Random Wrasslin' thoughts.....

Lithium93_

Itssoeasy wrote: »

Isn't it obvious why ? It's because Joey things bumping people with his dick and throwing women by their boobs is funny. It isn't funny in the slightest.

Well to retort to that, humour is subjective, what one person finds funny, another may find in this particular context absolutely vulgar. And that's great, it creates debate, gets people talking, it gets people hot under the proverbial collar, and isn't that what a wrestler is supposed to do by any means necessary.

I'm sure Joey Ryan loves all the attention his spot gets. And I applaud him for that.

If it were done in the Attitude Era, people wouldn't bat an eyelid.

Omackeral

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Sorry, I disagree. I feel strongly about this because it makes a mockery of something I enjoy and it gives ammunition to those who think wrestling fans are absolute eejits for being interested in it.

Again, for the third time I ask, where do you draw the line on what you put up with?

I don't think Foley's Mandible Claw is in the same ball park to what Ryan does.

Who gives a rats what anyone thinks? So what if it gives them ammo. If they like Game of Thrones you can slag them over dragons or whatever sh*t goes on in those shows. Walking Dead, yeah Zombies are realistic. It's only a show. Besides, it's an indy level gimmick, plenty of hardened wrestling fans will have gone through the week without knowing who Joey Ryan is.

PTH2009 wrote: »

I dont knw who Joey Ryan is

See? It's all gravy baby! Oh and Foley used a thing called Mr Socko at the height of the Attitude Era, it was utterly ridiculous but so is Pro Wrestling in general.

Mr.Nice Guy

Itssoeasy wrote:

Isn't it obvious why ? It's because Joey things bumping people with his dick and throwing women by their boobs is funny. It isn't funny in the slightest.

Agreed. I have no problem with risque humour but this is just a guy with very little talent who decided to pimp out his John Thomas because he had little else going for him.

Also worth noting that the WWE have always struggled to attract top advertisers in the States because there is a perception over there that it's low-rent, cheap trash. Even all the PG years haven't removed that stigma. It's because of guys like Ryan that this perception is still out there and it hurts the business more than many realise. I don't think this trash would have been deemed acceptable in any era. It's the kind of thing that would have been found on an outlaw promotion which is where it belongs.

What's wrestling going to be like in ten years...?

"Ladies and gents, introducing our newest tag team, The Diamond Scutters! They have a devastating finisher where they pull down their pants and defecate upon their fallen foes! Some of you may find this objectionable, but it's all good craic (or rather crack) and it really garners an audible groan from the audience! Well done to both guys on making a living for themselves in the wrestling business!"

Omackeral

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Agreed. I have no problem with risque humour but this is just a guy with very little talent who decided to pimp out his John Thomas because he had little else going for him.

Also worth noting that the WWE have always struggled to attract top advertisers in the States because there is a perception over there that it's low-rent, cheap trash. Even all the PG years haven't removed that stigma. It's because of guys like Ryan that this perception is still out there and it hurts the business more than many realise. I don't think this trash would have been deemed acceptable in any era. It's the kind of thing that would have been found on an outlaw promotion which is where it belongs.

What's wrestling going to be like in ten years...?

"Ladies and gents, introducing our newest tag team, The Diamond Scutters! They have a devastating finisher where they pull down their pants and defecate upon their fallen foes! Some of you may find this objectionable, but it's all good craic (or rather crack) and it really garners an audible groan from the audience! Well done to both guys on making a living for themselves in the wrestling business!"

You're giving Joey Ryan far too much credit. He's a freaking nobody. He's a blip on the smart fan's radar, he's a non entity on the casual fan's radar. What does that make him to the non fan? He influences nothing. He was a niche act on an 18+ event in a 1,000 capacity hall in Dublin. You're vastly overrating his sphere of influence. It's ok that you don't like him, others seem to and he gets booked. Nobody is forcing you to go watch him and it's pretty unlikely he's gonna be on your tv screen anytime soon either.

Insect Overlord

I, for one, laughed and laughed until it hurt while Joey was in the ring last Saturday night. Plenty of others in the audience did the same. Anyone who chooses to take it seriously is missing the point. It was a comedy sketch in the middle of a show with plenty of technical expertise, drama, tension, "srs bznz", etc.

