Bike Scheme like Dublin, Waterford misses out.

7upfree

O Riain wrote: »

In fairness Limericks population is just about 100k but the 'metropolitan' district of waterford is 68k, Galway is 73k so if they can have it, we should also be able to

So true. the 57K is "without suburbs" meaning surrounding towns. So there is no great real difference in the core population. They like to dress it up though.

The big problem as many see it it is that there is constant chipping away at Waterford's status. Some huge things, then the smaller ones - like the bike scheme. It all adds up.

Roanmore

7upfree wrote: »

The other three cities outside Dublin are getting it. Did you not read the OP? This is what happens when there is no City-based TD representing us. The three sitting TDs are an unmitigated disaster for the City.

Did you not read the link in the OP?
It says the 3 cities mentioned MAY get a bike scheme subject to a tender process, nothing is guaranteed yet. It may well prove too expensive in those cities as well.

"Whoever wins the tender, will have to supply 300 bikes for Cork, 150 for Limerick and 200-250 for Galway.

They will also have to construct and install 75 docking stations, 75 user terminals and 25 advertising hoardings.

Few Irish companies will be equipped to apply. Interested companies have until the 23 July to submit their tenders.

Conditions for application include having installed and operated such a scheme involving at least 150 bikes in the past three years"

Wanderer2010

7upfree wrote: »

For God's sake man - THEY'RE IN THE DAIL! They were elected to represent us. They should be jumping up and down about everything that has happened. They're not. Following the party whip like sheep. So you now want to blame the people of Waterford City for the discrimination being practised against us?

So no other City is "militant"? Was Cork's push against WIT not "militant"?

Sweet Jesus. There is no hope . There really isn't. Not with attitudes like that prevailing.

BTW, Limerick's population 57k, Waterford's almost 50k. So I fail to see your point.

Do you actually think our elected TDs can make a tap of difference when it comes to shouting for Waterford and our needs? Think about the stage they are on. Pushed to the very back of the Dail, only given a few mins speech usually in front of about 4 people, shouting and posturing for all the injustice that goes on and yet nothing changes because the fact is our Government has enough on its hands, what with dancing to Germany's tune, the recession and abortion laws. This city is the last thing on its mind. If you want change it has to come from within and community projects etc. Nobody is going to hand us money to build bike schemes and it wouldnt even be practical in town with so many shops closed down.

7UpFree, you seem to think that just because we elect TDs and stupidly fall for their big words and promises pre-election that there will be change. It doesnt work like that, politics is just a circus and although some of the few Waterford TDs have genuine passion (one is a waste of space), they havent the tools or the power to change anything. But, alas, people being as stupid as they are, will probably vote in FF again next election and hence start the next cycle of rebuilding/destruction/false promises etc thats the norm in politics. They are not going to do anything for Waterford. You want change? Programmes like Winterval, Give your Shirt for Waterford etc are the way to keep us in the spotlight. However mixed the success, at least the people involved know the score. Politicians DO NOT CARE. Its up to us.

Wanderer2010

O Riain wrote: »

In fairness Limericks population is just about 100k but the 'metropolitan' district of waterford is 68k, Galway is 73k so if they can have it, we should also be able to

Sigh.

7upfree

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Do you actually think our elected TDs can make a tap of difference when it comes to shouting for Waterford and our needs? Think about the stage they are on. Pushed to the very back of the Dail, only given a few mins speech usually in front of about 4 people, shouting and posturing for all the injustice that goes on and yet nothing changes because the fact is our Government has enough on its hands, what with dancing to Germany's tune, the recession and abortion laws. This city is the last thing on its mind.

Our "elected TDs" are put there to MAKE a difference. Do you not understand this principle. If everyone in the world took the "ah sure what can we do" stance would Hitler have been defeated? Would communism have collapsed? Would the Berlin Wall have fallen? On our own doorstep the Crystal workers fought tooth and nail for their pension rights. Would you also have classed them as "moaners"? And advisd them to stop "moaning"? Well?!

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

If you want change it has to come from within and community projects etc. Nobody is going to hand us money to build bike schemes and it wouldnt even be practical in town with so many shops closed down.

But it's OK to hand it to Cork, Limerick, and Galway? And you actually ACCEPT this? Do you actually understand the concept of a bike scheme? It is not merely about shops.

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

7UpFree, you seem to think that just because we elect TDs and stupidly fall for their big words and promises pre-election that there will be change. It doesnt work like that, politics is just a circus and although some of the few Waterford TDs have genuine passion (one is a waste of space), they havent the tools or the power to change anything.

