Waterford City Outlet?

Max Powers

Parker green are looking for permission for this in munster express planning section. I would urge all to write to your councillors to tell them your views on it. I have and told them that this would take business away from the city centre, close down more businesses in city centre and harm all the work being done to try and create a vibrant city centre.

fiesty lady

We need jobs in Waterford this petty attitude city centre versus outside shopping malls is stupid. Any investors that will bring jobs to Waterford should be encouraged, I have visited this company s shopping malls in Newbridge and Junction 1 near Belfast and was very impressed by both.

IanVW

fiesty lady wrote: »

We need jobs in Waterford this petty attitude city centre versus outside shopping malls is stupid. Any investors that will bring jobs to Waterford should be encouraged, I have visited this company s shopping malls in Newbridge and Junction 1 near Belfast and was very impressed by both.

Agree 100% ill be fully supporting this!

Max Powers

fiesty lady wrote: »

We need jobs in Waterford this petty attitude city centre versus outside shopping malls is stupid. Any investors that will bring jobs to Waterford should be encouraged, I have visited this company s shopping malls in Newbridge and Junction 1 near Belfast and was very impressed by both.

do you honestly think that this wont have a big negative effect on the city centre?
PS there is nothing petty about what i said.

O Riain

fiesty lady wrote: »

We need jobs in Waterford this petty attitude city centre versus outside shopping malls is stupid. Any investors that will bring jobs to Waterford should be encouraged, I have visited this company s shopping malls in Newbridge and Junction 1 near Belfast and was very impressed by both.

Do you not realise that this will cost more jobs than it will make????

Libby029

In fairness I don't think we can get any less going into the city centre.. the only reason most people go into the city centre is either to buy from Penneys or Dunnes... everything else can be bought on the outskirts of town. I think this city is on it's knees and if there is anyway of getting more employment back into the city, be it city centre or outskirts, we should be grabbing it with both hands and holding on for dear life!!

Max Powers

Libby029 wrote: »

In fairness I don't think we can get any less going into the city centre.. the only reason most people go into the city centre is either to buy from Penneys or Dunnes... everything else can be bought on the outskirts of town. I think this city is on it's knees and if there is anyway of getting more employment back into the city, be it city centre or outskirts, we should be grabbing it with both hands and holding on for dear life!!

yeah we are all for jobs but not at the expense of the city centre viability. If the city centre dies, no one or any tourists will come here. Vibrancy of the city centre is paramount. In my experience i used to know loads of people who on saturday would drive to TKmaxx (on ORR) and back home again, the same people drive to town now, do TKmaxx and visit other places; debenhams, book centre, coffee, too.
Just ask anyone from Limerick what the centre on outskirts of there has done to city centre, lovely shopping centre and no one in town, i have visited both on same day myself and it was busier in the out of town SC, Limerick have realised that this was a terrible move and are trying their damdest to bring people back.

Libby, you recognise that the city is on its knees (quote) yet you are supporting to reduce the people traffic in the city further. This thing would be viable if we had a thriving city centre, we dont unfortuantly, the attitude of sure get whatever you need outside the city centre is contributing to the problem

gw80

why not just embrace the doughnut instead of fighting a losing battle, but do it properly.

The outer bypass road is perfect for it, lets face it we all use the shops on the outskirts because they,er convenient, accsess,parkability (maybe not a word).

lets make it a feature of the city, and keep the city center for tourists and recreation, pubs,clubs a few restraunts and cafes ect,
Completly rebuild the city walls,

"give the people(and the tourists)what they want"

Just a taught.

Libby029

Max Powers wrote: »

yeah we are all for jobs but not at the expense of the city centre viability. If the city centre dies, no one or any tourists will come here. Vibrancy of the city centre is paramount. In my experience i used to know loads of people who on saturday would drive to TKmaxx (on ORR) and back home again, the same people drive to town now, do TKmaxx and visit other places; debenhams, book centre, coffee, too.
Just ask anyone from Limerick what the centre on outskirts of there has done to city centre, lovely shopping centre and no one in town, i have visited both on same day myself and it was busier in the out of town SC, Limerick have realised that this was a terrible move and are trying their damdest to bring people back.