So what if English TV shows are taking it out of context? Sure they were embarrassed themselves when the world found out they were just as scripted as pro-wrestling anyway.

LeeJM

So Mick Foley, the legend, 3 time WWE Champion, most hardcore of hardcore wrestlers degraded himself in your eyes by taking a bump from Joey Ryans dick flip and that is where you draw the line. Thats fine but that would imply that Foleys creepy behaviour towards numerous WWE Divas was ok with you as its seemingly the interaction with Ryan that has hurt him in your eyes.

You can rant and rave all about where is a line drawn and whats acceptable all you want but people are going to have different lines to yours. I dont see you going mad over Candice LaRae doing a ballplex where she grabbed Angel Cruz by the balls and suplexed him.

If you cant accept that there is a place in the wide world of pro wrestling for a Joey Ryan then maybe its not for you anymore.

Oh and by the way dont think your hero Cornette wouldnt take a bump off Joey Ryans dick if he was paid to. Cornette is an even bigger worker than anybody else and the fact that people buy into what he says is kinda sad IMO. This is a guy that spent years bashing the Young Bucks and Kevin Owens and WWE and yet he has been outed as wanting to work with the Bucks to make money and he gleefully toddled off to WWE during WrestleMania weekend and did exactly what he was told because thats what he does.

Omackeral

Like DX were going around telling people to suck it and dumping sh*t all over the Spirit Squad. Undertaker (the undead zombie man) was sacrificing people all over the gaff. Kane was lighting c*nts on fire. What's any of that got to do with actual Lou Thesz style wrestling. It's like a 3 ring circus of a show, don't be suprised if a couple of clowns show up now and again.

Lithium93_

Just diverting slightly off topic if I may, if WWE have struggled to attract top advertisers in the States due to it being "low-rent, cheap trash", then what in hell's bells does that make Keeping Up With The Kardashians, which is according to a quick Google is heading into it's 14th season.

Also like Insect Overlord said above "It was a comedy sketch in the middle of a show", people are reading way too much into the spot.

Omackeral

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Or how about a move where a wrestler defecates on his opponent - would that be cool providing it got a reaction?

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Can we justify taking a dump in the ring if it gets a reaction? Wow the fans really popped for the babyface in peril there! And you could really smell the stench in the first few rows!

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

"Ladies and gents, introducing our newest tag team, The Diamond Scutters! They have a devastating finisher where they pull down their pants and defecate upon their fallen foes!

Call me crazy but you really seem to be pulling for this sh*t in the middle of the ring gimmick. You keep mentioning it. This might tie you over, it's from two carny no-talent hacks though.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pGt4TL5sJbA

LeeJM

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Also worth noting that the WWE have always struggled to attract top advertisers in the States because there is a perception over there that it's low-rent, cheap trash. Even all the PG years haven't removed that stigma.

Except thats not true at all. WWE have struggled to get major sports like sponsers because wrestling is seen a blue collar sport similiar to NASCAR. You dont see Rolex or Apple sponsoring NASCAR but you do see the National Guard or Snickers or Mountain Dew which is the very same level of sponsors WWE gets. And I believe its been proven that wrestling fans instead of spending money on sponsors items will still ultimately spend their money on wrestling merch.

Mr.Nice Guy

LeeJM wrote: »

So Mick Foley, the legend, 3 time WWE Champion, most hardcore of hardcore wrestlers degraded himself in your eyes by taking a bump from Joey Ryans dick flip and that is where you draw the line. Thats fine but that would imply that Foleys creepy behaviour towards numerous WWE Divas was ok with you as its seemingly the interaction with Ryan that has hurt him in your eyes.

You can rant and rave all about where is a line drawn and whats acceptable all you want but people are going to have different lines to yours. I dont see you going mad over Candice LaRae doing a ballplex where she grabbed Angel Cruz by the balls and suplexed him.

If you cant accept that there is a place in the wide world of pro wrestling for a Joey Ryan then maybe its not for you anymore.

Oh and by the way dont think your hero Cornette wouldnt take a bump off Joey Ryans dick if he was paid to. Cornette is an even bigger worker than anybody else and the fact that people buy into what he says is kinda sad IMO. This is a guy that spent years bashing the Young Bucks and Kevin Owens and WWE and yet he has been outed as wanting to work with the Bucks to make money and he gleefully toddled off to WWE during WrestleMania weekend and did exactly what he was told because thats what he does.

