Aer Lingus Cadetship 2013

optimus125

Yeh, I think I'm just going to fill in Leaving Certificate, without any mention of results in the education details section, and then will just include the actualy results in my CV. Overall it seems to be a fairly poorly organised application... Would it have killed them to read/think it through a couple of times?

Calm Observer

I interpreted that section as college results, degrees, masters etc? That would make more sense with the institution and dates bit?

Calm Observer

Very nerve wracking actually clicking 'Submit Application'. Spent about 40 mins double checking everything for spelling errors!

Bsal

BrakePad wrote: »

Is a PPL and a heap of hours plus fully completed ATPL theory regarded and a 3rd level qualification per say?

I'm in the same boat as you, seen as they only give 3 places to enter any ATPL exams you did, do we just choose our best 3 out of the 14 exams?

Shamrock231

Calm Observer wrote: »

Very nerve wracking actually clicking 'Submit Application'. Spent about 40 mins double checking everything for spelling errors!

Same here... :o

optimus125

What are people's thoughts on the lower age limit? 17 by/on the 1st of January 2013. Very young? Or justifiable? I mean, they've got it there for a reason... They're not going to want any extra applications if they're never going to give them any real consideration in the first place!

Shamrock231

optimus125 wrote: »

What are people's thoughts on the lower age limit? 17 by/on the 1st of January 2013. Very young? Or justifiable? I mean, they've got it there for a reason... They're not going to want any extra applications if they're never going to give them any real consideration in the first place!

AFAIK 17 is the age you have to be to hold a pilots license, so they're keeping their options open.

Calm Observer

optimus125 wrote: »

What are people's thoughts on the lower age limit? 17 by/on the 1st of January 2013. Very young? Or justifiable? I mean, they've got it there for a reason... They're not going to want any extra applications if they're never going to give them any real consideration in the first place!

Maybe they're thinking that might be a few outstanding candidates at that age and it would be a shame for them to miss the opportunity of getting them now before they possibly enter university etc?

optimus125

Calm Observer wrote: »

Maybe they're thinking that might be a few outstanding candidates at that age and it would be a shame for them to miss the opportunity of getting them now before they possibly enter university etc?

Yeah that's probably what they're thinking, and plus they'd get a good long shelf life out of them. But what about students sitting the LC this June? The people processing the applications won't have any real way to judge their abilities and potential? Let alone their maths and physics proficiency.

phonypony

optimus125 wrote: »

What are people's thoughts on the lower age limit? 17 by/on the 1st of January 2013. Very young? Or justifiable? I mean, they've got it there for a reason... They're not going to want any extra applications if they're never going to give them any real consideration in the first place!

A post on their f@cebook page suggests they want young blood:

'By the time your friends are landing their first job, you could be landing your first jet'.

Says it all really...

BrakePad

Bsal wrote: »

I'm in the same boat as you, seen as they only give 3 places to enter any ATPL exams you did, do we just choose our best 3 out of the 14 exams?

I just put a note that I'd passed them all in the first slot and then entered all the results in the details of flight experience section.

Peregrine

Leave us teenage entrants alone

Not entering this year but I'd feel guilty if I actually got it next year considering how most of yous here are better candidates than me.

optimus125 wrote: »

Yeah that's probably what they're thinking, and plus they'd get a good long shelf life out of them. But what about students sitting the LC this June? The people processing the applications won't have any real way to judge their abilities and potential? Let alone their maths and physics proficiency.

Well they say you must be finished or finishing your LC this year. The applications close at the end of May and the LC results will be out 2 months later. I'd imagine if their grades aren't good enough then, they'll be out of it.

BrakePad

The way these things work is pretty simple. The yes/no or drop down questions you answer in the application are the ones that will dictate whether or not you get a psychometric test sent to you. Sadly if you do not answer all the questions the way they want your application is deleted almost immediately!
These are likely to be criminal record, willing to pay some of the costs or DOB related etc. If you answer them all correctly from EI's point of view you will be sent out a test when they are sent. When the tests are back they are paired electronically to your application by a computer program. Then if they want say 2000 people to the next phase they take the top 2000 test scores and call them to the group interviews. They may refer a bit to the info you give in the short one on one interview at the group day. Those who score well in the groups are brought back obviously to the panel interview and this is the first time that they will take an in depth look at the details of your application.
EI are not reading every application, they set broad criteria that a computer can easily compare applications to and cut the numbers down like that. Chances are if there is anything that is not clear in the application and you have any chance of being picked on your skills etc etc you will be there to explain them to the panel.

ExtaticFob

Hi All,

Thanks for all the information so far. Has anyone heard how many places will be available and what the eyesight requirement is? Will anyone here be applying for the Defence Forces Air Corps Cadetship this year?

phonypony

ExtaticFob wrote: »

Hi All,

Thanks for all the information so far. Has anyone heard how many places will be available and what the eyesight requirement is? Will anyone here be applying for the Defence Forces Air Corps Cadetship this year?