Libby, you recognise that the city is on its knees (quote) yet you are supporting to reduce the people traffic in the city further. This thing would be viable if we had a thriving city centre, we dont unfortuantly, the attitude of sure get whatever you need outside the city centre is contributing to the problem

Waterford City is no longer a shopping city and hasn't been for many many years.. so why try to fool yourself by trying to get foot fall back into the city, when there is such a lack of business there.. the only time there is decent footfall is when there is festivals in the town, but unless there is going to be a festival in the city every single week that is the only way to increase it. Waterford City needs to play on it's tourist draw in relation to the museums, restaurants etc it is time to change the way things have been done for years...plus I believe the rates in the city centre are huge, so when the city council is not helping to bring business into the town centre why would people open anything in there now. Look at Clonmel, they built a fine shopping centre on the outskirts of their town and it draws alot of people to the town... I have to say I often go to Clonmel for clothes shopping for my kids/house etc due to the better range and value I can get. There is a number of nice shops in the town itself, along with the usual big brand shops, even Dungarvan is a better town to shop in than Waterford. So why don't Waterford try to find a new niche? Why are people always so afraid of change?

BBM77

Libby029 wrote: »

...I think this city is on it's knees and if there is anyway of getting more employment back into the city, be it city centre or outskirts, we should be grabbing it with both hands and holding on for dear life!!

See this is the frame of mind that the developers are trying to take advantage of. They are not thinking of any long term benefit other than their own. The actual long term benefit of this development to Waterford would range from little to none. Parker Green knows that they will have a hard time getting planning for this so they speak of jobs and baseless claims through their leaflet (which you would want to be brain dead to accept) to force the city councils hand. They know that nobody wants to look like they are preventing job creation in this climate.

I also dispute the developer’s assertion that a retail outlet should be on the outskirts of a city. TK Maxx is effectively already doing the same thing in the city centre so why can’t they.

I have every attention to object to this development. It may not be my place to say this but I will say it anyway. I would encourage people to object also. Objecting to this development is not being anti-business or preventing job creation. This development is completely inappropriate for Waterford and developers like this need to be stood up to. If Parker Green wishes to develop in the city centre I will be the first to support them but not this.

decies

Libby029 wrote: »

Waterford City is no longer a shopping city and hasn't been for many many years.. so why try to fool yourself by trying to get foot fall back into the city, when there is such a lack of business there.. the only time there is decent footfall is when there is festivals in the town, but unless there is going to be a festival in the city every single week that is the only way to increase it. Waterford City needs to play on it's tourist draw in relation to the museums, restaurants etc it is time to change the way things have been done for years...plus I believe the rates in the city centre are huge, so when the city council is not helping to bring business into the town centre why would people open anything in there now. Look at Clonmel, they built a fine shopping centre on the outskirts of their town and it draws alot of people to the town... I have to say I often go to Clonmel for clothes shopping for my kids/house etc due to the better range and value I can get. There is a number of nice shops in the town itself, along with the usual big brand shops, even Dungarvan is a better town to shop in than Waterford. So why don't Waterford try to find a new niche? Why are people always so afraid of change?

Am around clonmel a lot for various reasons , the town has being hit just has hard as Waterford , don't know how you could say clonmel was better for shopping than Waterford . As for the shopping centre , it basically just contains a below average M+S you'd get a better selection in a WATERFORD Dunnes or Penneys . Look we just don't support our own recession or no recession . I wish the new proactive Waterford Retail organisation great success but its a big battle you have in front of you lads !!!

Max Powers

Libby029 wrote: »

Waterford City is no longer a shopping city and hasn't been for many many years.. so why try to fool yourself by trying to get foot fall back into the city, when there is such a lack of business there.. the only time there is decent footfall is when there is festivals in the town, but unless there is going to be a festival in the city every single week that is the only way to increase it. Waterford City needs to play on it's tourist draw in relation to the museums, restaurants etc it is time to change the way things have been done for years...plus I believe the rates in the city centre are huge, so when the city council is not helping to bring business into the town centre why would people open anything in there now. Look at Clonmel, they built a fine shopping centre on the outskirts of their town and it draws alot of people to the town... I have to say I often go to Clonmel for clothes shopping for my kids/house etc due to the better range and value I can get. There is a number of nice shops in the town itself, along with the usual big brand shops, even Dungarvan is a better town to shop in than Waterford. So why don't Waterford try to find a new niche? Why are people always so afraid of change?

says it all really, happy to go elsewhere, the grass is greener etc. I presume we can count on you to support the city centre in its time of need. I believe we can get back to where we were not so long ago. I work in Clonmel regularly and am here a lot more than yourself I would imagine, to say Clonmel or Dungarvan for that matter has better shopping is just plain deluded, they dont have half the number of shops they have in Waterford. We have better shops also, yeah fair enough there is an M&S here in Clonmel, its not up to much, i have been in there a few times. No debenhams, selection of cafes, resturants that we have, no where near the tourist attractions, cinema is crap, no TK Max, the book centre is far superior to any book shop in clonmel, no mothercare, etc etc. No one here is afraid of change and a couple of years ago I would have been in favour of a development like this, what annoys me is Waterford people willing to trump other areas because they head up there for a day out occasionaly and suddenly this is (place we are visiting) is much better than Waterford.

fiesty lady

Just been in town tonight free parking, live music on the street, lovely sunshine. . . Half the shops closed ( clarks, lily o briens, etc) about 50 people around, hard to see how an outlet mall outside the city will make things worse.

