I'm late 11 days with rent and landlord emails me a "Notice of Eviction"

SwissK

Hello,

I have been renting a house for 7 months now (lease started 26th Oct. 2012), I always paid the rent. My lease was suppose to be for 12 months, however we had a break in in April and I was badly assaulted by the person who broke in and I ended up in the hospital. My fiance freaked out and said she wants to leave here as she feel no longer save. I contacted the Landlord and told him what happend.
He agreed to break the lease early and we could move out on July 13th rather than September. As a penalty for terminating the lease early, he asked us to move out 2 weeks before the end of the month but still pay for that full last month. I agreed on that as it seemed fair, plus he was always really friendly person and I felt bad that we want to move out already.

Now unfortunately 1 month before moving out, the company I work for (a small franchise) had internal problems which caused a delay with some payments. My salary payments are delayed by 14 days.
I have forwarded that information to the landlord. I told him there will be a delay of my rent by 14 days and I apologize for that, unfortunately there is not much I can do. I also told him that the very second I get my paycheck, I will go to the bank and pay the rent.

I never had any trouble with the landlord and he was always super friendly to me.

But now that I have told him I will be 14 days late with the rent, I received an email back from him saying the following:

Thank you for your email and I am sorry to hear that you are having difficulties. However, I have a mortgage to pay on the house and since the rent is now eleven days overdue, I have no choice but to serve you with Notice of Eviction, with notice effective as of today, 6th June 2013.

My agent will serve notice in writing at [MY ADDRESS] in the coming days. I also wish to notify you my agents will require access to the above property and that I will advise you by email 24 hours in advance.

I am shocked... 11 days late and he wants to kick me out of the house?

I explained to him that I will be 14 days late, and there is really nothing I can do.
Our lease is also up in exactly 5 weeks (13th July).

Seeing that he wants to evict us on a basis of being 11 days late rent pay, just 5 weeks before we move out anyway, seems very fishy to me.

My question is what can he actually do? Can he come over to the house and kick us out? Or if we would be evicted, does that mean he does not need to pay us back our deposit?

ted1

Honestly I see a lot if excuses in your post, but the bottom line is its your responsibility to pay your rent on time. None of you business is relevant to the landlord, he really doesn't and shouldn't care what is going on in your life.

Eviction is a result of not paying rent.

drunkmonkey

Your hardly going to pay the rent if he's evicting you for not paying the rent so you've saved some rent and you were moving out anyway. Kind of a win win for you.

SwissK

I am aware of that, and I fully understand the pain of him needing to pay the mortgage and having me as a tenant who pays the rent late. I apologised in advance to the landlord for that and told him I will be 14 days late, however seeing that we move out in 35 days anyway, it seems unnecessary to go to all that trouble for an eviction, unless he gains something from it. That is why I am asking what he could possibly get ouf of this?

As I said, I am aware that I am in the wrong here about being late with my rent, but this is not what I am asking. I am not asking who is in the right or wrong, from what I read a landlord can send out a notice of eviction at any time as it's his property.

But my question is, does a notice of eviction give him some sort of right not to pay us back the deposit? Or why would he do that in the first place, considering he needs to give us 28 days notice, but we are leaving in 35 days. It just doesn't add up. I don't want to be surprised with some sort of legal chatter about not paying back the deposite on grounds of eviction and one time 14 days late with rent.

LowKeyReturn

SwissK wrote: »

I am aware of that, and I fully understand the pain of him needing to pay the mortgage and having me as a tenant who pays the rent late. I apologised in advance to the landlord for that and told him I will be 14 days late, however seeing that we move out in 35 days anyway, it seems unnecessary to go to all that trouble for an eviction, unless he gains something from it. That is why I am asking what he could possibly get ouf of this?

As I said, I am aware that I am in the wrong here about being late with my rent, but this is not what I am asking. I am not asking who is in the right or wrong, from what I read a landlord can send out a notice of eviction at any time as it's his property.

But my question is, does a notice of eviction give him some sort of right not to pay us back the deposit? Or why would he do that in the first place, considering he needs to give us 28 days notice, but we are leaving in 35 days. It just doesn't add up. I don't want to be surprised with some sort of legal chatter about not paying back the deposite on grounds of eviction and one time 14 days late with rent.

I'm not sure about the deposit. My understanding is it's only to cover if there is damage / broken lease without agreement. That said a friend did everything right when she broke her lease (new tenant etc.) LL seemed fine until it was time to give the deposit back.

On the eviction - he needs to cover himself - he doesn't know what you're up to. I'd issue an eviction notice as well.

SwissK

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Your hardly going to pay the rent if he's evicting you for not paying the rent so you've saved some rent and you were moving out anyway. Kind of a win win for you.

