Should Robbie Keane retire from ROI squad?

aramush

Rekop dog wrote: »

Funny thing is the mongtards in this thread will wait for his first poor performance against a decent team to slaughter him and think it's some sort of justification for their frankly cringeworthy argument here.

He hasn't just had one poor performance against decent teams in recents times, he's had many.

Rekop dog wrote: »

People don't seem to grasp the very basic concept that we're faaaar more unlikely to score against the likes of Germany Spain Brazil Argentina than we are against weaker opposition. We're relative minnows compared to those nations full of champions league stars. RVP would have a terrible goal record for us against these nations if he started up front us, do not fool yourself about that. Still doesn't mean Keane isn't the right man to have there from our limited player base to stick to occasional chance away (naturally less frequent than against Faroes ect..)

I'd call Austria and Sweden to be of equal standing to us, and Robbie didn't produced or have any meaningful contribution in those games at all.

LuckyLloyd

Doesn't matter what they think though, Trapp sees his value so he'll start the rest of the campaign with the band. And rightly so.

jimjamcos

aramush wrote: »

He hasn't just had one poor performance against decent teams in recents times, he's had many.

In terms of playing poorly against the stronger teams, so has Aidan McGeady and so has James McClean and so has Walters and so has Cox. We have a limited squad of average players who should, being realistic, always struggle against the much better players of Germany etc.

When the above play poorly however, they are totally ineffective.

When Robbie plays poorly, he still scores.


Therein lies the difference.

aindriu80

Looking at the stats its doesn't make much sense to question Robbie Keane's place in the first XI. He has scored more goals than anyone else and we could do with a few more goals in our games. Who is going to replace him ? Long does well in making a presence on the pitch and attracting play to attacking positions but he isn't going to get us that many goals.

A better thread would be time to religiously stick to better football. We could play better football and we should put more goals away against the poorer teams. We still play long ball against the worst teams in Europe and have yet to keep the ball on the ground for an extended period of time and work it into the goal. We still play 4-4-2 and I wish that would change. Nothing too wrong with the Irish players but its very predictable at games.

Rekop dog

aramush wrote: »

I'd call Austria and Sweden to be of equal standing to us, and Robbie didn't produced or have any meaningful contribution in those games at all.

I wouldn't, both them nations had many players competing in European club competitions last season, the likes of Ibra and Alaba really standing out as world class, we had nothing in comparison. You like many are fooled by Trap having us punching above our current weight.

CSF

Rekop dog wrote: »

I wouldn't, both them nations had many players competing in European club competitions last season, the likes of Ibra and Alaba really standing out as world class, we had nothing in comparison. You like many are fooled by Trap having us punching above our current weight.

Alaba? World class? Are ya sure?

jimjamcos

CSF wrote: »

Alaba? World class? Are ya sure?

Best LB in the world.

LuckyLloyd

I'd have Scotland as a not dissimilar standard if squad to us these days. Look how they're getting on during the Trapp era as a comparison

jimjamcos

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'd have Scotland as a not dissimilar standard if squad to us these days. Look how they're getting on during the Trapp era as a comparison

Scotland = Ireland - Keane.


They'd have bitten our hands off for a consistent goalscorer over last 10 years.

CSF

jimjamcos wrote: »

Best LB in the world.

But not really.

Rekop dog

CSF wrote: »

Alaba? World class? Are ya sure?

He's been a key component this season in probably the best defensive unit I've seen since mid 90's Serie A. Offers plenty going forward as well, there wasn't too many better performers in his position last season in world football.

jimjamcos

CSF wrote: »

But not really.

Who is better so? He's much better defensively than Alba.

Aenaes

jimjamcos wrote: »

Who is better so? He's much better defensively than Alba.

SSN tells us Ashley Cole. They wouldn't lie, would they?

CSF

jimjamcos wrote: »

Who is better so? He's much better defensively than Alba.

Alba, Marcelo, Cole, Vertonghen

jimjamcos

Aenaes wrote: »

SSN tells us Ashley Cole. They wouldn't lie, would they?

Oh sorry, it's definitely Ashley Cole, when it's not Baines.

Rekop dog

CSF wrote: »

Alba, Marcelo, Cole, Vertonghen

Marcelo?

Go home, your drunk.

CSF

jimjamcos wrote: »

Oh sorry, it's definitely Ashley Cole, when it's not Baines.

The fact that the British media overhypes pretty much everyone, doesn't mean the Premiership (and a few British) doesn't have some fantastic players. Cole a prime example.