You can ask me where I draw the line on things if you want, just like I asked you if you would tolerate in-ring defecation, or a woman using her genitalia in a similar fashion. Care to answer on those? I'm curious where your "line" is since dick-flipping grown men doesn't appear to be one.

And no I don't accept there is a place in pro wrestling for that glorified pimp. If that is the direction wrestling goes in then yes I will turn away from it, much like most of the mainstream world has turned away from it. Until such a time comes, I'll defend TRUE pro wrestling which involves getting people emotionally invested in an athletic contest with scripted finishes, as opposed to the silly trailer-park-trash, outlaw hokey horsesh*t that the likes of Joey Ryan want it to be.

P.S. my hero Cornette did appear on a show with Ryan, I believe it was WCPW, and he was commentating. He was asked to call the dick spot and he said if he was to call the match he would refuse to call the spot and stay silent for it. Fair play to him for that. Cornette has more integrity and genuine love for wrestling than that pathetic talent vacuum you seem intent on defending.

Mr.Nice Guy

LeeJM wrote: »

Except thats not true at all. WWE have struggled to get major sports like sponsers because wrestling is seen a blue collar sport similiar to NASCAR. You dont see Rolex or Apple sponsoring NASCAR but you do see the National Guard or Snickers or Mountain Dew which is the very same level of sponsors WWE gets. And I believe its been proven that wrestling fans instead of spending money on sponsors items will still ultimately spend their money on wrestling merch.

It's seen as low-rent trash, even worse than Nascar. The advertisers don't want to be involved with it.

J. Marston

https://twitter.com/JoeyRyanOnline/status/894371568423448576

On the advertising. It is low-rent, so what? It's a soap opera in spandex. You're not going to have Apple, Lamborghini or Dom Pérignon knocking at WWE's door ever. Don't see how that's a big deal?

Joey Ryan isn't keeping them away.

jaykhunter

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

It's seen as low-rent trash, even worse than Nascar. The advertisers don't want to be involved with it.

That's true (hence WWE getting a much lower TV deal increase than other sports), but on the plus side, WWE's PG era has upgraded their advertisers - like the Mattel deal is HUGE for them, they've just extended it to 2021. (I recently wrote up a bit for a future review) their global sponsorship $$$ is up 25% thanks to new deals with blue-chip companies (KFC, Nestle and AT&T) and gaming partners (Psyonix, Square Enix & Activision). Ok it's not Apple or Car companies but it's well above the days of Stridex Pimple Cream!

Itssoeasy

LeeJM wrote: »

So Mick Foley, the legend, 3 time WWE Champion, most hardcore of hardcore wrestlers degraded himself in your eyes by taking a bump from Joey Ryans dick flip and that is where you draw the line. Thats fine but that would imply that Foleys creepy behaviour towards numerous WWE Divas was ok with you as its seemingly the interaction with Ryan that has hurt him in your eyes.

You can rant and rave all about where is a line drawn and what's acceptable all you want but people are going to have different lines to yours. I don't see you going mad over Candice LaRae doing a ballplex where she grabbed Angel Cruz by the balls and suplexed him.

If you cant accept that there is a place in the wide world of pro wrestling for a Joey Ryan then maybe its not for you anymore.

Oh and by the way dont think your hero Cornette wouldnt take a bump off Joey Ryans dick if he was paid to. Cornette is an even bigger worker than anybody else and the fact that people buy into what he says is kinda sad IMO. This is a guy that spent years bashing the Young Bucks and Kevin Owens and WWE and yet he has been outed as wanting to work with the Bucks to make money and he gleefully toddled off to WWE during WrestleMania weekend and did exactly what he was told because thats what he does.

Firstly, I don't remember mick foley being creepy towards the women. He was friends with a lot of them but I've never seen any women say he was creepy.

I like Candice but the same as joey Ryan that crap isn't okay IMO.

the reason I believe what Jim Cornette says is simply because he has the original facts written down and he isn't pulling his facts out of his hole. Jim Cornette said he had issues with kevin on a creative basis, he's said several times he's never said KO was bad in the ring.

Jim went back because he was asked by Triple H to induct the rock n roll and jim said yes out of respect to ricky and robert.