Hmm... why wouldn't I? I never intended not to pay the rent. As i told my landlord, I will simply be 14 days late and then suddenly I receive the above email.
I don't want to play games with my landlord. He has always been super friendly, seems like an honest person and I have nothing against him, except for this email from him now, which makes me question if he's up to something.

LowKeyReturn wrote: »

I'm not sure about the deposit. My understanding is it's only to cover if there is damage / broken lease without agreement. That said a friend did everything right when she broke her lease (new tenant etc.) LL seemed fine until it was time to give the deposit back.

On the eviction - he needs to cover himself - he doesn't know what you're up to. I'd issue an eviction notice as well.

Alright, so it's more of an official thing incase he thinks I would run away or not pay my rent at all just before I move out?
I'm starting to understand. Maybe he thinks the same of me as I just did of him. Looking at it from his perspective that the very last month his tenant sends him an email saying he's late with rent just before moving out, might sound fishy to him.

But then again, sending out a 28 days notice just 35 days before moving out doesn't really give him any security.

LowKeyReturn

I can't really say but it's best to do things by the book. Perhaps give him a call and ask him about the deposit. Let us know how you get on and someone more knowledgeable than I can perhaps recommend how to proceed.

SwissK

I just read the following on http://www.keepingyourhome.ie/if_your_landlord_wants_you_to_leave.html

If you do not pay your rent a notice of termination may be served, only if the rent due has still not been paid 14 days after you get written notification from your landlord of the amount owing.

Since he already sent out an email saying the email serves as notice of eviction, I wonder if it is legal what he does. It's not like I will be a pain in the ass towards him, as I said he has always been a very friendly person and I will respect all his wishes.
But for the sake of the situation and the legal matter, do I understand the above quote correctly, that first he needs to send me a written notification saying my rent is late, and only 14 days after he has sent that notification, he can then issue a letter of eviction, which says he wants us to leave in 28 days?

Secondly, what is defined as written notification? Does that include email and text message?

LowKeyReturn

E-mail is probably covered but I'm just guessing on a passing knowledge of the e-commerce act which might have absolutely no bearing.

crazy_kenny

I'd contact the prtb.

D3PO

he cannot issue a notice of eviction. he must first issue you with a notice of arrears. if the arrears are not cleared in 14 days then he can issue a notice of eviction.

given your leaving your lease early and then all of a sudden not paying rent he probably thinks you are pulling a fast one. that said he must follow due course which he is not doing as described above.

the_syco

D3PO wrote: »

given your leaving your lease early and then all of a sudden not paying rent he probably thinks you are pulling a fast one. that said he must follow due course which he is not doing as described above.

Agreed. I'm thinking the landlord got burnt before, and is issuing what he may think is the correct process to follow. Get advice from Threshold, and rely the info onto the landlord?

djimi

D3PO wrote: »

he cannot issue a notice of eviction. he must first issue you with a notice of arrears. if the arrears are not cleared in 14 days then he can issue a notice of eviction.

given your leaving your lease early and then all of a sudden not paying rent he probably thinks you are pulling a fast one. that said he must follow due course which he is not doing as described above.

This. Politely inform him that it is in his interest to go off and research how to carry out an eviction legally, to prevent him from making a costly mistake in future when someone takes a case against him for illegal eviction.

Zulu

Were you ever late with the rent previously? I note you mention you always paid, but don't mention if you paid when due.

Frankly, if I were your landlord, I'd be thinking you are trying to pull a fast one on your last month. As you agreed, when you look at it from his perspective, it looks that way. Perhaps, as opposed to trying to second guess each other, and determine what "rights" you have - RING HIM.

Ring him and tell him you'll have the rent in his account as mentioned on the day you said (and do it). Ask him about the notice of eviction. Ask him if he's just covering himself, or does he expect you to be gone prior to the previously agreed date. It's only when you talk, that you'll fully understand his intentions. Then you can work out what to do.

Zulu

djimi wrote: »

This. Politely inform him that it is in his interest to go off and research how to carry out an eviction legally, to prevent him from making a costly mistake in future when someone takes a case against him for illegal eviction.

While you'd be within your rights to do this, you have to ask yourself: is it the right thing to do now?
Frankly I'd imagine it'll only serve to worsen relations; fuel to the fire and all that. First port of call is to find out if he wants you gone prior to the agreed date. Then, if that is indeed the case, remind him that he can't do that and ring the PRTB.

djimi

Zulu wrote: »

While you'd be within your rights to do this, you have to ask yourself: is it the right thing to do now?
Frankly I'd imagine it'll only serve to worsen relations; fuel to the fire and all that. First port of call is to find out if he wants you gone prior to the agreed date. Then, if that is indeed the case, remind him that he can't do that and ring the PRTB.