All EASA class 1 requirements are here: http://www.caa.co.uk/default.aspx?catid=49&pageid=527

bombs away

phonypony wrote: »

A post on their f@cebook page suggests they want young blood:

'By the time your friends are landing their first job, you could be landing your first jet'.

Says it all really...

Hope your not suggesting that older people should not bother applying based on this :rolleyes:

Shamrock231

Does anyone know the age profile of the last cadet group, I wouldn't say there's no point in older people applying, but I would say they'd have to make a pretty good impression. I'd say being a couple of years younger could be an advantage in this, but again, older candidates bring experience to the table, the value placed on this experience has yet to be seen. If you're not in you can't win though, no point not at least entering...

Contrails

I heard the average age was about 26/27 last time. So not exactly school leavers. I was under the impression that the extra life experience was actually a big plus whilst at the same time not being too old.

Shamrock231

Contrails wrote: »

I heard the average age was about 26/27 last time. So not exactly school leavers. I was under the impression that the extra life experience was actually a big plus whilst at the same time not being too old.

Looking at the photo on the cadet page I'd put most of them in the 23-27 bracket. Could be wrong though, suits can add a year or two to some people's looks...

BrakePad

I asked at the FLYER exhibition and he said the average age was 26. It should be remembered that given the economy a lot of people do postgrad stuff in college so is is very possible to graduate and look for "your first job" at 26! :rolleyes:

paulmcgrath

Contrails wrote: »

I heard the average age was about 26/27 last time. So not exactly school leavers. I was under the impression that the extra life experience was actually a big plus whilst at the same time not being too old.

a mate of mine was 23.

First year out from a BEng.

BrakePad

While I wince personally at being the one to start this. I know a Captain in Aer Lingus(well he's a friend of a relative). I mentioned I had applied for the cadetship and we had a chat. I mentioned the "are you related to current EI staff" question. He was of the opinion that they want to move away a little from the dynasty image this year. I also asked in jest about the whole "transgender/gay/traveler" question section and he lead me to believe that there may have been a little bit of flack leveled at them last year by a late stage applicant. It certainly may explain why that bizarre line of inquiry was added.

Given I have flight experience as I stated before I asked did he know anything about the last crop in that respect. It seems that some were fresh with no time but a few had 150+ total hours and even 100+ P1 time on application. One may even have had a MEIR but no CPL, however he was not sure of that.

Obviously take that with a pinch of salt and all that but personally it matches what I had heard a little in the past.

james142

When was the last time Aer Lingus did a cadet program like this? I do not meet the requirements this year, hopefully this will come around again in 2 - 5 years time?

If only they started this program next year, then I'd be grand :rolleyes:

Flier

phonypony wrote: »

A post on their f@cebook page suggests they want young blood:

'By the time your friends are landing their first job, you could be landing your first jet'.

Says it all really...

They've been using that tag line for at least 20 years, and in that time have recruited cadets from school leavers to people in their 30's with no flying at all, so I wouldn't read anything at all into it.
As for those who haven't sat their LC yet, they will be left until the later stages when the exams are done and their results will be out, so it'll be clear weather they've made the required grade. (tbh, if you can't manage a C in pass English and Maths and a couple of honours, you might find the course very hard going. The LC requirements are very basic. The aptitude tests will weed out the many)

As for the gay/transgender/traveler etc questions, they are part of 'equal opportunities monitoring' and have nothing to do with your application per se.


Anyway, good luck to all of you who are applying. It's a great opportunity, so make the most of it.

optimus125

Flier wrote: »

As for those who haven't sat their LC yet, they will be left until the later stages when the exams are done and their results will be out, so it'll be clear weather they've made the required grade.

Just curious as to where you got this information?

Cheers

Flier

That's the way they've done it before, so I have no reason to assume they'll do it differently this time. The whole recruitment process takes many months to get through, so it make sense to leave those with incomplete applications (for want of a better phrase) 'til later. What they don't want to happen is to invest time into assessing candidates, who then don't qualify on their LC results.

optimus125

Ah right ok, makes sense yeah!

Question for you, or anybody else who knows the procedure, what is the order of events with referees? Are they only contacted if applicants get to a certain stage? Or could they be contacted quite early? And will they be looking for the referees to write a reference, or is it more likely to be a phone call?

paulmcgrath

optimus125 wrote: »

Ah right ok, makes sense yeah!

Question for you, or anybody else who knows the procedure, what is the order of events with referees? Are they only contacted if applicants get to a certain stage? Or could they be contacted quite early? And will they be looking for the referees to write a reference, or is it more likely to be a phone call?

