Retrofitting Phonewatch Alarm System ?

Luckycharms_74

Hi All

I have a wireless PW alarm system installed for the past 5 years or so. Will all the negative press about GSM jamming I'm worried about my system's security. Is it possible to retrofit this system with an alternative, can an external siren bell box be added to it (at present its only a decoy box with led lights).
I'm also thinking of getting a CCTV system installed and if someone can point me in the right direction of what to go for and a rough cost. I got quoted for CCTV system with 4 camera and PVR costing between €700-€750.
I'm not sure of the model of my PW system but here is a pic of the unit.

P.S. I'm living in Waterford

KoolKid

You could retro fit with a GE/UTC panel & use the existing sensors.
You could also connect a working external bell to this.
The CCTV quote you got is very cheap & you need to look at what your getting for that.

Luckycharms_74

KoolKid wrote: »

You could retro fit with a GE/UTC panel & use the existing sensors.
You could also connect a working external bell to this.
The CCTV quote you got is very cheap 7 you need to look at what your getting for that.

You got any links for that equipment mentioned ?
I assumed the CCTV quote was an average price (he said it had 4 IR cameras & PVR to record, )

KoolKid

Something like thiswould suit for the alarm.

Huntthe

A lot of scaremongering about jammers. Mostly propagated by people with vested interests. It's not a major issue.

KoolKid

I would say there is ,
A lot of denial about jammers. Mostly propagated by people with vested interests.
I have seen them in use & have tested them.
I would not recommend anyone to use GSM for central station monitoring.
If people do wish to do so after being informed of the risks that's up to them, but I would be looking for a disclaimer signed.
To sell GSM monitoring & deny the risk is leaving yourself wide open.

Luckycharms_74

KoolKid wrote: »

Something like thiswould suit for the alarm.

I would also need to to be hardwired. The problem is I don't have a land line. I do have UPC but AFAIK Eircom don't support UPC or vise versa. I may be wrong with that though ?

Would it be better for me just to get a new alarm fitted ?

KoolKid

That system will allow some wired zones also.
Monitoring will work with UPC, for some reason Eircom say it doesn't.
Your best bet is get your UPC and connect it to UPC.
It works perfectly. The only thing to be aware of is that it is reliant on mains power.

Luckycharms_74

KoolKid wrote: »

That system will allow some wired zones also.
Monitoring will work with UPC, for some reason Eircom say it doesn't.
Your best bet is get your UPC and connect it to UPC.
It works perfectly. The only thing to be aware of is that it is reliant on mains power.

Is it possible to have it primarily running on UPC and then GSM as back up in event of power failure.
How do i go about setting up the UPC ?

KoolKid

Yes you can have duel reporting.
See the link in my sig re connection to UPC.

Thunderbird2

If gsm jamming is a serious issue I'd advise that you forget about having a wireless alarm at all in your house .

A wired bell can be added to your GE SIMON 3 alarm .

You could connect a phoneline to your gsm unit and if the phone line is cut it switches to gsm . Do you have a white steel box with lights on it ?
You can use UPC . Eircom or who ever
Your phone service is with for the landline .

KoolKid

You really are on a buzz about wireless and jamming...
In another thread you are making unfounded claims about radio. Now here is the same about wireless systems???
Are you seriously suggesting all wireless alarm devices are vulnerable like GSM?
Any evidence and proof of this one?

Thunderbird2

http://m.youtube.com/watch?feature=relmfu&v=y6Zent9tT7E

Here's an example of a 433.mhz system being jammed . 868mhz is just a different frequency .

KoolKid

That is a very specific example of an old technology and in no way proves today's systems are vulnerable.
Perhaps if you were to post a video of a Siemens, HKC or other modern system being jammed we might take notice.
Before 433 there were other frequencies.
Before that there was basic FM systems. I reckon those could be jammed as well now. But I don't use that as a basis for today's systems.
The fact that you say 868 mhz is just a different frequency shows your lack of knowledge of alarm systems. I suggest you do some more research before making such claims.

Thunderbird2

That is in no way old technology .
America uses 319mhz and 433mhz with the newer alarms .
Europe use 868mhz


HKC, Siemens and other 2- way systems can have the signals jammed but because they are 2- way they are much quicker at realising a jam condition.
But not all companies are using 2-way systems .
If you feel gsm should be phased out then should all 1 way alarm systems be phased out and replaced ?

I'm not trying to argue but you can't say that one type of signal is impervious to jamming . They all can be jammed but it depends on how the panels react to jamming and how they are setup .

Phonewatch systems are the easiest to jam because they are setup to perform poorly .

KoolKid

You are missing the point. Newer systems handle missing signals better.
Whether it's one way or 2 way is not the point either. There is no comparison between one way wireless and GSM, so I'm not sure what point you are trying to make there.
It's all back to this.
GSM jamming is cheap, widely available and works globally.
To jam any individual system or cover all systems could not be done on such a generic scale.
Again, there are lots of proof of GSM jamming.
There is not proof of wireless alarms be as vulnerable.

altor

Luckycharms_74 wrote: »

Hi All

I have a wireless PW alarm system installed for the past 5 years or so. Will all the negative press about GSM jamming I'm worried about my system's security. Is it possible to retrofit this system with an alternative, can an external siren bell box be added to it (at present its only a decoy box with led lights).

