Asperger's Syndrome No Longer Recognised

ManicDiablo

First of all, sorry if this was posted in the wrong section. I wasn't sure where to put it.

Anyway, for a long time, I've suspected that I may have Asperger's. I was recently thinking of going to a doctor about it but I've heard that it's no longer recognised in America.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/dec/02/aspergers-syndrome-dropped-psychiatric-dsm

I'm just wondering what, if any, impact this has had over here. I know that some of you might say that the best thing would be to go to the doctor anyway but I'd like to know what difference this has made before I go.

JuliusCaesar

The ICD is what is used here, rather than the DSM. These things/categories change anyway, so I wouldn't worry about it. Why not see a doctor if you suspect something is wrong with you? It's the main reason people go see doctors, after all.

skooterblue2

You need to see a very "special" doctor to spot it. I approached mine and she ignored it and told me it was "my own unique personality". But she was very helpful introducing me to an unnecessary drug called effexor which is a Demon to come off of. The only way I could get off it was acupuncture.

If you are on the Medical Card , Tough Sugar, You will have to pay €500 for a psychologist. The medical card ones are really only trainee doctors who haven't gotten the stabilisers off their bikes yet. All they will do is top up your perscription of Ciprimil/Effexor/Lustral or what ever the Pharma companies are touting

Greystoner

There is a very good person who could diagnose you under dsm4 if you request it, instead of dsm5. However, you might need to ask yourself if you need the 'label' to get yourself support, or if you just want it for your own clarification? If it is just for your own self, and you know you have aspergers already then go via gp. If you need supports, then it is going to cost quite alot to go private. I can give you a contact name by pm if you wish, but he is €350 for about 30 minutes. Consider your means to an end. Ie for a child a diagnosis would help you get resource hours through their school. There are loads of support groups online for adult 'aspies' too.

skooterblue2

You could be dead and pushing up daisys waiting for the health boards to do anything like that, possibly up to 5 years. Only a registered Psychiatrist or Psychologist can actually write the report. If you are going to do it, do it properly so questions cannot be asked by administrators later trying to wangle their way out of supports. Check it out first.

skooterblue2

Oh and you will need to get "The Bible".

Its the complete guide to Aspergers, by Tony Attwood. Its as common as muck and costs between £14-25 plus post and packaging from the UK. Do shop around. Get in Contact with the National Learning Network, after you get your diagnosis.

JuliusCaesar

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You need to see a very "special" doctor to spot it. I approached mine and she ignored it and told me it was "my own unique personality". But she was very helpful introducing me to an unnecessary drug called effexor which is a Demon to come off of. The only way I could get off it was acupuncture.

If you are on the Medical Card , Tough Sugar, You will have to pay €500 for a psychologist. The medical card ones are really only trainee doctors who haven't gotten the stabilisers off their bikes yet. All they will do is top up your perscription of Ciprimil/Effexor/Lustral or what ever the Pharma companies are touting

Four Points:
1. Most people come off their antidepressant medication using a reducing dosage.

2. There is no charge for psychology appointments in the HSE, although there may be a significant waiting list.

3. Doctors treating medical card patients are fully qualified doctors, who do not prescribe at the whim of pharmaceutical companies.

4. Psychologists do not prescribe - only qualified medical doctors (and some nurses) can prescribe.

skooterblue2 wrote: »

You could be dead and pushing up daisys waiting for the health boards to do anything like that, possibly up to 5 years. Only a registered Psychiatrist or Psychologist can actually write the report. If you are going to do it, do it properly so questions cannot be asked by administrators later trying to wangle their way out of supports. Check it out first.

"Dead and pushing up daisies"???? "Administrators trying to wangle their way out"???

Please stop spreading misinformation.

skooterblue2

I was waiting a year to see a psychatrist in Cork and only because my doctor made calls. Then I was sent to the HSE ones, y'know the fresh faced ones in their late 20's and early 30's. Many of them were foreign national from other countries like Nigeria, India and the States on 4 were from Ireland. I asked them all and they said they were doing it as part of their supervised work experience. During my time I saw 12 different "Psychiatrist" in a period of 36 months and never the same one twice. Either they turn over psychiatrist really quickly or its a training hospital.

