Dog Food

Man on Fire

Is there much of a difference in pedigree chum then say lidls dog food...

Lidls dog food is twice as big and same price...
My da is sayin you have to buy pedigree just wondering what other people think

meoklmrk91

Man on Fire wrote: »

Is there much of a difference in pedigree chum then say lidls dog food...

Lidls dog food is twice as big and same price...
My da is sayin you have to buy pedigree just wondering what other people think

No difference quality wise, they are both rubbish to be honest.

ISDW

I don't think you'll find many people on here recommending Pedigree Chum, or Lidl's food for that matter. Better food out there. I'd steer clear of any food with colours in it, just because something is green, doesn't mean its a vegetable, its had colouring added, and we all know what additives like that do to kids, so would they not have the same effect on dogs?

andreac

They are both as bad as each other and id never feed either to my dogs.

Try getting a good quality food in the local pet shop. Anything sold in a supermarket usually isnt that great at all.

Pedigree is a name, thats all, and thats why it sells. Its prob one of the worst foods on the market to be honest.

Nody

Could not find Pedigreee Chum but here's the review of Pedigree Adult (Complete) instead:

Ingredient list:
Ground yellow corn, meat and bone meal, corn gluten meal, chicken by-product meal, animal fat (preserved with bha/bht), wheat mill run, natural poultry flavor, rice, salt, potassium chloride, caramel color, wheat flour, wheat gluten, vegetable oil, vitamins (choline chloride, dl-alpha tocopherol acetate [source of vitamin e], l-ascorbyl-2-polyphosphate [source of vitamin c*], vitamin a supplement, thiamine mononitrate [vitamin b1], biotin, d-calcium pantothenate, riboflavin supplement [vitamin b2], vitamin d3 supplement, vitamin b12 supplement), trace minerals (zinc sulfate, copper sulfate, potassium iodide).

*not recognized as an essential nutrient by the aafco dog food nutrient profiles.

This food receives a 1 star rating simply because there is nothing lower.

The primary ingredients in the food are grains (it should be meat!). Corn is a problematic grain that is difficult for dogs to digest and thought to be the cause of a great many allergy and yeast infection problems. We prefer not to see this used in dog food.

Meat and bone meal is a low quality meat product for which it is impossible to determine the source.

Corn appears a second time as corn gluten meal. The AAFCO definition of corn gluten meal is “the dried residue from corn after the removal of the larger part of the starch and germ, and the separation of the bran by the process employed in the wet milling manufacture of corn starch or syrup, or by enzymatic treatment of the endosperm”. In plain English, that which remains after all the nutritious bits have been removed.

The next ingredient is by-products. It is impossible to ascertain the quality of by-products and these are usually products that are of such low quality as to be rejected for use in the human food chain, or else are those parts that have so little value that they cannot be used elsewhere in either the human or pet food industries. The AAFCO definition of chicken by-product meal is “a meal consisting of the ground, rendered, clean parts of the carcass of slaughtered chicken, such as necks, feet, undeveloped eggs and intestines, exclusive of feathers, except in such amounts as might occur unavoidable in good processing practice.”

Animal fat is a further low quality ingredient and is impossible to determine the source. Unidentified ingredients are usually very low quality. AAFCO define this as "obtained from the tissues of mammals and/or poultry in the commercial processes of rendering or extracting. It consists predominantly of glyceride esters of fatty acids and contains no additions of free fatty acids. If an antioxidant is used, the common name or names must be indicated, followed by the words "used as a preservative".

This food uses chemical preservatives (BHA, BHT) which is believed to be carcinogenic, and is banned from use in human food. It also uses artificial colourants.

The 6th and 12th ingredients are fragments of wheat. The use of wheat is a significant negative: wheat is believed to be the number one cause of allergy problems in dog food. This is another ingredient we prefer not to see used at all in dog food.

So yes, I'd agree with the three posters above and get a proper dog food rather then either of the two you've named because they are not even medium quality type of dog food.

tomtucker81

Pedigree is a name, thats all, and thats why it sells.

take the pedigree out of the name and all uiu have is chum. Sounds like bits of waste meat.

