Waterford City Outlet?

GrandBlaa

Got a leaflet in the post earlier for Waterford City Outlet -a company called Parker Green International want to build:

"...proposing a €70 million Outlet Centre, offering... outlet brands at discount prices at the former Waterford Crystal Playing Fields, Cork Road... Parker Green will soon lodge a planning application for consideration to Waterford City Council..."

The leaflet ends by requesting thoughts on the proposal to an email address.

Now, I'm all for Waterford's economic recovery, but doesn't this strike anybody else as useless? We've already-built retail centres laying idle in Ferrybank, Abbeylands and I think a few in the city centre as well?

The leaflet itself is impressive and professionally created with lots of 3D mock-ups and the usual spiel about Waterford being Ireland's oldest city.

But there's something off-kilter about the leaflet, imho. It advises people "If you would like to... register your interest for a position at Waterford City Outlet please email..." Err, that's a bit cock-sure, no? And why blanket-mail people requesting they respond via email? To pre-empt planning objections? It's all very strange.

Max Powers

GrandBlaa wrote: »

Got a leaflet in the post earlier for Waterford City Outlet -a company called Parker Green International want to build:

"...proposing a €70 million Outlet Centre, offering... outlet brands at discount prices at the former Waterford Crystal Playing Fields, Cork Road... Parker Green will soon lodge a planning application for consideration to Waterford City Council..."

The leaflet ends by requesting thoughts on the proposal to an email address.

Now, I'm all for Waterford's economic recovery, but doesn't this strike anybody else as useless? We've already-built retail centres laying idle in Ferrybank, Abbeylands and I think a few in the city centre as well?

The leaflet itself is impressive and professionally created with lots of 3D mock-ups and the usual spiel about Waterford being Ireland's oldest city.

But there's something off-kilter about the leaflet, imho. It advises people "If you would like to... register your interest for a position at Waterford City Outlet please email..." Err, that's a bit cock-sure, no? And why blanket-mail people requesting they respond via email? To pre-empt planning objections? It's all very strange.

Agree, as much as I would like to see something positive happening on retail front, i dont know (open to persuasion) that a out of town outlet is good. Then again, it could attract visitors like that one in Kildare (never been to it but i hear the ads on radio).

TheGormog

GrandBlaa wrote: »

Got a leaflet in the post earlier for Waterford City Outlet -a company called Parker Green International want to build:

"...proposing a €70 million Outlet Centre, offering... outlet brands at discount prices at the former Waterford Crystal Playing Fields, Cork Road... Parker Green will soon lodge a planning application for consideration to Waterford City Council..."

The leaflet ends by requesting thoughts on the proposal to an email address.

Now, I'm all for Waterford's economic recovery, but doesn't this strike anybody else as useless? We've already-built retail centres laying idle in Ferrybank, Abbeylands and I think a few in the city centre as well?

The leaflet itself is impressive and professionally created with lots of 3D mock-ups and the usual spiel about Waterford being Ireland's oldest city.

But there's something off-kilter about the leaflet, imho. It advises people "If you would like to... register your interest for a position at Waterford City Outlet please email..." Err, that's a bit cock-sure, no? And why blanket-mail people requesting they respond via email? To pre-empt planning objections? It's all very strange.

Parker Green are the owners/developers of the Ferrybank shopping centre. Bertie is on the board of directors.

Max Powers

TheGormog wrote: »

Parker Green are the owners/developers of the Ferrybank shopping centre. Bertie is on the board of directors.

Thats a big negative then. I wouldnt want that man or any trace of his dealings anywhere near us

GrandBlaa

TheGormog wrote: »

Parker Green are the owners/developers of the Ferrybank shopping centre. Bertie is on the board of directors.

Yikes! :eek:

Suspicions affirmed!

jimbojazz

Wasn't something similar for this site granted planning permission a few years ago - can't remember what the name of the development company was - think they were from Newry

invalid

jimbojazz wrote: »

Wasn't something similar for this site granted planning permission a few years ago - can't remember what the name of the development company was - think they were from Newry

Thats Parker Green, they bought the Waterford Crystal Social Club site back during the madness for silly money.

jimbojazz

This is from their website

http://www.parkergreen.com/pages/index.asp?title=Waterford_City_Outlet%2C_Waterford%2C_Republic_of_Ireland

Looks like the next phase of what they previously got planning for - which was never built - could they be getting approval for these developments in order to increase the value of the site in the hope that when the market picks up they can sell it on

I remember that the cinema was going to go ahead before anything else was built - it was going to be built on a stilt like structure afaik - obviously never happened

I'd be a bit sceptical about this development ever happening - bit like New Street

iseegirls

Who designed that brochure??