O Riain

fiesty lady wrote: »

Just been in town tonight free parking, live music on the street, lovely sunshine. . . Half the shops closed ( clarks, lily o briens, etc) about 50 people around, hard to see how an outlet mall outside the city will make things worse.

A lot of measures being introduced to try and draw people back in. What are we suppose to do, give up after week 1 and finally kill it off for good?

spankmemunkey

O Riain wrote: »

A lot of measures being introduced to try and draw people back in. What are we suppose to do, give up after week 1 and finally kill it off for good?

If there was no attempt made to bring a bit of life back into town people would be giving out, at least the powers that be are trying!

decies

Ironically if the weather is too nice it does the shops no favours people just hanging out at the beach or in their gardens , you can't blame people for that mind you . Friday night is a good initiative but maybe advertise a dedicated shopping festival with reductions , freebies , free entertainment . Spread the word around the southeast and further afield link it up with hotels and special offers .

gowley

Max Powers wrote: »

says it all really, happy to go elsewhere, the grass is greener etc. I presume we can count on you to support the city centre in its time of need. I believe we can get back to where we were not so long ago. I work in Clonmel regularly and am here a lot more than yourself I would imagine, to say Clonmel or Dungarvan for that matter has better shopping is just plain deluded, they dont have half the number of shops they have in Waterford. We have better shops also, yeah fair enough there is an M&S here in Clonmel, its not up to much, i have been in there a few times. No debenhams, selection of cafes, resturants that we have, no where near the tourist attractions, cinema is crap, no TK Max, the book centre is far superior to any book shop in clonmel, no mothercare, etc etc. No one here is afraid of change and a couple of years ago I would have been in favour of a development like this, what annoys me is Waterford people willing to trump other areas because they head up there for a day out occasionaly and suddenly this is (place we are visiting) is much better than Waterford.

would have to take issue with your point on the book centre. the prices they charge for books is far higher than easons in clonmel. i used to buy my books there and did mention the price difference. they told me they couldnt compete. now i know its a lovely shop with coffee but i will buy my books where they are not overpriced.

gowley

decies wrote: »

Am around clonmel a lot for various reasons , the town has being hit just has hard as Waterford , don't know how you could say clonmel was better for shopping than Waterford . As for the shopping centre , it basically just contains a below average M+S you'd get a better selection in a WATERFORD Dunnes or Penneys . Look we just don't support our own recession or no recession . I wish the new proactive Waterford Retail organisation great success but its a big battle you have in front of you lads !!!

in fairness clonmel also has a penneys even though it is smaller. they have three dunnes one of which is bigger than the waterford store and has free parking

Junior

Looks like this thing might be a step closer than we think, if the rates increases are to be believed on shops in the City Centre it will be dead by the City Councils hand quicker than by the development.

Psychedelic

Junior wrote: »

Looks like this thing might be a step closer than we think, if the rates increases are to be believed on shops in the City Centre it will be dead by the City Councils hand quicker than by the development.

People need to actually read up on the rates issue as there's a lot of misunderstanding of what's happening. First of all, City Council has nothing to do with the new rates - this is something being done by the Valuation Office. Secondly, many businesses will see their rates decrease significantly. Thirdly, the new rates are only being proposed, so businesses have an opportunity to appeal the new rate if they are not happy with it. That said, many businesses will see an increase in their rates. The whole rates system though is something the Government needs to revise, not local councils.

Junior

Psychedelic wrote: »

People need to actually read up on the rates issue as there's a lot of misunderstanding of what's happening. First of all, City Council has nothing to do with the new rates - this is something being done by the Valuation Office. Secondly, many businesses will see their rates decrease significantly. Thirdly, the new rates are only being proposed, so businesses have an opportunity to appeal the new rate if they are not happy with it. That said, many businesses will see an increase in their rates. The whole rates system though is something the Government needs to revise, not local councils.

Your point is contradictory many will see a decrease, many will see an increase ?

Which is it ?