Insect Overlord

Val Venis. The Godfather. Rikishi. The celebration of sex. Bra & Panties matches. Khali or the Oddities dancing in the ring, or the Insane Clown Posse. Who blew up Vince? Kurt Angle has an illegitimate black son. :eek: Vicky Guerrero swimming in jelly, or custard, or mud, or whatever. Big Boss Man hanging from the cell. Goldust rubbing himself and licking his lips. 10s of millions of viewers. But one guy doing a funny bit in an Irish hall for an audience of 1500 is the real problem. Yeeeeeaaaaah...

Lithium93_

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Val Venis. The Godfather. Rikishi. The celebration of sex. Bra & Panties matches. Khali or the Oddities dancing in the ring, or the Insane Clown Posse. Who blew up Vince? Kurt Angle has an illegitimate black son. :eek: Vicky Guerrero swimming in jelly, or custard, or mud, or whatever. Big Boss Man hanging from the cell. Goldust rubbing himself and licking his lips. 10s of millions of viewers. But one guy doing a funny bit in an Irish hall for an audience of 1500 is the real problem. Yeeeeeaaaaah...

Not to mention Vince pitching a certain storyline involving Stephanie when she was pregnant with hers and Triple H's first kid.

Mr.Nice Guy

Omackeral wrote: »

Call me crazy but you really seem to be pulling for this sh*t in the middle of the ring gimmick. You keep mentioning it. This might tie you over, it's from two carny no-talent hacks though.

Well I'm trying to figure out what you and others would consider to be beyond the pale. I'd suggest a guy flipping his opponent with his penis but apparently that's as acceptable as an arm drag now.

Let me put it like this then, is there any move that a wrestler could do which you feel would be indefensible and an embarrassment to the business, or is your view that anything goes if it gets a reaction?

Insect Overlord wrote:

Val Venis. The Godfather. Rikishi. The celebration of sex. Bra & Panties matches. Khali or the Oddities dancing in the ring, or the Insane Clown Posse. Who blew up Vince? Kurt Angle has an illegitimate black son. Vicky Guerrero swimming in jelly, or custard, or mud, or whatever. Big Boss Man hanging from the cell. Goldust rubbing himself and licking his lips. 10s of millions of viewers. But one guy doing a funny bit in an Irish hall for an audience of 1500 is the real problem. Yeeeeeaaaaah...

This isn't an argument claiming that Joey Ryan has done the first dumb thing in wrestling. It's an argument suggesting that flipping a guy with your PENIS is a level of idiocy and embarrassing stupidity that ought to see this guy labelled a clown and avoided by any wrestler that values their dignity.

Cody Rhodes left WWE claiming he was fed up with the goofy gimmick of Stardust and that he wanted to be taken seriously as a wrestler...and then he goes and takes a bump off a guy's knob.

Insect Overlord

Undertaker and Kane, possibly the two greatest big men of all time, used a magical urn to screw with the elements. Bray Wyatt can teleport and cause hallucinations. Santino had a snake. R-Truth spent months talking to Little Jimmy.

Sometimes silly imaginary stuff is fun.

Mr.Nice Guy

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Undertaker and Kane, possibly the two greatest big men of all time, used a magical urn to screw with the elements. Bray Wyatt can teleport and cause hallucinations. Santino had a snake. R-Truth spent months talking to Little Jimmy.

Sometimes silly imaginary stuff is fun.

Once again, I repeat: this isn't an argument claiming that Joey Ryan has done the first dumb thing in wrestling. It's about dragging the reputation of the business through the gutter with an act of sleazy stupidity.

I'll ask you what I asked Omackeral: is there any move that a wrestler could do which you feel would be indefensible and an embarrassment to the business, or is your view that anything goes if it gets a reaction?

martyos121

If Viscera was allowed to simulate anal rape on WWE television and not ruin the credibility of pro-wrestling, absolutely nothing will. Especially not Joey Ryan's funny little dick move.

