Dublin Airport New Runway/Infrastructure.

SharkMX

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249398#Comment_121249398

True but the poster was pretending that an airport that close to them on the map doesnt drown out conversations etc and that noone there in 8 years had ever mentioned departing aircraft. Total bull.

dublin12367

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249423#Comment_121249423

It really doesn’t though. I’d be in a similar situation to that poster and nobody takes any notice around me either as they’ve always gone in and out in those directions. North runway residents simply don’t want to allow themselves get used to the noise.

blackwhite

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249398#Comment_121249398

You're missing option 3) there.

Make as much fuss as possible in the hope of getting a few €€€€€

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249402#Comment_121249402

Why should the number of passengers be a planning matter? I could at least understand if the cap were the number of flights. What business is this for planners? Capacity depends on daily peaks, so if you fit in extra passenges in off-peak (daytime) hours why should this be a matter fpr planners?

Are there planning restrictions on the annual numbers viditing the Aviva, Croke Park, Heuston Station, my local pub?

The whole thing is a tribute to our mad planning regime and the over-reach of planners.

dublin12367

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249990#Comment_121249990

100 percent agree and from I understand it is to do with the road infrastructure of said passengers travelling in and out of the airport where the cap comes into play.

Economics101

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250089#Comment_121250089

If its got to do with the road infrastructure, then why an annual passenger limit? The roads are a peak-hour problem, not an annual one.

It's still mad over-reach by planners.

Dublinflyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121249990#Comment_121249990

But there is no need for a third terminal (unless daa get to build and run it)

davebuck

DAA keep talking about seeking planning for 40Million up from the present 32 million but nothing so far and with the current delays don't expect any decision for a couple of years following appeals and court case!!

Charles Babbage

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121250469#Comment_121250469

The airport generates a lot of traffic at 04:30 for the early wave, but of course the road network can handle that fine.

goodlad_ourvlad

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121245152#Comment_121245152

it was in ref to your:

"In fact I just arrived at that office i was talking about 10 minutes ago and they are very loud already this morning. Some much louder than others. I woudlnt be going for a nap for sure."

Those planes were arriving....

LXFlyer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121253187#Comment_121253187

To be fair, if you look back on FR24 (which I did to check), at the time that post was made, the switch hadn’t happened, and they were actually still taking off on 28R.

I do think people on both sides of the debate could maybe take a small step backwards here - there’s elements of truth on both sides of the argument, and sweeping statements don’t really help on either side.

As I said before, given the limited visits the quoted poster makes to that location, it’s perfectly possible they were never there when 16/34 was in operation.

At the same time, references to sleep being disturbed are misplaced as take-offs using 28R will only happen between 07:00 and 23:00.

For sure, the noise levels will be significantly different than before with aircraft taking off, but again perhaps some of the descriptions are a tad exaggerated.

The truth lies somewhere in between and there are going to have be compromises.

Murph85

Dublin Airport in talks with airlines on staying below 32m passenger ‘cap’ for flights – The Irish Times

what a farce... if they are concerned, maybe proper road infrastructure and public transport should be put into place. Government decision not to to that for decades, not a DAA one...

dublin12367

With 5 new transatlantic routes alone announced for next year, daa would seriously want to get a move on with the apron/ pier/ gates expansion.

MICKEYG

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282576#Comment_121282576

They would have wanted to get a move on 4 years ago.

T2 was great in that it had more capacity than needed but that foresight has gone.

The new runway is very good (aprt form the operational hours) but gate space is a joke now and will take years to rectify.

dublin12367

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282592#Comment_121282592

Agree, any additional gate space that’s panned to get to 40m will be at capacity again by the time it is actually completed.

L1011

It might make more sense to wait until the new planning regulations are fully in place rather than get caught in the run out queue at abp

davebuck

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283539#Comment_121283539

They must be waiting on something as they've been talking about planning for T1+T2 pier upgrades for the last 5/6 months and also the cap up to 40PPA either its poor planning on DAA's side or they've been advised to wait as you mention. From planning application to commencement can easily be at least 18 months etc. so time is not on DAA's side with gate/pier capacity stretched already....

dublin12367

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121284473#Comment_121284473

Taken from the Independent. Now December before application will be lodged.

"An application to amend the annual cap to 40 million passengers will be submitted to Fingal County Council in December this year as part of DAA’s Infrastructure Application,” said Kevin Cullinane, DAA group head of communications.

“The application will include a number of infrastructure developments and investments that will support and enable the growth of Dublin Airport to cater for Ireland’s future demand for international air travel while achieving its stated goal to reduce carbon emissions by 51pc by 2030 and to be net-zero by 2050,” he added.

