Extermination through sterilisation - the solution to "skangerism"

PhlegmyMoses

Rojomcdojo wrote: »

You don't honestly believe that there are only 40,000 ne'er do wells in all of Ireland, do you? Have a read of my post above:
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=84946898&postcount=127

All you've done is post a link - which I've read and also does not give any insight into why they believe this is happening. Could you maybe give your own opinion on why this is happening before I offer mine? Just so I know where you stand.

kylith

touts wrote: »

If we cap welfare at 90% of the minimum wage it will encourage/force people to take minimum wage jobs which will make Ireland more competitive and attract jobs (call center, assembly, etc) back into the country from the likes of China. If people don't want to take those sorts of jobs they can stay on welfare capped at 90% of the minimum wage with the associated constraints such as vouchers etc. No one will be forced. They will just be made less comfortable.

We advertised for part time a cleaner where I'm on a course and had nearly 200 applicants, so what is it that makes you think that Irish people won't work a minimum wage job, rather accepting the obvious: that there are too many people for the amount of jobs available?

To bring down unemployment we, as a society, would have to either re-think 'working hours' and look at job sharing and shortening the working week, or we would have to de-industrialise: get rid of the car-making robots and the box-packing robots and give those jobs back to flesh-and-blood people.

looking_around

touts wrote: »

If all welfare was through vouchers then so many people would be using them there would be no shame in it. But the government could limit what they are spent on so we don't see drunken riots on beaches if the sun happens to be out on dole day.

I wasn't talking about shame, I was talking about having a right to decide what you spend the money on.
Is it fair that those on illness would not be able to buy gifts and the likes because it wasn't "categorized as necessary" ? Like I said, one might go through clothes faster than another, while someone else will find that they're food allowance is too high/low. What about those with pets. How much internet/phone cost is considered necessary.
Again, it isn't right to force those who can't work into a box of what we think they need help with/money for.

up for anything

Ush1 wrote: »

No they can't. Perhaps the super rich and powerful could organise the extermination of the lower classes? I don't think the lower classes could do it to the powerful and rich though.

French Revolution? Mau-Mau rebellion?

touts wrote: »

Introduce drunk tanks where anyone intoxicated and need of medical assistance are treated and held until an adult over the age of 30 comes to release them the following day.

From what I've seen on the rare occasions I go out these days there are an equal number of those intoxicated over and under 30. Do you get a rebate on the €1,000 jail charge if your releasing over 30 adult is too ill with a hangover to come get you?

touts wrote: »

If we cap welfare at 90% of the minimum wage it will encourage/force people to take minimum wage jobs which will make Ireland more competitive and attract jobs (call center, assembly, etc) back into the country from the likes of China.

That's a bit of a joke. Do you really think that our minimum wage is going to make us attractive to companies when people in the countries they have their factories/call centres in are probably on the equivalent of day's worth of our minimum wage a week?

You'd end up replacing the 'undersirables' with a huge section of society limited to working 12 hours a day, 6 days a week in call centres or sweatshop factories who would themselves become undersirable to those above them.

AlekSmart wrote: »

Unemployment is a very real thing all over the EU and the wider world,what is somewhat more unreal is the extent to which "Feckless Scroungery" has to be fully funded by the declining numbers who are attempting to support both themselves,their families AND the Feckless Scroungers as well.......it's not even Mathematics...it's Sums...and they don't add up...

So the solution is to ape the rest of the world and have large amounts of people living on the streets and scrounging for food.

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

4My biggest worry now is that we have a generation of young people coming through who'll meet the "experience required" wall when things eventually pick up because they couldn't get a look in when everything went tits up.

It's always been the same in this country. Nothing to worry about. Immigration will sort it out.

