Mayweather v Canelo Alvarez September 14th

kryogen

Pretty sure Mayweather has only got a couple of things going for him in terms of drawing ability these days, number one is that zero, for obvious reasons, and number two, and this may sound strange, is that he is black.

I hope someone will understand what I mean there

To use a poker comparison as it stands out for me, Eric Seidel, super player, white, boring, not too much interest. Phil Ivey, super player, black, boring, coolest motherfuker at the table

kryogen

Oh yeah, and is there now any chance that the judge, CJ Ross, gets ****ed out of it and not allowed near a ring anymore? Worse then the feckin Pac scoring to call that fight a draw

Mind boggling, she should be gone

T-K-O

The 0 Yes. The other stuff, I have no idea what you're talking about.

It's no coincidence Floyd likes to fight guys from Mexico or with some Mexican connection.

SRFC

I dont think its going to hurt his draw in future fights ill still pay to see greatness everytime no matter who he's fighting tbh,apart from the natural talent this is why he's the greatest nobody is more commited http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HTdqV8XkYNo

T-K-O

Dedication


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q-8hOKNbtxg

kryogen

T-K-O wrote: »

The 0 Yes. The other stuff, I have no idea what you're talking about.

It's no coincidence Floyd likes to fight guys from Mexico or with some Mexican connection.

Floyd is a great fighter, unquestionably, but he doesn't exactly thrill fight fans with his actions in the ring. My theory is, if he was white, like say a Wladomir Klitschko, people would be more inclined to focus on the boring aspect rather then the skills aspect. They certainly wouldn't be shelling out the money they do to see him. He wouldn't be commanding the fees he is

Wlad is a great fighter, one of the GOAT imo, so Is Flyod.

One is constantly referred to as boring, one isn't.

This also happens in poker, golf etc

For whatever reason white is just not as cool as black if both are the same level of boring

Im not sure I can illustrate this properly so Ill just leave it there

simongurnick

kryogen wrote: »

Floyd is a great fighter, unquestionably, but he doesn't exactly thrill fight fans with his actions in the ring. My theory is, if he was white, like say a Wladomir Klitschko, people would be more inclined to focus on the boring aspect rather then the skills aspect. They certainly wouldn't be shelling out the money they do to see him. He wouldn't be commanding the fees he is

Wlad is a great fighter, one of the GOAT imo, so Is Flyod.

One is constantly referred to as boring, one isn't.

This also happens in poker, golf etc

For whatever reason white is just not as cool as black if both are the same level of boring

Im not sure I can illustrate this properly so Ill just leave it there

Wouldn't say it's down to skin colour at all. The casual fight fans want to see him lose and the educated fans recognise his brilliance and genius for what it is. The guy is an absolute superstar when the rest of boxing is in the crapper (from a mainstream sports sense).

T-K-O

kryogen wrote: »

Floyd is a great fighter, unquestionably, but he doesn't exactly thrill fight fans with his actions in the ring. My theory is, if he was white, like say a Wladomir Klitschko, people would be more inclined to focus on the boring aspect rather then the skills aspect. They certainly wouldn't be shelling out the money they do to see him. He wouldn't be commanding the fees he is

Wlad is a great fighter, one of the GOAT imo, so Is Flyod.

One is constantly referred to as boring, one isn't.

This also happens in poker, golf etc

For whatever reason white is just not as cool as black if both are the same level of boring

Im not sure I can illustrate this properly so Ill just leave it there

The key difference is nationality. If Wlad was American, he could be as big if not bigger than Floyd.

simongurnick

T-K-O wrote: »

The key difference is nationality. If Wlad was American, he could be as big if not bigger than Floyd.

Good point...although he doesn't do too bad for himself in Germany and eastern Europe as it is.

kryogen

T-K-O wrote: »

The key difference is nationality. If Wlad was American, he could be as big if not bigger than Floyd.

That is true to an extent, they are huge in their region, same as Floyd is huge in his, we just hear a lot more from his side.

If Wlad or Vit had been American they would have been built to an unbelievable level as the American public haven't had a real top heavyweight in such a long time.

