Traditional Shirt Numbering. Why do left wingers wear 11?

GSPfan

I've always wondered how it came about that Left wingers wear the number 11. It seemed a bit too random that certain numbers defined a position on a pitch in a 4,4,2 but did not fit any order. So I googled. And I wiki'd.

Originally in the first days of numbering jerseys back in the 1920's they did not play a 4,4,2. The popular formation was a 2,3,5.

So as they numbered players starting with the goal keeper. They started at 1 and worked there way from right to left up the pitch. So your old school line up looked a bit like this.

............1.............
........2.......3........ = 2

......4.....5.....6..... = 3

.........8....10........ = 5
..7........9.......11..

1. Goalkeeper
2. Right full back (right side centre back)
3. Left full back (left side centre back)
4. Right half back (right side defensive midfield)
5. Centre half back (centre defensive midfield)
6. Left half back (left side defensive midfield)
7. Outside right (right winger)
8. Inside right (attacking midfield)
9. Centre forward
10. Inside left (attacking midfield)
11. Outside left (left winger)

With the evolution of the formation to a 4,4,2 the numbers remained with their original players but the position changed. The numbers followed the players and became the traditional position numbering we see today.
5 and 6 dropped into center back moving 2 and 3 to the full back positions. 4 moved central in front of the defence. 7, 8, 11 dropped back to join 4 in a midfield four. And 10 stayed just behind 9.

Interestingly in South America a similar thing happened but you will find a different evolution of systems which means numbers are in different positions from European teams.

Just thought I'd share that for anyone wondering the same thing. I find it cool now that I know. Would love to see how a 2,3,5 would go down in todays game.

Mars Bar

You would probably find the book "Inverting The Pyramid" interesting so!

dd972

I remember Liverpool in the 70's to late 80's had a 5 in Midfield and 2 and 6 were the centre backs.

Jimmy Iovine

I've always wondered why Gerrard wore number 4 for England and the centre backs wore 5/6. I don't think any other team lines up with a number 4 in midfield.

Hulk Hands

I prefer to have 4 in midfield and 5 and 6 as Centre halves. They just seem like the proper CB numbers. Numbers are mattering less and less though. I wonder do kids still fight over jersey no. 10 and 7 liked we used to

RikkFlair

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

I've always wondered why Gerrard wore number 4 for England and the centre backs wore 5/6. I don't think any other team lines up with a number 4 in midfield.

Owen Hargreaves was no.4 for United.

Squad numbers nowadays can get a bit silly, when you see attacking players/strikers wearing 2 for example, Aruna Kone & Clint Dempsey.

Skylinehead

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

I've always wondered why Gerrard wore number 4 for England and the centre backs wore 5/6. I don't think any other team lines up with a number 4 in midfield.

Fabregas?

Blatter

The likes of this has ruined the meaning of numbers in football for me.

Xavi6

I see your Hargreaves, Fabregas and whoever else and raise you...

Jimmy Iovine

Ah yea. I knew that would happen. Ignore my previous post.

DazMarz

I'm amazed no cheeky sod of a footballer has taken 69 as his squad number yet...

Max Power1

What about the likes of Edmundo who wear 99?
Or that inter wing back who wore 77

Blatter

DazMarz wrote: »

I'm amazed no cheeky sod of a footballer has taken 69 as his squad number yet...

Meggiorini currently wears it for Torino. He's he only one I know of.

Rubber_Soul

My favourite

yabadabado

Was just going to put up the Zamorano picture first person I thought of when I read the thread.
Lizarazu wore 69.

astonaidan

I wear number 14 after the French icon that captured so many peoples hearts. Was the King of North London.
Never be another player like David Ginola

Moneymaker

DazMarz wrote: »

I'm amazed no cheeky sod of a footballer has taken 69 as his squad number yet...

Lizarazu wore 69 for Bayern. He always insisted it was because he was born in 1969 though

Zaph

astonaidan wrote: »

I wear number 14 after the French icon that captured so many peoples hearts. Was the King of North London.
Never be another player like David Ginola

14 always was, and always will be this guy

yabadabado

For the '82 World Cup Argentina picked numbers on alphabetical order so Ardiles wore No. 1.
LA Galaxy keeper and Zerouali when he was at Aberdeen wore 0 .

Jimmy Iovine

yabadabado wrote: »

For the '82 World Cup Argentina picked numbers on alphabetical order so Ardiles wore No. 1.

Everyone except for Maradona. He switched with one of the subs to get the number 10.

I loved the way the '06 Brazil team lined up 1 - 11 in their correct positions on the pitch. I'll probably be proven wrong on this again, but I can't remember any team since who have done that.

United are very close to it. They just need a number 9 and to shuffle a few of the numbers in the defence.

Zaph

yabadabado wrote: »

For the '82 World Cup Argentina picked numbers on alphabetical order so Ardiles wore No. 1.

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

Everyone except for Maradona. He switched with one of the subs to get the number 10.

They did the same in 1978. Ardiles was no. 2 that year. They did it again in 1986, but with a few changes to the order so some players could get their favoured numbers.