Kev11491

forgive my paint job, but with the north dock proposal would you think that it will eventually lead to a T3 something along the lines of the above?

L1011

Single-sided terminal wouldn't happen anymore. I hope!

A protruding pier from a terminal head building like that would be too close to the runway also

Kev11491

Aren’t they building hangers over close to the runway?

davepatr07

Hasn't Ryanair got planning permission building it's hanger down opposite existing Aer Lingus hanger (6)? Bit of a tight fit having a long pier or terminal at the north end. Isn't there supposed to be an extension (another pier) in the plans for T2?

xper

The eastward extension of Pier 1 through the area currently occupied by hangars and the addition of a second pier to Terminal 2 have been on the DAA future to-do list for a long time. However, the exact form they are foreseen taking has changed from time to time. The current envisaged long term plan, i.e., for 2050's) is shown in the following images which provide for full extension of the current Terminal 1 & 2 areas as far as possible including Pier 1 East and Pier 5 plus a large mid-field pier complex albeit still accessed from the current landside campus but with some provision for a future terminal building at the western end of the airport with its own landside access from the west (similar to Heathrow's T5):

source: DAA Capital Investment Plan 2020+

https://i.imgur.com/Ws9gCai.jpg

source: Flying In Ireland

That's long term.

More immediately, the North Dock building project screenshoted in a previous post above (link to source IDOM page) is the initial part of the full Pier 1 eastern extension - which is indeed one-side only (sometimes the available space dictates a sub-optimal solution) although the current masterplan seem to have dropped previous ideas of having the fully extended Pier 1 having its own terminal building around about where the old North Terminal building sits now. Together with the remote stands on the north side of the Apron 6 taxiway opposite the hangars associated a new remote northern boarding gates building alongside the new Ryanair hangar, the North Dock will provide quite a number of new contact and remote stands (though I'm unsure how much help it'll be to the pressure on the increasing capacity demands for NA flights from T2)

source: DAA Capital Investment Plan 2020+

On the southern side, earlier drafts of the airport masterplan showed the new Pier 5 for T2 as an L-shaped building emerging from the eastern side of the terminal and then turning south to provide stands on both sides. This always seemed to come very close to the approach to 28L however and had single taxiway access to a lot of the stands. The current proposal for this pier is a straight eastward extension from the terminal with stands on its south side only and remote stands with a relocated southern boarding gates building on the south side of a 'two-lane' taxiway and relocated cargo facilities

source: DAA Capital Investment Plan 2020+

trellheim

I do think they will need a holding area sooner rather than later for aircraft full and ready to go but waiting on their CTOT slot , so they can free up the boarding gate . Also might be worth short term a couple of CBP remote gates ( waiting for the horde to tell me it ain't possible at all, no sir )

xper

Just to add, one slight surprise about the new North Dock illustration is that unlike the existing Pier 1, it has full-on airbridge pairs with wide body capable stands, so it may be the case that the DAA aren't looking at this facility as directed at low cost airline ops.

L1011

Plenty of airlines currently use A or D and would likely prefer bridges.

dublin12367

Aerlingus in the indo this afternoon - if they can’t grow at DUB due to passenger cap they will grow at MAN instead. Have already been asked to cut ad hoc flights from DUB.

A lot of it all talk, but could be a very real scenario for a lot of airlines, not just aerlingus if daa don’t get moving asap.

EchoIndia

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121290349#Comment_121290349

The "ad hoc flights" thing is a red herring IMO but of course it presses buttons politically and with the public. The Rugby World Cup is the only really large programme of such flights seen of late and while EI and FR put on some extra services, the majority involved non-Irish operators. In terms of annual throughput it is probably a blip, really.

IngazZagni

As previously mentioned the annual cap is completely stupid and made by people that don't understand how airports work.

What this could ultimately lead to in the short term is a drastic reduction in winter season flights to prioritise higher profit summer flights. This would mean the airport bursting at the seams in peak summer and a ghost town in winter. Even a monthly cap would help with this issue.

dublin12367

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121290837#Comment_121290837

Good point, it is silly.

Look at the August passenger numbers. 3.4million. No major facility issues reported in August only the lack of car parking of which, should be sorted next year.

If the facilities are there to achieve that figure in August, they are there for all other 11 months.

If each of the 12 months handled 3.4 million passengers that would give a yearly total of 40.8m. Way above the current cap of 32m and even above the cap the daa are trying to increase it to 🤦.