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Irish Call Signs

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  • 19-05-2013 11:12am
    #1
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭


    I was having a look through the EI call book listings

    http://www.irts.ie/callbook/index.html

    Some queries for the knowledgeable folks here :

    How are these assigned, i.e. is it year of exam etc. ?

    Why are there very few assignments in EI0 and EI1 ?

    Also there is a few under SWL (short wave listener), how are licences awarded under this class and what is the criteria ?

    Also I notice there is a 'B' at the end of some call signs, I believe this means the holder has not sat a morse test, is this correct ?

    When is the morse test held and what are the required standards ?,

    I can't find this info on the IRTS site.


«1

Comments

  • Registered Users Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    There used to be two kinds of licences in UK and Ireland. For below 50MHz you had to have Morse exam. For 50MHz and above you didn't need Morse and in Ireland got a B suffix. Though most of back then there was no Amateur Allocation between 29.7MHz and 144MHz.

    Current licences are EI9. I guess about 8 years ago the prefix was EI8. EI0 and EI1 was very long ago, most are now "Silent Key", (i.e. Late / Dead). Not sure what the plans are when the letters used up in EI9, also special Events, Clubs or Repeaters are often not in the Regular sequence. It's not like cars, the Number isn't a specific year, but a range of years depending how fast the letters are used up.

    I traded in a UK Licence for an Irish one (sort of like I did for Driving Licence), so I may be in error on some of the finer nuances. The UK has changed their scheme since I did my licence.

    I think you can still get a two letter EI9xx call without the B if you pass a Morse (CW) exam, but it doesn't any longer give any other advantages. You can use Morse if you learn it without an exam. Or with a good operator at the other end you can decode Morse in Software. Sending Morse with a QWERTY keyboard has been done since the 1930s, there is no difficulty in that. So to a variable extent you can do Morse without even learning it.

    AFAIK a Morse test is organised any time enough people want to do it. Email IRTS. The requirement used to be 12 wpm, but it may now be less, maybe 6wpm?. It's actually hard to get faster if you learn it very slowly. Most experts recommend learning to hear it before sending and more like 20wpm than 6 wpm. There are plenty of good free programs to download.

    I've no idea if a paddle (bug) key is allowed or if a test must use a straight key, but in any case it's learning to RECEIVE not Send it is the critical part.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    according to ComReg, EI0-9 are issued to clubs, special events etc, whereas operators get EI2-9. For automated stations (such as repeaters) number indicates the band at which it operates. As far as I know there are still plenty of combinations available for EI2-8, but looks like they are only issued to people who have passed Morse test.

    Morse test is taken at rallies and should be requested from IRTS beforehand. Minimum is 5 words per minute


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,043 ✭✭✭martinedwards


    5 WPM is a joke.

    you could take a crib sheet and look up the dots and dashes on it and still be able to write it down at that speed!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    I think the goal here is to encourage people to actually try it. If it's anything like 15wpm I will never going to look at it, but what 5wpm is saying to me - it sound's like a monkey could do it so why can't I?


  • Registered Users Posts: 32,417 ✭✭✭✭watty


    Unfortunately if you learn 5wpm, you are practically learning from scratch to do 15WPM.
    H   A   V   E              Y  O   U              E   V   E   R            L   I    S    T   E   N   E  D              TO              V    O    A           E   A   S   Y                E    N   G    L    I    S    H
    

    You don't do Morse by listening for a dot dash or space and then translating. You do it by the "song" or "rhythm" of each letter. At 5 WPM it's too slow to get the impression of the entire letter, you only hear the dots and dashes.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    What do people here think of this site ?

    http://lcwo.net/

    I've found it very good, it promotes the Koch method for learning morse


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    What do people here think of this site ?

    http://lcwo.net/

    I've found it very good, it promotes the Koch method for learning morse

    Anthony, EI2KC, who is a keen CW operator (started just few years ago) recommended it on his blog, together with this http://www.justlearnmorsecode.com/

    http://hamradioireland.blogspot.ie/2010/02/ei7gvb-ei8ghb-to-upgrade-to-shorter.html

    I'll give my first try tonight


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    What's the exact format of the morse exam, is it listening to and sending live transmissions and for how long ?


