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Get rid of your pets to go Insolvent??

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Comments

  • #152
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    Pets and animals are not on a par with children, why do people keep making this analogy?

    That depends.... I would never consider giving my dog away but with 2 of my kids going through teenage years, sometimes I wish there was a rescue centre for handing kids back.


  • #153
    gowley
    Registered Users Posts: 629 ✭✭✭gowley


    Hellrazer wrote: »
    Have to have a bit of a rant here.

    Just heard on the radio that one of the rules in the new insolvency bill is to get rid of your pets in order to get the settlement set up.

    Are these people living in the real world??Whats next get rid of the kids??
    Stop eating?Dont wear clothes??


    Im pissed off with this government and their stupid rules.

    My dog costs me around 25 euros a month on food.17 per month for pet insurance and once a year a couple of hundred for boarding.


    This is just nuts stuff!!!!


    So would you get rid of your pet to get insolvency?

    Thoughts on campaigning our beloved leaders to put a stop to this stupidity?Im actually fuming at this one and feel that we need to start doing something to stop this.

    Heres a list of all your Tds e,ail addresses.

    http://www.oireachtas.ie/viewdoc.asp?DocID=12684

    well for you with pet insurance and boarding kennels for your holidays. your obviously not affected by insolvency. some people have had to give up their familys health care and have a lot more to worry about than boarding kennels.


  • #154
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    Deleted User wrote: »
    That depends.... I would never consider giving my dog away but with 2 of my kids going through teenage years, sometimes I wish there was a rescue centre for handing kids back.

    All joking aside, I have seen this analogy used many times in this debate and while we all consider our pets as part of our families, they are not children and I think it's pointless to use the comparison in this discussion.


  • #155
    Feathers
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,082 ✭✭✭Feathers


    annascott wrote: »
    This needs to be fought...

    Report the OP so - at the moment it seems to be the only thing linking pets to the ISI guidelines :P


  • #156
    lubie76
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,151 ✭✭✭lubie76


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    Pets and animals are not on a par with children, why do people keep making this analogy?

    My pets are very much part of my family and while i appreciate they are not children, I have an emotional bond and a responsibility for them that means I would never abandon them no matter how bad things get. Also Getting rid of a pet for financial reasons would be a very bad example to set for your kids- they need to learn that they need to take control and ownership for the things they care about despite what life throws at them and also that material things are not important in the grand scheme of things. Kids don't get messed up socially because they're poor/hungry, it's because they lack the appropriate norms and nurturing/emotional skills from their parents.


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  • #157
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    lubie76 wrote: »
    My pets are very much part of my family and while i appreciate they are not children, I have an emotional bond and a responsibility for them that means I would never abandon them no matter how bad things get. Also Getting rid of a pet for financial reasons would be a very bad example to set for your kids- they need to learn that they need to take control and ownership for the things they care about despite what life throws at them and also that material things are not important in the grand scheme of things. Kids don't get messed up socially because they're poor/hungry, it's because they lack the appropriate norms and nurturing/emotional skills from their parents.

    But let's say you put the needs of your pet in front of your children, is that setting a good example too? What if you're poor and your kids are going hungry because you've decided to keep the family horse or you prioritise feeding the St. Bernard you have over giving your kids food. Do you look after your pet to the detriment of your kids health and well-being?


  • #158
    Anynama141
    Closed Accounts Posts: 964 ✭✭✭Anynama141


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    But let's say you put the needs of your pet in front of your children, is that setting a good example too? What if you're poor and your kids are going hungry because you've decided to keep the family horse or you prioritise feeding the St. Bernard you have over giving your kids food. Do you look after your pet to the detriment of your kids health and well-being?
    I have to say I admire people making sacrifices for their animals; I'd certainly expect the children to be higher up the pecking order, but fair play to the people who cancel the Sky TV or some other luxury to ensure their pets are provided for.

    As I've said, it's when people demand others to make sacrifices for their pets that I see a problem.


