UPC on VDSL? !!

bk

I just had an interesting thought. I wonder might UPC consider becoming another ISP to resell Eircoms VDSL?

I know it sounds like a crazy idea, but bear with me for a moment.

By rolling out their own VDSL product UPC could gain access to customers that they can't or don't currently reach with their cable broadband service.

It is looking like Eircoms VDSL network is going to cover much more homes then UPC's cable network will.

UPC could then deliver their TV service using IPTV to these new customers.

UPC are a very well known and respected brand offering TV services in Ireland and they have vastly more experience with it then Eircom, with agreements and relationships already in place with all the TV companies. I think they would have quiet a competitive advantage over Eircom with a BB + TV bundle over VDSL.

It isn't as crazy as it might first seem, in the UK, Virgin Media who is the cable company there actually rolled out their own VDSL network to reach extra customers!

I also assume Sky will also eventually do something similar.

BTW I've absolutely no inside knowledge on this, it is just something that jumped into my head.

phog

Afaik, UPC don't come under the umbrella of ComReg as they're seen as an entertainment company, if they go this route would they have to become a communications company and fall under the regulations of ComReg. Would it be worth it for them?

dub45

They do.

bk

phog wrote: »

Afaik, UPC don't come under the umbrella of ComReg as they're seen as an entertainment company, if they go this route would they have to become a communications company and fall under the regulations of ComReg. Would it be worth it for them?

Well they already are a registered telecoms company and are regulated by Comreg is this area and they are also regulated by Comreg in the area of MMDS.

It is just their cable network that isn't regulated by Comreg.

So there wouldn't be any change if they started reselling VDSL.

roast

I spoke with a colleague about this recently.

It's certainly a possibility, I'd imagine. UPC never acquired or successfully negotiated a licence with ComReg to provide broadband over their MMDS network, which pretty much limited their future expansion to laying more cable for their Docsis network instead.
With the steady decline of UPCs MMDS customers, I'm curious whether they'll renew the licence next year - if not, what's the next plan?

As you said, expanding to VDSL over Eircom's network would be quite lucrative, and certainly feasible. UPC Austria are already supplying VDSL, so Liberty Global do have some experience with the technology.

Obviously UPC would much prefer to keep supplying services over their own infrastructure, but in the meantime, they could increase their foothold a lot more by reselling VDSL.

colm_mcm

It would really dilute the brand though. I know years ago NTL used to do a phone pack over the eircom line. They have a reasonably sized infrastructure at the moment and in my opinion they'd be better off maximising their share for all 3 services on that network first.

Praetorian

UPC could lose a significant quantity of customers back to the Eircom network (and other resellers) once VDSL takes a foothold. This may really take off when they offer IPTV. If it's good & reliable, UPC could take a serious hit. UPC may just accept that, or they may choose to expand again with a further rollout, or even as suggested, piggy backing on the VDSL network. I can't see how it would dilute the brand too much, if they only promise a service to customers with good strong VDSL profiles. I wouldn't get down & dirty supplying services to people on 4m/bit adsl lines.

The minds of boards.ie are available for a small consultancy fee UPC!

animaal

bk wrote: »

UPC are a very well known and respected brand

You had me thinking, until I read this. :pac:

bk

I don't think it would dilute the brand, quiet the opposite.

As Praetorian said, if they limited it to only reselling VDSL and more likely VDSL + IPTV, then it could be quite a boost for their brand.

Imagine the ads, UPC from 70mb/s nationwide *, then when the customer goes to sign up, if they are found to be on a cabled area, put them on that, otherwise put them on the VDSL.

Not only would they benefit from increased revenue from this new VDSL + IPTV service that they would otherwise never get, but they would also see what areas get high take up and could use this information to target areas for expansion of their cable network.

They would then even have an existing relationship with their customers, making it easier to switch them over to their cable network once in place.

Thinking about it further, UPC already have most of the infrastructure in place to make use of this easily. They have their own extensive fibre network and gear, international backhaul and peering agreements, network monitoring center and staff, telecoms trained call center and staff and extensive agreements, including on demand TV and movies, with all the TV companies.

Given that Eircom take care of all of the VDSL side of things, it should be relatively very easy for UPC to enter this market with their existing resources.

The only thing that might be new for UPC here is they would have to develop an IPTV service and set top box. I wonder if the new Horizon box might be easily modified to do this?

I also expect that in time UPC will also end the mobile phone market as a MVNO operator piggybacking on an existing network in order to offer 4 play services. Specially when LTE hits.

Praetorian

I wonder if UPC gained access to selling VDSL would Eircom insist on being able to use UPC's network & sell cable

Stranger things have happened. Bord Gais sells us electricity and Electric Ireland sells us gas

bk

Praetorian wrote: »

I wonder if UPC gained access to selling VDSL would Eircom insist on being able to use UPC's network & sell cable

Well Eircom couldn't make it a condition or anything like that.

It was Comreg would decided that Eircom had a SMP and had to open up to other operators and it would be up to Comreg to make a similar decision about cable. However such a decision is very unlikely as the cable network is much less extensive then the telephone network.

Plus cable TV already faces significant competition from Sky, Free To Air Satellite and Saorview.

colm_mcm

Is there any real money to be made out of it though? I was under the impression that vodafone and sky are only in the landline and broadband game to sell their other products.

axle108

Regarding UPC and Comreg. This is a response to a mail i sent Comreg, a few months back.

Firstly, cable television transmission does not come within ComReg’s remit so there is no question of ComReg intervening to force UPC to allow other operators to offer television services via their network.

ComReg does have responsibility for monitoring competition within the electronic communications sector. When an operator is found to have ‘significant market power’ in certain specific markets, ComReg can intervene to ensure there is adequate competition. The markets we monitor are in line with European Commission guidelines (http://eur-lex.europa.eu/LexUriServ/LexUriServ.do?uri=OJ:L:2007:344:0065:0069:EN:PDF).