  • Moderators, Technology & Internet Moderators, Regional North East Moderators Posts: 10,869 Mod ✭✭✭✭PauloMN


    What's the exact format of the morse exam, is it listening to and sending live transmissions and for how long ?

    Was very quick when I did it, can't have been more than 10 mins in there. Just did it in a classroom while I was at the Coolmine rally one time. Had to receive a short piece of text sent by the examiner and write it down. Then was asked to send a short piece, and that was that.


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,043 ✭✭✭martinedwards


    What do people here think of this site ?

    http://lcwo.net/

    I've found it very good, it promotes the Koch method for learning morse

    excellent.

    Koch is the ONLY way to learn, with the individual letters sent at speed with wider spacing.

    learning that DAAAAAAH DAAAAAAAAAH DIIIIT is G is a waste of time when you speed up.

    good trainer here:

    http://www.g4fon.net/

    uses Koch method and can add all sorts of QRM, QSB and other silliness to add to the challenge.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    PauloMN wrote: »
    Was very quick when I did it, can't have been more than 10 mins in there. Just did it in a classroom while I was at the Coolmine rally one time. Had to receive a short piece of text sent by the examiner and write it down. Then was asked to send a short piece, and that was that.

    What's the required RPM for both receive and send, is it both 5 wpm ?

    Also does the examiner always send at 5 wpm ?

    If you're used to 10-20 wpm 5 wpm might actually be hard to understand.


  • Registered Users Posts: 177 ✭✭brownmini


    I was having a look through the EI call book listings

    http://www.irts.ie/callbook/index.html

    Some queries for the knowledgeable folks here :

    How are these assigned, i.e. is it year of exam etc. ?

    Why are there very few assignments in EI0 and EI1 ?

    Also there is a few under SWL (short wave listener), how are licences awarded under this class and what is the criteria ?

    Also I notice there is a 'B' at the end of some call signs, I believe this means the holder has not sat a morse test, is this correct ?

    When is the morse test held and what are the required standards ?,

    I can't find this info on the IRTS site.




    1. How are these assigned, i.e. is it year of exam etc. ?
    A.
    Callsigns/Licences for people are assigned as they come off
    the list of available callsigns/licences.
    There is no pick&choosing.
    You take what you're given.
    The sequence used to be
    EI2XX, EI3XX, EI4XX, EI5XX, EI6XX, EI7XX, EI8XX, EI9XX, EI2XY, EI3XY
    The sequence may be the same today.

    Please note:
    Club callsigns, repeater callsigns, beacon callsigns are formatted
    differently and do not have a sequence.



    2. Why are there very few assignments in EI0 and EI1 ?
    A.
    EI0 and EI1 callsigns used to be issued along with the others until
    someone noticed that under the ITU rules, EXPERIMENTAL radio stations
    are not supposed to have a 0 or 1 in their callsign/licence. The Dept
    of Comms/Dept Transport&Power/ODTR/COMREG did not issue 0 or 1 callsigns
    as a result of this. The callsigns that were issued remain valid.
    Up until about 4 years ago, Irish amateur radio was officially Irish
    experimental radio. SI 192 of 2009 changed Irish experimental radio
    into Irish amateur radio.
    [See: http://www.comreg.ie/_fileupload/publications/SI192of2009.pdf]
    COMREG's current policy of issuing callsigns with a 0 or 1 in it is unknown
    at this time.

    3. Also there is a few under SWL (short wave listener), how are licences awarded under this class and what is the criteria ?
    A.
    There is no class of licence for an SWL.
    The SWL number is used in the same way as a callsign is used to identify
    a person without having to write out their full name&address.
    The IRTS issue a SWL number to people who join as an identification
    number so that they can be identified in a similar way. This number
    means that people from around the world can send confirmation cards
    back via the BURO (Bureau) [see: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QSL_card ]
    without having to write their name&address.