Define a significant waiting list? I think 6 months is more than anyone should have to wait for an assessment like that.
The reality in this country is "Health care is free on the medical card but it may take a while, oh you are willing pay well thats different, I can see you next week then".

Qualified and experienced have two very different meanings. Might have done medicine in UCD but guaranteed the guy with 20 years experience has seen everything. Clearly you have never met a persuasive sales rep. If they don't there are a quare amount of people on anti depressant.

I was onto college and the disability support officer wanted to see my psychological assessment. She could very easily turn around and say "The EU standard is ICD not DSM". Administrators always want to cover themselves and protect the companies/ institutions interest before yours.

In my time I have seen 6 Doctors (2 family GPs, 2 regular GPs for 2nd opinion and 2 company doctors), 12 different "psychiatrists" (who should have spotted it a mile off, but hadn't their training wheels off), 6 of my cousins are doctors, My cousin is a counsellor and psych nurse in St Pats, 2 aunts are nurses, One a primary teacher, one child care specialist (5 year degree), a sister a nurse. One Occupational therapist. 3 college head of student services. And Finally one proper psychologist.

What kind of "psychiatrist" prescribes anti depressants for Aspergers anyway? I was told twice when I brought it to a GP and a psychiatrist that I didnt know what I was talking about.

The moral of the story is if you want premium healthcare in this country you will have to pay for it cos the system is over burdened.

skooterblue2

To access the National Learning Network (Kind of REHAB for Aspergers) you will need your Psychologist/Psychiatrists report. NO REPORT NO ENTRY.

JuliusCaesar

skooterblue2, this is your LAST CHANCE. Any more misinformation and you'll be banned.

Go talk with your relatives and you will discover that the Psychiatrists you saw were Registrars or Senior Registrars. The grade above this is CONSULTANT. Many Regs will have had substantial experience and knowledge. Not all Regs can become Consultants because there are less Consultant posts than Reg posts.

Stop talking nonsense about 'training wheels' or do so on the Health Science forum, where medical doctors (and Psychiatrists) congregate. We are PSYCHOLOGISTS here.

skooterblue2

Well if they were that great and experienced ..... how come they didnt spot it?

skooterblue2

Apologies to Julius Cesar.
I meant the if you were on the medical card, for the time you would have to wait ..... you would be better off paying for the Psychologists Report if you need it that badly.

To say I am "Piqued" as in my psychologists report doesnt begin to cover how I feel how I was treated by the Educational and medical system.

JuliusCaesar

Can we just say that skooterblue2 had a bad experience?

The waiting list to be assessed by a psychiatrist will vary around the country and at various times. Where I work, the waiting is about 2-3 weeks for non-urgent people. These people may or may not be on the medical card. It is irrelevant as it is the HSE public mental health service and I certainly wouldn't know who has one and who hasn't. The wait is exactly the same, treatment is exactly the same, in the public service.

skooterblue2

No we can't say "skooterblue2 had a bad experience"

A bad experience is going to the Doctors exactly on time, and his secretary has given your appointment to someone else and told you, you missed it. On your way out she tells she is billing you for missing it but do come again. That is a bad experience.

Its is a complete failure of the systems across a broad spectrum of levels and then being told ".... Its the Ministers responsibility".

The service is Definitely not the same. I only got between 10-15 minutes with each HSE psychiatrist but when I paid for a private psychologist with 20 years experience I got a 3 hour consultation. Comes down to the same old story "Money talks".

DM addict

skooterblue2, I'm sorry you had such a bad experience. That really sucks, and isn't fair.

When I was treated within the HSE for mental health issues, I had a very supportive GP and an excellent clinical psychologist, as well as a privately paid psychotherapist. (I did briefly see a psychiatrist, but it was a non-event as they agreed I already had all my bases covered with the other professionals). I remember that I started seeing the private psychotherapist initially on GP's advice because of the potential for a long waiting list. However when I asked for a referral within HSE to a psychologist, I was seen within a couple of weeks, and managed to get numerous appointments with the same clinician.

I know you've had a completely different experience, but there are good GPs, psychologists and psychiatrists working within the HSE. To say otherwise does something of a disservice to a lot of hard-working clinicians and professionals.

