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Students breaking a lease

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    #32
    JohnnyBoii
    Registered Users Posts: 15 ✭JohnnyBoii


    JustAThought wrote: »
    Dear Johnny ,

    You need to honour your obligation and the legal contract in place. You have involved another persons finances in this -your guarantor -who no doubt trusted you and was prepared to believe in your honesty to put their name, money & time on the legal document as a guarantor . To loose this among of money to pay someone else's rent because they want to go home/on holidays/don't want to anymore is a horrific thing to do to them.

    Pay your rent, honour your legal contract.
    Otherwise you can be GUARANTEED that the landlord will IMMEDIATELY go after both you AND your guarantor.

    To look at it selfishly -it will cause a financial disaster for your guarantor . You will also loose your deposit . You will also have no reference for next year.

    Next year you will also have no guarantor & never will again.

    If you have gone through the PTRB you will have either a cut & dry judgement against your name there too.

    if you have outstanding bills, or damage your landlord will most likely ALSO chase both you AND your guarantor for those costs also which will mean you could spend your summer in the small claims court AND have a legal judgement made against you -not to mention your guarantor who may well not be able to pay.

    Most likely all your parents will become involved too.

    The fate your guarantor dosn't really seem to be a big issue for you; so let me phrase it this way. Anyone with a judgement made against them for this type of thing WILL have it registered in the legal system, where it will follow you WHEN reference or standard credit checks are done for car loans, future UPC connections, future jobs checks (essential with banks , insurance etc ),car loans, store Cards, credit card applications etc.

    You will also have to declare it for employees who may request it & will not employ you if you are a debt cheat or have court judgements made against you for debt & unpaid bills ( increasing
    common) with employees especially multinationals who employ reference checker companies to do this for them . And of course Australia And America visa require you to declare judgements, debt orders or prosecutions made against you , or ones that are underway , and can and will refuse your visa application based on this.

    Check your contract -typically breech of termS involves loosing your deposit. If you break it you will also loose this. I hope your guarantor didn't give this to you too?


    Pay your way, pay your rent, don't shaft yourself, your future & most of all your guarantor . Like it or not, you have signed a legally binding document ; these people don't give a hoot about you - they WILL prosecute and it will have serious long term consequences for you .


    Thanks for all the advice. I think we will try sublet it for the remaining two months and if not pay for June and let them keep the deposit for the month of July.


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    #33
    JohnnyBoii
    Registered Users Posts: 15 ✭JohnnyBoii


    Zamboni wrote: »
    Johnny, you're a man now. Don't play the "poor student" card.
    The Landlord and your guarantor treated you with respect and entered into agreements with you as a man.
    Be a man and deliver your side of the agreement.

    On another note - €2,900 for a 3 bed apt in SCD???
    That is either sheer lunacy or the place must be like something off MTV Cribs.


    No it's nothing too fancy at all and yea it's a 3 shared bedroom apartment. It's our fault though we left it too late and had no options at the end of August.


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    #34
    endacl
    Registered Users Posts: 22,306 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    JohnnyBoii wrote: »
    No it's nothing too fancy at all and yea it's a 3 shared bedroom apartment. It's our fault though we left it too late and had no options at the end of August.

    What'll ye do at the end of August this year? Landlords wanna know?


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    #35
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Paying 2900 for a 3 bed apartment!! I hope your not doing economics.

    Face up to your responsibility and see out the remainder of the lease.

    Plenty of big houses in SCD for less .
    What type if apartment is it?


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    #36
    JohnnyBoii
    Registered Users Posts: 15 ✭JohnnyBoii


    ted1 wrote: »
    Paying 2900 for a 3 bed apartment!! I hope your not doing economics.

    Face up to your responsibility and see out the remainder of the lease.

    Plenty of big houses in SCD for less .
    What type if apartment is it?


    3 twin rooms near the UCD area. Not within 20 min walking distance of UCD there isn't. Anyway this is beside the point.


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    #37
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Theres a 6 bed house in Clane for rent on Daft at the moment for €1000 a month. You could get a car and drive into UCD from there and still save a fortune!


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    #38
    valleyoftheunos
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,332 ✭✭✭valleyoftheunos


    OP you need to pay the rent or face the consequences, that could mean the LL pursuing you through the PRTB and/or your guarantors through the courts for whatever the LL has lost out on. Bear in mind that you aren't entitled to not pay your last month's rent and tell the LL to hold on to the deposit.

    Try and think of this in the longer term, if this goes badly you may find yourself without a LL's reference and without a guarantor in the future, that could make things difficult for you when you need to rent another place, which presumably will be soon enough.