I feed mine massbrook complete. Ive two golden retrievers, its full of the important stuff for them. They're on it about 5 weeks now and they're looking brilliant and full of energy.

paultf

Man on Fire wrote: »

Is there much of a difference in pedigree chum then say lidls dog food...

The ingredients for both contain 'meat/animal derivatives' and 'cereal derivatives'. For some reason the EU have decided this is the minimum labeling allowable which means dog food manufacturers can add whatever ingredients suits them best i.e. the cheapest. Also each batch of food produced will contain different types of 'meat/cereals' - again as it is cheaper for them. So you will never know what your dog is getting exactly.

www.gov.uk/dealing-with-animal-by-products

Types of ABPs include:

• catering waste (including used cooking oil) from commercial and household kitchens
• former foodstuffs of animal origin from food manufacturers and retailers
• butcher and slaughterhouse waste
• blood
• feathers
• wool
• hides and skins
• fallen stock - see the guide on fallen stock
• dead pet animals
• dead zoo animals
• hunt trophies
• manure
• ova, embryos and semen (when not destined for breeding purposes)

Maybe changing to a dry food might give you better options, an improvement in the quality of the food and could work out better value.

maggiepip

All ingredients for petfood in the EU must be fit for human consumption, but petfoods containing by products must be labeled not fit for human consumption, even though the animals they have come from must have been declared fit for human consumption.

Gain do a range of dog foods - http://www.gainfeeds.com/pet/home
As do REd Mills http://www.redmills.co.uk/uk/pet/home/

paultf

maggiepip wrote: »

All ingredients for petfood in the EU must be fit for human consumption, but petfoods containing by products must be labeled not fit for human consumption, even though the animals they have come from must have been declared fit for human consumption.

The link I gave above came from an email from the Pet Food Manufacturers Association www.pfma.org.uk which had this information aswell:

"Regarding your enquiry, firstly I would like to explain a bit more about animal derivatives.
The material of animal origin used by the pet food industry comprises are those parts of animals which are either deemed surplus to human consumption or are not normally consumed by people in the UK, and derived from animals inspected and passed as fit for human consumption prior to slaughter. Animal material of this nature, which is not intended for human consumption, is classified as "animal by-products" under the EC Regulation on Animal By-Products for which Defra is responsible, and assigned the lowest risk rating. This rating requires that the material be free of any transmissible disease, which therefore excludes material from dying, diseased or disabled animals.
To find out more about this, please see the Defra website http://www.defra.gov.uk/food-farm/byproducts/ ."

The OP was comparing Pedigree Chum and Lidl's dog food and I suppose I was just trying to point out what would be in these type of foods. And basically there are better ones out there at a decent price that doesn't break the budget.

juniord

maggiepip wrote: »

All ingredients for petfood in the EU must be fit for human consumption, but petfoods containing by products must be labeled not fit for human consumption, even though the animals they have come from must have been declared fit for human consumption.

that is not exactly true , if you have a meat feeders license you can buy meat from knackeries licensed to sell meat which comes from animals not fit for human consumption but has been passed by a vet as fit for petfood

maggiepip

juniord wrote: »

that is not exactly true , if you have a meat feeders license you can buy meat from knackeries licensed to sell meat which comes from animals not fit for human consumption but has been passed by a vet as fit for petfood

Is that for personal feeding use then? As in petfood manufacturers couldnt use such meat under EU law?

juniord

yes you must record all meat bought for and fed to dogs ,its marked as unfit for human consumption with a dye

meoklmrk91

Just to touch in this again. A lot of people come to me for advice on dogs, one of the questions I get asked the most is regarding dog food. A lot of people say I know should be getting pedigree or bakers but I just can't afford it. They are shocked when they hear that pedigree is no better than the food from Lidl or Aldi.