Some of the text placed over the images is very hard to read.

From the 3D aerial view of the whole site on Page 2, where is the main Cork Road? Is it at the top or bottom?

Bards

I think it will be a good compliment to the City especially with shuttle buses to/from the Centre, which will lead to increased spend/footfall in the City Centre which will in turn lead to a more vibrant City. - This is not the same as an Out of Town Retail Mall (ferrybank) selling the same stuff (Albeit cheaper) than whats available in the CIty Centre.

I have often visited Kildare Outlet Centre and on each occasion I have travelled into Kildare Town centre and spent money which otherwise I would not have.

Full Brochure - http://www.parkergreen.com/media/uploads/Waterford%20City%20Outlet%20Information%20Brochure.pdf

ToxicPaddy

I dunno, something doesn't sit right about this whole company.

But we shall wait and see. They seem to be sitting on a hell of a lot of land in various locations around Europe and the US but not really doing much with it..

Max Powers

ToxicPaddy wrote: »

I dunno, something doesn't sit right about this whole company.

But we shall wait and see. They seem to be sitting on a hell of a lot of land in various locations around Europe and the US but not really doing much with it..

Thinking about this and i reckon it shouldnt go ahead, it would take from city centre, simple as that. Bertie Crook involved is definitely a negative too. We dont want to end up like Limerick where no one goes into city centre. (bit of exaggeration i know but most from Limerick will tell you that big SC they built killed the centre.)

BBM77

What Waterford needs for the greater good is the Newgate Centre to be built as it received planning permission a few of years ago. The last thing it needs is another dodgy out of town retail development. Not to mention the fact that the likes of Bertie Ahern aren’t involved in developments that are for the greater good. It never fails to amaze me that the likes of Parker Green and Dodgy Ahern never fail to forget Waterford when they want to do something like this but they are never behind something like the Newgate Centre that would actually be of benefit to the city.

Max Powers

BBM77 wrote: »

What Waterford needs for the greater good is the Newgate Centre to be built as it received planning permission a few of years ago. The last thing it needs is another dodgy out of town retail development. Not to mention the fact that the likes of Bertie Ahern aren’t involved in developments that are for the greater good. It never fails to amaze me that the likes of Parker Green and Dodgy Ahern never fail to forget Waterford when they want to do something like this but they are never behind something like the Newgate Centre that would actually be of benefit to the city.

agreed, Newgate would have been employing good few construction trades now if going, could attract a few big name retailers to city which would cement Waterford as a shopping destination especially for SE. this would add to vibrancy of the place also. It will be built, it sjust going to be delayed now, City Square was delayed and was years behind schedule.

artful_codger

What Waterford City really needs is a business park not a retail park. If a multi national / high tech company want to locate in Waterford, where would they go, the IDA industrial estate? Something like East Point, Park West or City West in Dublin.

Max Powers

artful_codger wrote: »

What Waterford City really needs is a business park not a retail park. If a multi national / high tech company want to locate in Waterford, where would they go, the IDA industrial estate? Something like East Point, Park West or City West in Dublin.

not bad yeah, we do have that tech park out in butlerstown. Plans (APPARENTLY) for new building out there (to go with citibank one...i know)with a view to it being occupied by some company.

I say apparently because so far the last couple of years I have heard about plans for quays (i know of some of the contractor problems there), fire station, courthouse, IDA new building in tech park, City square extension, all planned but nowt happening.

DeiseforLiam

I'd say the reason they're canvassing in this manner is to drum up public support so that the councillors will be more likely to vote in favour of a rezoning, which I assume it will require.

tonc76

MetalMan9 wrote: »

I'd say the reason they're canvassing in this manner is to drum up public support so that the councillors will be more likely to vote in favour of a rezoning, which I assume it will require.

From the brochure:

Parker Green International have already secured planning permission for a mixed use development including an 8 screen Omniplex Cinema with restaurants, cafes and other leisure uses, which will sit alongside Waterford City Outlet.

Can PP be awarded before lands are rezoned?

spankmemunkey

What does Waterford need one of these for? nobody has any money to spend anyway, unemployment is one of the high counties in Ireland, i know it will create jobs but cant be enough to sustain a large shopping mall and like most people said theres shops already empty, then again if they do a nice good job and get it right it might work depending what goes into it.

I wonder what does Noel Frisby make of it after he just bought Waterford Crystal site for development?

decies

If Michael street development had been up and running , it might work as you could have a twin track approach ie link transport between the two as it is, it would kill the city centre end create a ghost town .