CSF

Rekop dog wrote: »

Marcelo?

Go home, your drunk.

Left back in the world team of the year. Yeah, such an absurd notion.

jimjamcos

CSF wrote: »

Alba, Marcelo, Cole, Vertonghen

That is one loller of a list.


Alba: Not as good defensively
Marcelo: Doesn't get starting for Real, way too rash in the tackle and poor defensively.
Cole: Still up there but no way is he in his prime (when he was near best in world), not even a regular starter for his country anymore.
Vertonghen: You actually pullin me leg aren't ya? :pac:

CSF

jimjamcos wrote: »

That is one loller of a list.


Alba:Not as good defensively
Marcelo: Doesn't get starting for Real, way too rash in the tackle and poor defensively.
Cole: Still up there but no way is he in his prime (when he was near best in world), not even a regular starter for his country anymore.
Vertonghen: You actually pullin me leg aren't ya? :pac:

All better than Alaba who has had one good season in said position under his belt.

jimjamcos

CSF wrote: »

All better than Alaba who has had one good season in said position under his belt.

You crazy man, crazy crazy crazy

CSF

jimjamcos wrote: »

You crazy man, crazy crazy crazy

How many good seasons does Alaba have as a leftback then?

.jacksparrow.

CSF wrote: »

All better than Alaba who has had one good season in said position under his belt.

And how many good seasons has vertongen had at LB? I think you're getting a bit confused..

LuckyLloyd

Cole has been top notch for some time. Totally worthy of the hype. Was fantastic at last year's Euros.

CSF

.jacksparrow. wrote: »

And how many good seasons has vertongen had at LB? I think you're getting a bit confused..

I don't think Vertonghen is the best LB in the world though, do I? Can I get an answer to my question?

Andersonisgod

CSF wrote: »

How many good seasons does Alaba have as a leftback then?

One season at Barcelona, one La Liga title and an incredible influential and important role in Spain's victorious Euro 2012 campaign. I can't remember the last international tournament when a full back had such a decisive role in the outcome.

Rekop dog

CSF wrote: »

Left back in the world team of the year. Yeah, such an absurd notion.

You mean the most insanely la liga biased team they announced earlier in the season? He's hardly started a game this year.

I'm not arguing that Alaba is the best, I said there's been few better performers this season which is true and an example of a player achieving far greater things despite his age compared to anyone in the Irish squad.

CSF

Andersonisgod wrote: »

One season at Barcelona, one La Liga title and an incredible influential and important role in Spain's victorious Euro 2012 campaign. I can't remember the last international tournament when a full back had such a decisive role in the outcome.

Wrong player.

Andersonisgod

CSF wrote: »

Wrong player.

No, I'm pretty sure that's Jordi Alba.

CSF

Rekop dog wrote: »

You mean the most insanely la liga biased team they announced earlier in the season? He's hardly started a game this year.

I'm not arguing that Alaba is the best, I said there's been few better performers this season which is true and an example of a player achieving far greater things despite his age compared to anyone in the Irish squad.

I wouldn't take Mourinho's judgement as Real manager as an indication of anything. Serious problems behind the scenes as illustrated by Casillas suffering the same fate.

CSF

Andersonisgod wrote: »

No, I'm pretty sure that's Jordi Alba.

I was criticising David Alaba though.

jimjamcos

CSF wrote: »

How many good seasons does Alaba have as a leftback then?

What difference does that make? He's 20 years of age.

Is it not enough to judge him on one (his first) season at the top level, against the best club sides in the world, in which he and his team have won all before them? He'll only get better if anything!

Are you saying that a player can't be the best in his position if he hasn't played for numerous years?

Get your head out of your arse and open your eyes.

Andersonisgod

CSF wrote: »

I was criticising David Alaba though.

Damn, my apologies, right direct my defence of Alba to whoever was having a go at him.

CSF

jimjamcos wrote: »

What difference does that make? He's 20 years of age.

Is it not enough to judge him on one (his first) season at the top level, against the best club sides in the world, in which he and his team have won all before them? He'll only get better if anything!

Are you saying that a player can't be the best in his position if he hasn't played for numerous years?

Get your head out of your arse and open your eyes.

One season of strong performances (not exactly world class performances) as part of a team annihilating everyone they meet (and not being a star player on that team) does not entitle you to any such accolade.