As I said, its just something I have noticed in other areas also, could be wide of the mark, just don't see his appeal other then the zero

I am an admirer of him, he truly is an excellent boxer. I just wouldn't pay big money to watch him, he doesn't excite me in the way a Tyson did, or a Pacquaio or whatever. The level he has got himself to is incredible, same as the Klits but in all honesty, none of them are very entertaining fighters (Vitali maybe at one point) so you have to look for what factors come into it.

The zero is huge, without it nobody really cares I suspect, its why he will continue to cherry pick opponents who actually have no chance of tarnishing his record. Protect the brand

wonderfullife

walshb wrote: »

It was a clear decision win, but not a domination IMO. Some parts of the fight saw Floyd clearly landing with no reply, but many many parts of the fight were posing and threatening from both men.

How would you define domination?

Mayweather —– Alvarez

505 Total punches thrown 526
232 Total punches landed 117
46% Punches Connected 22%
330 Jabs Thrown 294
139 Jabs Landed 44
42% Pc Jabs Connected 15%
175 Power Punches Thrown 232
93 Power Punches Connected 73
53% Pc Power Punches Landed 31%
Mayweather landed 11 of 27 jabs per round


They say statistics can be misleading but really these stats, added to the visual impression of the fight, and you come up with one conclusion........the very conclusion you don't see - this was a complete domination.

Canelo only landed 22% of punches thrown and he threw pretty much the same amount as Floyd, so there's no argument here about Canelo being the busier fighter. When you land twice as many punches and 20 more power punches than your opponent, surely that's a dominant performance?

It's a simple bottom line for me, Floyd took him to school.

T-K-O

The brothers do not need America, they have done very well fighting in Europe.

However, America is the home of boxing in a lot of ways. America does not respect the brothers, Why? Because their not American but rest assured American fans want nothing more than the HW champion of the world.

They haven't got him. So the brothers are 'boring robots'

The interest in Floyd; He's a bit of marketing genius if you ask me. He has built this huge empire around that 0. Between that and his personality people tune in. His fans and those who want to see him lose.

kryogen

True

simongurnick

T-K-O wrote: »

The brothers do not need America, they have done very well fighting in Europe.

However, America is the home of boxing in a lot of ways. America does not respect the brothers, Why? Because their not American but rest assured American fans want nothing more than the HW champion of the world.

They haven't got him. So the brothers are 'boring robots'

The interest in Floyd; He's a bit of marketing genius if you ask me. He has built this huge empire around that 0. Between that and his personality people tune in. His fans and those who want to see him lose.

And the fact he is one of the greatest boxers in living memory, if not all time.
There is no marketing department when you are in the ring.

T-K-O

simongurnick wrote: »

And the fact he is one of the greatest boxers in living memory, if not all time.
There is no marketing department when you are in the ring.

Nobody is denying that - we are discussing how Floyd has become such a mega star - probably bigger than Tyson, taking home Tiger Woods-esque pay checks.

If his popularity was directly connected to his performances in the ring, the money team would have to open a credit union account.

simongurnick

T-K-O wrote: »

Nobody is denying that - we are discussing how Floyd has become such a mega star - probably bigger than Tyson, taking home Tiger Woods-esque pay checks.

If his popularity was directly connected to his performances in the ring, the money team would have to open a credit union account.

Maybe the boxing public are more intelligent than we take them for. Boxing is an art and as great as it is to see a slug fest, there is a beauty in watching the fine art performed at it's best.
No doubt, Mayweather has got his promotion down to a tee, but you can only promote "boring" for so long.

T-K-O

simongurnick wrote: »

Maybe the boxing public are more intelligent than we take them for. Boxing is an art and as great as it is to see a slug fest, there is a beauty in watching the fine art performed at it's best.
No doubt, Mayweather has got his promotion down to a tee, but you can only promote "boring" for so long.

They are. I know lot of Americans that refuse to pay to watch Floyd. The Canelo fight was slightly different.

Floyds is smart, his opponents usually have a huge fan base, probably bigger than his own. The Mexican opponent will always sell

simongurnick

T-K-O wrote: »

They are. I know lot of Americans that refuse to pay to watch Floyd. The Canelo fight was slightly different.

Floyds is smart, his opponents usually have a huge fan base, probably bigger than his own. The Mexican opponent will always sell

Floyd's fanbase is usually just the lads around him coming into the ring! I was actually surprised to hear a few "USA USA" chants last night.