Mr.Nice Guy

Folks, ask yourselves, if this is really what you want the image of pro wrestling to be in 2017 and going forward...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCtgGfI-MaQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Kc-mPq1P7g

Wrestling is supposed to be a simulated FIGHT. Like Joe and Lesnar for example. Yes, there have been instances where the business has moved away from that, and we can all name stupid sh*t, but the above is a level of stupidity that worries me, because if this is the trend then the business is just going to slide into the gutter where nothing matters.

ricero touched on Cornette's thoughts earlier in the thread and here is what he had to say on the above spots if you're interested. Not everyone will agree with him but he is speaking for me at least...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0M9ENbZ2POo

Itssoeasy

The fact Cody lowered himself that **** is supsrising as his dad wouldn't have done that horse**** in the ring.

DEFTLEFTHAND

I agree with Cornette on Joey Ryan. It just makes a mockery out of professional wrestling. The thing which we all love.

I first got into wrestling as a kid because I believed in what I saw in the ring, they made it look real. The sign of great workers and bookers.

I have respect for people who've been involved in this industry for decades.

Another thing which pisses me off is WCPW talking about their 'Booking Committee'.

A bunch of marks propped up by funds. Who on this committee has payed their dues in the industry? A group of media studies 20 something year olds.

Their jokes are wearing very thin at this stage.

Omackeral

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Once again, I repeat: this isn't an argument claiming that Joey Ryan has done the first dumb thing in wrestling. It's about dragging the reputation of the business through the gutter with an act of sleazy stupidity.

I'll ask you what I asked Omackeral: is there any move that a wrestler could do which you feel would be indefensible and an embarrassment to the business, or is your view that anything goes if it gets a reaction?

And once again it's a freaking nobody on a freaking Indy show. You might as well be naming some curtain jerker from IWA-MS or CZW that does death matches. It means ABSOLUTELY NOTHING in the grand scheme of things. It doesn't affect kids as it was performed at an 18+ event. It doesn't change or destroy the business. It was performed at an event that is very very very niche. Not one of my wrestling watching friends will have heard of Joey Ryan. You'd actively have to search him out. Nothing he does has any impact on anything. That's all that it really boils down to. The only way this will ever affect you or anyone else is if you go to a show he's booked on. I suggest you move on.

leggo

Joey Ryan isn't hurting wrestling's image with the casuals.

The spot you're talking about is the most talked about moment on the second biggest show in Irish indie wrestling history. It's gotten attention from, with the mainstream media who've picked up on it now, maybe millions.

Here's the thing if you're insecure about what people think about wrestling: whatever it is they think, they're going to look for evidence to support that. The same way you're going to argue that Joey Ryan is killing wrestling after a spot on a show that definitely confirms that the industry is EXPLODING over here right now. If someone wants to like wrestling and think it's gas craic, they'll like or at least forgive the spot. If someone wants to think wrestling is dumb, they'll ignore all the awesome stuff that happens and zone in on that one spot. If someone is naturally insecure about being a fan and wants to blame a spot for that, same deal.

It's not ruining wrestling. The breaking of the fourth wall and treatment of the audience as intelligent people who understand what's going on has, in fact, caused an upswing of interest in the independent scene. There's no magic left in a world where everyone knows magic isn't real, so pretending it is is just a couple guys doing a stupid dance in a ring fooling nobody. Whereas if you actually show some self-awareness and treat the audience with respect by saying, "We know this is ridiculous, but you love it anyway and we're gonna have some fun with it" then guess what? You actually ENGAGE them! There's a disconnect between the adult audience and WWE programming right now, whereas the indies who trend towards catering for a smarter audience are all booming. This isn't a coincidence.

ERG89

leggo wrote:

The spot you're talking about is the most talked about moment on the second biggest show in Irish indie wrestling history.

Never even knew it was on :pac: :pac:

Necro

Just read through the last page of this. Who in the name of God is Joey Ryan and what is this dick spot people are on about?
Literally never heard of the guy until his name popped up here

leggo

ERG89 wrote: »

Never even knew it was on :pac: :pac:

Do they have much wrestling on under that rock?

Lithium93_

Itssoeasy wrote: »

The fact Cody lowered himself that **** is supsrising as his dad wouldn't have done that horse**** in the ring.

The faux outrage is just :rolleyes:, Wrestlers will do whatever they have to MAKE MONEY at the end of the day, that's their job as entertainers/entrepreneurs.

And besides the wrestling business is a different beast compared to when Dusty Rhodes was running around in his prime.

Times change, people change, business evolves, that shouldn't be too hard to understand, either get with the IT or get left behind.