  • #159
    ResearchWill
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,111 ✭✭✭ResearchWill


    lubie76 wrote: »
    My pets are very much part of my family and while i appreciate they are not children, I have an emotional bond and a responsibility for them that means I would never abandon them no matter how bad things get. Also Getting rid of a pet for financial reasons would be a very bad example to set for your kids- they need to learn that they need to take control and ownership for the things they care about despite what life throws at them and also that material things are not important in the grand scheme of things. Kids don't get messed up socially because they're poor/hungry, it's because they lack the appropriate norms and nurturing/emotional skills from their parents.

    Let's say there is a family, say they have rent free accomodation and owe no money, lets say that they owe no money. Now lets say they have no cars don't go on holidays have 4 children and 3 large dogs. Lets say the parents don't smoke or drink and let's say they are a bit alternative and don't have Internet or sky. Now lets say the books balance each month but then one parent's business folds and they have no entitlement to social welfare. Now the budget is no longer balanced and let's say after cutting every unnecessary bill they are still over spending by €100 a month lets just assume that dog food etc. comes to €100, who should pay that money. Should children go withou food, or the parents or should electricity be turned off.

    This issue is bull, it has clearly been said if anyone wishes to go down this road there are guidelines as to how much money they can retain so as to clear their debts. It's up to the person to decided what that is spent on, if a prrson has a couple of dogs and decides that's more important than a pint or a car or new clothes that's fine they can make that choice. But like us all they will have a budget it's their choice where and how they spend it.


  • #160
    loveisdivine
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,463 ✭✭✭loveisdivine


    Anynama141 wrote: »

    What I can't understand is that they expect everyone else to agree with them.

    We don't! I don't agree with parents about the importance of their children. So why would I expect you to agree with me? However, I wouldn't tell you to get rid of your kids.


  • #161
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    Anynama141 wrote: »
    I have to say I admire people making sacrifices for their animals; I'd certainly expect the children to be higher up the pecking order, but fair play to the people who cancel the Sky TV or some other luxury to ensure their pets are provided for.

    As I've said, it's when people demand others to make sacrifices for their pets that I see a problem.

    But the implication wasn't about getting rid of a couple of luxuries, it was that kids will be alright if they go poor and hungry.


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  • #162
    Rightwing
    Closed Accounts Posts: 8,101 ✭✭✭Rightwing


    Surely they mean race horses as 'pets'? A few developers may have a few race horses they want to keep as pets.

    If it's dogs/cats I give up.


  • #163
    ozt9vdujny3srf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,152 ✭✭✭ozt9vdujny3srf


    bluewolf wrote: »
    As far as I'm concerned the dogs are family members and not something to "get rid of" any more than kids
    It's not really a question of "entitlement"

    I think that is pretty much the definition of entitlement.

    The idea of having to get rid of pets because you can't afford to keep them isn't nice, but then again either is having to give up Health Insurance.


  • #164
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    loveisdivine wrote: »
    We don't! I don't agree with parents about the importance of their children. So why would I expect you to agree with me? However, I wouldn't tell you to get rid of your kids.

    If you don't have and won't have children and you have an avowed dislike of the tykes, as long as your not looking after them for a living that's not a problem. If you choose to starve yourself to look after your pets, I have no problem you doing that as an adult. That is your personal choice and the sacrifice is admirable. If you have dependent children and you choose to starve them to look after your pets, that is morally wrong in my opinion.


  • #165
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    Dont get me started on the scam that is Health Insurance.


  • #166
    Bullseye1
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,731 ✭✭✭Bullseye1


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    If you don't have and won't have children and you have an avowed dislike of the tykes, as long as your not looking after them for a living that's not a problem. If you choose to starve yourself to look after your pets, I have no problem you doing that as an adult. That is your personal choice and the sacrifice is admirable. If you have dependent children and you choose to starve them to look after your pets, that is morally wrong in my opinion.

    What about people who decide to have more children when they are financially unable to care for them? Will this bill tell those in insolvency not to have any more kids? Kids are not a necessity but that does not mean they are a luxury.


