Room to Improve.

newport2

Call me Al wrote: »

I have to say this was my take too.
I know her 25 page brief was a wishlist, but a child could have seen that with these expensive bits it was unrealistic on her budget.
She was so emotionally invested in her end dream and talk about the colours that she didn't seem to be able to see the amount of work the original structure was going to need before any talk of the extension. The roll-away trolley they all stood around, that she wanted to call a butcher's block, looked silly to my eye.

At one stage we here were asking how she could be an IT manager with her ditziness and poor budgeting skills. The whole moaning "I wanted It, why couldn't I have had it" approach, for example with the hand-carved sash windows, when her budget of 140k clearly wasn't going to cover it was frustrating and eye-rolling. She had obviously not priced around, even informally, or researched renovation prices in Dublin before starting the project and approaching Dermot Bannon. Her lack of any type of contingency was a disaster decision. Although she ended up finding it so I suppose it was ok.

And I say this as a woman who has been talked down to by an archaic "builder" in the past, who was sent out by a developer to fix big problems left after finishing a build which left our first home under scaffold for 3 or 4 weeks. He did his best to ignore and not take me seriously because I was female. It was maddening in the extreme, and I knew I was right.

Either that or else she figured that this was a TV show and deals that are not available in the real world might crop up, for advertising purposes, make Dermot look great, etc. So she perhaps decided to wing it and see what they could do, while being well aware she wasn't going to get everything. If she'd asked for less, she might have ended up with less.

lawred2

doylefe wrote: »

IT manager. Great wage and all you have to be is a clueless spoofer in my experience

well she seemed to have clueless down

freshpopcorn

Sebastian Dangerfield wrote: »

It was,100% certain

Yes your correct.

jodaw

Hardly ever watched this show in the past but watched the last couple of weeks and it made me want to vomit in my mouth. Yer one last week was some weapon.
I cannot understand the criticism the woman last night is getting and I would not have been happy at all with the professionals.

The builders last night looked like cowboys to me. The amount of foam in the expensive windows struck me aswell. Also i think Dermo came up with some solution to put a pipe and break the floor insulation, creating a massive cold bridge.

The budgets are massive and always overrun, 180k for the work done is huge.

Changing windows on the sly, changing colours on the sly and putting the mostly disgusting red brick in them sample walls. I would fire the barsteward. And a fcking daybed in the kitchen.

Cop the feck on you numpty, I am half thinking he took her to see that other house because he wanted to hop into the daybed with yer one. (a la jacuzzi last week that my eyes cannot unsee)

Silly show

And the final result was horrible.

Outkast_IRE

I actually really liked the woman . She was right to get worked up with them some of the changes and stunts that Dermot was trying to pull was shocking, she was very clear on her ideas, and fair enough they needed some refinement overall she gave a decent brief.

She may of came across as a bit ditzy but so would alot of others if they were dumped into discussions on construction and engineering. However she shouldnt of tried to budget for something she clearly doesnt have a clue on.

alchemist33

pilly wrote: »

Except it was done. They got the underfloor heating in.

Did we ever find out how they managed it?

Hurrache

ted1 wrote: »

I thought so too, when they fitted the windows so could see that they used a lot of expanding foam to fill gaps. So you spent a fortune on expensive windows to get a high energy rating yet they use expanding foam beside it which has no energy rating

I noticed that myself.

At the start of the show Dermot did talk about how challenging the tendering process was so I imagine the guys that eventually won it would have been those proposing the lower costs and labour.

Also you could see she was getting, understandably, upset after Dermot did change some things without consulting with her. It's like getting painters in and you come home to a different coloured house because they thought it looked better themselves.

Sunny Dayz

alchemist33 wrote: »

Did we ever find out how they managed it?

I think there was supposed to be 2 steps down into the extension, but putting in the underfloor heating with the additional pipes or whatever needed to be done, it would mean raising the floor and only having one step down into the extension which Dermot felt would be a tripping hazard - but the client said she was happy with the one step.

newport2

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

I think there was supposed to be 2 steps down into the extension, but putting in the underfloor heating with the additional pipes or whatever needed to be done, it would mean raising the floor and only having one step down into the extension which Dermot felt would be a tripping hazard - but the client said she was happy with the one step.

Either this or the budget increased, they didn't reveal the final figure at the end. It could have gone up 20k for all we know, they didn't tell us.

Sunny Dayz

I have to say I'm a bit uncomfortable with how last nights episode went. Leaving aside how the client came across, the attitude of Dermot, the QS and the builder to the client was disappointing. I got the impression that the QS didn't like her, that Dermot wasn't respectful to her and that the builder would have little or nothing to do with her.
Am I picking up things wrong?