    4. Also I notice there is a 'B' at the end of some call signs, I believe this means the holder has not sat a morse test, is this correct ?
    A.
    It means that at the time of applying for a licence, the applicant did
    not show proof of passing an official national standard morse test of not
    less than 5wpm and therefore was issued with a callsign ending in a B.
    It does not strictly mean that the person has not actually passed an
    official morse test of not less than 5 WPM.


    5. When is the morse test held and what are the required standards ?,
    A.
    The morse test is usually held at various radio rallies/junk sales as long as
    someone who is authorised to hold the morse test is available.
    On arriving at the radio rally/junk sale, ask the organisers if/where
    the morse tests are on. Contact the IRTS to enquire further.
    The test is by sound, send and receive using an up/down key, speed not
    less than 5 WPM.


    73


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    I notice from the IRTS EI call listings that there have been very approx. in the region of about 1800 EI call signs issued.

    About 40 or so of them have Northern Ireland addresses.

    What are the benefits of someone from NI having an EI callsign ?

    Are they likely to also have a UK callsign ?

    Did they sit the IRTS exam or are there co-qualifying arrangements ?

    Can an amateur from the Republic of Ireland also apply for a UK callsign, and what benefit, if any, would that confer ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 177 ✭✭brownmini


    I notice from the IRTS EI call listings that there have been very approx. in the region of about 1800 EI call signs issued.

    About 40 or so of them have Northern Ireland addresses.

    What are the benefits of someone from NI having an EI callsign ?

    Are they likely to also have a UK callsign ?

    Did they sit the IRTS exam or are there co-qualifying arrangements ?

    Can an amateur from the Republic of Ireland also apply for a UK callsign, and what benefit, if any, would that confer ?



    1. What are the benefits of someone from NI having an EI callsign ?
    A.
    Since the arrival of CEPT, the benefits have reduced,
    but the main benefit is not having to rattle off a slightly
    longer callsign beginning E_I_stroke everytime you identify
    yourself.
    In N.I. a number will have sat the exam in COMREG and
    obtained an Irish licence & callsign & HAREC(certificate).
    With that certificate, they may then have applied to OFCOM
    for a UK licence&callsign.
    This is not always the case. Some may have already had a
    UK licence&callsign and applied for an EI afterwards.
    Perhaps they also spend their holidays here and prefer
    to operate as a local rather than as a visitor.


    2. Are they likely to also have a UK callsign ?
    A.
    I would estimate that the majority have both
    an EI and (G or M) callsign.


    3. Did they sit the IRTS exam or are there co-qualifying arrangements ?
    A.
    The HAREC scheme
    (see CEPT TR61/02 at http://www.erodocdb.dk/docs/doc98/official/pdf/TR6102.pdf)
    is a mutual recognition between various countries mainly
    in the Europe area but not only Europe, where if you pass
    the exam in one country, you can have that result recognised
    in another country. The result is certified by the issuing
    of the HAREC (certificate) which states that you passed the
    exam of a member country of the CEPT TR61/02 scheme.
    In the days before CEPT TR61/01 and TR61/02 one had to
    apply to each country for a stand alone licence.
    Each country knew about each other country's standards.
    i.e. a Class-A licence in GB was the same as a Class-A in EI.
    Licences from countries where there might be a slight difference
    in standards meant that sometimes you might fall between two levels
    and end up with the lower level licence as a result.


    4. Can an amateur from the Republic of Ireland also apply for a UK callsign, and what benefit, if any, would that confer ?
    A. Yes.
    Benefit is again relative to each person (See Answer #1)
    Someone who travels to the UK often may prefer to switch to
    a G or M callsign rather than always have to say
    M_stroke_E_I_9_X_Y_Z everytime they identify.
    Someone who has mother/father in EI but lives/works in GB
    will find it handy to have both.
    Its down to personal preference if you are travelling between
    two CEPT TR61/01 countries - rely on TR61/01 or get two licences.


    73


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    Thanks brownmini for the patient comprehensive replies, very useful and interesting for a newbie like me, all full of questions. Fair play.


  • Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭Quaderno


    brownmini wrote: »
    The sequence used to be
    EI2XX, EI3XX, EI4XX, EI5XX, EI6XX, EI7XX, EI8XX, EI9XX, EI2XY, EI3XY
    The sequence may be the same today.

    The next call in line for assignment should be EI3HNB, then EI3HOB, EI3HPB up to EI3HZB. Next series after that would be EI4HAB, EI4HBB, EI4HCB and so forth.
    I may be wrong though.
    BTW: next exam 04/07/2013, three weeks left to apply.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    Quaderno wrote: »
    BTW: next exam 04/07/2013, three weeks left to apply.

    and then the exam itself is on the 4th July.

    Would a month or so be enough to study for it ?


  • Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭Quaderno


    and then the exam itself is on the 4th July.

    Would a month or so be enough to study for it ?

    I'd say that depends entirely on your personal background. With a reasonable understanding of electronics and a bit of underlying physics and practical experience listening to ham radio (i.e. knowing a thing or two about call signs, band plans, propagation and commonly used abbreviations) it's certainly possible to get it done within a month. With no previous experience it would be a lot harder I think. Did you check the syllabus on irts.ie?


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 128 ✭✭Popular Hardback


    Quaderno wrote: »
    I'd say that depends entirely on your personal background. With a reasonable understanding of electronics and a bit of underlying physics and practical experience listening to ham radio (i.e. knowing a thing or two about call signs, band plans, propagation and commonly used abbreviations) it's certainly possible to get it done within a month. With no previous experience it would be a lot harder I think. Did you check the syllabus on irts.ie?

    I had a look at it all right thanks, I think a month would be very borderline, that's why I was asking, and I'd like to properly understand it all in depth rather than just cram it off rote, so I think I'll wait. It's the journey not the destination as they say.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    I had a look at it all right thanks, I think a month would be very borderline, that's why I was asking, and I'd like to properly understand it all in depth rather than just cram it off rote, so I think I'll wait. It's the journey not the destination as they say.

    don't do that. Study hard now, take the exam, you have nothing to lose except 50 eur (or 25, depending on your circumstances)

    If you wait till October, the pressure will get you, because all that will go trough your mind is going to be - "if I fail, the next exam will be in 9 months"

    English is not my native tongue, with that in mind I started studying in February and begin feeling confident in April. I use "Advance! The Full Licence Manual" and "Amateur Radio Exam Secrets", both by RSGB. I ordered them from here http://www.rsgbshop.org/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_Training_19.html
    The reason why I mentioned that i'm a "bloody foreigner" is that it took me days to just get through a page so that I completely understood it.. The language used in these books is not the kind we use on our daily bases (my I remind you that I'm a software engineer and I'm not a stranger to tech-lingo) anyway, if you're a native speaker, it might be a lot easier for you. Those books are great!

    delivery was quick - just few days and they were delivered to my mailbox (both books are around 100 pages, they fit in a large envelope)

    for self-test I use QADV http://freespace.virgin.net/murray.g3kzb/

    also I use these question banks - http://www.iaru-r1.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=224&Itemid=169

    NZ bank is quite good. Don't use Hamtests, they're crap!. From time to time, when I start to feel overconfident about my abilities, I pick an exam sheet from the Radio Society of my native country, it really puts me back to my knees. I guess the message here is that if you have any 2nd languages, check if that country has something to offer.

    There are few good hams in Ireland who do their best to pass the knowledge - one I mentioned previously is Anthony - http://hamradioireland.blogspot.ie/
    if you browse till 2009, you'll get a lot of exam syllabus right there... Ger is also doing a huge favour to newbies - http://ei4gxb.com/

    so go on, if you really want it, now is the best time to start!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 177 ✭✭brownmini


    Quaderno wrote: »
    The next call in line for assignment should be EI3HNB, then EI3HOB, EI3HPB up to EI3HZB. Next series after that would be EI4HAB, EI4HBB, EI4HCB and so forth.
    I may be wrong though.

    That might be the sequence nowadays.


  • Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭Quaderno


    martinsvi wrote: »
    don't do that. Study hard now, take the exam, you have nothing to lose except 50 eur (or 25, depending on your circumstances)

    If you wait till October, the pressure will get you, because all that will go
    trough your mind is going to be - "if I fail, the next exam will be in 9 months"

    I think this is sound advice. The exam will be a valuable experience either way, you could repeat it in October if necessary and as a repeat candidate you would only pay half the fee, so a "fail" would effectively cost you only €25 more than a pass. You will spend a lot more than that after you got the licence anyway :)
    So I too would give it a try, knowing that you are not perfect yet may actually take some stress out of the whole exercise - but you may still be well able to pass first time if you use your time wisely.

    @martinsvi: I'm in the same boat. I have been holding a German Class E licence for many years and now I consider going through the whole process again to convert it to an Irish one since Class E is not valid here. So a lot of work for me too, and the language doesn't make it any easier. But that's how it works and I see it as the most exciting part of the challenge :D


  • Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭Quaderno


    Since nobody else picks up on that topic again I will do it :)

    I sat the exam on Thursday afternoon and - although the atmosphere in the room with 13 or so candidates was quite tense - I found that the questions were mostly fair. A few unexpected things popped up though where common sense and educated guessing would have to do. I didn't expect it to be easy, though.

    There were five or six questions that I know I got wrong. In one it was asked which one out of four given frequencies was not in an SSB - contest preferred area of the 80m-band. The choices were all above 3.6MHz and I had no clue and think I wrongly picked 3630kHz (3680kHz would have been right).

    Two questions referred to different types of amplifiers, the easier one asking (I don't remember the exact wording) which produces the least amount of harmonic distortion (Class A) and another one referred to the time and/or phase angle in which the amplifying stages would be biased in a certain type. I don't remember that one exactly, but I think I got that one wrong.

    Another one I didn't get right was the voltage in a 50 ohm dummy load on a 50 ohm feeder line when fed with 100W of rf power. I think the choices were 2V, something in between, 100V and >5000V. I went for the latter choice, but 100V is probably closer to the right answer. I never encountered that question while studying.

    The next question I think I didn't get right was dealing with an open coaxial stub at a quarter wavelength, which could work as (a) a low pass filter at the appropriate frequency, (b) a low pass filter at twice the frequency, (c) a notch filter at the frequency or (d) a notch filter at twice the frequency. I now think (c) would be correct.

    Some more questions were "interesting", one asking for the best practice when confronted with an accident that involves electricity and where you find a casualty still connected to a live wire.
    The choices were like (a) call a qualified electrician, (b) pull the arm or leg of the casualty with an insulated glove, (c) switch off the power and remove the casualty and something else I don't remember. Since an insulated glove might not be readily available and the electrician would take too long to arrive I went for cutting off power myself and removing the victim (assuming the reference was for an accident in the home rather than a power line outside).

    Some more questions off the top of my head:
    -permitted power level on 1.9MHz (a) 1W (b) 10W (c) 100W (d) 400W. 10W is the correct answer here and this question has been asked before (thanks to Anthony for mentioning it in his blog).

    -"G4XXX, this is HB9XXX" refers to a swiss operator calling an english station, I don't remember the other choices given

    -55 as a signal report refers to a "perfectly readable, fairly strong signal". One close, but wrong option was "perfectly readable, weak signal", the others were fairly obvious though

    -Emission designations were asked for in general, and the correct answer was that the first letter indicates the type of modulation used, the following digit represents the type of modulating signal and the final letter corresponds to the type of information transmitted

    -The correct wiring of a mains plug (blue neutral, brown live and yellow/green earth)

    -Two of the calculations that had to be done: one involved two capacitors (one fix, one variable) in series and the other one referred to a circuit consisting of two resistors in parallel and another one in series with the first two. I got the first one wrong initially but spotted the error in time I think.

    -It was asked what a varicap diode was and some funny answers given like a heat- or light variable resistor or someting. Right answer should be a current variable capacitor.

    -One question referred to what should be noted in the log book on an ongoing basis and I think it was the mode of transmission that was asked for. The other choices were details of the equipment, location of the other station and signal reports.