No, I refer you to my answer above. We elect them to represent us and to produce results. A quite simple concept really.

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

But, alas, people being as stupid as they are, will probably vote in FF again next election and hence start the next cycle of rebuilding/destruction/false promises etc thats the norm in politics. They are not going to do anything for Waterford.

More of the doom and gloom.

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

You want change? Programmes like Winterval, Give your Shirt for Waterford etc are the way to keep us in the spotlight. However mixed the success, at least the people involved know the score. Politicians DO NOT CARE. Its up to us.

I have been involved with WGAS and other projects, but they are part of the whole, something which some people cannot seem to grasp. You have to hound and harry for your rights. That is life. It IS up to us. That is why people complain. Get it now?

Sully

I can't believe the anger on here over a ****ing bike scheme. You want the TDs to shout about a bike scheme?! Get them to shout about more important issues. Bikes won't help Waterford. Get real please.

Nobody is getting it yet. Waterford was given the opportunity but it appears no sponsor came forward and it was proven to costly. Someone in the other cities seem interested. You cant ask our TDs to shout about it if there is no interest.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

I can't believe the anger on here over a ****ing bike scheme. You want the TDs to shout about a bike scheme?! Get them to shout about more important issues. Bikes won't help Waterford. Get real please.

Nobody is getting it yet. Waterford was given the opportunity but it appears no sponsor came forward and it was proven to costly. Someone in the other cities seem interested. You cant ask our TDs to shout about it if there is no interest.

No - we want equality for Waterford. It's just more discrimination, pecking away at Waterford, ably propped up by their supporters who try to whip it under the carpet. Not any more. Maybe you should get real yourself Sully.;)

7upfree

Roanmore wrote: »

Did you not read the link in the OP?
It says the 3 cities mentioned MAY get a bike scheme subject to a tender process, nothing is guaranteed yet. It may well prove too expensive in those cities as well.

"Whoever wins the tender, will have to supply 300 bikes for Cork, 150 for Limerick and 200-250 for Galway.

They will also have to construct and install 75 docking stations, 75 user terminals and 25 advertising hoardings.

Few Irish companies will be equipped to apply. Interested companies have until the 23 July to submit their tenders.

Conditions for application include having installed and operated such a scheme involving at least 150 bikes in the past three years"

And what is missing from that list? Well?

7upfree

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Sigh.

Sigh yourself.

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

No - we want equality for Waterford. It's just more discrimination, pecking away at Waterford, ably propped up by their supporters who try to whip it under the carpet. Not any more. Maybe you should get real yourself Sully.;)

Its a BIKE SCHEME! Your making a fuss over something that appears was TOO COSTLY to open in Waterford and apparently little interest. Nobody came forward to sponsor the bleeding thing whereas in other counties they did! Money talks!

What your suggesting, that the government withdrew it on purpose, is factually incorrect. Neither of the other cities have been given it either, but the process for consideration suggests finances will be offered and interest is there.

Your selectively quoting and putting your own incorrect spin on a non-story.

Roanmore

7upfree wrote: »

And what is missing from that list? Well?

Did you read the link or are you just interested in playing victim? There was a survey done on Waterford and it proved too costly. The same thing may happen for the other 3 cities.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

Your selectively quoting and putting your own incorrect spin on a non-story.

ROTFLMAO.

Now Sully, in fairness.............:D:D:D:D:D

Wanderer2010

^ I agree with some of your points there. With regards Waterford Crystal, of course it was terrible what happened but who was it who made the loudest noise and protest? The workers of course. They staged a sit in (sadly came to nothing) and fought tooth and nail to meet Ministers only to be ignored, they had to take their case to the highest court in order to get some comeback. Thats what I love about the people of Waterford, they fought their case but they did this on their own guts and crusade, just like WGAS etc. No TD helped in any way with regards Waterford Crystal or TalkTalk closing down etc. Its people power because at the end of the day, the likes of Halligan and Conway just want a soundbite and to look good on the 6.1 news for a minute or two and say all the right things but they have no power to do anything, can you see this?

Its no good ranting about the politicians, this country is a cess pool of corruption and me, me and more me culture. By your logic, I should be breaking into the Dail and demanding Enda Kenny stop giving his staff pay rises because its not right. He wouldnt care less. Politics as a rule is a circus of image and saying the right things at the right time. People who believe ANY of the pre election promises of an independent TD are idiots. Blinekered, naive idiots. And you seem to be raging at the fact that our TDs dont do enough. They dont and they never will, man, its staring you right in the face.

