Exasperated: Landlord Advice Desperately Required for Rent Allowance Tenant

fermatstheorem

Hello –
I was wondering if any landlords could please give me some advice.
I have a rent allowance tenant who is 5 months behind in her rent.
It’s a long story, I won’t go into it. She’s basically an alright sort a bit of a ‘howaya’ dolly bird and extremely disorganised and hasn’t filled her forms for the social welfare but she’s taking the piss now. She paid her rent until a couple of months ago so I do believe there is an issue with a reevaluating her case because one of her kids turned 18 so it’s a matter of her completing the paper work and then the cheques will be released.
It’s the usual scenario, broken phone, doesn't do what she says she’ll do etc.
The rent was made to be all up to date last Friday but of course more problems. I’ve spent the weekend stalking her house trying to meet up with her. I’ve mostly been speaking to her ‘friend’. I know she was in Spain last week because her facebook account is open. I’m at the end of my tether.
I want to scare her into taking this seriously and sorting it out with the welfare office. I’ve showed up at her house etc. and sent letters.

What else can I do to ‘get her attention’ so she'll sort this mess out?

Any advice would be most welcome.

Thanks.

djimi

If she hasnt paid a penny then you need to issue her with a 14 day notice of rent arrears, after which time you can issue an eviction notice.

Id advise to seek legal advice however, as this can be a bit of a minefield, both with the notice you must give and the process you must follow, but also with how you deal with her if she decides to dig her heels in and become difficult.

fermatstheorem

Thanks, I really don't think she'll get difficult. She gets into a panic but I want her to know I'm serious. Up to now she thinks I'm a 'nice girl' that she can mess with.

She had paid her rent each month up until a couple of months ago until she had this issue with the reevaluation of her case and I do believe her that the welfare office are giving her major hassle.However I need her to now sort it out properly.

My plan is to hand her an eviction notice the minute she pays the arrears. But I really need her to sort out the payments. I was just wondering if there were any other approaches I could use to make her realise that she can't mess with me.

djimi

The 14 day notice of arrears might give her the kick up the arse that she needs. If she pays the arrears in the 14 days then the matter is sorted and you cant take it further, so maybe if she realises the threat of eviction hangs over she might be more inclined to get it sorted.

fermatstheorem

Thanks I'll try that. I will never rent to a rent allowance tenant ever again. It has been a horrendous experience.

D3PO

fermatstheorem wrote: »

My plan is to hand her an eviction notice the minute she pays the arrears. But I really need her to sort out the payments. I was just wondering if there were any other approaches I could use to make her realise that she can't mess with me.

You cant do that. Seriously the first thing you need to do is learn how and when you can evict.

Your only way of being serious is to issue a notice of arrears and when you do so advise her that eviction notice will follow in 14 days if she hasn't sorted it out.

However if she does sort it out, you cannot provide her eviction notice as you have no ground to. Doing so would be considered an illegal eviction and you could end up in a very costly world of hurt doing so.

BostonB

Just follow the legal procedure. It has more than enough warning. As a LL you should be aware of the procedure. You're only short of the dog ate my homework, to have the full set of standard excuses. 5 months behind. You're being taken for a ride.

StillWaters

You have been way way too soft. Issue the notice of arrears and start getting tough. Be prepared for not seeing any of the past rent.

H3llR4iser

I'll definitely join the "get some legal assistance" line, the matter can prove a bit prickly if not handled well...do not hound her, do not wait for her at the door and generally harass the tenant, it's very easy to end up on the wrong end of the issue.

In all fairness, you've been way, way, way too soft until now - the woman is clearly a piss taker, all I see is a random set of cookie-cutter excuses. I have a feeling the fact she was in Spain and the missed payments are somewhat related

fermatstheorem

Totally agree with you. I want to scare the sh1t out of her now.

