"Close account" button. Success or Failure?

RoundyMooney

In that case, it has always been said on here that a PM to a mod after the 48 hour window has elapsed can see such posts removed from public view.

This decision was driven by data protection guidelines, we're told. The need, real and all as it is, for posters to revisit their past posts for genuine reasons, didn't form part of that decision, or at least was never specified as such.

K-9

Dubhlinner wrote: »

Its one way of looking at it. On the other hand if people can remove things they want to remove they might be less inclined to pull the plug and re-reg/leave

There's a good reason why you can't edit posts after 48 hours, indeed you'll often get called up on a ninja edit, never mind one a few minutes later!

It's a discussion site which depends on the flow of debate, allowing editing that conversation defeats the whole purpose.

Dubhlinner

RoundyMooney wrote: »

In that case, it has always been said on here that a PM to a mod after the 48 hour window has elapsed can see such posts removed from public view.

This decision was driven by data protection guidelines, we're told. The need, real and all as it is, for posters to revisit their past posts for genuine reasons, didn't form part of that decision, or at least was never specified as such.

Oh of course. I mean if anything closing your account eliminates any chance of removing posts because you can no longer pm a mod.

I posted that in relation to the topic of this thread. I'm not trying to argue the merits of introducing a delete function - rather making the point that seeing as one cannot remove posts; it is utterly inevitable that users will look for ways to disassociate themselves from past posts. Some would appear to see the close account function as one way of doing this.

Steve

Dubhlinner wrote: »

Its one way of looking at it. On the other hand if people can remove things they want to remove they might be less inclined to pull the plug and re-reg/leave

....and it ultimately becomes an anon chatroom, moot point.

Regarding the seagull comment - how exactly are people made to take responsibility for things they post? They can just re-reg or not log on.

That's self apparent, if they post something and get banned for it then they can do one of three things.
a/ log off an never come back, site is better off.
b/ re-reg and post more crap and eventually get found out and banned again.
c/ fess up, admit they were wrong, sort the issue out and become a more valued and respected community member for doing so.

Dubhlinner

Steve wrote: »

....and it ultimately becomes an anon chatroom, moot point.

What are you on about? completely missed the point.

That's self apparent, if they post something and get banned for it then they can do one of three things.
a/ log off an never come back, site is better off.
b/ re-reg and post more crap and eventually get found out and banned again.
c/ fess up, admit they were wrong, sort the issue out and become a more valued and respected community member for doing so.

again missing the point. you mentioned people seagulling in response to being able to delete posts. The above would therefore bear no relevance.

I think my comment about deleting pissed you off. Perhaps wait until the morning and then reply because you're not getting what I'm saying at all.

Steve

Dubhlinner wrote: »

What are you on about? completely missed the point.

Really? please educate me then.

You made the point that people post in a possibly euphoric or non compos mentus state - fair enough. They have 48 hours to edit and / or recind their post. Is that not enough? After that, it defines who you are in the world and I agree with Dav that if you want to remain a part of boards than it's cowardly to try and hide who you were. Who you used to be is as much a part of who you are now as anything else.

As said, Dav was talking about stuff posted years ago.

again missing the point. you mentioned people seagulling in response to being able to delete posts. The above would therefore bear no relevance.

I think my comment about deleting pissed you off. Perhaps wait until the morning and then reply because you're not getting what I'm saying at all.

No, not pissed off at all, they surgically removed my ability to be pissed off when I became a mod years ago, all I have left is common sense, an inquisitive nature and hopefully a sense of objectivity.

Ando's Saggy Bottom

I don't buy for a second that constant re regging will be a way to facilitate renewed trolling by a user. If youre causing trouble youre going to come to a mods attention one way or another. If youre really really causing trouble they're going to probe into your background further and the trolling that was done under other names will soon become apparent too.

Bottom line if you cause trouble you'll soon be found out. If you play ball you won't. That holds whether you post under one or ten different names.

seamus

RoundyMooney wrote: »

Playing devil's advocate for a sec, boards is the biggest one in this jurisdiction, and may well have come up on the commission's radar as a result, purely because of that.

There's nothing in law which specifically requires that a website implement functionality that allows someone to close an account, though forums are relatively different to other entities (like online shops) in terms of what an "account" is.
Dav probably won't mind me expanding on it, but the discussion with the data commissioner was started on foot of a complaint/query from someone who wanted to delete their account but was told this couldn't be facilitated.

After discussion with the commissioner and the nature of the business, they directed that users must be provided with a facility whereby they can close their account and remove all personal data associated with it. The commissioner has power in law to make such directions which data controllers are compelled to comply with.

The direction did not extend to requiring deletion of accounts or the posts associated with them.

Theoretically all other Irish forums should implement similar functionality on foot of this, but they are not under an obligation to do so unless directed to do so by the commissioner.

Dades

Dubhlinner wrote: »

That's great for you but you have to remember it is just you you can speak for. Some people may have revealed things when they were of a certain age, or mental status, which they're no longer comfortable with, eg someone with bipolar disorder might post a lot of stuff because it seemed fine to do so in a euphoric state.

These are hardly the scenarios Dav was referring to in his earlier post.