Call me Al

Outkast_IRE wrote: »

I actually really liked the woman . She was right to get worked up with them some of the changes and stunts that Dermot was trying to pull was shocking, she was very clear on her ideas, and fair enough they needed some refinement overall she gave a decent brief.

She may of came across as a bit ditzy but so would alot of others if they were dumped into discussions on construction and engineering. However she shouldnt of tried to budget for something she clearly doesnt have a clue on.

For me I felt that she would have saved herself a lot of heartache if she had done even a small bit of homework on a proper budget and costings before she started the project. She seemed to have just plucked figures out of the air.

We were told she is an IT manager, who clearly has an eye for detail, so this type of stuff shouldn't be a foreign concept to her.

newport2

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

I have to say I'm a bit uncomfortable with how last nights episode went. Leaving aside how the client came across, the attitude of Dermot, the QS and the builder to the client was disappointing. I got the impression that the QS didn't like her, that Dermot wasn't respectful to her and that the builder would have little or nothing to do with her.
Am I picking up things wrong?

A lot went on behind the scenes, we only saw the edited version I guess.

mfceiling

pilly wrote: »

Except it was done. They got the underfloor heating in.

Without doing it the way it was originally planned on the drawings. They had to put a step in to get it to work.

harr

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

I have to say I'm a bit uncomfortable with how last nights episode went. Leaving aside how the client came across, the attitude of Dermot, the QS and the builder to the client was disappointing. I got the impression that the QS didn't like her, that Dermot wasn't respectful to her and that the builder would have little or nothing to do with her.
Am I picking up things wrong?

No I think you are right..I don’t think they took her ideas seriously at all ..they seen a single lady with ideas she wanted but never really took her seriously...you could clearly see they all taught she had notions.

I don’t see anything wrong with having a few pages of what you want in your renovation , yes the architect can advise you and try guide you in right direction with certain things but to go behind a clients back and change things is totally Unacceptable.
I have experienced this first hand with builders and architects when we did an extension, my wife wanted things a certain way or certain materials in new kitchen and both builders and architect were very dismissive and annoyingly would always ring me to get the ok after my wife asked them to do something.

Living Off The Splash

I just don't understand why everything (building work) is so costly in this country. You see guys building complete houses in places like Spain for the cost of an extension in Ireland.

Colser

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

I have to say I'm a bit uncomfortable with how last nights episode went. Leaving aside how the client came across, the attitude of Dermot, the QS and the builder to the client was disappointing. I got the impression that the QS didn't like her, that Dermot wasn't respectful to her and that the builder would have little or nothing to do with her.
Am I picking up things wrong?

There's definitely a lot more to it than we saw imo and I'd love to know the full story.

I felt she needed someone with her even a friend or relation to help her get her head around the whole project,it's difficult enough to make decisions on the spot regarding house changes such as paint colours etc but these were big decisions about things that she seemed to know very little about (I'd be the same myself and would need someone with me for the technical bits).

She seemed very overwhelmed by the whole thing and started to get confused..she genuinely seemed to think that she picked the wall colour which was bizarre but I think she just wanted to get to the decorating/furnishing part and hadn't a clue about the building aspect..I think she should have had someone with her that would be familiar with that part of things.

No doubt we only get the edited version but I'd really love to know the full story..did she run into big financial problems as she even seemed unsure of her budget when the QS pushed the issue in the coffee shop?

It was a difficult watch imo..as an aside I thought she looked very like Cher lol...hope she gets to enjoy it anyway,I thought it was lovely and would probably have just moved in and just updated it without the extension.

Should the pipes/ woodworm issues have been discovered before the purchase by someone?

harr

Living Off The Splash wrote: »

I just don't understand why everything (building work) is so costly in this country. You see guys building complete houses in places like Spain for the cost of an extension in Ireland.

And a lot of locations in Ireland you could build a decent new house for €250,000 , renovations and large extension are always going to be problematic on older houses..

evolving_doors

harr wrote: »

No I think you are right..I don’t think they took her ideas seriously at all ..they seen a single lady with ideas she wanted but never really took her seriously...you could clearly see they all taught she had notions.

I don’t see anything wrong with having a few pages of what you want in your renovation , yes the architect can advise you and try guide you in right direction with certain things but to go behind a clients back and change things is totally Unacceptable.
I have experienced this first hand with builders and architects when we did an extension, my wife wanted things a certain way or certain materials in new kitchen and both builders and architect were very dismissive and annoyingly would always ring me to get the ok after my wife asked them to do something.

Case in point... the bricks.