  • #167
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    Bullseye1 wrote: »
    What about people who decide to have more children when they are financially unable to care for them? Will this bill tell those in insolvency not to have any more kids? Kids are not a necessity but that does not mean they are a luxury.

    Well, it's already gotten the government into a lot of hot water for the suggestion that women would have to give up work if childcare costs were too high so I imagine probably nothing is off the table in terms of the advice they will give to insolvent couples.


  • #168
    lubie76
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,151 ✭✭✭lubie76


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    But let's say you put the needs of your pet in front of your children, is that setting a good example too? What if you're poor and your kids are going hungry because you've decided to keep the family horse or you prioritise feeding the St. Bernard you have over giving your kids food. Do you look after your pet to the detriment of your kids health and well-being?

    Who said anything about putting the needs of your pet in front of your children. Obviously you don't want your kids to go hungry but as a parent you need to take control of the situation and figure out a way to take care of your kids without the detriment to an important part of the family. How would a person without a pet cope in the same situation? They would find a way...thats how. I haven't heard of any Irish kids starving to death lately.


  • #169
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    lubie76 wrote: »
    Who said anything about putting the needs of your pet in front of your children. Obviously you don't want your kids to go hungry but as a parent you need to take control of the situation and figure out a way to take care of your kids without the detriment to an important part of the family. How would a person without a pet cope in the same situation? They would find a way...thats how. I haven't heard of any Irish kids starving to death lately.

    You said:
    Kids don't get messed up socially because they're poor/hungry, it's because they lack the appropriate norms and nurturing/emotional skills from their parents.

    Remember that absolutely everything that we've being discussing here is hypothetical, do you an appropriate norm would be to feed your pets before your children? Obviously I'm talking about extremes here but then the whole thread has been about extremes. In my situation, where feeding my dog meant my kids would go hungry, I would seek to have our pet housed with someone that could look after him properly. Thankfully I'd have a couple of options in terms of caring, animal friendly people if that extremely hypothetical situation ever arose.


  • #170
    Mo60
    Closed Accounts Posts: 485 ✭✭Mo60


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    You said:


    I would seek to have our pet housed with someone that could look after him properly. Thankfully I'd have a couple of options in terms of caring, animal friendly people if that extremely hypothetical situation ever arose.

    Perhaps you could give these people the contact details of animal rescues currently caring for the hundreds of animals that have been dumped.


  • #171
    kunst nugget
    Closed Accounts Posts: 10,375 ✭✭✭✭kunst nugget


    Mo60 wrote: »
    Perhaps you could give these people the contact details of animal rescues currently caring for the hundreds of animals that have been dumped.

    The people I'm thinking of have both taken in animals from shelters already. You can tone down the high and mighty attitude.


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  • #172
    Mo60
    Closed Accounts Posts: 485 ✭✭Mo60


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    You can tone down the high and mighty attitude.

    I do not have a 'high and mighty attitude' I was just pointing out that there are already hundreds of pets that have been dumped and are looking for homes.


  • #173
    lubie76
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,151 ✭✭✭lubie76


    kunst nugget wrote: »
    You said:


    Remember that absolutely everything that we've being discussing here is hypothetical, do you an appropriate norm would be to feed your pets before your children? Obviously I'm talking about extremes here but then the whole thread has been about extremes. In my situation, where feeding my dog meant my kids would go hungry, I would seek to have our pet housed with someone that could look after him properly. Thankfully I'd have a couple of options in terms of caring, animal friendly people if that extremely hypothetical situation ever arose.

    Well you are one of the better owners then as from what I'm hearing from my local shelter, pets are being left abandoned and tied to the gates of the shelter so the workers are arriving to a very traumatised pet alot of mornings. If we are talking about extremes I think we need to include people that do this rather than take the sensible step of rehoming.

    I do not as stated in my last post think it appropriate or normal to put my pets needs including feeding needs before my children (and I think the kids starving for the sake a a few cans of lidl pet food is going beyond extremes) neither do I think it appropriate to dump my family pet because I think it's important to show my kids that when times get tough that their parents must pull together and look after each other.


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