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    #39
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,394 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    djimi wrote: »
    Theres a 6 bed house in Clane for rent on Daft at the moment for €1000 a month. You could get a car and drive into UCD from there and still save a fortune!

    Except 6 people in different classes may need a car each.;)

    OP it is just plain silly what you are saying. Suddenly all 6 of you can't afford rent just at the end of the college year.?! Who would believe that? Did you ever really plan on staying past the college year?


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    #40
    Corkbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,668 ✭✭✭Corkbah


    djimi wrote: »
    Ignoring the lynch mob for a second, your legal way out of this situation is to look to reassign the remainder of the lease. This means that you go and find someone to take over the remainder of your lease (someone who is acceptable to the landlord), you pay all costs involved and are responsible for any shortfall in rent that the landlord may incur.

    Granted it might not be all that easy to reassign the remaining two months of a lease, but given that it is coming into the summer months you may well find someone who is looking for a short term letting who would be willing to agree to what would effectively be a two month lease. The cost of the rental may be an issue for you, but it cant hurt to give it a try.

    you are assuming that the contract permits subletting - which I doubt it will.

    most landlords will be willing to facilitate but are under no obligation to do so.


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    #41
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Corkbah wrote: »
    you are assuming that the contract permits subletting - which I doubt it will.

    most landlords will be willing to facilitate but are under no obligation to do so.

    Its not subletting; its reassignment. The law allows for a tenant to seek to reassign the remainder of their lease to a third party. This is not optional for the landlord.


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    #42
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    JohnnyBoii wrote: »
    3 twin rooms near the UCD area. Not within 20 min walking distance of UCD there isn't. Anyway this is beside the point.

    heres a 5 bed for 100 extra http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1317009

    heres a 6 bed house for 2950 http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1313175

    was it your first time up in Dublin?


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    #43
    Corkbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,668 ✭✭✭Corkbah


    djimi wrote: »
    Its not subletting; its reassignment. The law allows for a tenant to seek to reassign the remainder of their lease to a third party. This is not optional for the landlord.

    can you please provide a link to this law (I've never heard of it) .... my experience of the renting world is that if its not in the contract its not permitted.


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    #44
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Corkbah wrote: »
    can you please provide a link to this law (I've never heard of it) .... my experience of the renting world is that if its not in the contract its not permitted.

    http://www.threshold.ie/advice/ending-a-tenancy/assignment-and-subletting/


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    #45
    zl1whqvjs75cdy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,042 ✭✭✭zl1whqvjs75cdy


    Rent this instead

    http://www.daft.ie/searchrental.daft?id=1326378


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    #46
    Corkbah
    Registered Users Posts: 1,668 ✭✭✭Corkbah


    djimi wrote: »
    http://www.threshold.ie/advice/ending-a-tenancy/assignment-and-subletting/


    did you read that link ?? it doesn't say that the landlord must accept a sublet.
    As a tenant, whilst you cannot assign or sub-let without the landlord's written consent,

    also ...its not a law , you said its there under the law...but dont provide a law !!


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    #47
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Corkbah wrote: »
    did you read that link ?? it doesn't say that the landlord must accept a sublet.


    also ...its not a law , you said its there under the law...but dont provide a law !!
    As a tenant, whilst you cannot assign or sub-let without the landlord's written consent, you may terminate the tenancy if they refuse your request. It is advisable to request a refusal in writing.

    Perhaps I phrased it badly. The landlord isnt obliged to accept the reassignment, but if they refuse it then the tenant may break the lease. It amounts to the same thing either way; no sensible landlord would refuse a reassignment when they know to accept it means that the tenant has to do the groundwork to find their replacement.

    Im not bothered going through the RTA2004 to pick out the relevant part; thats from the Threshold site, if you can find something in law that contradicts them then take it up with Threshold!


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    #48
    JustAThought
    Registered Users Posts: 5,324 ✭✭✭JustAThought


    I wouldn't be messing with the OPs head to try and get someone in, to a 3k a month rent, at the END of a lease, when there is a deposit and possibly outstanding bills involved. Nobody in their right mind would consider it - it's a school fantasy.

    Better to let the OP focus on REALISM & how they wil bridge the gap financially for the month - which no doubt will be manageable among 6 of them & their parents rather than trying to chase a 1 in a million off chance .