It's amazing what good marketing can do. Someone once said that they thought dogs must love bakers because it looks so appetising with all the different colours. Then I told them that dogs don't see colours the same way we do and that they would smell it long before they saw it, they said they had never really thought of it that way because the marketing had trained them to think that their dog would love it. The colours or for our benefit, so that we can think that fido, loves the green bits because he is getting his veg, and the brown bits because they taste like meat. In reality it's all the same stuff mixed together and then mixed with nasty colourants that serve no purpose other than to make them pleasing to us.

And when I tell them I feed my large dog on what I consider to be decent quality food, for far less than they are feeding their small dogs on pedigree, bakers etc. they are even more shocked. Like I said good marketing does wonders. If you don't want to buy good quality food, atleast save yourself a few bob and supplement their diet with some raw goodies from the money you you save buying lidl/aldi over pedigree.

maggiepip

Actually I think Aldi wet is better than pedigree - I looked at the ingredients in the foil tubs and theres no cereals....!

falabo

juniord wrote: »

yes you must record all meat bought for and fed to dogs ,its marked as unfit for human consumption with a dye

I'm sure we can buy with confidence its EU law after all . . .

Ms Tootsie

In terms of quality there are so many more better options out there - burns, arden grange, red mills, raw, fresh. A good quality food will save you money in the long run as you will need to feed your dog less of it so if that is your reason for considering switching to Lidl dog food then maybe consider the other brands.

I feed our medium sized dog on about a fiver a week. I get all my meat from the butchers. I buy about 5e worth of good quality meat, livers and hearts and then mix it with scraps the butcher gives to me. Add some rice which I cook in water and beef stock, portion it up and voila enough food for seven days along with a few spare bones and a chicken leg for a Saturday morning treat.

oban

you are much better off giving your dog a dry food, like a fully balanced complete food in kibble form, it helps keep their teeth clean and its better for their digestion. Most wet dog foods are only made up of a very small percentage meat offal, after that its flavour enhancers and soya. A good dry food will have a high meat content and a well balanced formula of vitamins and minerals. Look for other ingredients like prebiotics, antioxidents, omega, glucosamine etc
These are the factors that make a difference and are better for your dogs health in the long run.
Pedigree dog food is very high in sugar which is bad for you dog as are the majority of off the shelf supermarket dog foods.
You are better off going to a pet store where you can find specific dog foods to meet your dog's needs. The proper feed for an active, inactive, big, small, old, puppy etc etc. They will advise you which is the best. At the end of the day they are no more expensive than buying it in the supermarket. If you feed the right amount of the correct feed to your dog, do the sums and you will see the price difference and you will know you are feeding the best. They will have better health in the long run and you will notice the difference in their skin and coat and your vet bills will be less in the long run. Try not to give your dog too many treats they are very high in sugar. Red Mills make good dog food particularly their super premium range Leader and a new one range Engage which can be bought on line. I have fed my dog Royal Canin in the past too, its a bit more expensive but also good. I prefer to stay with Red Mills because its Irish and made in Ireland.

maggiepip

I dont agree at all that dried food is better than wet food. If you buy a good wet food with good ingredients (basically just meat and innards) its a much more natural feed than dried food which is totally dehydrated and basically incinerated. As for the teeth cleaning things - I fear that was propaganda - a recent study showed no difference in dogs teeth whether they were fed wet or dry food.... it did show dogs fed raw had better teeth though.

Its very difficult though to get a good wet food in Ireland - so I get mine from zooplus would be lost without it.

meoklmrk91

maggiepip wrote: »

I dont agree at all that dried food is better than wet food. If you buy a good wet food with good ingredients (basically just meat and innards) its a much more natural feed than dried food which is totally dehydrated and basically incinerated. As for the teeth cleaning things - I fear that was propaganda - a recent study showed no difference in dogs teeth whether they were fed wet or dry food.... it did show dogs fed raw had better teeth though.

Its very difficult though to get a good wet food in Ireland - so I get mine from zooplus would be lost without it.

I agree with the teeth thing, when you think about it kibble turns basically into wet food when the dog is chewing it.

