Training and diet advise needed for a unique case!

2Cando

Howdy,

I'm looking for the training and diet advice for the upcoming summer and race season but my parameters are quite unique, odd and difficult for me to analyse. I'm just going to explain my scenario and hopefully someone can help me out!

Basically, I'm a rugby player who has been cycling for the last 4 year. Generally playing rugby over the winter months and cycling throughout the summer partaking in lots of sportives but no races until a few weeks ago. But I've now decided to give up rugby to focus solely on cycling.

I'm looking for a training plan that will help me loose my rugby 'weight' and become a lean cyclist. Obviously it won't happen quickly. But I have 3 months this summer of hanging around home so I'll have access to a structured setting with proper food, reasonably nice weather and both hills and flats to train on. I don't have a solid base of endurance from over the winter months, but I have gone for a few spins (70km-ish) and I commute everyday into college (around 25mins return) so I'm not starting from scratch. I started racing with my college 3 weeks ago and have done 3 races. In the first one, I was dropped but finished the 70km circuit. Second one, got dropped on the hills but managed to bridge back to the peloton. In my third, I came 12th in a uphill drag sprint after 70km. So as I said, I do have some legs.

Essentially, I want to loose my extra weight and build a base over the summer, or should I be trying another structure? I weigh 98kg and am 190cm tall (15.5 stones & 6ft 2inch), not fat but chunky! I'll be in Brussels, Belgium, over the 3 months as well and will have access to races and sportives.
Also, what sort of diet should I be focusing on? A loosing weight diet, I presume, would leave me without much energy for training? Or just have a structured diet?

Thanks a lot for any advice. I've tried looking for training and diet plans, but it's hard to find one that suits me, changing sports (with very different body types!) at a time when I should already have a good base and be ready to race.

If you have any specific questions for me ask away!

kenmc

Go travelling for a year, through Asia and China. I lost 20kg doing this and went from a 95kg front-rower to a 75kg cyclist.
Hope this helps

colm_gti

I think I was chatting to your dad at the finish line of one of the Balbriggan races....?

I made a similar transition last year...played rugby for ~15 years on and off at a high enough level. Like you I was roughly 98kgs at 6'2" (played any position between 4 and 8). Dislocated my shoulder in October 2010 and that was the straw that broke the camels back, hung up the boots and packed it in. Bought a bike when I recovered and started cycling to keep fit, joined a club and, well...slippery slope...next thing I know I'm racing. I started mid-season, so a lot of lads were already fit, first race was a bit of a hole opener. It's still early in the season now, so it'll be more of a level playing field as far as you're concerned. 70kms is longer than most A4 races you'll do, so wouldn't worry about your base endurance, and you'll have a good level of that already from rugby. You should have a good bit of power in your legs too though, use that to your advantage!!

Unfortunately there is no quick way to loose that sort of muscle mass, especially if you're broad enough to start with. I didn't really watch my diet too closely, just ate balanced meals. I raced every race I could get to, and trained 2 or 3 times during the week. Roughly a year since I started cycling, I'm now at about 85kgs and still struggling to stay with the climbers going uphill, but getting slightly faster at the same time. I've started watching my diet a bit closer, cut out sugar and trying to get to 80kgs, without losing any power.

Like I said, use your power to your advantage. I used to just go to races because they were close to me, and have done that a few times this year. Or went to races because the rest of the club were going, even though they didn't suit me. They'll get you stronger in aspects you're weak at, but if you want to upgrade you've gotta be cute about it.

Hope this helps you somewhat...

petethedrummer

There will be a few options suggested
1. Count calories. Guess what you need daily. Guess the number you are taking in, Guess the number that is going out and hope you start losing weight by creating a deficit. Start writing down what you eat every day, perhaps log it on a website. great fun.

2. Go on a low fat diet and feel miserable and feel increasingly hungry, more run down and weak.

3. Eat as you are. Go on massive training rides in the hope of burning off more than you consumed over the last few days. Come home ravenously hungry. Probably eat it all back again.

4. Figure out your zones, with a heart rate meter or however its done. Go on training rides in your fat burning zone while strapped to your heart rate monitor.

5 (the mad man shouting in the street option, of which I am an exponent). Reduce your carb/sugar intake. Because that's what actually what makes a person gain weight (the extent of the gain is governed by genetics, not a weak will). Increase saturated fat intake to properly sate hunger.

pprendeville

myfitnesspal app will help with calorie counting and you might like to try a coach for a diet if you want to get a proper structured weight loss and cycling prep program going.

petethedrummer

pprendeville wrote: »

myfitnesspal app will help with calorie counting and you might like to try a coach for a diet if you want to get a proper structured weight loss and cycling prep program going.

Can you eat any type of calorie on the calorie counting method?

chester3455

Look up the cyclocore videos on youtube the dude on it is a bulky build too and give great advice on losing weight and training.

2Cando

colm_gti wrote: »

I think I was chatting to your dad at the finish line of one of the Balbriggan races....?

I made a similar transition last year...played rugby for ~15 years on and off at a high enough level. Like you I was roughly 98kgs at 6'2" (played any position between 4 and 8). Dislocated my shoulder in October 2010 and that was the straw that broke the camels back, hung up the boots and packed it in. Bought a bike when I recovered and started cycling to keep fit, joined a club and, well...slippery slope...next thing I know I'm racing. I started mid-season, so a lot of lads were already fit, first race was a bit of a hole opener. It's still early in the season now, so it'll be more of a level playing field as far as you're concerned. 70kms is longer than most A4 races you'll do, so wouldn't worry about your base endurance, and you'll have a good level of that already from rugby. You should have a good bit of power in your legs too though, use that to your advantage!!

