & irregular.

Great advice - apart from the bit above.

Recording contentious meetings or phone calls is not a breech of anyone's dignity, if anything it helps to ensure that behaviour stays dignified. It's a totally normal practise, carried out in lots of places every day, for all sorts of reasons.

Asking for a copy of the "tape" makes you look like you're still living in the 20th century - sheesh, they'd probably have to buy a machine to cut one just to give it to you!


IMHO the only thing the OP should do is ask for confirmation that all future meetings are recorded, and for all participants to receive copies of the recording.

fatboypee

Morning all.

I must apologise for my lack of input so far, however I do want to say thank you to everyone who replied. I appreciate all the comments and the advice and I must say it has essentially re-affirmed my position that I need to move on and let it blow over (however much it pains me) and as said, confirm the faith this company has in my by closing out the project in a professional manner.

Again, much appreciate the advice.

FBP.

rgmmg

fatboypee wrote: »

Morning all.

I must apologise for my lack of input so far, however I do want to say thank you to everyone who replied. I appreciate all the comments and the advice and I must say it has essentially re-affirmed my position that I need to move on and let it blow over (however much it pains me) and as said, confirm the faith this company has in my by closing out the project in a professional manner.

Again, much appreciate the advice.

FBP.

Good man - congrats on seeing past the red mist - your's is the best approach imo. Next time you are in a meeting you should pull out a hand held video camera each time he talks for the laugh :pac:

wallycharlo

OP, did you use a conference bridge service from someone such as Cisco, etc, and if so who owns this bridge (i.e. your company or your client)?

I would always take the assumption that whoever owns the bridge could be recording conf calls, as already pointed our above this is very easy to do these days, for playback afterwards.

In fact I'm pretty sure that some companies may even record conf calls on their own bridges by default.

ifah

wallycharlo wrote: »

I would always take the assumption that whoever owns the bridge could be recording conf calls, as already pointed our above this is very easy to do these days, for playback afterwards.

I would agree with the above and add that you may already have given consent when you signed your contract with company - it's common that a company's usage policies cover both email and voice communications with clients - you don't own them, they do.

keithclancy

In Ireland it's not admissible as evidence in a court afaik.

Here in Germany its a heavy penalty for the company and the employee who recorded the call without others consent (would be dismissed immediately)

When I worked at one particular Irish company (A Large American multinational) the Company policy was that if you were notified that you were being recorded to just end the call immediately and consult your line manager.

the_syco

fatboypee wrote: »

The recording was of a call that got quite heated on both sides.

If your boss has your back, I'd talk to your boss to see if ye can figure out what angel the 3rd party is working, as it seems the person pushed your buttons to get a reaction all the time knowing they was recording the conversation.

Irish_Elect_Eng wrote: »

but I also inform people in the meeting invite if I am going to record the meeting for distribution to an absentee.

Saying that you are recording the conversation up front is usually cool, but I think the problem is that the OP didn't find out about the recording until the call was produced.

kippy

the_syco wrote: »

If your boss has your back, I'd talk to your boss to see if ye can figure out what angel the 3rd party is working, as it seems the person pushed your buttons to get a reaction all the time knowing they was recording the conversation.


Saying that you are recording the conversation up front is usually cool, but I think the problem is that the OP didn't find out about the recording until the call was produced.

Yeah, you'd wonder about the motivation and planned use of the recording by the third party and their employer.

wallycharlo

OP, my advice going forward would be always assume that you may well be recorded, and conduct yourself accordingly on the call. Legality aside, you should not be putting yourself in a situation regardless where you are saying something on the call which you a are not willing to fully stand by afterwards.