I think any poor quality food that is high in sugar, which they usually are, whether it be wet or dry will play havoc with a dogs teeth.

Another good marketing trick of pedigree is dentastix, full of sugar. A free bone from the butcher will do them far more good.

maggiepip

Yeah those dentastix are horrific:eek:

oban

I was told by 2 vets that specialize in small animals that dry food is better. The dry food is extruded and cooked in order to gelatinise the starch because dogs cannot disgest starch in raw form. Extrusion increases the digestibility of the food and ensures sterile food. If you visited any factory that makes human level foods that uses meat, like for soups or any of tinned food you wouldnt eat it yourself again not alone give it to you dog. I've seen it first hand.

meoklmrk91

oban wrote: »

I was told by 2 vets that specialize in small animals that dry food is better. The dry food is extruded and cooked in order to gelatinise the starch because dogs cannot disgest starch in raw form. Extrusion increases the digestibility of the food and ensures sterile food. If you visited any factory that makes human level foods that uses meat, like for soups or any of tinned food you wouldnt eat it yourself again not alone give it to you dog. I've seen it first hand.

In my personal opinion, many vets know very little about nutrition in this country. One if my vets once asked me about the protein content of my cats food, when I said 32% she said that that was very high, but then she looked at the bag of hills she was trying to sell me and it was even higher. She is an excellent vet, I would trust her with my pets any day of week, and she is far from alone, I've fine work experience in a number of places and the vets would have had very similarly a low level of knowledge regarding nutrition. There is only one vet that I would trust with regards to nutrition and that was my teacher in college, she was excellent and made it a point to teach us about nutrition in a very in depth manner.

Most vets sell hills or royal canin, because they get incentives to. So that's what they push. Hills and royal canin used to be super premium, but now they are just overpriced, medium quality food. The prescription foods most certainly have their place, and are very useful.

I've attended a seminar by royal canin when I was in college. The way that they push it is incredible.

Finally what suits one dog may not suit another, be it dry, wet, raw or barf. I feed my dog dry because its what works for us. Plus some raw goodie. But I wouldn't go completely raw.

borderlinemeath

oban wrote: »

I was told by 2 vets that specialize in small animals that dry food is better. The dry food is extruded and cooked in order to gelatinise the starch because dogs cannot disgest starch in raw form. Extrusion increases the digestibility of the food and ensures sterile food. If you visited any factory that makes human level foods that uses meat, like for soups or any of tinned food you wouldnt eat it yourself again not alone give it to you dog. I've seen it first hand.

Of course a vet is going to say that dry food is better, they sell it and make a healthy margin on it. The dregs that go into 'meat derivitives' in the majority of dry foods is the stuff that's swept out the door in the abbottoir. The majority of protein that hides under the protein content is vegetable which is harder to digest.

Think back 25 years, nobody fed dried kibble, it was tins of wet food and table scraps. And dogs did just fine on it. I think we've been bamboozled by the marketing companies (as have the vets) into thinking that a dried 'complete' food is the best for our dogs. I know that dogs have far less taste buds than humans but in fairness would you like to live on something that was similar to eating dry toast day in day out? No wonder they go crazy for the likes of dentastix when they get them:D.

The fact that so many dogs have intolerances with various brands of dry food indicates to me that there's something seriously wrong with feeding dried kibble, particularly if it's got a shelf life years in advance. Years ago, dogs didn't have intolerances, poos were hard and small and dogs lived well into their teens. It's scary how many dogs can't stomach something that is advertised and sold as 'complete food for dogs'

/end rant

Cocolola

I always heard that whole dry-food-is-better-for-teeth thing too. And I believed it for a while but when you think about it, as other posters have pointed out, it doesn't really make sense.

In saying that, I currently feed my fella Orijen kibble. When I got him I was living at home and my mother used to feed the other dogs cans of whatever horrible cr*p was cheapest in Tescos at the time, be it Pedigree or their own brand so I was adamant that when I finally had my own dog and was in control of his food I'd get as far away as possible from that.