When I went to London in the 80s looking for work. I had to fake my CV. Filled it up with companies and hotels that I worked for which unfortunately the prospective employer couldn't contact because they'd gone to the wall due to the economic situation in Ireland. Not one interviewer ever queried it. The only one who even mentioned it was one guy in the context of a jokey, well I'm not sure should we hire you as you seem to close companies down. He offered me the job anyway.

mattjack

Emme wrote: »

No need for drastic measures such as sterilization. If skangers don't contribute to the upkeep of their children banish them to somewhere desolate in the midlands and make them pick stones, fork silage or shovel slurry all day. With no money for Dutch Gold and the threat of forced labour in the sticks skangers will embrace a life of celibacy. Skangers become extinct. Mission accomplished.

The Midlands ? you haven't travelled much , have ya ?

666irishguy

Take away the one thing they enjoy most:freedom. Freedom to not work, do what they want etc. Put GPS trackers on them and give them conditions such as curfews and the taking away of social welfare if they break those conditions. Make them work cleaning their shredded neighborhoods. Get a law passed that lets their associates be GPS tagged for being their associates. If they are within certain range of each other, they get the same punishment. Cap welfare for kids and make contraception readily available.
Blood and Piss test them randomly and if they fail, punish them. Use their mobiles to randomly inform them once a day to ring a state number setup for the purpose and explain what they are up to and make it at least an hour long call, or go to the nearest Garda barracks and check in for a Piss test or a debrief, if they hang up or don't show, punish them. Take away their clothes, humiliate them by making them wear a plain humiliatingly gaudy uniform in public when they are on this program. If they don't wear it they are punished.
If you are seen with a person in such a uniform, make it so that you can be randomly searched as-well. No travel beyond their local area. Sell their property to pay for their crime or pay for the system. Put their faces in the paper every month. Put their names and addresses on a blacklist for internet and satellite TV companies. Make them live in a state provided house (not the one they are in now) and inspect the home randomly. Keep upping the punishment and if they keep misbehaving, then shove them in prison and guess what? they get put on the program again from where they left off when they come out. If they play ball, they get some privileges back.
Just make it a nuisance/danger to be around them and deny them their freedom to do nothing. They will soon learn.

Ush1

up for anything wrote: »

French Revolution? Mau-Mau rebellion?

Are we talking Ireland or the whole world?

steddyeddy

mike65 wrote: »

Since the sun put its hat on Dublin has seen riots on a beach in Portmarnock, a gang of feral youths in near Dalkey smash up some poor chaps car while he was in it, that same gang terrorise passengers on a bus and last night a train was invaded by louts on the journey between Pearse Street Station and Maynooth. Blood was spilt before the Guards arrived.

Rather than wring our hands at the horror of it all, is it time to just acknowledge
that there is a strata of society that will never be reformed regardless of best intentions and state spending and that sterilisation of the Skanger class is the best way forward. It won't catch all the bad genes but certainly a large % will be wiped out without killing anyone.

That's the thinking about right wing thinking, it's unscientific BS!

steddyeddy

Examine the situations and enviroment that leads to such behaviour rather than tackle the behaviour after it's happened.

Kintarō Hattori

bedrock#1 wrote: »

One of the main problems with discussing 'sections of society' is that it generally fails to take account of the criminals that dwell within other 'section s of society'. Our criminal justice system is wholly focused on people from the lower segments of society even though the crimes of the powerful are far more devastating and go nearly totally unpunished.



Most sophisticated theories about human behaviour have come to the conclusion that simple rational choice is too reductionist. It sounds pretty nice and succinct but fails to factor in the mixture of biological, social, cultural environmental and psychological factors that make up a human being.




Doesn't work I'm afraid. Longer sentences haven't been shown empirically to make any difference to the crime rate. Prisons don't rehabilitate and if we are to talk about retribution we have to ask ourselves a number of questions regarding the legitimacy of an increasingly unequal society, where the crimes of the poor are punished and the crimes of the rich white washed and how this society can legitimately inflict punishment taking these facts into consideration.