SirDelboy18

Richie Sadlier in the Independant today with a great article on Keane (on the topic we have been discussing), where he recognises low little he offers outside the box and says that he can do a job against smaller teams or from the bench.

LuckyLloyd

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Richie Sadlier in the Independant today with a great article on Keane (on the topic we have been discussing), where he recognises low little he offers outside the box and says that he can do a job against smaller teams or from the bench.

Sadlier is not a credible analyst of the Irish team these days tbh.

MANUTD99

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Sadlier is not a credible analyst of the Irish team these days tbh.

His point is fair to be honest. Ireland do not play to Robbie Keanes strengths anymore. Trap likes players like Walters, Doyle, Cox who will come in deep and catch long balls. Keane feeds on link up quick play in the box. Ireland haven't done that since McCarthy

Robbie Keane is not at his peak for this type of game. We have players who could link up play to feed Keane but Trap over looks it. Like it or lump it thats they way it is these days. Thump up the ball and hope for the best,

aindriu80

here is the article in the indo http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/dion-fanning-trapattoni-is-not-for-turning-29331185.html

We are 1/5 to qualify by the way.

I think the article was a good read and made some interesting points. We should have brought new players in before now and changed the way we play. I don't think robbie being in the team is much of an issue. Its not like hoolahan where someone else has to be dropped.

Rekop dog

aindriu80 wrote: »

We are 1/5 to qualify by the way.

Whatcha talkin bout?

aindriu80

Rekop dog wrote: »

Whatcha talkin bout?

odds to make brasil.

SirDelboy18

aindriu80 wrote: »

here is the article in the indo http://www.independent.ie/sport/soccer/dion-fanning-trapattoni-is-not-for-turning-29331185.html

We are 1/5 to qualify by the way.

I think the article was a good read and made some interesting points. We should have brought new players in before now and changed the way we play. I don't think robbie being in the team is much of an issue. Its not like hoolahan where someone else has to be dropped.

Thats NOT to qualify. We are 3/1 to qualify.

aindriu80

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Thats NOT to qualify. We are 3/1 to qualify.

I must have read/wrote it wrong :

....Ireland are still unlikely to qualify (they are 1/5 not to make it) for the World Cup despite Trapattoni's optimism.......

I was meant to write ..we are 1/5 not to make it to brasil.

Wilberto

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Thats NOT to qualify. We are 3/1 to qualify.

That's actually good. I thought the odds would be much higher!!!

Still though, Brasil, who wants to go to that WC??!!! It's way too far away. Prepare for the Euros that's what I say!!!! :D:D

Coillte_Bhoy

Wilberto wrote: »

That's actually good. I thought the odds would be much higher!!!

Still though, Brasil, who wants to go to that WC??!!! It's way too far away. Prepare for the Euros that's what I say!!!! :D:D

why on earth is that price good?

andyman

Hello everybody, my name is Rafael Benitez and I'm here to present you with some "fahcts".

*fahct* Robbie Keane has 59 goals for Ireland. Fantastic achievement.

*fahct* When was the last time Robbie scored against one of the bigger seeds in the groups? Or even one of the better teams at a major competition?

*fahct* Robbie's last 14 goals for his country have been against teams we should be beating.

*fahct* Robbie's last goal scored in a big game was against Russia in 2010

*fahct* That goal was also a penalty

*fahct* Robbie's been a great servant for the country. Nobody is denying it or trying to take it away from him, however he just can't perform in a big game anymore and he hasn't done for a long, long time...

Optimalprimerib

So from skippibg to the last few pages of this thread, is robbie planning to play at full back or something?

Laois_Man

If Keane isn't good enough to be picked, then blame the manager for picking him, not Robbie!

And remember, anyone who criticises Robbie for wanting to play for Ireland has no right to ever criticise anyone like James McCarthy or Darren Gibson or whoever for not making themselves avaialable.

Wilberto

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

why on earth is that price good?

What I mean is that I thought the odds on us qualifying would have been more like 6/1 or 7/1.

Essentially the point that I'm trying to get across is that I'm more pessimistic about our chances of reaching Brazil than the bookies apparently!! :D

So the guys that want Keane gone, your main argument is that he doesn't score in the big games.

Is there someone to replace him that does score these goals in big games?

The_Kew_Tour

rarnes1 wrote: »

So the guys that want Keane gone, your main argument is that he doesn't score in the big games.

Is there someone to replace him that does score these goals in big games?

Anthony Stokes ;-)

Seriously I agree entirely.