Reading this forum though has got me thinking of maybe trying a raw diet after his current bag runs out. The only thing is I like being able to buy a 13Kg bag of food and not need to worry about it for 3-4 months. I need to do a lot more research (read: start researching!) into it first.

Maggiepip what is the wet food that you get? I'd be interested in that maybe too.

hedgehog2

I had our dogs on redmills supreme but they were flying through it and it is not that cheap at 40 ish euro.
Found a 15kg bag of worker that they really like for 13 euro,I suspect most places stock it.
Its just as good as the higher priced stuff,no difference in dogs coat and they both like it.
Would recommend

andreac

hedgehog2 wrote: »

I had our dogs on redmills supreme but they were flying through it and it is not that cheap at 40 ish euro.
Found a 15kg bag of worker that they really like for 13 euro,I suspect most places stock it.
Its just as good as the higher priced stuff,no difference in dogs coat and they both like it.
Would recommend

Sorry, but hate to tell you, theres a HUGE difference in both of those foods. The ingredients for a start. Just look at the ingredients on both bags.

One will be meat and animal derivitives :eek: and the other will be good quality meat.

Edited to add: I just looked up that food. The first ingredient is cereals, not even meat. Then second is meat and animal derivitives, then more derivitives so yes, huge difference in quality, hence the lower price...

hedgehog2

andreac wrote: »

Sorry, but hate to tell you, theres a HUGE difference in both of those foods. The ingredients for a start. Just look at the ingredients on both bags.

One will be meat and animal derivitives :eek: and the other will be good quality meat.

Edited to add: I just looked up that food. The first ingredient is cereals, not even meat. Then second is meat and animal derivitives, then more derivitives so yes, huge difference in quality, hence the lower price...

Our dogs get good quality scraps,butchers bones and fish oils on top of the food.I suppose htere is nothing wrong with it as long as you add in extra nutrients,it beats the pedigree chum and lidl brands but might fall marginally short of the premium dog foods.This can be easily fixed by being creative with the dogs scraps and it is in fact far cheaper to sustain,please don`t be fooled by the marketing hype of hills and the other expensive plans.
Dogs thrive on scraps alone as long as they are the right ones,more power to people if they want to fork out on over priced brands but there are other methods to give your dog the right nutrition.

andreac

hedgehog2 wrote: »

Our dogs get good quality scraps,butchers bones and fish oils on top of the food.I suppose htere is nothing wrong with it as long as you add in extra nutrients,it beats the pedigree chum and lidl brands but might fall marginally short of the premium dog foods.This can be easily fixed by being creative with the dogs scraps and it is in fact far cheaper to sustain,please don`t be fooled by the marketing hype of hills and the other expensive plans.
Dogs thrive on scraps alone as long as they are the right ones,more power to people if they want to fork out on over priced brands but there are other methods to give your dog the right nutrition.

Oh believe me, im not fooled. I dont feed Hills or Royal Canin, but i do feed a good quality food with good ingredients that dont have cereals listed as their first ingredient. I feed a quality food that has meat as the ingredient, not derivitives.

That food is not marginally short, it is way more than that.

If your dog does ok on it then thats fine. But you cant say that there is little difference between the two you mention when in fact there is huge difference.

I just wanted the op to realise that, in case they werent that experienced when it comes to ingredients etc.

Bigus

We've 2 good bichon s on Lidlor Aldi food last 4 years, no visits to vet apart from boosters , since they've been on this dry food,

and emissions easier to handle too, nice and firm.

Vet even commented on how good condition they both are.

Cost s about 7 euro a month too feed them both, added bonus is food is made in Ireland too.

Happy dogs.

PucaMama

i feed 1 cup of skinners ruff and ready, mixed with half a can of natures menu

http://www.skinnerspetfoods.co.uk/store/all-dogs/ruff-ready/

http://www.naturesmenu.co.uk/category-cans--pouches.aspx

is that ok? i was thinking of switching to lillys kitchen wet food