Again reductionist arguments won't get us anywhere. There are constantly people on this forum talking about the huge numbers on social welfare yet conveniently ignore the fact that when the 'boom' times were here we had about 3% unemployment - ergo, if there are jobs people will work.



The fact that the vast majority of our prison population have never taken state exams points to needing them to at least have the tools to lift themselves out of their situation (whether or not their situation is of their own making or a consequence of our society).



Good idea. Something I agree with.



Sure there are but they require a more humane and equal society, which unfortunately is not something we are even coming close to considering either this thread or the fact that the concerns of business and finance come before the citizens of this and most other countries.

I'm currently on holiday and so have limited access/time to the web but, and I'm not attacking you here you've not answered any of the basic points I've made. You highlighted what was wrong with them, and they were basic- starting points. Rather you've highlighted what was wrong when really what we need is an answer.

What do you think is an answer to the problem. Where would you start?

looking_around

Kintarō Hattori wrote: »

I'm currently on holiday

you're on boards while on holidays :eek:
Is it THAT bad? :P

mattjack

danniemcq wrote: »

so i should have let him mug me and not broke his nose?

Hush , hush there now...

How Soon Is Now

Everyones favorite Austrian would of sorted all of this out but no you all had to shun him......

magicmushroom

mike65 wrote: »

They would need to fulfil 3 of the following criteria

Failed to sit Leaving Cert exams
No history of having worked
No history of either parent having worked, assuming fit to work
Having been the subject of more than one call out by the Guards to their home
Having been banned from a public bar
Made more than one phone call or 2 texts to FM 104s Adrian Kennedy

I meet these 3:
Failed to sit Leaving Cert exams
Having been the subject of more than one call out by the Guards to their home
Having been banned from a public bar

However these were all the result of a couple of silly and rebellious teenage years!
I'm now married, have a full time job, no arrears on any of my bills, no criminal record, wouldn't dream of acting like a 'skanger' in the street and like to think I'm a decent, respectful person who would be a wonderful parent if/when the time comes.

HOWEVER - I do quite like the idea of sterilising some people, the world is very over populated and would be a much nicer place without some of the c-u-next-tuesdays roaming around. Not all of them are from the lower classes, that's just an unfortunate stereotype. Peodophiles, animal abusers, ppl that have never attempted to get a job and fail to contribute anything decednt to society and spend all their dole money on booze and drugs on 'payday', gosh the list is endless!! :eek:

steddyeddy

Has anyone identified these “bad genes”? Because barring the discoveries of these genes their behaviour has to stem from environmental cues. Be they parents, lack of opportunities or living in a cess pool.

KyussBishop

Yes eugenics is the answer, right? I mean, it's not a problem that can be solved at all, by resolving the underlying socioeconomic problems creating the fúcking skangers in the first place, is it?

It's odd to see a thread about eugenics, where the people advocating it are sufficiently barbaric enough in attitude, to arguably qualify for extermination based their own criteria.

Oink

KyussBishop wrote: »

[...] It's odd to see a thread about eugenics, where the people advocating it are sufficiently barbaric enough in attitude, to arguably qualify for extermination based their own criteria.

Gotham

OP's post is reminiscent of what happened in America, and of course, practiced in Germany during... you know... the war.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eugenics_in_the_United_States

up for anything

Ush1 wrote: »

Are we talking Ireland or the whole world?

With the fantastic vision of the OP we're surely talking the whole world. Start small with Ireland and then spread this wonderful idea further afield.

steddyeddy

There's a lot of really stupid people around the world who perpertuate this myth that people are born into what they deserve. That the circumstances they are born into do not affect their outcomes in life.

Seachmall

steddyeddy wrote: »

Be they parents, lack of opportunities or living in a cess pool.

But if the parents are discovered to be a major factor in forming children into scumbags it may justify OP's approach.

It would also reduce the population of those areas which could increase standards of living, and it would reduce competition in the job market (which would have the same effect as increasing the number of opportunities).