When they went to pick them out he was showing her the white ones and she said she wanted the red ones. He threw a hissy fit when she said that she should go with his idea and he then said ".. but I want you to choose them because you want them". At the end of the scene she said she'd go away and think about it, and obviously went with the white ones.
Then at the end of the show he made a meal about the bricks 'he chose'. (Not to mention trying to pull a swifty when they were trying out the sample at her house).

Also the Island.

Just give her the island. I think he had a bit of space to play with to get her an island, maybe not looking directly out into the garden but parallel to the kitchen units if they decreased the downstairs bathroom/utility room.
But no.. he had to be a dick about it and get her a bread board on wheels with it's own storage cupboard ffs (short on space??). Then proceeded to mock her at the end in front of her friends and family about how stupid it was.

The initial budget was 130k, she went at least 30k over and didn't seem too stressed. So she was obviously playing her cards close to her chest and not giving in.

I think the kitchen in between the front room and the back was just odd.

Effects

freshpopcorn wrote: »

These people clearly have money!

I don't think you could find a single person who didn't already think this.

Effects

Atlantic Dawn wrote: »

Electronic gates should need planning permission, they are my new pet hate having to wait for peoples gates to open.

So someone having to get out and manually open gates is faster?

jon1981

I'm suggesting RTE edited this very negatively against this lady. She is very well educated and the title IT manager is just a generalised title used for TV. Her real title is not IT manager and a very senior position in the company.

Taking on this project on your own when you have a very busy job is going to be challenging for anyone so it's no surprise that she wasn't up on every little detail.

p.s. I don't know her and anyone related to her. Stumbled across her Linkedin profile.

James 007

AndrewJRenko wrote: »

If that's the case, then the risk of finding something that is going to add significant costs should be flagged up in advance and covered in contingency - basic project management.

Yes you are right, in reality an engineer should be involved in a renovation to pick up all these things including the woodworm etc. but a clever architect will not want all these things covered in his architectural project costs and his contingency. Bannon well knows that the drainage would be an issue, but of course he does not want to derail his project, anything hidden will remain hidden, this is how he works to maximise his architectural spend.

Call me Al

evolving_doors wrote: »

Just give her the island. I think he had a bit of space to play with to get her an island, maybe not looking directly out into the garden but parallel to the kitchen units if they decreased the downstairs bathroom/utility room.
But no.. he had to be a dick about it and get her a bread board on wheels with it's own storage cupboard ffs (short on space??). Then proceeded to mock her at the end in front of her friends and family about how stupid it was.

The initial budget was 130k, she went at least 30k over and didn't seem too stressed. So she was obviously playing her cards close to her chest and not giving in.

I think the kitchen in between the front room and the back was just odd.

But these were the things she wanted.. She wanted a downstairs toilet and utility. A meditation "room". In what is, let's be honest, a very narrow space.
And i thought she did look very much like a stressed rabbit caught in the headlights in the coffee shop with my hero the qs.
My gut tells me she cut corners picking her builder, and went for the lowest price offer on the table, and didn't leave a contingency fund for structural issues, rather instead trying to squirrel her extra cash away on the styling and look. Which is obviously her prerogative, but viewers can't call foul when it's pointed out.

matrim

Colser wrote: »

Should the pipes/ woodworm issues have been discovered before the purchase by someone?

The pipes had nothing to do with the purchase. They were fine for the original layout of the house. It's just that the extension was going over them that caused an issue. But it should possibly have been caught earlier in the build process.

The woodworm possibly should have but it might not have been obvious until the carpet and floorboards came up.

That was an interesting one for me as I have similar mid-terrace red brick so would possible have the same issues with an extension and overall layout of the house.

Penn

evolving_doors wrote: »

Case in point... the bricks.

When they went to pick them out he was showing her the white ones and she said she wanted the red ones. He threw a hissy fit when she said that she should go with his idea and he then said ".. but I want you to choose them because you want them". At the end of the scene she said she'd go away and think about it, and obviously went with the white ones.
Then at the end of the show he made a meal about the bricks 'he chose'. (Not to mention trying to pull a swifty when they were trying out the sample at her house).

Also the Island.

Just give her the island. I think he had a bit of space to play with to get her an island, maybe not looking directly out into the garden but parallel to the kitchen units if they decreased the downstairs bathroom/utility room.
But no.. he had to be a dick about it and get her a bread board on wheels with it's own storage cupboard ffs (short on space??). Then proceeded to mock her at the end in front of her friends and family about how stupid it was.

The initial budget was 130k, she went at least 30k over and didn't seem too stressed. So she was obviously playing her cards close to her chest and not giving in.

I think the kitchen in between the front room and the back was just odd.