Unfortunately there is no quick way to loose that sort of muscle mass, especially if you're broad enough to start with. I didn't really watch my diet too closely, just ate balanced meals. I raced every race I could get to, and trained 2 or 3 times during the week. Roughly a year since I started cycling, I'm now at about 85kgs and still struggling to stay with the climbers going uphill, but getting slightly faster at the same time. I've started watching my diet a bit closer, cut out sugar and trying to get to 80kgs, without losing any power.

Like I said, use your power to your advantage. I used to just go to races because they were close to me, and have done that a few times this year. Or went to races because the rest of the club were going, even though they didn't suit me. They'll get you stronger in aspects you're weak at, but if you want to upgrade you've gotta be cute about it.

Hope this helps you somewhat...

Thanks for the advice! But you weren't talking to my Dad! I thought that would happen with trying to lose mass, it'll take time. I'd be more interested in losing 'fat' weight over the summer then trying to lose muscle mass, want to keep the power!
Unfortunately, I'm in exam mode at the moment and can't do much riding and racing for around 3 weeks.
I do have quite a lot of power and am very strong on the flats, being able to maintain high speed (after all that mass has to be good for something!), but when the mountains come...
The diet advice I got was using a low GI food diet, so I'll try and follow that over the summer and see what happens!

Jawgap

I followed the same route, rugby to cycling and no one has given you the most important piece of advice.......


.......only shave your legs once you are absolutely sure the rugby season is over and you don't have to into the dressing rooms until at least September:D

Seaneh

howya,

I'm a big fecker (5'9, 110kg+) and was chatting to an american lad I know who races a lot recently and he recommended yoga to me for a few reasons.
He reckons that for a big lad coming into cycling core strength needs to be worked on a lot to improve your position on the bike so as your weight is being supported by your core instead of all the weight going through your arms and hands into the handlebars, you will have less pain in your shoulders and hands and back and with your core engaged properly will be burning even more carlories per ride.

He also reckons Yoga is really good for burning fat, I have no idea how true it is but he told me that over the past few years from doing 4-6 hours a week he'd gone from 87kg to 72kg, he used to play basketball and american football so the last time I saw him he was a built like a tank and now he's really lean looking.

On top of that he reckons it helps reduce your revocery time from injuries and between sessions and generally makes your major muscle groups more efficient.

It could all be whoopsie, but feck it, worth looking into it!

colm_gti

2Cando wrote: »

But you weren't talking to my Dad!

Apologies...was chatting to a chap at a race a few weeks ago, said his son had gone from playing rugby to cycling, was a tall well built lad that struggled on the hilly courses, and was doing some racing with his college....sounds like there are plenty of our type out there

petethedrummer

petethedrummer wrote: »

Can you eat any type of calorie on the calorie counting method?

Can anyone answer this for me?

2Cando

colm_gti wrote: »

Apologies...was chatting to a chap at a race a few weeks ago, said his son had gone from playing rugby to cycling, was a tall well built lad that struggled on the hilly courses, and was doing some racing with his college....sounds like there are plenty of our type out there

That sounds suspiciously like me... Maybe my Dad was there, just didn't tell me!

RoboRat

I use myfitnesspal and I find it helps a lot.

I am looking to tone down myself as I am quite muscular due to my other sporting interest. I try to get most of my carbs into me before 2pm and I sub out carbs later on. For example my day would be:
8am: porridge with blueberries,
11am: apple
12.30: 100- 150gm rice, protein, lots of veg - i usually make a curry from scratch so I dont add any fatty **** into it. I pad it out with kidney beans, chickpeas and other low fat legumes so it provides a bit of satiety.
3pm: fruit, nuts or both
7pm: protein with lots of veg, maybe a small amount of carbs

Generally I sub out carbs later on so say if I made a shepherds pie I would use mashed cauliflower instead of potato, for a lasagne I use baked courgette strips instead of pasta.

There is a lot of talk of fasting days, not too sure what to make of it but basically you only take 500 cals twice a week.

Personally I try to take between 1300 - 1600 cal per day (max 1900) and to be honest, by eating right this is quite easy and I am not hungry at all.

I do a good spread of cardio and weight training, I am doing more reps, less weight to tone down.

This is just what works for me so each to their own.

petethedrummer

RoboRat wrote: »

so I dont add any fatty **** into it. I pad it out with kidney beans, chickpeas and other low fat legumes so it provides a bit of satiety.

Animal* Fat is just about the healthiest thing you could eat. And it properly sates hunger.

*Olive oil and Coconut oil are also excellent sources of fat. Vegetable oil and margarine are the work of the devil (aka Ancel Keys).

RoboRat

Animal* Fat is just about the healthiest thing you could eat. And it properly sates hunger.

I meant the likes of cream and oils that are found in a lot of ready made curry sauces.

petethedrummer

RoboRat wrote: »

I meant the likes of cream and oils that are found in a lot of ready made curry sauces.

Ahh. Yes. I just checked the ingredients of an Uncle bens curry sauce. Has sunflower oil like most sauces I imagine.