Rothko

How Soon Is Now wrote: »

Everyones favorite Austrian would of sorted all of this out but no you all had to shun him......

Mozart?

wexie

steddyeddy wrote: »

There's a lot of really stupid people around the world who perpertuate this myth that people are born into what they deserve. That the circumstances they are born into do not affect their outcomes in life.

So what do you suggest then? Send in the social workers to take the kids away from the 'skangers' to give them a fair chance?

steddyeddy

Seachmall wrote: »

But if the parents are discovered to be a major factor in forming children into scumbags it may justify OP's approach.

It would also reduce the population of those areas which could increase standards of living, and it would increase opportunities (as the lower population would mean less competition).

Or we could remove the two tier education system and give every kid an equal chance regardless of social context.

Grayson

danniemcq wrote: »

or.....

just nuke Dublin and wall up Limerick.

(I'm skipping from page one here so sorry if someone's already posted this)

Just arrange a nother swedish house maffia gig the same time as oxegen. If you napalm both you'd get rid of a lot.

Seachmall

steddyeddy wrote: »

Or we could remove the two tier education system and give every kid an equal chance regardless of social context.

But then who do we sterilise?

steddyeddy

wexie wrote: »

So what do you suggest then? Send in the social workers to take the kids away from the 'skangers' to give them a fair chance?

I'm not suggesting anything I am currently working on it. In a volunteer capacity I show people in disadvantaged areas that they can achieve third level education if they so want. Academic abiltiy and intelligence isn't confined to one social strata. It doesn't stop the schools involved pushing one social group into education over another though.

steddyeddy

Seachmall wrote: »

But then who do we sterilise?

No one. All should have an equal chance in life

old hippy

Grand Moff Tarkin wrote: »

Free legal aid is a joke which has every scumbag and scut taking advantage of it when they are up before the court quite a large number of the legal profession have made a good living from it.

Also as a law abiding citizen of the state I have never had need or use for it myself.

So, let's say you were in a club somewhere and got glassed but during the arrest the perp accused you of assaulting them first (you didn't) and you had to go to the courts? Would you not avail of free legal aid? And yes, this happened to a totally innocent mate of mine.

Seachmall

steddyeddy wrote: »

No one. All should have an equal chance in life

Your solution has an unfortunate lack of sterlising people.

I'm not sure I can get behind it as is.

wexie

steddyeddy wrote: »

I'm not suggesting anything I am currently working on it. In a volunteer capacity I show people in disadvantaged areas that they can achieve third level education if they so want. Academic abiltiy and intelligence isn't confined to one social strata. It doesn't stop the schools involved pushing one social group into education over another though.

So then there is already equal opportunity no? Is third level education not open to all and sunder, depending on academic achievement?

sweetie

mike65 wrote: »

They would need to fulfil 3 of the following criteria

Failed to sit Leaving Cert exams
No history of having worked
No history of either parent having worked, assuming fit to work
Having been the subject of more than one call out by the Guards to their home
Having been banned from a public bar
Made more than one phone call or 2 texts to FM 104s Adrian Kennedy

Support a uk soccer team

woodoo

The riff raff are out-breeding the genuine working classes and the middle classes thanks to our cradle to grave welfare state.

steddyeddy

wexie wrote: »

So then there is already equal opportunity no? Is third level education not open to all and sunder, depending on academic achievement?

We have the same test to determine academic ability for different groups with different variables applied to each.

Think about it scientifically. You want to test for a particular trait yet your using different variables and controls. How are you getting an accurate representation of the trait you are looking for?

In laymans terms we have a public and private sector and the private sector send far more kids to third level. I would asociate that with a particular social strata where it not for the fact that people from disadvantaged areas who attend fee paying schools via scholarship do just aswell.

Norfolk Enchants

Mad f*cking thread, lads.

wexie

steddyeddy wrote: »

We have the same test to determine academic ability for different groups with different variables applied to each.