The bricks, absolutely he should have let her go with what she wanted. Same with the colour for the kitchen units etc. It's absurd that he still changes things without telling the clients and gets away with it. Makes him look really bad. There has to be something written in the contract for appearing on the show that says he's allowed to do that, because if I was the client and an architect did that on me, I'd be making them change it back to what I wanted at their own expense.

However, under no circumstances would the island have fit in there following proper design guidelines. He couldn't make the utility/WC smaller because that would have involved moving a load-bearing wall and they didn't have the budget for that (plus I think it was the stairs the other side of the wall, the utility/WC was in the extension if I remember right). So since the Kitchen was in that room and that was all the space they had, an island simply wouldn't have fit. You're supposed to have at least 900mm from the cabinets to an island (to allow enough space for opening presses and standing behind them etc). The island would have been at a minimum 600mm wide (standard press size/depth). Which means you would have needed 900+600+900 (2.4m) between the units on either side. The room simply wasn't wide enough for an island at all, never mind the type of island she wanted.

His only option for that would have been to have the kitchen in the extension instead of the middle of the house.

Sunny Dayz

harr wrote: »

No I think you are right..I don’t think they took her ideas seriously at all ..they seen a single lady with ideas she wanted but never really took her seriously...you could clearly see they all taught she had notions.

I don’t see anything wrong with having a few pages of what you want in your renovation , yes the architect can advise you and try guide you in right direction with certain things but to go behind a clients back and change things is totally Unacceptable.

Yes I think Dermot even used the word "notions" at some point.
If we were getting our house done up I'd have a physical wish list made out too. I like and need lists! However it was conveyed on the program as "I want, I want".

James 007

She was right about the brickwork. If an architect pulled that trick on me, I would of said to him when I had seen the finished built brick wall, 'its nice, but its not what i asked for, so it can either stay up and I am not paying for it or have the guys take it down and I will pay only the build cost'

This is what was built, okay I think it was a yellow/greyish colour:
https://www.google.ie/search?tbm=isch&sa=1&ei=rh-dWvSBHMyzkwX5z5WQDg&q=old+grey+yellow+brick&oq=old+grey+yellow+brick&gs_l=psy-ab.3...55474.64235.0.64580.20.18.2.0.0.0.157.1540.17j1.18.0....0...1c.1.64.psy-ab..1.15.1140...0j0i13k1j0i7i30k1j0i8i7i30k1j0i67k1j0i8i13i30k1j0i8i30k1.0.MZYcnNHZvZg#imgrc=a5_oXqMGlaO0ZM:

This is what clever Bannon built as a sample,not what she asked for:
https://www.google.ie/search?q=old+red+brick&tbm=isch&source=iu&ictx=1&fir=SOg5Gr3l4ycuMM%253A%252Cw9b1DcX3mXBrXM%252C_&usg=__rlkVdgBZhgX94Py_IYdjHDiltgw%3D&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwi-4eTD_9TZAhWCC-wKHTTJCvQQ9QEIYDAB#imgrc=SOg5Gr3l4ycuMM:

This is what she asked for in the first place:
https://pixers.uk/wall-murals/old-grunge-red-brick-wall-texture-63423635?o%5Bdimension%5D%5Bwidth%5D=70&o%5Bdimension%5D%5Bheight%5D=70&o%5Blaminate%5D=0&o%5Bkeep_crop%5D=0&_currency=EUR&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI89Xow__U2QIVLTPTCh0PbQhLEAQYAiABEgI3CPD_BwE

Penn

Colser wrote: »

Should the pipes/ woodworm issues have been discovered before the purchase by someone?

The pipes wouldn't have been an issue to pick up on during the pre-purchase survey, because there was no issue with the pipes themselves. Just that the level and location of the pipes conflicted with the design, which only happened after the house was already bought.

The woodworm, it depends. During a normal survey, the surveyor doesn't do things like lift carpets or anything unless specifically allowed. It's a visual inspection with some testing of elements but unless the floorboards were exposed during the survey, they wouldn't have been able to be tested. Surveyors can only check items/areas which are accessible at the time of the survey.

Call me Al

Sunny Dayz wrote: »

Yes I think Dermot even used the word "notions" at some point.
If we were getting our house done up I'd have a physical wish list made out too. I like and need lists! However it was conveyed on the program as "I want, I want".

I think they may have used the word notions to convey that the wishlist was trying to have a metaphorical champagne lifestyle on an unrealistic lemonade budget.

ted1

Living Off The Splash wrote: »

I just don't understand why everything (building work) is so costly in this country. You see guys building complete houses in places like Spain for the cost of an extension in Ireland.

Taxes and wages.