Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Property Tax return

Options
  • 12-05-2013 2:01pm
    #1
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭


    Just completing this online and looking for ways to justify a lower valuation.

    I am using an average of properties sold in the area. However, I intend reducing the average price further to account for the impact of property tax.

    I am justifying this because historic prices do not reflect the impact of property tax on value as of 1 May. Property tax is equivalent to approx 5% of the rental value of the house so am reducing the value of the property by an additional 5%.

    Thoughts? Is this reasonable?


Comments

  • Options
    #2
    athtrasna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,420 ✭✭✭✭athtrasna


    What makes you think that there will be a reduction in the value of properties due to the introduction of property tax? If you were to put your property on the market in the morning would you look to sell it at 5% less than the recent averages? Somehow I don't think so


  • Options
    #3
    jamesccp
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭jamesccp


    On the radio they said the taxman will only be after people who have not registered for the first year or so until they have got all of them. Then they will move onto people with value way out of range with all of their neighbours but if your only one tax band down they may leave you alone until the next valuation which is in three years. I was in the 250-300 bracket but changed it and paid the 200-250 which was the estimate most of my neighbours got. Horrible tax hate it


  • Options
    #4
    Phoebas
    Registered Users Posts: 9,371 ✭✭✭Phoebas


    Bigcheeze wrote: »
    Just completing this online and looking for ways to justify a lower valuation.

    I am using an average of properties sold in the area. However, I intend reducing the average price further to account for the impact of property tax.

    I am justifying this because historic prices do not reflect the impact of property tax on value as of 1 May. Property tax is equivalent to approx 5% of the rental value of the house so am reducing the value of the property by an additional 5%.

    Thoughts? Is this reasonable?
    It seems an odd justification - you might be better using some other professional estimate of the impact on property tax on the market.

    Is 5% just the figure you need to bring you into the next band down?


  • Options
    #5
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    go put down whatever value you want. I look forward to laughing at you and others who get hit hard for their flimsy reasons for undervaluation.


  • Options
    #6
    OU812
    Registered Users Posts: 6,050 ✭✭✭OU812


    Use the official government supplied valuation - national property price register website.

    They provide the actual value of houses sold in your area. They can't exactly argue with that.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #7
    jamesccp
    Registered Users Posts: 77 ✭✭jamesccp


    If you are 1 or 5 thousand over by the government valuation which they admit is wrong in the majority of cases. Its is not flimsy to put yourself in lower tax bracket. D3p0 u seem like a very nice chap


  • Options
    #8
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    jamesccp wrote: »
    If you are 1 or 5 thousand over by the government valuation which they admit is wrong in the majority of cases. Its is not flimsy to put yourself in lower tax bracket. D3p0 u seem like a very nice chap

    He is a very nice helpful chap. Take a look at his post history and you'll see that.

    You or your family have never had any serious interactions with revenue have you? My dads self employed. Trust me audits are scary.

    Value your house at what you value it at. It's revenue not the flimsy local council with feck all powers.
    They mightn't get you this year, but they will get you eventually. They always do. They will audit a select amount in each category. Not just outliers. They will ask how you came to that value. Now if you've evidence to justify that value fair enough. If you don't, we'll then your screwed.

    This looked perfectly legal avoidance of tax. Revenue were able to put a successful case together that it was evasion. http://www.irishtimes.com/news/revenue-wins-key-taxation-case-1.751206

    It's at your own peril if you value your house below the limit. Is it worth the risk for a hundred quid?


  • Options
    #9
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Bigcheeze


    athtrasna wrote: »
    What makes you think that there will be a reduction in the value of properties due to the introduction of property tax?

    The Accommodation and Property forum on Boards is full of threads telling me that the property tax will drive prices down further.


  • Options
    #10
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Bigcheeze


    D3PO wrote: »
    go put down whatever value you want. I look forward to laughing at you and others who get hit hard for their flimsy reasons for undervaluation.

    Hello Mr. Angry man off the internet. Unless Revenue can come up with a superior valuation methodology I don't see what they can do about it.


  • Options
    #11
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Bigcheeze


    Phoebas wrote: »
    It seems an odd justification - you might be better using some other professional estimate of the impact on property tax on the market.

    Is 5% just the figure you need to bring you into the next band down?

    If I take the average of properties sold on the road, it gets me (just about) 3 bands below the revenue estimate. This would be additional justification.


  • Advertisement
  • Options
    #12
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Bigcheeze wrote: »
    Hello Mr. Angry man off the internet. Unless Revenue can come up with a superior valuation methodology I don't see what they can do about it.

    They'll look at ppr.
    " Oh big cheese your next door neighbours house sold for 500k last year. You've valued your house at 400k. Have property prices fallen by 20% in your area in the last year? If so can we see proof?"


  • Options
    #13
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Bigcheeze wrote: »
    If I take the average of properties sold on the road, it gets me (just about) 3 bands below the revenue estimate. This would be additional justification.

    Revenues value is done on the average price if the property In that locality/town. Some roads are better than others. Some roads will be below the value others will be above.

    If the average price of the most recent sales on your road are 3 bands below the value, then that's what you put down as the value.
    Once you have proof in case an audit is done revenue dont mind.
    Our house was valued 300k below its value because that's the average price of a house in our town. It's just an average, not the value of each individual house.


  • Options
    #14
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Bigcheeze


    Scortho wrote: »
    They mightn't get you this year, but they will get you eventually.

    Why would they get me? I believe adjusting the historical data for relevant factors such as property tax will achieve the most accurate valuation.

    Revenue have instructed me to value the house at 1st May 2013, 11 days ago, so I don't have exact historical data.

    Bizarrely the 1st May valuation date involves many people predicting the future as the postal deadline was 1st May.


  • Options
    #15
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Bigcheeze


    Scortho wrote: »
    They'll look at ppr.
    " Oh big cheese your next door neighbours house sold for 500k last year. You've valued your house at 400k. Have property prices fallen by 20% in your area in the last year? If so can we see proof?"

    I'm using PPR less 5%


  • Options
    #16
    Scortho
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,876 ✭✭✭Scortho


    Bigcheeze wrote: »
    I'm using PPR less 5%

    Ask yourself if you were to put your property on the market, would you accept 5% less than ppr.
    If yes then that's fair enough


  • Options
    #17
    Bigcheeze
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,858 ✭✭✭Bigcheeze


    Scortho wrote: »
    Ask yourself if you were to put your property on the market, would you accept 5% less than ppr.
    If yes then that's fair enough

    What I would accept isn't relevant. The highest bid is relevant. And I'm not in a position to find out so I'm using the best alternative.


  • Options
    #18
    StillWaters
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,799 ✭✭✭StillWaters


    Bigcheeze wrote: »
    The Accommodation and Property forum on Boards is full of threads telling me that the property tax will drive prices down further.

    Oh well then just ask the Revenue Auditor to read this forum then, that will get you off the hook.


  • Options
    #19
    zumi
    Registered Users Posts: 26 ✭zumi


    I just watched this from beginning to end and its an eye-opener. Can be hard to hear at times but worth watching. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KkcPTLMdKmc


Advertisement