I have issued a notice of arrears. How else can I get tough? Only with letters?

fermatstheorem

D3PO wrote: »

You cant do that. Seriously the first thing you need to do is learn how and when you can evict.

Your only way of being serious is to issue a notice of arrears and when you do so advise her that eviction notice will follow in 14 days if she hasn't sorted it out.

However if she does sort it out, you cannot provide her eviction notice as you have no ground to. Doing so would be considered an illegal eviction and you could end up in a very costly world of hurt doing so.

I have a break clause in the lease so my intention was get her up to date with the rent and then break the lease.

wallyMe

14 days notice and see what happens then

D3PO

fermatstheorem wrote: »

I have a break clause in the lease so my intention was get her up to date with the rent and then break the lease.

It doesn't matter. The tenant is 5 months in arrears so its fair to assume he/she is in the property over 6 months. Therefore your tenant has acquired part 4 rights.

You cannot sign away your rights in a lease which means you can only break the tenancy for one of the very specific reasons outlined in the RTA 2004

Ray Palmer

fermatstheorem wrote: »

Thanks I'll try that. I will never rent to a rent allowance tenant ever again. It has been a horrendous experience.

It pretty much is a standard problem with RA. They don't see the rent as their responsibility. If the HSE ( they provide RA not DSP) decide to cut the rent or revaluate the tenant stops paying.

On another note you mentioned here that a child turned 18, that would not effect the RA. Ending full time education does AFAIK.

Grandpa Hassan

D3PO wrote: »

It doesn't matter. The tenant is 5 months in arrears so its fair to assume he/she is in the property over 6 months. Therefore your tenant has acquired part 4 rights.

You cannot sign away your rights in a lease which means you can only break the tenancy for one of the very specific reasons outlined in the RTA 2004

So if it were me, I would go ahead and issue the appropriate notices, and hope she doesn't pay so that I can get her evicted. I would forego 5 months rent (well, 6 or 7 by the time she's out) in order to get a non rent allowance tenant in.

Being stuck with a rent allowance tenant, who is messing you about (and will likely continue to do so even if she clears these current arrears), but has part 4 protection sounds like a nightmare

realgirl

D3PO wrote: »

It doesn't matter. The tenant is 5 months in arrears so its fair to assume he/she is in the property over 6 months. Therefore your tenant has acquired part 4 rights.

You cannot sign away your rights in a lease which means you can only break the tenancy for one of the very specific reasons outlined in the RTA 2004

The tenant not complying with the terms of the rental is one of these reasons so as she has not been paying rent as agreed then surely the tenancy can be broken

fermatstheorem

D3PO wrote: »

You cant do that. Seriously the first thing you need to do is learn how and when you can evict.

Your only way of being serious is to issue a notice of arrears and when you do so advise her that eviction notice will follow in 14 days if she hasn't sorted it out.

However if she does sort it out, you cannot provide her eviction notice as you have no ground to. Doing so would be considered an illegal eviction and you could end up in a very costly world of hurt doing so.

Ray Palmer wrote: »

It pretty much is a standard problem with RA. They don't see the rent as their responsibility. If the HSE ( they provide RA not DSP) decide to cut the rent or revaluate the tenant stops paying.

On another note you mentioned here that a child turned 18, that would not effect the RA. Ending full time education does AFAIK.

This is the scenario, I think he finished school.

fermatstheorem

realgirl wrote: »

The tenant not complying with the terms of the rental is one of these reasons so as she has not been paying rent as agreed then surely the tenancy can be broken

I reissued the lease in march and added that clause.

jarvis

I made a mistake of taking my eye off the bank account when my wife had a baby, 4 months later I realised the rent wasn't going in and was getting all sorts of reasons as to what the HSE were doing with their allowance etc and it was always a case were he said it'll be sorted by next week and they'll send me all the cheques together. I eventually rang the HSE and the welfare officer was able to give me dates of issue of all the cheques,He was spending them!!!!!!
It was a complete nightmare, in the end I got some of the money back from the tennant but the legged it without paying the majority of it.
I've rented it again recently and have a private tennant in it but 90%% of the people were looking to use RA and a good majority of them were saying "if my rent allowance gets cut, then you'll have to reduce the rent" it is very much as a previous posted said, a lot of them see themselves as uninvolved in the agreement and that it's between the HSE and the LL.