Benimar

yabadabado wrote: »

For the '82 World Cup Argentina picked numbers on alphabetical order so Ardiles wore No. 1.
LA Galaxy keeper and Zerouali when he was at Aberdeen wore 0 .

So did England (bar Keegan who got No 7). Also, for years Italy used to have squad numbers based on alphabetical by position eg: defenders were 2-8 alphabetically, midfielders were 9-16 etc.

In 1982 The Argentinian keeper wore No 7

BOHtox

Always used to wear 14 whether I started or was on the bench. I think I was on the bench for a while and usually had 14 so I just stuck with it. When starts came around I used to just continue to wear it. We lined out 1-8, 10, 11 and 14!

Kevin Hunt wore 4 as well for Bohs. Great centre mid!

Pro. F

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

I loved the way the '06 Brazil team lined up 1 - 11 in their correct positions on the pitch. I'll probably be proven wrong on this again, but I can't remember any team since who have done that.

Haven't Ireland done that a good few times (iirc they recently changed to squad numbers). And I would guess there are a good few other international teams still doing it.

Pinturicchio

The numbers that traditionally go with certain positions are different in different parts of the world.

In England it's generally
1
2 5 6 3
7 8 4 11
9 10
It's the same for most of Europe, except 4 and 6 are swapped around.


In Brazil it's more like
1
2 3 4 6
8 5 10
7 9 11

Argentina
1
4 2 6 3
8 5
10
7 9 11

Mikeyt086

Serie A has gone all NHL with their numbers lately. Nearly every game has numerous players with shirt numbers in the 70's and 80's.

Lovely Bloke

Paul Ince wore number 4 for United and England.

Max Power1

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Paul Ince wore number 4 for United and England.

And #9 &#17 for liverpool

Omackeral

A good little article on bizzare jersey numbers here

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/96356-footballs-most-bizarre-shirt-numbers

Omackeral

Bit of a head-banger, Bill!!

MrJoeSoap

Hicham "Zero" Zerouali. RIP.

ambid

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Paul Ince wore number 4 for United and England.

Not sure that's correct. Ince wore 8 for United as Steve Bruce wore 4 for his whole career there.

Lumbo

GSPfan wrote: »

Originally in the first days of numbering jerseys back in the 1920's they did not play a 4,4,2. The popular formation was a 2,3,5.

Found this on tinternet.

Shirt numbers appeared in club level football before the England team wore them for the first time, although the national side regularly sported shirt numbers before the Football League required them for league play.

On 25 August 1928, Arsenal and Chelsea wore numbered shirts in their matches against The Wednesday (renamed Sheffield Wednesday soon after) and Swansea Town, respectively. This is the earliest record of the use of shirt numbers in Football League play.

On 29 April 1933, shirt numbers were worn for the first time in the Football Association Challenge Cup final. Everton players wore numbers 1 through 11 and Manchester City numbers 12 through 22. The following week, on 6 May 1933, Everton wore their numbered shirts in a Football League match against Wolverhampton Wanderers at Molineux. But at its annual general meeting in 1933, the Football League Management Committee rejected a proposal requiring shirt numbers after hearing objections that it would cost too much and spoil club colours.

On 4 December 1933, Arsenal, reigning Football League champions, wore numbers as an experiment when they beat the full Austrian national side, in the guise of F.C. of Vienna, 4-2 at Highbury. However, the Football League Management Committee again rejected requiring shirt numbers at its 1934 annual general meeting.

England wore numbers on the back of their shirts for the first time in the 3-1 loss to Scotland at Hampden Park in Glasgow on 17 April 1937. For the next two decades and more, England continued to play in the 2-3-5 formation or its variant, the W-M formation, and shirt numbers were assigned according to player position, 1 going to the goalkeeper and 2 through 11 to the outfield players beginning with the right fullback, continuing through the 2-3-5 formation from back to front and right to left and ending with the outside left.

On 5 June 1939, the Football League Management Committee finally decreed at its annual general meeting that players on each club would wear numbers 1 through 11 in league matches and that the numbers would be assigned according to position. William Cuff, the incoming Football League president, turned aside a proposal that would have made shirt numbers optional; either all clubs would wear them or none. The vote was 24 for numbering and 20 against. Shirt numbers were first worn in league play during the 1939-40 season, which was abandoned after three rounds of matches on the outbreak of the Second World War. Thus the first official season in which Football League matches featured shirt numbers was the first conducted after the war, the 1946-47 season.

jenno86

swoody

Cristiano Lupatelli wore 10 at Chievo and he's a goalkeeper



Pantelis Kafes wore 1 at AEK Athens and he's a central midfielder

Noo

Skylinehead wrote: »

Fabregas?

And vieira

Red Kev

Jan Jongbloed was the Dutch goalie in 74 and 78. He wore the Nr. 8 in 74 as the numbers were given alphabetically and Holland had "no Nr. 1". Most squad members from 74 kept the same numbers again in 78.

jameshayes

Noo wrote: »

And vieira

and gibson for everton