Dum_Dum

spankmemunkey wrote: »

What does Waterford need one of these for? nobody has any money to spend anyway, unemployment is one of the high counties in Ireland, i know it will create jobs but cant be enough to sustain a large shopping mall and like most people said theres shops already empty, then again if they do a nice good job and get it right it might work depending what goes into it....

Exactly. Retailing is the 'fun bit' at the end of a process in which the town goes out there, makes and generates wealth, pulls income in from outside and then spends it.

spankmemunkey

Dum_Dum wrote: »

Exactly. Retailing is the 'fun bit' at the end of a process in which the town goes out there, makes and generates wealth, pulls income in from outside and then spends it.

I wouldnt really see outside custom, i presume you mean outside the county? Cork has a great retail set up, plenty of shops so i doubt cork people would travel to waterford for shopping,

With high unemployment people have very little disposable income these days as we all know, There were plans there awhile back i dont know if its the same site, but it had cinema and like leisure plex bowling pool food courts shopping and so on,

DeiseforLiam

tonc76 wrote: »

From the brochure:

Parker Green International have already secured planning permission for a mixed use development including an 8 screen Omniplex Cinema with restaurants, cafes and other leisure uses, which will sit alongside Waterford City Outlet.

Can PP be awarded before lands are rezoned?

I might be wrong but I don't think they have planning for a retail outlet yet.

tonc76

MetalMan9 wrote: »

I might be wrong but I don't think they have planning for a retail outlet yet.

Planning with conditions granted

http://www.waterfordcity.ie/ePlan41/FileRefDetails.aspx?file_number=06371&LASiteID=0

Decision Description: a mixed use development of 36,556.5sq.m.(all development areas in gross floor space) on a 6.55 ha site within an 8.9ha overall site to be developed as phase 1 of a two phase development. The proposed scheme comprises of six blocks with associated access, parking, and all other landscaping and services installation intrinsic to the development and all ancillary site development works.BLOCK A: comprises an integrated Conference and Enterprise Centre of 3906 sq.m. incorporating ground, mezzanine, first & second floor levels including a gallery area, conference and banqueting facilities. This building is designed to have flexible exhibition/conference spaces with start up enterprises offices.BLOCK B: contains a Hotel of 7829 sq.m. over 5 floors a bar & cafe to be located on the ground floor, with restaurant and deck area on first floor, 104 guest rooms split over the first, second, third and fourth floors.BLOCK C: comprises of 5 No. retail warehouse units with mezzanine retail spaces with office space overhead with a total floor area of 9305 sq.m. with the retail warehousing units comprising a total area of 6315 sq.m., and a total office floor area of 2990 sq.m. BLOCK D:with a total floorspace of 6737 sq.m. incorporates an eight screen Cinema at first floor level with a total seat capacity of 1516 covering an area of 37second and third floors to include a waiting area, 8 No. treatment rooms, 28 No. consultation rooms, offices and a rooftop garden. BLOCK E: comprises a Polyclinic covering an area of 2541.5sq.m. incorporating a ground floor reception and Pharmacy, first, second and third floors to include a waiting area, 8 No. treatment rooms, 28 No. consultation rooms, offices and a rooftop garden. BLOCK F: relates to an anchor retail warehouse covering an area of 6238 sq.m. incorporating a main retail floor, offices/ancillary spaces, covered builders yard, service yard and garden centre. A public Plaza with primarily pedestrian walkway will link the Polyclinic & Hotel to the Retail units & Cinema. A total of 753 carparking spaces to be provided within the overall proposed development.Access to the development site is proposed from the Cork Road(N25) which will be via a signalled controlled T-junction, located immediately to the east of Waterford Crystal Sports & Leisure Centre. An Environmental Impact Statement will be submitted with the application.

DeiseforLiam

I meant that type of retail. The reason TKMAX moved into town. As I said though, I might be wrong and this might cover it.

In my own opinion, I don't think that the town centre is strong enough not to suffer if it goes ahead.

Max Powers

Write to your councillors guys, make sure this monstrosity that will kill the city centre doesnt go ahead.

O Riain

How on gods Earth did this get planning permission????

tankbarry

the city has already being killed.

Max Powers

tankbarry wrote: »

the city has already being killed.

cheers for your positivity. i think only part of it has been approved, thats why they are doing all this publicity i would have thought.

Sully

I think this has potential but I do have concerns it will be a further blow for the City Center which is already struggling. The council and various bodies are working wonders to try help, but I am not sure these Friday offers will see a major shift. I would like to see more incentives for businesses to open up in any empty units that are sitting around (and there isn't many, IIRC). The problem appears to be getting locals to shop and stay in Waterford, more so than the shops.

tankbarry

Maybe Sully you should go to the council that you think are doing a good job and tell them maybe if they drop the rates a bit it might help !