fermatstheorem

jarvis wrote: »

I made a mistake of taking my eye off the bank account when my wife had a baby, 4 months later I realised the rent wasn't going in and was getting all sorts of reasons as to what the HSE were doing with their allowance etc and it was always a case were he said it'll be sorted by next week and they'll send me all the cheques together. I eventually rang the HSE and the welfare officer was able to give me dates of issue of all the cheques,He was spending them!!!!!!
It was a complete nightmare, in the end I got some of the money back from the tennant but the legged it without paying the majority of it.
I've rented it again recently and have a private tennant in it but 90%% of the people were looking to use RA and a good majority of them were saying "if my rent allowance gets cut, then you'll have to reduce the rent" it is very much as a previous posted said, a lot of them see themselves as uninvolved in the agreement and that it's between the HSE and the LL.

Thanks for sharing your story. Very similar situation as myself. I got a letter from the welfare office and as of March no cheques had been issued since December. I helped her fill out the paper work and the cheques were meant to be issued end of April but seemingly they haven't arrived.

gurramok

Ray Palmer wrote: »

On another note you mentioned here that a child turned 18, that would not effect the RA. Ending full time education does AFAIK.

This caught my eye Are you 100% sure about this?
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/social_welfare_payments/supplementary_welfare_schemes/rent_supplement.html

You won’t qualify for Rent Supplement if you:

Are in full-time employment (30 hours or more a week). However, if you are assessed as in need of housing under the Rental Accommodation Scheme and have been out of full-time employment for 12 months or more you may be entitled to the Supplement - see ‘Employment and Rent Supplement’ below
....
Are attending full-time education. However, if you are getting a Back to Education Allowance, are participating in the Back to Education Programme or in the Momentum Programme you may be entitled Rent Supplement.

If the child is now an adult at 18 and probably seeking work, I suspect the entitlement maybe reduced. In DCC for example it would decrease from 875 to 600 (from 1 parent with child to 2 single people in shared accommodation).

This maybe why the mother cannot afford the full rent anymore, she needed to find 275 quid extra a month.

Marcusm

I'm surprised that no one has picked up on your words such as "stalking", "scare her" and "scare the sh1t out of her".

Seriously, I have no idea whether you truly means those literally but I would worry about the guards knocking on my door to discuss harassment if the dots were ever joined up by the tenant.

ahnowbrowncow

Marcusm wrote: »

I'm surprised that no one has picked up on your words such as "stalking", "scare her" and "scare the sh1t out of her".

Seriously, I have no idea whether you truly means those literally but I would worry about the guards knocking on my door to discuss harassment if the dots were ever joined up by the tenant.

I think it's safe to assume it was a figure of speech for toughening up, they've been too soft for 5 months I doubt they are literally going to scare the **** out of her now.

D3PO

realgirl wrote: »

The tenant not complying with the terms of the rental is one of these reasons so as she has not been paying rent as agreed then surely the tenancy can be broken

you haven't read the thread correctly. The OP says after arrears are repaid she will give notice to evict. This cannot be done, she can go through the eviction process now due to failure to pay rent but cannot do so if the arrears are cleared.

fermatstheorem

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

I think it's safe to assume it was a figure of speech for toughening up, they've been too soft for 5 months I doubt they are literally going to scare the **** out of her now.

Thanks ahnowbrowncow; yes I've been way too soft up until now listening to her tales of woe. I have sent her letters, and nicely printed spreadsheets with colour coding as to when she needs to pay and what she currently owes to no avail. I feel now she obviously isn't responding so I need a new approach and hence I started this thread to get ideas.