T-K-O

simongurnick wrote: »

Floyd's fanbase is usually just the lads around him coming into the ring! I was actually surprised to hear a few "USA USA" chants last night.

yeah its strange to hear the USA drowned out... In America.

wonderfullife

T-K-O wrote: »

They are. I know lot of Americans that refuse to pay to watch Floyd. The Canelo fight was slightly different.

Floyds is smart, his opponents usually have a huge fan base, probably bigger than his own. The Mexican opponent will always sell

That in itself to my mind means it's an absolute stone cold certainty Mayweather v Khan happens - as long as Amir gets past Alexander.

Whilst i'm sure Danny Garcia has a big following in Philly, you can bet the house on Mayweather v Khan selling out anywhere they want to put it on in the UK especially. A sold-out Wembley or Old Trafford or somewhere similar, massive PPV audience for the UK etc.

As everyone keeps saying - he's gonna run out of credible opponents fast and really the only way they will make this financially viable is to take the likes of Khan on.

I've no doubt in my mind Floyd will dismantle each of his next 4 opponents possibly over 48 rounds too. But Khan has the type of fanbase and stature in the UK to certainly make it profitable and a no-brainer on the numbers alone.

Frankie Lee

wonderfullife wrote: »

That in itself to my mind means it's an absolute stone cold certainty Mayweather v Khan happens - as long as Amir gets past Alexander.

Whilst i'm sure Danny Garcia has a big following in Philly, you can bet the house on Mayweather v Khan selling out anywhere they want to put it on in the UK especially. A sold-out Wembley or Old Trafford or somewhere similar, massive PPV audience for the UK etc.

As everyone keeps saying - he's gonna run out of credible opponents fast and really the only way they will make this financially viable is to take the likes of Khan on.

I've no doubt in my mind Floyd will dismantle each of his next 4 opponents possibly over 48 rounds too. But Khan has the type of fanbase and stature in the UK to certainly make it profitable and a no-brainer on the numbers alone.

Mayweather willnever fight outside of Vegas and you are overestimating Khan's English fanbase. He is arguably more popular in the US. A Khan fight would bring nowhere near the interest and money that Canelo has. The only credible opponent Floyd can fight now is Golovkin but the problem is that he is a HBO fighter.

Kirby

wonderfullife wrote: »

That in itself to my mind means it's an absolute stone cold certainty Mayweather v Khan happens - as long as Amir gets past Alexander.

Whilst i'm sure Danny Garcia has a big following in Philly, you can bet the house on Mayweather v Khan selling out anywhere they want to put it on in the UK especially. A sold-out Wembley or Old Trafford or somewhere similar, massive PPV audience for the UK etc.

As everyone keeps saying - he's gonna run out of credible opponents fast and really the only way they will make this financially viable is to take the likes of Khan on.

I've no doubt in my mind Floyd will dismantle each of his next 4 opponents possibly over 48 rounds too. But Khan has the type of fanbase and stature in the UK to certainly make it profitable and a no-brainer on the numbers alone.

But Khan / Mayweather will be a boring fight. I think people recognise that. Both are runners. It's the type of fight where you can see less than a dozen punches thrown in a round. Lots of juking and jiving but nobody is ever in range to let the hands go. And if Khan did lose the head and start taking chances (which wouldn't happen but if it did), Mayweather would floor him.

It doesn't help than Khan would have zero chance of winning. I wouldn't pay to see it. I'd watch it but I wouldn't pay. I'll gladly open the wallet for pay per view when its two good fighters who can both win. This would be a stream fight to be honest.

heyheyhey1982

Khan has the potential to be great. He has to protect himself more and not very into mad wars when he didn't need to. Hunter aknowledged that Khan hasn't been training right and enjoys himself to much and then knuckles down for eight weeks pre fight. This doesn't work. Khan was dreadful against Diaz and very nearly lost it. After Saturdays fight I don't think anyone can beat Floyd.

Just watched the Castillo fight back there and he beat mayweather and the numbers proved it. But as usual in boxing the love a dodgy decision.