If you can find anyone that's had a rates decrease I'd love to hear about it - I personally know of two business's one had a 50% increase another had a 100% increase

Whatever way you appeal that, it's not going to be a reduction, and in one of the cases, it's the amount that covers the wages for a part time staff member - you figure out what's going to happen there then.

Psychedelic

Junior wrote: »

Your point is contradictory many will see a decrease, many will see an increase ?

Which is it ?

Both. Many will see a decrease, many will see an increase. We'll mainly hear about the increases though, naturally, as this put businesses under more pressure or in worst case scenarios in danger of closing. I wonder what the split will be though, I'd guess it will be 50/50 (see my next point below).

Junior wrote: »

If you can find anyone that's had a rates decrease I'd love to hear about it - I personally know of two business's one had a 50% increase another had a 100% increase.

I have little to go on, but I have heard of some businesses getting reductions. I remember reading something ages ago when the revaluation process begun in Waterford, that the whole process was worked out so that the council wouldn't really see much difference to their rates income, in other words the amount of rate reductions will be about the same as all the rate increases. That's only a vague recollection now so I could have that wrong.

Junior wrote: »

Whatever way you appeal that, it's not going to be a reduction, and in one of the cases, it's the amount that covers the wages for a part time staff member - you figure out what's going to happen there then.

I agree. I don't think anyone will end up having to pay double their rates, but they will end up paying more rates even if they successfully appeal, and like you said that could lead to people losing jobs or even the business closing.

Max Powers

all in all another f-up from the govt, Waterford is as far as im aware one of the first counties with these new rate evaluations, wouldnt it have made sense to take into account the desperate struggle we are in here re: retail and unemployment. No such common sense from the govt. Yeah i know its just an estimate that can be appealed, how much luck will people have appealing them. You can be dam sure if this was Cork or Galway struggling and they tried this with their retailers, it would be Dail business today.

0rt

Blanket friend requests on fb as well by the looks of it.

sandin

On rates the changes will be revenue neutral however some low rated locations which are busy will see big rises and other locations that have seen a fall in business will see rates fall. I'm involved in a business in Waterford and I expect a rise of about 40%, I don't like it, but up to now I've paid relatively low rates compared to other stores I have.

Max Powers

sandin wrote: »

On rates the changes will be revenue neutral however some low rated locations which are busy will see big rises and other locations that have seen a fall in business will see rates fall. I'm involved in a business in Waterford and I expect a rise of about 40%, I don't like it, but up to now I've paid relatively low rates compared to other stores I have.

i posted couple weeks ago that dublin city council are doing lower rates for some businesses, start ups etc, why cant WCC do same.

bilibob

I'd love to know if they have jacked up tesco ardkeen or nexts rates doubling them? Somehow I doubt it.

wellboytoo

Junior wrote: »

Your point is contradictory many will see a decrease, many will see an increase ?

Which is it ?

If you can find anyone that's had a rates decrease I'd love to hear about it - I personally know of two business's one had a 50% increase another had a 100% increase

Whatever way you appeal that, it's not going to be a reduction, and in one of the cases, it's the amount that covers the wages for a part time staff member - you figure out what's going to happen there then.

I got a rates decrease in the City and the County on Industrial properties
over 20% so it is not just a rumour, it seems shops got the big hit, but I am still appealing as the rates are higher than the rent roll in some instances still!

7upfree

Psychedelic wrote: »

People need to actually read up on the rates issue as there's a lot of misunderstanding of what's happening. First of all, City Council has nothing to do with the new rates - this is something being done by the Valuation Office.

Who are these people? And where the fcuk are they getting their valuations from? Deevy's Garage valued at €1.25m - in this climate? Completely detached from reality.

Psychedelic wrote: »

Secondly, many businesses will see their rates decrease significantly.

If you're a multinational on the Estate. They've gone down by 25% apparently.

Psychedelic wrote: »

Thirdly, the new rates are only being proposed, so businesses have an opportunity to appeal the new rate if they are not happy with it. That said, many businesses will see an increase in their rates. The whole rates system though is something the Government needs to revise, not local councils.

Apparently not. Many businesses have been told "This is it - suck it up".

Not a clue between the whole lot of them. Unbridled stupidity which will result in job losses. While certain neighbouring towns have had their rates REDUCED!

Having spoken to a business person recently he informed my that some small City Centre sole traders have seen increses in rates of between 70 & 100%. I agree it needs revision at the minimum. Or scrapping completely.

jennygirl

and what do rates pay for --- street cleaning and

---

used to cover rubbish, water etc -
now there are all seperate prices for them -

Friend of Mine with a small take away in city centre was paying €2,750 a year - now €14,000 -
his rent is 450 a week - reasonable enough!