There is no need for a retro fit if using the Simon alarm.
That is not going to change anything to do with a GSM being jammed

The Simon can be connect to a landline, UPC or a regular analog line to give a voice message of alarm activation's. A 6V Simon SABB can also be added to this system to have a live external bell.

Luckycharms_74

altor wrote: »

There is no need for a retro fit if using the Simon alarm.
That is not going to change anything to do with a GSM being jammed

The Simon can be connect to a landline, UPC or a regular analog line to give a voice message of alarm activation's. A 6V Simon SABB can also be added to this system to have a live external bell.

Thanks Altor.
I saw how to set up UPC in "KoolKid" signature. I'm still trying to figure it out
Where could I pick up the 6V Simon SABB. Is it easy enough to replace it instead of the decoy bell box ?

KoolKid

Luckycharms_74 wrote: »

Where could I pick up the 6V Simon SABB. Is it easy enough to replace it instead of the decoy bell box ?

AFAIK REW do them.
REW (Richmond Electrical Wholesale)
Unit 17 / 18,
Finglas Business Centre,
Jamestown Road,
Dublin 11
Tel:01 858 0960
Fax:01 8569830

The Westway Centre,
Ballymount Ave,
Dublin 12
Tel:01 405 0200
Fax:01 456 8802
www.rew.ie

If not check out the other suppliers in the sticky.

If you need any help setting up that UPC line give me a shout.

altor

Luckycharms_74 wrote: »

Thanks Altor.
I saw how to set up UPC in "KoolKid" signature. I'm still trying to figure it out
Where could I pick up the 6V Simon SABB. Is it easy enough to replace it instead of the decoy bell box ?

Your welcome Luckycharms_74.

Another option is to disconnect the main EIRCOM line where it comes into the house and connect the UPC line in its place. This will give your alarm line priority plus make any phone points you have in your home active for plugging in a phone.

stuartkee

That simon panel needs a 6 volt bell 12v wont work on it

Luckycharms_74 wrote: »

Hi All

I have a wireless PW alarm system installed for the past 5 years or so. Will all the negative press about GSM jamming I'm worried about my system's security. Is it possible to retrofit this system with an alternative, can an external siren bell box be added to it (at present its only a decoy box with led lights).
I'm also thinking of getting a CCTV system installed and if someone can point me in the right direction of what to go for and a rough cost. I got quoted for CCTV system with 4 camera and PVR costing between €700-€750.
I'm not sure of the model of my PW system but here is a pic of the unit.

P.S. I'm living in Waterford

altor

A 12V bell will work but to be honest you would be better off buying the 6V SABB. Easier to install

arnieguy01

Luckycharms_74 wrote: »

Hi All

I have a wireless PW alarm system installed for the past 5 years or so. Will all the negative press about GSM jamming I'm worried about my system's security. Is it possible to retrofit this system with an alternative, can an external siren bell box be added to it (at present its only a decoy box with led lights).
I'm also thinking of getting a CCTV system installed and if someone can point me in the right direction of what to go for and a rough cost. I got quoted for CCTV system with 4 camera and PVR costing between €700-€750.
I'm not sure of the model of my PW system but here is a pic of the unit.

P.S. I'm living in Waterford

This panel is a Simon 3 panel made by GE. This panel works on 6 volts so you need a 6 volt external bell which HKC make only for Phonewatch and is not available for general sale. If you connect a 12 volt bell you may get the led's to come on but the bell will drag the panel down. Believe me, I have tried:D

That quote sounds too cheap for CCTV, ask what equipment is being used, could be cheap Chinese imported stuff.

arnieguy01

stuartkee wrote: »

That simon panel needs a 6 volt bell 12v wont work on it

ur dead right stuartkee

stuartkee

the pyronixs bell will sound but getting the tamper to work is a different story the simon need a 47k aswell as a 4k7 resistor can be tricky

Huntthe

KoolKid wrote: »

You are missing the point. Newer systems handle missing signals better.
Whether it's one way or 2 way is not the point either. There is no comparison between one way wireless and GSM, so I'm not sure what point you are trying to make there.
It's all back to this.
GSM jamming is cheap, widely available and works globally.
To jam any individual system or cover all systems could not be done on such a generic scale.
Again, there are lots of proof of GSM jamming.
There is not proof of wireless alarms be as vulnerable.

reference the 'proof' please.

altor

arnieguy01 wrote: »

This panel is a Simon 3 panel made by GE. This panel works on 6 volts so you need a 6 volt external bell which HKC make only for Phonewatch and is not available for general sale. If you connect a 12 volt bell you may get the led's to come on but the bell will drag the panel down. Believe me, I have tried:D

That quote sounds too cheap for CCTV, ask what equipment is being used, could be cheap Chinese imported stuff.

R.E.W will get you one of them bells if your looking for one