JuliusCaesar

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Its is a complete failure of the systems across a broad spectrum of levels and then being told ".... Its the Ministers responsibility".

Maybe it is. The HSE is operating under different money-saving rules for the last few years. Write to the Minister - or do you think complaining on boards.ie does the same job?

skooterblue2 wrote: »

The service is Definitely not the same. I only got between 10-15 minutes with each HSE psychiatrist but when I paid for a private psychologist with 20 years experience I got a 3 hour consultation. Comes down to the same old story "Money talks".

Psychiatrists and psychologists are not the same, and don't work in the same way. Psychiatrists as I've said here before are medical doctors. If you want to complain about them, don't do it here - go to the Health Science forum.

Valmont

I was surprised to find out last week (not personally) that the waiting list for therapy on the NHS is over six months long.

'Hang onto to those issues, because in six months you will have a great therapist to discuss them with! In the meantime, take some of this xanax and forget about life'

Torakx

Just posting an experience I know of.
I know someone with Aspergers who tried to see a therapist or counselor of any kind for depression(admitedly a few years ago now).
And after trying various types of drugs from the doctor.
Doctor said he could only set him up with a group counseling session because he is on the medical card and can't pay for it himself.
So he didnt go... of course.. Tried changing diet which helped a lot and also smoking a certain shade of green lol
He felt very dissapointed he couldn't see anyone even for 10 minutes a week.
But he doesn't need it now anyway and found his own way out.
I hope this has changed since, for those who still need counseling/therapy.

JuliusCaesar

Torakx wrote: »

Doctor said he could only set him up with a group counseling session because he is on the medical card and can't pay for it himself.
So he didnt go... of course..

Why didn't he attend the group?




From an effectiveness viewpoint, it is VERY expensive to provide everyone with one-to-one therapy. One therapist could have a caseload of about 20 clients. If seeing people in groups, that number could be 100. There's a lot of psychoeducation that can be delivered in groups and which may be sufficient for many of those attending. That means for those who then go on to individual therapy, the duration of therapy is shorter, and so the therapist can see more people if he/she is say seeing people for 20 sessions instead of 40.

Have a look at how Stresspac was delivered in Glasgow - groups of 50 or more weren't uncommon. Those who needed minimal intervention got it, those who needed more went on to the next tier. It makes sense, in every way.

Nowadays, there are a lot of computer self-help programmes as a first tier too, the most reputable of which have been trialled and evaluated.




(This isn't directed at Asperger's sufferers, but at anxiety and depression sufferers. I've gone a bit off topic!)

JuliusCaesar

Valmont wrote: »

'Hang onto to those issues, because in six months you will have a great therapist to discuss them with! In the meantime, take some of this xanax and forget about life'

I would think that waiting lists vary from place to place and from time to time, but that might well be an average.

That's why a lot of energy and time has gone into trying to come up with cost-effective tiers of therapy.

RobbingBandit

I was assessed by a Professor, you may say the Professor. No need to name names at this stage I would imagine. My diagnosis took place back in 2007 and since then when I say where the diagnosis took place more than a few people have looked at me funny, my local HSE psychologist disputed my diagnosis to no end. I don't think she had/has any experience dealing with people with AS, I was also attending a well known Psychiatric hospital for some serve issues back in 2011/2012 and they also disputed the diagnosis, I and my GP are 100% certain I am on the Autistic Spectrum with other issues too boot.

To make a long story short it takes time to find a doctor or service that is right in these cases, I was only diagnosed when I was 25 years old myself.

hotbabe1992

Just reading this forum and im shocked that aespergers is no longer recognised in the states,really i think this is a step backwards.

Just to point out..I have been to psychiatrits/psychologists too,and i notice (im afraid i'll have to agree with skooter on this) i went through about 10 or 12 like skooter did and i wasnt impressed either,there was no real continunity some of my medical notes were lost,other doctors added notes on to old notes and when i finally got to read my own medical notes which i asked for,i couldnt make head or tail of it.

Im now under private health insurance,and off the medical card(ie working),and there is no going through 10-12 doctors,no inexperienced student staff etc,no confusion or misunderstandings..