Think about it scientifically. You want to test for a particular trait yet your using different variables and controls. How are you getting an accurate representation of the trait you are looking for?

In laymans terms we have a public and private sector and the private sector send far more kids to third level. I would asociate that with a particular social strata where it not for the fact that people from disadvantaged areas who attend fee paying schools via scholarship do just aswell.

You'll have to forgive me my ignorance, I never went to school in Ireland.
Is it not just the case that admittance to College / University is based on how well you do in the leaving cert? And is the leaving cert not the same for everybody?

Personally I would have thought that someone from a public school in a bad area could still do very well (and I've seen this) provided their parents have taken an interest in their education from a young age.

Personally I don't know if I'd be able to put them through a fee paying school, however my kids get read to every night, are being encouraged to read for fun, helped with their homework, taken to museums, etc. etc.

I'd be interested to know how many of the 'disadvantaged' kids are getting the same support from their parents and how much of a difference it makes.

While forced sterilisations are probably taking it a step too far, I do think there are a lot of people out there that don't deserve kids and aren't fit parents and consequently are perpetuating the 'skanger' problem.

There comes a time where people need to take responsibility for their own lives, no matter how much tax payers money is thrown at this problem, if the people don't want to improve their / their kids lives it's never going to happen.

gosplan

This is the most ignorant thread ever.

You don't like skangers, you don't have a clue about how society works so the solution because they caused done trouble in middle class areas is forced sterilisation.

Guess what, the USC and not being able yo get a mortgage is a far bigger annoyance to me. How about we go for anyone that studied BESS or economics instead.

steddyeddy

wexie wrote: »

You'll have to forgive me my ignorance, I never went to school in Ireland.
Is it not just the case that admittance to College / University is based on how well you do in the leaving cert? And is the leaving cert not the same for everybody?

Personally I would have thought that someone from a public school in a bad area could still do very well (and I've seen this) provided their parents have taken an interest in their education from a young age.

Personally I don't know if I'd be able to put them through a fee paying school, however my kids get read to every night, are being encouraged to read for fun, helped with their homework, taken to museums, etc. etc.

I'd be interested to know how many of the 'disadvantaged' kids are getting the same support from their parents and how much of a difference it makes.

While forced sterilisations are probably taking it a step too far, I do think there are a lot of people out there that don't deserve kids and aren't fit parents and consequently are perpetuating the 'skanger' problem.

There comes a time where people need to take responsibility for their own lives, no matter how much tax payers money is thrown at this problem, if the people don't want to improve their / their kids lives it's never going to happen.

I will respond to all your post but I just want to make sure you understand that a standardised test is rendered useless with different variables applied? I’m asking in determining aptitude via a state test would not the addition of non-state supports to one group throw the test results?

shruikan2553

How much does society need to do before it is up to the person themselves to try without having their hand held? Everything to succeed is available and very few people have any excuse. Oh poor you, you had a bad start at life, might as well give up and become scum, or maybe work for a better life but no, thats probably too much work.:rolleyes:

Offer people money if they get sterilised, that way it isnt forced and save money in the long run when dont have to educate or pay child benefit.

gosplan

wexie wrote: »

You'll have to forgive me my ignorance, I never went to school in Ireland.
Is it not just the case that admittance to College / University is based on how well you do in the leaving cert? And is the leaving cert not the same for everybody?

Personally I would have thought that someone from a public school in a bad area could still do very well (and I've seen this) provided their parents have taken an interest in their education from a young age.

Personally I don't know if I'd be able to put them through a fee paying school, however my kids get read to every night, are being encouraged to read for fun, helped with their homework, taken to museums, etc. etc.

I'd be interested to know how many of the 'disadvantaged' kids are getting the same support from their parents and how much of a difference it makes.

While forced sterilisations are probably taking it a step too far, I do think there are a lot of people out there that don't deserve kids and aren't fit parents and consequently are perpetuating the 'skanger' problem.