    -The first question referred to the circumstances that would allow an radio amateur to transmit messages on behalf of a third party and I think the obvious answer would have been only in case of a catastrophic event and for disaster relief.

    -Some more of the antenna questions: one was a schematic of a trap dipole and the question was what the traps are used for. The answer of course was to make it usable on more than one band.

    -Similarly another question asked what needs to be done to make a half wave dipole resonant at a higher frequency and the choices were something like to shorten it on one end, shorten it on both ends, lengthen it on one end or lengthen it on both ends. Both ends need to be made shorter here.

    -Then it was asked what can be used to match the impedance of the antenna to the transceiver at the trx end of the feeder line. An antenna matching unit it was.

    -Then there was the schematic of a dipole antenna with the diagram of "something" over the antenna (high value at the feeding point, low values at both ends), you had to pick from the choices and I went for "current".

    -Another question asked what it is good for to have the same impedance in the feeding line as in the antenna, answer here was for the best possible transfer of power.

    -Then there was the question on which of four given frequencies a half wave dipole of a certain length would be resonant. I forgot the exact values here, but the answer was quite straightforward.

    -A question was asked regarding the radiation characteristics of different antenna types, i.e. which one emits the least directional/most circular radiation pattern and the choices given were three different types of dipole antennas and a quarter wave ground plane, which I think should be the correct answer.

    -One question asked for the upper limit of the 20m-band (14350kHz) and another one asked which of four given bands was allocated to radio amateurs on a secondary basis (10MHz).

    -Then there was the question on which out of four bands no contest activity was allowed and it was one of the WARC-bands. (12/17/30m, I don't remember which one exactly was mentioned)

    -Some more questions I remembered over night: 4 circuits (all very similar apart from the polarity of the diodes) were drawn and the one depicting a full wave rectifier had to be identified

    -A mains transformator with 1100 windings of the primary side should give an output of 14V, you had to figure out the number of secondary windings.

    -Four sample callsigns were given and the one that violates the rules was to be identified. One ended with a number.

    I think there were three or four more that I don't remember now, but I hope the ones I do can help someone preparing for the next exam. As I said, it wasn't too bad and I hope I made it through. I'll come back if I remember any more questions.


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    I was on the morning group, I was originally in the afternoon group as I applied early, but I switched around to accommodate someone coming from far...

    I barely remember any questions, I think I did A section almost perfectly, the B got me goosebumps... I think I did good, but... I'm not confident..

    questions that I remember - something about working with 15cm and shorter radiowaves - what do you use -
    - wave-guides,
    - coaxial cable
    - twisted twin cable (or something like that)
    -- don't remember

    when are you allowed to transmit next to an airport

    -when you use 25w
    - 50w
    - never
    - after getting a permission from airport

    we were asked to recognize a circuit of an antenna trap

    anyway, no surprises, I just wish I had more confidence on the answers I provided...


  • Registered Users Posts: 2,043 ✭✭✭martinedwards


    when do you get results?

    and you will let us know your new call signs to listen out for you, right?


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    I've been told that it takes two weeks for comreg to process the results and then another two weeks to process the licence/callsign.

    However, because I believe there were around 30 (I read somewhere that usually it's around 15) people attending the exam, I wouldn't be surprised if there would be some delays.

    I'll let you know my callsign IF I get it... oh the wait...


  • Registered Users Posts: 815 ✭✭✭Quaderno


    I can hardly believe it, but the postman just brought the letter. So watch out when you come home today, there may be a surprise in the post :)
    BTW: 90% overall, I'm happy :)


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    ah, my workday is now ruined.. how does one stay focused with something like that (possibly) in a mailbox... 90% wow, excellent job!


  • Registered Users Posts: 1,729 ✭✭✭martinsvi


    got mine - Section A - 97%, Section B - 73%, Overall - 85%!


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  • Registered Users Posts: 2,043 ✭✭✭martinedwards


    well done guys! now to ebay to get a radio!

    unless of course anyone fancies a FT101B?


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