Johner

heyheyhey1982 wrote: »

Khan has the potential to be great. He has to protect himself more and not very into mad wars when he didn't need to. Hunter aknowledged that Khan hasn't been training right and enjoys himself to much and then knuckles down for eight weeks pre fight. This doesn't work. Khan was dreadful against Diaz and very nearly lost it. After Saturdays fight I don't think anyone can beat Floyd.

Just watched the Castillo fight back there and he beat mayweather and the numbers proved it. But as usual in boxing the love a dodgy decision.

Khan has blistering hand speed, he has no potential to be great because of his chin. Anyone who can bang will knock him out.

willmunny1990

heyheyhey1982 wrote: »

Khan has the potential to be great. He has to protect himself more and not very into mad wars when he didn't need to. Hunter aknowledged that Khan hasn't been training right and enjoys himself to much and then knuckles down for eight weeks pre fight. This doesn't work. Khan was dreadful against Diaz and very nearly lost it. After Saturdays fight I don't think anyone can beat Floyd.

Just watched the Castillo fight back there and he beat mayweather and the numbers proved it. But as usual in boxing the love a dodgy decision.

No he doesn't.

heyheyhey1982

willmunny1990 wrote: »

No he doesn't.

He does. He throws Great combos at speed and moving up in weight his chin would get better.

His big downfall is getting into scraps were he throws the game plan out the Window and goes to war.

willmunny1990

heyheyhey1982 wrote: »

He does. He throws Great combos at speed and moving up in weight his chin would get better.

His big downfall is getting into scraps were he throws the game plan out the Window and goes to war.

He doesnt have any ko power, all he has is speed. He has no chin and doesn't have the discipline to change his style and moving up in weight wont help him.

SRFC

Khan could be great :D:D:D:D:D:D



I've heard it all now.

Big Ears

heyheyhey1982 wrote: »

He does. He throws Great combos at speed and moving up in weight his chin would get better.

His big downfall is getting into scraps were he throws the game plan out the Window and goes to war.

Khan's downfall is a severe lack of head movement and a tendency to attack in straight lines. He's completely reliant on his footwork and phenomenal footspeed for defence and that's why whenever he 'goes to war' he gets caught, because like any fighter who stands in range without moving their head....they get it knocked off their shoulders.

He also is sometimes guilty of throwing the same combinations again and again making him somewhat predictable and easy(ish) to counter.

walshb

Johner wrote: »

Khan has blistering hand speed, he has no potential to be great because of his chin. Anyone who can bang will knock him out.

Not just chin. He has no real inside game. No real natural pro skills. He's too amateurish in a pro game. He's damn exciting and full of passion, but the innate natural and subtle pro skills are lacking.

darced

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walshb

darced wrote: »

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Floyd for me was never a text book combination puncher. His combinations look odd. Not really silky or fluid. He's superb, don't get me wrong, but I am not a big fan of his combination punching.

darced

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SRFC

darced wrote: »

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He wouldnt go 4 rounds with mayweather he'd be spark out with one of Floyds straight right im 100 % sure he'd be floyds easiest fight so easy to pick off he'd be.



Heres one for the broner haters you'll enjoy it :pac: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqRaE6eXrj4

Big Ears

walshb wrote: »

Floyd for me was never a text book combination puncher. His combinations look odd. Not really silky or fluid. He's superb, don't get me wrong, but I am not a big fan of his combination punching.

I agree something is unusual about Floyd's combos. Perhaps due to him not fully committing to them with one eye always on defence.

As for Wlad only being being effective defensively because of his size ?, what a load of rubbish. If you can put yourself through the pain of watching the Haye fight again you'll see him use his incredible foot speed and brilliant footwork to manoeuvre himself out of danger anytime Haye attempts to attack. His ability to read his opponents is fantastic aswell and while sure his size is very, very useful, there's much, much more to Wlad than just his size.

walshb

Big Ears wrote: »

I agree something is unusual about Floyd's combos. Perhaps due to him not fully committing to them with one eye always on defence.
.

That's it in a nutshell. He lets them go but he also is so keen on defence that he doesn't seem as committed to the delivery of the punches.
Personally I don't think his combinations are pretty or aesthetically pleasing. Even when he was hopping off Gatti it didn't look too pretty.

King Hearts

walshb wrote: »

That's it in a nutshell. He lets them go but he also is so keen on defence that he doesn't seem as committed to the delivery of the punches.
Personally I don't think his combinations are pretty or aesthetically pleasing. Even when he was hopping off Gatti it didn't look too pretty.