Yesterday I spent 2 hours waiting yesterday afternoon to no avail so then I returned at 11pm when I knew she would be finally home. I just got a text from her saying she'd appreciate if I wouldn't call so late. I texted her back saying i'd appreciate if she'd pay the rent.

I have zero interest in stalking this brainless dollybird but she's also not going screw me around any longer. She has two school going kids so not as easy for her to just do a runner.

Anyways a lesson for all don't let a RA near your property.

fermatstheorem

ahnowbrowncow wrote: »

I think it's safe to assume it was a figure of speech for toughening up, they've been too soft for 5 months I doubt they are literally going to scare the **** out of her now.

D3PO wrote: »

you haven't read the thread correctly. The OP says after arrears are repaid she will give notice to evict. This cannot be done, she can go through the eviction process now due to failure to pay rent but cannot do so if the arrears are cleared.

I wont give her an eviction notice, sorry I shouldn't have used that phrase, I meant just get rid of her. I'll just invoke the break clause of the lease and give her my tale of woe - I need to move back into the property ASAP; my relationship broke up etc etc.

fermatstheorem

gurramok wrote: »

This caught my eye Are you 100% sure about this?
http://www.citizensinformation.ie/en/social_welfare/social_welfare_payments/supplementary_welfare_schemes/rent_supplement.html



If the child is now an adult at 18 and probably seeking work, I suspect the entitlement maybe reduced. In DCC for example it would decrease from 875 to 600 (from 1 parent with child to 2 single people in shared accommodation).

This maybe why the mother cannot afford the full rent anymore, she needed to find 275 quid extra a month.

This maybe the case. She's definitely not in full time employment. She has three kids, one just turned 18.

fermatstheorem

Thanks for all the information and support. Really helpful. I just joined boards today. Probably should have a long time ago

realgirl

D3PO wrote: »

you haven't read the thread correctly. The OP says after arrears are repaid she will give notice to evict. This cannot be done, she can go through the eviction process now due to failure to pay rent but cannot do so if the arrears are cleared.

I have read the thread fine thanks. I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying. In relation to the tenant having a part 4 tenancy I was suggesting that the landlord can evict in this situation if the tenant has failed to comply with the obligations of the tenancy which she has by not paying rent for 5 months.

fermatstheorem

Apparently she's down at the office right now trying to sort it out. So I'll go over this evening with a proper 14 days arrears notice. I'll let you know how I get on.

When i was over at the house yesterday. Her 14 year answered the door and said she had gone down the shops and would be back in an hour. I waited about an hour and quarter and then someone came to the house in a car I didn't recognise when they went into the house (with grocery shopping) I rang the door bell.

This lady who answered the door said she was the baby sitter and that my tenant was in the hospital as her nan was sick. So it's a bit of a joke. Her kid says she's at the shops; 'the baby sitter' says she's in the hospital.

When i went around at 11pm, another friend who I've spoken to before and actually texts me a lot said she was still down at the hospital. I told her I thought it was all a joke and that I'd be back again tomorrow.

djimi

fermatstheorem wrote: »

I wont give her an eviction notice, sorry I shouldn't have used that phrase, I meant just get rid of her. I'll just invoke the break clause of the lease and give her my tale of woe - I need to move back into the property ASAP; my relationship broke up etc etc.

Just be careful of this. I have heard of landlords getting stung when they were checked up on to see if the reason behind their eviction notice was genuine; I dont know how often if would happen, but just bear it in mind.

Your tenant is right also; regardless of the circumstances you have no legal right to show up at the property unannounced at 11pm at night. I understand your frustration, especially if you are getting no response from her, but you need to be smart about how you go about things, and dont put yourself in a position where you could be seen to be in the wrong in any way should it go to a PRTB hearing. Waiting outside the house and calling in late at night could well be seen as harrassment.