Regarding deleting posts, we often get requests from people who want old posts deleted for various reasons. Sometimes it involves family, legal stuff or just threats to their anonymity which might put them in a compromising position. Where the request is genuine and removing the post isn't going to be a big disruption to an ongoing discussion, there's usually no problem doing this.

crazygeryy

Steve wrote: »

If you take away accountability for your posts then boards may as well just become one of the millions of chatroom sites out there where you can say what you like (gangnam seagull style) and then be gone without ever having to take responsibility for it.

Bollocks to that.

If that ever happens here then it will be a great loss to our community and society in general.

accountability yes but a great loss to our community and society in general.
boards is just another chat room,better run and organised than most but a chatroom nonetheless.so get down off the old high horse there would ya.:D

Steve

crazygeryy wrote: »

accountability yes but a great loss to our community and society in general.
boards is just another chat room,better run and organised than most but a chatroom nonetheless.so get down off the old high horse there would ya.:D

Some would claim boards is an archive of Irish societies opinions for the past 15 years. Anonymised data on post content has been made available for various studies already, not sure if anything ever came of it but that's where I'm coming from.

Czarcasm

Steve wrote: »

Some would claim boards is an archive of Irish societies opinions for the past 15 years. Anonymised data on post content has been made available for various studies already, not sure if anything ever came of it but that's where I'm coming from.

I used to be an idealist too Steve, then I realised not everyone can be civil on the Internet and some people are just dicks for the sake of their own entertainment. I'd sooner encourage anyone to close their account and walk away than stay and put up with that barrage of a shìtfest.

I used like the community spirit of Boards, but that's long, long gone now that Boards has taken on a much larger corporate identity and provides a haven for dicks to roam free and troll the hell out of other, more civilised members of society.

All well and good to say "I'm proud of my online identity" when you actually have full control over it, but when Boards has become over-run by dicks, you'll forgive me if I feel I don't owe Boards anything any more.

As someone above said- it's just another website. Nobody should be made to feel they owe a corporate entity any loyalty. If you can't see the product, you ARE the product as they say.

Steve

Czarcasm wrote: »

I used like the community spirit of Boards, but that's long, long gone now that Boards has taken on a much larger corporate identity and provides a haven for dicks to roam free and troll the hell out of other, more civilised members of society.

I think you are being overly pessimistic there, I still believe in the community spirit - if I didn't then I would have already handed back my mod buttons.
I agree that the whole corporate thing is encroaching on the community feel of the site but I also believe that the frontline mods are still more inclined to stick up for what's best for their forum over what's best for company profits.

Czarcasm

Steve wrote: »

I think you are being overly pessimistic there, I still believe in the community spirit - if I didn't then I would have already handed back my mod buttons.
I agree that the whole corporate thing is encroaching on the community feel of the site but I also believe that the frontline mods are still more inclined to stick up for what's best for their forum over what's best for company profits.

Frontline Moderators though Steve are unpaid volunteers and therefore will not have as vested an interest in the future of Boards.ie as an employee of Boards.ie.

Boards.ie offers it's long term users no protection against new users having just joined the site, going through their ten year posting history to nit pick at them and bring up a three year old post as the basis of a witch hunt.

Therefore the question remains- why should ordinary long term posters be made to feel guilty for protecting themselves and their online identity? Boards does the bare minimum to comply with the directives of the DPC, so as much as I love the community, as much as I love Boards, I think I'd rather take my chances with another random person I've never met being put out should I decidde to close my account to protect my offline identity.

K-9

Czarcasm wrote: »

Boards.ie offers it's long term users no protection against new users having just joined the site, going through their ten year posting history to nit pick at them and bring up a three year old post as the basis of a witch hunt.

I very much doubt "noob" posters are doing that.

Czarcasm

K-9 wrote: »

I very much doubt "noob" posters are doing that.

Missing the point though K-9, Boards.ie offers no protection against it, not even as a subscriber.

The poster who went trawling through my previous accounts post history to make their point to try and discredit me was the reason for me closing that account. It made me see that such dickish behaviour could become a regular occurrence because I posted in many different fora under that account for many years, whereas nowadays I'll still read all the old ones, but I won't post in them as it's too easy for inspector clueless to trawl my post history to glean information about my offline identity.

Oh, and it's pointless reporting the post afterwards, closing the gate after the horse has bolted and all that.

pablomakaveli

Didnt want to start a new thread and it sort of ties in with this topic so ill ask here.

I just noticed on this thread that one of the moderators has stated that calling someone out as a re-reg is now a bannable offence?

Not sure if this is site wide but isn't this a bit unfair?

Especially if the re-reg is a a previously banned poster.

28064212

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Didnt want to start a new thread and it sort of ties in with this topic so ill ask here.

I just noticed on this thread that one of the moderators has stated that calling someone out as a re-reg is now a bannable offence?

Not sure if this is site wide but isn't this a bit unfair?

Especially if the re-reg is a a previously banned poster.

It's an offence to do it on-thread, it's backseat moderating. If you think someone's a banned re-reg, you report them

El Guapo!

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Didnt want to start a new thread and it sort of ties in with this topic so ill ask here.