In any walk of life references are generally contacted around the same time as when they are choosing the correct candidate. ie final stage.

Jocry

I havent had a chance to apply just yet, intend doing so asap, however what I'm wondering is it the same application process / information which they required last year?

tigershould

ExtaticFob wrote: »

Hi All,

Thanks for all the information so far. Has anyone heard how many places will be available and what the eyesight requirement is? Will anyone here be applying for the Defence Forces Air Corps Cadetship this year?

dont quote me but i hear there are less than 30 places up for grabs.

Tenger

james142 wrote: »

When was the last time Aer Lingus did a cadet program like this? I do not meet the requirements this year, hopefully this will come around again in 2 - 5 years time?

If only they started this program next year, then I'd be grand :rolleyes:

They ran this last year as well. I think a batch of 20 were hired then. When the last one was launched it was hinted that EI would run is for 3-4 years. But that could easily change if the aviation sector encounters any difficulties.

BrakePad

For the LC 2013 students the process is the same as last year...I asked about this at the FLYER as I was considering resitting my LC because I was a sports star the first time around!:rolleyes:
I asked if you could apply and not give LC results(as they were pending) I was told you could and that you would be treated as if you met the requirement and sent a psychometric test. If you met the grade on that test you would be advanced with the rest to phase 3. The LC results would be out before phase 4 and if you did not meet the LC grades then you would be eliminated.

I would imagine though if you cannot get Ordinary Level Cs in English and Maths you would struggle with enough aspects of the psychometric to mean you would not score high enough.

ChicaneAuto

Any thoughts on the wisdom or relevance of putting a current cadet down as a reference? Basically, I am trying to avoid putting a past employer down because after a few years of a good relationship, I went into competition with him. On job applications I have previously put him down and stated at interview that I did it in good faith because I was a valued team member and left on good terms but to bare in mind that I left to go into competition so at best his reference would be indifferent! But all of this is a bit messy for something I'd rather not bring petty politics into.

Calm Observer

ChicaneAuto wrote: »

Any thoughts on the wisdom or relevance of putting a current cadet down as a reference? Basically, I am trying to avoid putting a past employer down because after a few years of a good relationship, I went into competition with him. On job applications I have previously put him down and stated at interview that I did it in good faith because I was a valued team member and left on good terms but to bare in mind that I left to go into competition so at best his reference would be indifferent! But all of this is a bit messy for something I'd rather not bring petty politics into.

To be honest, I don't think it's a good idea. I think it looks like you want them to know that you know someone. Especially if you are to believe other posts on this thread that say the company are trying to move away from that image. Surely you can find another personal reference? It's up to you though, there is a chance it could go in your favour, sure you never know!!

Flier

ChicaneAuto wrote: »

Any thoughts on the wisdom or relevance of putting a current cadet down as a reference? Basically, I am trying to avoid putting a past employer down because after a few years of a good relationship, I went into competition with him. On job applications I have previously put him down and stated at interview that I did it in good faith because I was a valued team member and left on good terms but to bare in mind that I left to go into competition so at best his reference would be indifferent! But all of this is a bit messy for something I'd rather not bring petty politics into.

I think it very much depends on the person. If the 'cadet' in question is straight out of school and this is his/her first gig, and s/he knows you from down the park, what is the reference about?? If, on the other hand, s/he has had another career, with responsibility, and knows you in a more professional context, then maybe it is the right thing to do. Assuming of course, that the particular cadet has excelled during the course and pushed all the right buttons, and not pissed off any of the training team in EI.

ChicaneAuto

Yeah, I suppose I should have mentioned that the cadet knows me through an organisation that I would have thought much of my leadership skills(if any!!) have been honed.

I guess it depends on the strength of the reference, Theres no point in putting it in purely because of the fact that he/she is a cadet.
It would be like shameless "name dropping" as it were.

optimus125

What are peoples take on the 'initials' box for the references? Are they really actually just looking for the referees initials!? Something seems odd about it to me...

ChicaneAuto

optimus125 wrote: »

What are peoples take on the 'initials' box for the references? Are they really actually just looking for the referees initials!? Something seems odd about it to me...

Odd how?

optimus125

ChicaneAuto wrote: »

Odd how?

Not entirely sure... Just something about it... I mean, don't get me wrong, we all know what initials are, and I indeed filled them in as that, but why would they want that? Especially considering that the next two boxes you fill are their fore and surnames.

GulDog

Hi guys,

I applied to this the last time back in 2011 and only got as far as the psychometric testing. I was wondering does anyone know any good websites/books etc. to use in preparation for this test? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

paulmcgrath

GulDog wrote: »

Hi guys,

I applied to this the last time back in 2011 and only got as far as the psychometric testing. I was wondering does anyone know any good websites/books etc. to use in preparation for this test? Any help or advice would be greatly appreciated.

Can you describe the then psychometric tests.