Does it really matter at this stage? The OP is only going to be there for another few weeks either way. Im not talking about screaming in his face and threatening legal action; Im simply suggesting that it might be an idea to politely suggest that look into his legal obligations and not go about throwing around illegal eviction notices that might prove costly if done to the wrong tenant.

Zulu

djimi wrote: »

Does it really matter at this stage? The OP is only going to be there for another few weeks either way...

Well thats kinda my point! Why create a confrontation when it might be needless?

If (s)he approaches the landlord with a "your eviction notice is invalid", be it polite or otherwise, the LL is going to assume that the tenant is pulling a fast one, and is planning on staying longer (rent free). It's simply fuel to the fire.

odds_on

D3PO wrote: »

he cannot issue a notice of eviction. he must first issue you with a notice of arrears. if the arrears are not cleared in 14 days then he can issue a notice of eviction.

given your leaving your lease early and then all of a sudden not paying rent he probably thinks you are pulling a fast one. that said he must follow due course which he is not doing as described above.

It took to the 11th post by D3PO, before a correct answer was given to the OP's question.

A landlord cannot issue a valid notice of termination for arrears of rent without first serving a 14 days notice of rent arrears. Furthermore, a valid Notice of Termination cannot be served by email as it would not comply with the requirements of a NoT, which require, among other things, the signature of the landlord.

I would be inclined to follow djimi's advice and point out politely to the landlord that his notice is invalid. Do this firstly, verbally if on reasonably terms with the LL and followed up by a written letter (keeping a copy for the OP's files) outlining his errors.

Alternatively, the OP could make a claim immediately with the PRTB for illegal eviction.

smilerxxx

Is it possible he thinks that the previous arrangement of ye paying for a months rent but leaving 2 weeks early is being backtracked on? If your wages is 2 weeks late, then you would need to pay him a months rent the day you move out, and would anyone do that? Correct me if I'm wrong, I'm just trying to see the LL's side, I'd think you were trying to get out of the last month rent

Ps sorry you were assaulted in your home that must have been awful

djimi

Zulu wrote: »

Well thats kinda my point! Why create a confrontation when it might be needless?

If (s)he approaches the landlord with a "your eviction notice is invalid", be it polite or otherwise, the LL is going to assume that the tenant is pulling a fast one, and is planning on staying longer (rent free). It's simply fuel to the fire.

Well if the landlord thinks that they are evicting the OP then a) there goes any hope the OP has of getting a reference and b) the landlord may be intent on getting the OP out before the agreed date (seeing as how they are making up their own rules its impossible to tell what they think consititutes an eviction period; they might expect the OP out in a week).

End of the day it doesnt matter a jot what the landlord thinks the OPs intentions are. They cant do anything about it either way. The OP is well within their rights to stand their ground and argue their case against an illegal eviction notice. How hard they want to fight is up to them, but they need to be firm and make it clear to the landlord that the eviction notice is invalid, and it will not be taken seriously.

Zulu

Of course you are perfectly correct, I just suspect that the landlord is just ensuring they leave when they were supposed to (albeit going about it in the incorrect manner).

The reference is gone (I suspect) but what I'm suggesting is to try and finish out the tenancy on as amicable a term as possible. Ringing the LL to tell them the eviction notice is invalid mightn't be necessary if they can first establish if he's only (poorly) protecting himself from further "excuses".

djimi

I agree with you about finishing out a tenancy as amicably as possible, but it works both ways, and the landlord didnt have to go wading in with both feet and throwing around (illegal) eviction notices at the first sign of trouble either! There are ways of protecting yourself, and even if he felt that the OP was going to pull a fast one, trying to evict them early was not the way to go about it.

Any eviction notice is serious, but especially when its not handled properly in a legal manner. Its not really something that can or should be ignored. It doesnt have to result in a blazing row, but it needs to be dealt with.

murphaph

Landlord is just covering himself in case you decide to over hold the property.

Mrs OBumble

OP, if your financial situation is tight that you cannot cover one month's rent from your savings, then it seems to me that you've got more problems going on than just accommodation!

Approach your bank about getting a short term personal loan or overdraft, and pay the rent tomorrow.

Then for the next few months, concentrate on savings. You should have 12 weeks worth of living money in the bank pretty much as call, so cover you for things like getting sick and not being able to work. I could understand an unemployed person doing this, but if you are working, then savings are a must.

BostonB

I'm not referring to the OP. But I expect considering the hardship out there that many people are struggling month to month, rather than having the excess income to put into savings.