    OP - they will STILL chase your guarantor for the final Months RENT AND take the deposit for breach of contract . That's what they do - every time - that's how they make their money. So you'd better plan around that & ask perhaps for them to do an inspection in advance of the final month so that you can try and negotiate - however the remaining utility bills and meter readings before you depart for gas, electricity, phone,& broadband/tV for the final Month will also be a factor as will a final inspection for damages/ missing items/spoilage etc

    It all goes back to the guarantor.Don't shaft your guarantor.


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    #49
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    JustAThought wrote: »
    I wouldn't be messing with the OPs head to try and get someone in, to a 3k a month rent, at the END of a lease, when there is a deposit and possibly outstanding bills involved. Nobody in their right mind would consider it - it's a school fantasy.

    Better to let the OP focus on REALISM & how they wil bridge the gap financially for the month - which no doubt will be manageable among 6 of them & their parents rather than trying to chase a 1 in a million off chance .

    So youre saying its not worth the effort of throwing an ad up on Daft for the sake of saving a few grand? :confused:


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    #50
    StillWaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,799 ✭✭✭StillWaters


    djimi wrote: »
    So youre saying its not worth the effort of throwing an ad up on Daft for the sake of saving a few grand? :confused:

    Realistically they probably wont find anyone willing to take a short let, move utilities etc, and the LL probably won't agree. It's too big a risk and too much hassle when he has a guarantor in place.


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    #51
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    StillWaters wrote: »
    Realistically they probably wont find anyone willing to take a short let, move utilities etc, and the LL probably won't agree. It's too big a risk and too much hassle when he has a guarantor in place.

    But they may get someone willing to take a longer lease, I'm sure the LL would not mind that


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    #52
    StillWaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,799 ✭✭✭StillWaters


    ted1 wrote: »
    But they may get someone willing to take a longer lease, I'm sure the LL would not mind that

    No, they can't do that. They can only reassign their existing lease.


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    #53
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    StillWaters wrote: »
    Realistically they probably wont find anyone willing to take a short let, move utilities etc, and the LL probably won't agree. It's too big a risk and too much hassle when he has a guarantor in place.

    The landlord has no choice but to agree (or face losing the tenant altogether).

    I agree; its unlikely to happen, but its the OPs only legal out, and for the sake of the cost of an ad on Daft Id say its worth it if it means them saving a few grand.
    StillWaters wrote: »
    No, they can't do that. They can only reassign their existing lease.

    Something tells me if they go to the landlord now and say that they have found someone who is willing to sign a 12 month lease the landlord is not going to turn them away.


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    #54
    odds_on
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,869 ✭✭✭odds_on


    Corkbah wrote: »
    can you please provide a link to this law (I've never heard of it) .... my experience of the renting world is that if its not in the contract its not permitted.

    How I do hate it when posters use "secondhand" information from websites like Threshold instead of going to the Original.

    Threahold, while giving excellent information, sometimes fail to differentiate between Part 4 lease laws and Fixed Term laws.

    Section 186 of the RTA 2004:
    186.—(1) This section has effect—
    (a) despite the fact that the tenancy concerned is one for a fixed
    period, and
    (b) despite anything to the contrary in the lease or tenancy
    agreement concerned.
    (2) If a landlord of a dwelling refuses his or her consent to an
    assignment or sub-letting of the tenancy concerned by the tenant,
    the tenant may serve a notice of termination in respect of the tenancy
    and terminate it accordingly.


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    #55
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    How is that any different from what I posted with my "secondhand information"?


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    #56
    odds_on
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,869 ✭✭✭odds_on


    djimi wrote: »
    How is that any different from what I posted with my "secondhand information"?
    Someone might easily try to dispute "secondhand" information.
    Much more difficult to dispute the original.


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    #57
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    Right...


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    #58
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    StillWaters wrote: »
    No, they can't do that. They can only reassign their existing lease.

    You say Can't as if its final.

    the landlord can do what ever it wants. if i had a choice of

    a.) tenants movign out, possibly goign to have an empty unit

    or

    b.) tenant movign otu and soemoen movign in straight away and sigining a 12 month or 14 month lease

    I know which one I would take.


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    #59
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,379 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    Seriously lads they will not be able to get anywhere close to €2,900 for a three bed apartment. I have seen nice 3 bed houses in Ballsbridge for 60% of that price. It is astronomical price unless something really special which the Op says it isn't. The Op might have a claim for a market rent assessment from the PRTB but that may be unlikely given how recently they signed the lease.
    I would think there is no doubt the landlord would pursue the guarantor. Otherwise why would he bother with them?
    I wonder whose name is actually on the lease? Is it all 6 or just 1 person?


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