There comes a time where people need to take responsibility for their own lives, no matter how much tax payers money is thrown at this problem, if the people don't want to improve their / their kids lives it's never going to happen.

If education had never done anything for anyone you knew, If you'd never been to college, and no-one you knew had ever been, if nobody in your world had ever profited from the leaving cert, would you automatically assume that that's what your kids were destined for?

Education is such a middle class construct. Like mortgages and shares, it's all about investing now for a reward later. That's a seriously alien concept to a large chunk of society.

dj jarvis

AHHHHH , once again the middle class show their true colors,

gas the scum !!!! the rallying cry

it will be priceless to see the faces of middle classes when they realize that the rich now need a target , and they are it

starting to think that a good lot of AH really are mentally ill.
people REALLY never learn from history

Insect Overlord

dj jarvis wrote: »

AHHHHH , once again the middle class show their true colors,

gas the scum !!!! the rallying cry

it will be priceless to see the faces of middle classes when they realize that the rich now need a target , and they are it

starting to think that a good lot of AH really are mentally ill.
people REALLY never learn from history

I can see no difference at all between the exaggeration of the OP and your own inflated sound bites. What makes it okay for you to call strangers "mentally ill"?

old hippy

dj jarvis wrote: »

AHHHHH , once again the middle class show their true colors,

gas the scum !!!! the rallying cry

it will be priceless to see the faces of middle classes when they realize that the rich now need a target , and they are it

starting to think that a good lot of AH really are mentally ill.
people REALLY never learn from history

The class snobbery on AH is, frankly, disgusting. "Skanger" this and "skanger" that every single day another thread on sterilisations, take away their benefits etc.

I'm saddened but not surprised by it.

old hippy

Insect Overlord wrote: »

I can see no difference at all between the exaggeration of the OP and your own inflated sound bites. What makes it okay for you to call strangers "mentally ill"?

Calling for people to be sterilised is the sign of a healthy mind?

Insect Overlord

old hippy wrote: »

Calling for people to be sterilised is the sign of a healthy mind?

Jonathan Swift called for the hungry people of Ireland to eat their own young.

dj jarvis

Insect Overlord wrote: »

I can see no difference at all between the exaggeration of the OP and your own inflated sound bites. What makes it okay for you to call strangers "mentally ill"?

oh , i dont know , the fact that they are in favor of randomly killing a certain section of the community might be a slight indication

a remember a certain little Austrian had the same idea and was he not labeled the same ???

sick thread , full of sick people , im just clinging to the slight hope that hundreds of trolls just happened to all arrive at the same thread at the same time

and riddle me this , how the **** do you know they are not mentally ill ?
i could be off my head for all you know

now - calm down , put the horse back into the stable

old hippy

Insect Overlord wrote: »

Jonathan Swift called for the hungry people of Ireland to eat their own young.

Yes he did, in jest - but to compare the comments from some here to that literary giant is a heinous crime

dj jarvis

old hippy wrote: »

The class snobbery on AH is, frankly, disgusting. "Skanger" this and "skanger" that every single day another thread on sterilisations, take away their benefits etc.

I'm saddened but not surprised by it.

in fairness , some should have benefits taken away for anti social behavior

but gassing and sterilization ??
shudder at what walks among us

gosplan

mike65 wrote: »

I'm not proposing the deletion of anyone merely the lack of creation, read the last sentence of the OP again.

Yes you are.

The Traveller community would be first to go. Little education, no employment etc etc. All of them sterilised.

This is pure nazi stuff. They weren't just 'evil' you know, they had reasons.

Grand Moff Tarkin

old hippy wrote: »

The class snobbery on AH is, frankly, disgusting. "Skanger" this and "skanger" that every single day another thread on sterilisations, take away their benefits etc.

I'm saddened but not surprised by it.

Don't worry none of them have the Internet so they have no idea what we are planning for them.