Páid

odds_on wrote: »

It took to the 11th post by D3PO, before a correct answer was given to the OP's question.

A landlord cannot issue a valid notice of termination for arrears of rent without first serving a 14 days notice of rent arrears. Furthermore, a valid Notice of Termination cannot be served by email as it would not comply with the requirements of a NoT, which require, among other things, the signature of the landlord.

I would be inclined to follow djimi's advice and point out politely to the landlord that his notice is invalid. Do this firstly, verbally if on reasonably terms with the LL and followed up by a written letter (keeping a copy for the OP's files) outlining his errors.

Alternatively, the OP could make a claim immediately with the PRTB for illegal eviction.

The above is true if the tenant has acquired a part 4 tenancy (which I believe they have).

I don't think the landlord was trying to serve a "notice of eviction" by email. In the original post, the email mentions "My agent will serve notice in writing at [MY ADDRESS] in the coming days.". I believe the landlord is paying an agent to serve a Notice of Termination in accordance with the PRTB rules.

Landlord is just covering himself in case you decide to over hold the property.

If the tenant has a part 4 tenancy then they are entitled to stay in the property for a further 3 years and 6 months (if any of the exceptions listed in the Acts don't arise).

The landlord is just trying to ensure that the property will become vacant as soon as possible so that it can be rented out again without delay. Don't take it personally.

BostonB

SwissK wrote: »

..Seeing that he wants to evict us on a basis of being 11 days late rent pay, just 5 weeks before we move out anyway, seems very fishy to me.

From a LL point of view it looks like you're going to stiff him with the rent, most likely for more than the deposit will cover. You may not intend to. But the LL has no way of knowing that.

SwissK wrote: »

My question is what can he actually do? Can he come over to the house and kick us out? Or if we would be evicted, does that mean he does not need to pay us back our deposit?

...both you and your LL need to look at the rules...

...If at the end of your tenancy, there is rent outstanding, your landlord may legitimately retain part or all of your deposit to cover the arrears...

Also

http://www.prtb.ie/dispute-resolution/disputes/information-on-terminating-a-tenancy-for-rent-arrears

BostonB

Páid wrote: »

...The landlord is just trying to ensure that the property will become vacant as soon as possible so that it can be rented out again without delay. Don't take it personally.

Probably. But hes doing it wrong.

Páid

BostonB wrote: »

Probably. But hes doing it wrong.

I don't agree. Before you serve anything in writing you have to notify the tenant that they are in arrears. This can be done verbally but in this case the landlord has done it in an email.

A landlord can give a tenant verbal notice of the rent arrears but must ensure that the tenant is aware that failure to pay the rent arrears within a reasonable time will result in the landlord terminating the tenancy.

http://www.prtb.ie/dispute-resolution/disputes/information-on-terminating-a-tenancy-for-rent-arrears

djimi

Mrs OBumble wrote: »

OP, if your financial situation is tight that you cannot cover one month's rent from your savings, then it seems to me that you've got more problems going on than just accommodation!

Approach your bank about getting a short term personal loan or overdraft, and pay the rent tomorrow.

Then for the next few months, concentrate on savings. You should have 12 weeks worth of living money in the bank pretty much as call, so cover you for things like getting sick and not being able to work. I could understand an unemployed person doing this, but if you are working, then savings are a must.

Lovely in an ideal world, but a lot of people have enough to pay bills and live off and not much else. Pretty patronizing thing to come out with really.

djimi

Páid wrote: »

The above is true if the tenant has acquired a part 4 tenancy (which I believe they have).

I don't think the landlord was trying to serve a "notice of eviction" by email. In the original post, the email mentions "My agent will serve notice in writing at [MY ADDRESS] in the coming days.". I believe the landlord is paying an agent to serve a Notice of Termination in accordance with the PRTB rules.


If the tenant has a part 4 tenancy then they are entitled to stay in the property for a further 3 years and 6 months (if any of the exceptions listed in the Acts don't arise).

The landlord is just trying to ensure that the property will become vacant as soon as possible so that it can be rented out again without delay. Don't take it personally.

The OP is not on a part 4; they are 7 months into a fixed term lease. There is no notice of termination in this instance, and even if there was, the OP has not given any indication that the landlord tried to, or had any good reason to, issue notice of termination under one of the clauses set out in the part 4 tenancy.

Páid wrote: »

I don't agree. Before you serve anything in writing you have to notify the tenant that they are in arrears. This can be done verbally but in this case the landlord has done it in an email.

If their intent was to issue a notice of arrears then they went about it completely arseways. Vaguely hinting in an email that a notice of eviction/termination will be issued is not sufficient.