I just see the same person each time,the way it should be for the public health service too..But its not for some strange reason.

Torakx

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

Why didn't he attend the group?

It most likely has something to do with the aspergers.
You probably have a fair idea of how this can affect people socially and so a group meeting would be the most negative experience for my friend he could imagine with regards therapy,well anything usually, when there is a function involved that is not social.Therapy is not something that would be put in the social category.
I also understand it's really exspensive to get everyone seen to.

I was about to say, " I wonder if exceptions could be made for those with conditions like this"..But, then again social anxiety,depression etc are quite common reasons for needing therapy in the first place.
Ultimately I have seen many people recover from depression (with AS too) by using a restricted diet.
I read somewhere a few years back that some kids have been put on restricted diets with AS and have made massive improvements.
So my diet theory with depression is one I have not been able to shake still.
Not that i want to ruin any business for those with vested interest. It's just a laymans view and experiences over the years.
I expect everyone to take my views with a pinch of salt.

Aestivalis

As far as I know, its not just as simple as getting rid of aspergers all together. But rather understanding that aspergers is/was part of Autism Spectrum Disorder as whole.
The specturm is a sliding scale so aspergers is covered within ASD.

Also, I always find that people who suspect they may have a disability with no real evidence get on a dangerous road to not accepting no for an answer.
They've decided they have aspergers themselves, and they're sticking with it regardless of what any psychiatrist or psychologist says.

Reventon93

Hi everyone, i'm hoping that this is the right place to ask this, seeing as you all seem to be extremely knowledgeable in this area.

Anyway, for the last few years, it has become much more likely that i have Aspergers or at least show a lot of the common symptoms. And my parents have confirmed that there were signs during my childhood and teen years, that point to me having Aspergers tendencies. My therapist recommended that i get a professional assessment because she thinks there's a strong possibility that i do have it. So i approached one of the GP's in my local surgery yesterday, and she completely wrote me off and said that i was essentially the opposite of what i am despite me meeting her rarely over the years. She had also written my Therapist off as unprofessional.

So i was wondering if anyone would know of someone who could assess me or diagnose me? I know that assessments are generally expensive, but both me and my parents believe that the money spent seeing someone would be well worth the peace of mind that it would bring, despite the outcome. I am 20 and live in the West, and have limited resources seeing as i haven't been able to find someone close who can do what i'm asking.

Thanks

ShaShaBear

Would have to confirm Skooter's story here - a family member of mine saw a total of 14 "professionals", all of which had no record of what the previous had decided and as such he was constantly forced to deal with strangers that he didn't feel comfortable talking to, who all recommended group therapy, very laughable for someone who cannot sit in a room with three people he knows well without losing control. He was put on several different courses of anti-depressants throughout his life, and has been exploring this diagnosis in the HSE for a total of 18 years now.
They are STILL squabbling over the diagnosis, as apparently he does not display ONE of the symptoms - a lack of intelligence and difficulties learning. :rolleyes:

skooterblue2

Of course you don't have Aspergers!because if you did and your doctor missed it .....

It's not too late. You are still very young. This will change your life in college. Any psychologist will see it amile off. Don't have full net capability. Go to Irish psychology board they have a register. I was waiting 6 weeks. 500 cash gets. Discount.

Shashabear you are
singing my song! Are we related? All my cousins went to UCC UCD WIT UL Trinity. I think they all went to Billie Barry night school

Reventon93

Thanks a lot for the help!

I've been trying to find any information about seeing someone and it's been giving me a headache At least i know where to look now. And from what i found, i'm looking for an educational/clinical psychologist, right?

ShaShaBear

skooterblue2 wrote: »

Shashabear you are
singing my song! Are we related? All my cousins went to UCC UCD WIT UL Trinity. I think they all went to Billie Barry night school

I hope not, or else I just got stung telling stories about you :P

JuliusCaesar

Did you contact the Asperger Association or Irish Autism Action? They'll probably be able to give you much better specialised advice than we can here.

Reventon93

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

Did you contact the Asperger Association or Irish Autism Action? They'll probably be able to give you much better specialised advice than we can here.

Not yet. That's actually a really good idea. Will definitely be getting in touch soon.