I'm pretty sure after watching his performance against Alvarez that Mayweather has a defensive move internalised and memorised for nearly every situation he he finds himself in and for every different punch he throws.

mfceiling

heyheyhey1982 wrote: »

He does. He throws Great combos at speed and moving up in weight his chin would get better.

His big downfall is getting into scraps were he throws the game plan out the Window and goes to war.

Unfortunately so would the strength of the punches he would take to his chin...and at present his chin wouldn't take a dig from a young one in junior infants!!

darced

This post has been deleted.

wonderfullife

walshb wrote: »

That's it in a nutshell. He lets them go but he also is so keen on defence that he doesn't seem as committed to the delivery of the punches.
Personally I don't think his combinations are pretty or aesthetically pleasing. Even when he was hopping off Gatti it didn't look too pretty.

Clearly there is a world of difference between his Olympic amateur bouts and pro bouts, but i like to think he learned a lot from the likes of this. Pretty rash, brash attacking stuff but was pretty easy to hit too.

Even then his combinations didn't look too clean or clever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tuHN68BrmzE

heyheyhey1982

mfceiling wrote: »

Unfortunately so would the strength of the punches he would take to his chin...and at present his chin wouldn't take a dig from a young one in junior infants!!

I know his chin is a weak spot but he took big shots from Maidana and he stayed up. His chin is a bit better.

Is there any one to take on floyd? if only Rigondeax could come up in weight and floyd go down a bit but it's too far out. He's give floyd a run for his money.

Frank Bullitt

The judge that called this a draw, she needs to be fired, what awful judging.

SRFC

Gintonious wrote: »

The judge that called this a draw, she needs to be fired, what awful judging.

Its pure an utter corruption,obviously playing her winnings from the the pac man fight.

qwabercd

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Mayweather willnever fight outside of Vegas and you are overestimating Khan's English fanbase. He is arguably more popular in the US. A Khan fight would bring nowhere near the interest and money that Canelo has. The only credible opponent Floyd can fight now is Golovkin but the problem is that he is a HBO fighter.

Khan would be a much bigger draw than golovkin. And a much easier fight for floyd. Win win.

A khan-mayweather fight would definitely sell out any english stadium. One off chance for most to see mayweather in the flesh.

ejohnl

qwabercd wrote: »

Khan would be a much bigger draw than golovkin. And a much easier fight for floyd. Win win.

A khan-mayweather fight would definitely sell out any english stadium. One off chance for most to see mayweather in the flesh.

Should we forget Manny Pacquiao?
I think he's the only boxer in the planet (despite of his losses) that could defeat Floyd.

barney4001

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_T6Fyd00Ebo#t=860

watched this press conferance after the fight and mayweather came across as a different person altogether from what he usally appeared to be

richierichballs

barney4001 wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_T6Fyd00Ebo#t=860

watched this press conferance after the fight and mayweather came across as a different person altogether from what he usally appeared to be

The money had been made, the promotion was over. Showbiz Floyd had no reason to act and sell.

King Hearts

barney4001 wrote: »

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_T6Fyd00Ebo#t=860

watched this press conferance after the fight and mayweather came across as a different person altogether from what he usally appeared to be

It's the same after nearly every Floyd fight. It's boxing marketing, be a c#*t beforehand, then relax and be yourself after the fight.

T-K-O

Frankie Lee wrote: »

Mayweather willnever fight outside of Vegas and you are overestimating Khan's English fanbase. He is arguably more popular in the US. A Khan fight would bring nowhere near the interest and money that Canelo has. The only credible opponent Floyd can fight now is Golovkin but the problem is that he is a HBO fighter.

Floyd could very well fight in the UK. He just has to turn up and fight an Englishman, Khan has a fan base and people would turn up just to see Floyd Mayweather in the flesh.

richierichballs

pac_man wrote: »

I cant see Mayweather fighting outside vegas, its tax free and he has a deal with the MGM. The UK tax system I think is 50%,kinda like the same way with premier league footballers (open to correction on that!). He's not called "money" for nothing.

I think his contract with shotime actually involves strictly fighting in the MGM,
I could be wrong.