Could be able to provide help if I had a better idea on what you experienced.

basill

If anyone here is serious about getting onto a cadet scheme then they need to pull finger and start doing some serious research and stop looking for spoonfeeding. Facts and figures about a publicly listed company and readily available and free. A bit of googling will find you the corporate strategy.

For a start go onto pprune and in particular their wannabes section. There are loads of links to interview threads and websites with example psycho tests etc. Countless threads exist covering various airline recruiting methods and the types of questions asked. More important is to understand why a recruiter asks a certain question and to plan an appropriate answer in advance to give yourself the best chance of success. Amazon will have interview books that whilst not aviation related per se will cover all of this in detail.

Anyone with some flying hours had better bone up on the technical side and expect to be grilled. Again the types of questions that an interviewer might ask a low houred pilot are all out there on the internet.

The few that eventually get through won't have been spoonfed and will have all the requisite knowledge in order to demonstrate how badly they want the job.

Shamrock231

Never hurts to ask, gotta take every advantage open to us Basill, and if that means trying to get a look in at what to expect in the psychometric tests straight from the horses mouth, then so be it...

doha

Alright lads

Dad's side from Monaghan, Mum's side from Stoke on Trent; Live in England but currently living (and in Sixth Form) abroad in Qatar.

Would having A Levels instead of Leaving Certificates put me at a disadvantage with AL?

Paxi_R6

LeftBase wrote: »

This Cadetship offers an interesting little window in to the changing world of Irish Aviation.

Last time this started there were guys complaining about the 100s of Irish jet pilots who would take a demotion to get a job in Aer Lingus and how it was all so unfair on them. Why were Aer Lingus running a cadetship? Surely some of these guys must meet their standards? Were Aer Lingus just too aloof and wanted their own stock? Why invest so much in new pilots when there are 100s who would bite your hand off for a job?
These were all points raised...however this is a bit of a misjudgment of the actual playing field here.

Had you asked my opinion during the last cadetship I would have said the same as above and been equally mystified. However through actual introduction to commercial aviation and mixing with guys in their "first job" I have seen that this is not the way it is.
This group of Irish pilots(many with 3000h+ in Ryanair) who complain and are being seemingly passed over by Aer Lingus in favour of a cadetship are like a ship passing Aer Lingus HQ in the night. They desperately want to be in Aer Lingus but Aer Lingus dont want them. The main reason in many cases? Age!
But all jet pilots out there are not old men you say! This is true, however an airline like Aer Lingus wants guys young enough to be Captains some day and most of the currently employed guys out there with that potential have their eyes set on the left seat in the East. I know Irish guys in Ryanair who are not even considering Aer Lingus. I hold it as an onward option but it is not top of my list.

So there you have the answer for anyone wondering why Aer Lingus are running cadetships. It's for the simple reason that they are not the only act in town for young lads and lassies who have their wings. When they run DE campaigns many of the applicants are over 35 or nearing 40 and do not have the ideal shelf life Aer Lingus would want. Those who are young(under 30) with a few 1000 hours are looking at the big money elsewhere and are less concerned with returning to the family and/or financial roots they have in Ireland. Hell even some of their former cadets are looking for the big money elsewhere!

Best of luck to those who apply. But if you do not make it dont crawl under a rock and die, keep plugging away at it! It's a wide world of flying out there!

Hate to break it to you there where 4,5 Cadets in there 30s that Aer lingus took in the last cadet program..Your right about keep plugging away ! There are other airlines who run cadet programs just apply ! Never know how far you will get.

surfer86

Hi,

Does anyone know what type of time frame can be expected between each stage of the assessment process? How long between assessments or what dates could he expected for each stage

Thanks

Suasdaguna1

basill wrote: »

If anyone here is serious about getting onto a cadet scheme then they need to pull finger and start doing some serious research and stop looking for spoonfeeding.

"me doth think he protest too much"

Boards.ie are amongst numerous websites is where potentials are attempting to glean some info. It's a forum where good gen is given and waffle,b/s and Walter Mitty characters lurk..(remember the last cadet thread where mr heavy weight was giving his words of wisdom.....he was ran off the forum)....it's not spoon feeding in the slightest.

Likewise and in support of Bas, if anyone thinks this is a walk in the park with theirM.engs and doctorates in aviation science, well they have another thing coming. Best of luck folk, it's a very rewarding career.

nabanoba

I was just wondering does anyone have a rough idea of how many people applied last time and how many places are up for grabs this time?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Shamrock231

I think it was in the region of 2000 that applied last time and 20 spots, I'd imagine there'd be between 15-20 cadets in this group.

nabanoba

Thanks a million Shamrock. I thought there'd be more than 2000 applying. Especially when CTC claim to have 7000 applications a year. Could be even less applying this time as well as the course isn't fully funded.