I just noticed on this thread that one of the moderators has stated that calling someone out as a re-reg is now a bannable offence?

Not sure if this is site wide but isn't this a bit unfair?

Especially if the re-reg is a a previously banned poster.

It makes perfect sense.
If someone has closed their account and set up another one, then they did it for a reason and it's their right to remain anonymous. Calling them out on thread ruins their anonymity and defeats the purpose of why they closed their original account.
If you think someone is a re-reg troll who's just trying to get around a ban, then that's a different matter. But a simple pm to a mod would do the trick.

pablomakaveli

El Guapo! wrote: »

It makes perfect sense.
If someone has closed their account and set up another one, then they did it for a reason and it's their right to remain anonymous. Calling them out on thread ruins their anonymity and defeats the purpose of why they closed their original account.
If you think someone is a re-reg troll who's just trying to get around a ban, then that's a different matter. But a simple pm to a mod would do the trick.

You see i dont really like this. A lot of posters these days seem to close accounts in a huff and are back a week later. They deserved to be called out if they carry on like that.

To be honest i think the boards community has suffered because of the closed account feature. I know its necessary obviously but i think its abused by a lot of people and i think there needs to be measures to prevent this abuse. For example maybe allow people close an account but have them banned from making a new one for a time period to discourage the banned users or ones who quit in a sulk.

Rev Hellfire

Unless you're using a verified real name on a forum or online service it's a disposable commodity IMO; true the length of time you use it creates a certain amount inertia, but even then it's still disposable in a way your true identity isn't.

seamus

pablomakaveli wrote: »

Didnt want to start a new thread and it sort of ties in with this topic so ill ask here.

I just noticed on this thread that one of the moderators has stated that calling someone out as a re-reg is now a bannable offence?

Not sure if this is site wide but isn't this a bit unfair?

Especially if the re-reg is a a previously banned poster.

It's like calling someone a troll or whatever. It's disruptive. If a poster feels someone else is a re-reg, they can report it, rather than pulling the thread off topic.

In addition to the comparison to calling someone a troll on thread given by Seamus, another reason we don't allow people call out a re-reg on thread is this;

Their previous account may have personally identified them - whether that be online, or by them attending a beers etc. They may not wish to be personally identified any longer. All users are entitled to anonymity. By "outting" them, you may inadvertently be identifying them, which is against the terms of use of this site.

Millicent

This is probably (it's almost definitely!) tangential to the thread topic, but I wasn't sure it warranted a thread of its own. Are "goodbye" threads frowned upon? So often I see long-time posters who I really like just disappear without another word when I would have appreciated the chance to say see ya.

When the time comes to close my own account, I'd like somewhere to voice my thoughts and reasons for leaving to people that I've been kind of/nearly friends with in my time here, people I respect but who I may have only been friendly with on-thread and not on PM basis.

Could a megathread be made somewhere or is there one already?

Insect Overlord

Millicent wrote: »

This is probably (it's almost definitely!) tangential to the thread topic, but I wasn't sure it warranted a thread of its own. Are "goodbye" threads frowned upon?

They've always been frowned upon, even in the years before the "Close Account" option came in.

Millicent

Insect Overlord wrote: »

They've always been frowned upon, even in the years before the "Close Account" option came in.

Fair enough. Can I ask why, if I'm not dragging this too far off topic? I'm guessing it's probably to deter flounce posts, but I think for most, it would be a way to say thanks and see you to people they have some sort of relationship with, often for quite some time.

Insect Overlord

Millicent wrote: »

Fair enough. Can I ask why, if I'm not dragging this too far off topic? I'm guessing it's probably to deter flounce posts, but I think for most, it would be a way to say thanks and see you to people they have some sort of relationship with, often for quite some time.

Because it's attention-seeking, off-topic silliness. There's only ever been one really good "farewell" thread, and that was well over 4 years ago. It ended up getting moved to the Cuckoo's Nest because it was so ridiculous. Somebody leaving the site just isn't that big a deal.

Say goodbye in your favourite off-topic chat thread if you must, but chances are you'll be back with a different account after a few months anyway!

Millicent

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Because it's attention-seeking, off-topic silliness. There's only ever been one really good "farewell" thread, and that was well over 4 years ago. It ended up getting moved to the Cuckoo's Nest because it was so ridiculous. Somebody leaving the site just isn't that big a deal.

Say goodbye in your favourite off-topic chat thread if you must, but chances are you'll be back with a different account after a few months anyway!

Fair enough. I know there's a few posters who have left that I really would have liked the opportunity to say see you to that haven't come back. I would have appreciated some sort of exit conversation with them, if only to have a chance to wish them well.

I'll keep the off-topic chat threads in mind though. Cheers.

K-9

Millicent wrote: »

When the time comes to close my own account,

Just an aside, you seem to say that as if it's inevitable?

I'm sure I'll leave the site at some stage but just leave, and that's it.

Posy

Millicent wrote: »

I think for most, it would be a way to say thanks and see you to people they have some sort of relationship with, often for quite some time.

If I have a close relationship with someone on boards I think I'd just send them a visitor message or PM telling them I'm closing my account and saying so long.