To address your other points, its not all doom and gloom, im simply pointing out how politics work. If you cant see that then I feel sorry for you. No amount of us ranting about individual TDs is going to make a tap of difference here. Yes, the population of Limerick as a whole is similar but Dublin and Galway will always get priority because, as i said, more people, more companies, more colleges, more employment,more money. Dont be a typical Waterford head 7UPFree and blame the TDs for EVERYTHING to do with Waterford, theres enough of that crap all over the city. Im not for a second blaming the people, but its up to us to rebuild. Who else is going to do it for us?

7upfree

Roanmore wrote: »

Did you read the link or are you just interested in playing victim? There was a survey done on Waterford and it proved too costly. The same thing may happen for the other 3 cities.

I would imagine all four would have been done simultaneously? If so, why not?

7upfree

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

^ I agree with some of your points there. With regards Waterford Crystal, of course it was terrible what happened but who was it who made the loudest noise and protest? The workers of course. They staged a sit in (sadly came to nothing) and fought tooth and nail to meet Ministers only to be ignored, they had to take their case to the highest court in order to get some comeback. Thats what I love about the people of Waterford, they fought their case but they did this on their own guts and crusade, just like WGAS etc. No TD helped in any way with regards Waterford Crystal or TalkTalk closing down etc. Its people power because at the end of the day, the likes of Halligan and Conway just want a soundbite and to look good on the 6.1 news for a minute or two and say all the right things but they have no power to do anything, can you see this?

Its no good ranting about the politicians, this country is a cess pool of corruption and me, me and more me culture. By your logic, I should be breaking into the Dail and demanding Enda Kenny stop giving his staff pay rises because its not right. He wouldnt care less. Politics as a rule is a circus of image and saying the right things at the right time. People who believe ANY of the pre election promises of an independent TD are idiots. Blinekered, naive idiots. And you seem to be raging at the fact that our TDs dont do enough. They dont and they never will, man, its staring you right in the face.

To address your other points, its not all doom and gloom, im simply pointing out how politics work. If you cant see that then I feel sorry for you. No amount of us ranting about individual TDs is going to make a tap of difference here. Yes, the population of Limerick as a whole is similar but Dublin and Galway will always get priority because, as i said, more people, more companies, more colleges, more employment,more money. Dont be a typical Waterford head 7UPFree and blame the TDs for EVERYTHING to do with Waterford, theres enough of that crap all over the city. Im not for a second blaming the people, but its up to us to rebuild. Who else is going to do it for us?

From your earlier post:

"Do you really lay all the blame on the militant reputation of Waterford at the seat of our three TDs"

In your rush to defend Government incompetence you have, effectively, blamed the people of Waterford city.

And what, pray tell, is a "typical Waterford head"?

I've already given examples of other places jumping up and down and being given their own way, but when it's Waterford it's because we are "militant"? WTF. Seriously?

And as for who is going to rebuild for us - is that a serious question??!!

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

From your earlier post:

"Do you really lay all the blame on the militant reputation of Waterford at the seat of our three TDs"

In your rush to defend Government incompetence you have, effectively, blamed the people of Waterford city.

And what, pray tell, is a "typical Waterford head"?

I've already given examples of other places jumping up and down and being given their own way, but when it's Waterford it's because we are "militant"? WTF. Seriously?

And as for who is going to rebuild for us - is that a serious question??!!

Any chance we can stay away from suggesting people are pro-government when they disagree with you, no?

Some of us want a balanced, sensible, factual discussion on this without being personally attacked without foundation.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

Any chance we can stay away from suggesting people are pro-government when they disagree with you, no?

Some of us want a balanced, sensible, factual discussion on this without being personally attacked without foundation.

Without the spin Sully? That post has answered questions that have been asked. Where is the problem with it? Without wearing your FG hat.......:)

Sully

7upfree wrote: »

Without the spin Sully? That post has answered questions that have been asked. Where is the problem with it? Without wearing your FG hat.......:)

Ill take that as a no so.

7upfree

Sully wrote: »

Ill take that as a no so.

O Riain

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

Sigh.

What are you sighing at exactly???? I gave examples of the population of Waterford and the population of Galway, both extremely similiar with only 5000 in the difference. If Galway can manage it with a population over 10 times smaller than Dublin then surely Waterford could manage with a population slightly smaller than Galway.

This is not even a Waterford being singled out issue. I would go as far to say that any reasonably sized town should also be considered. There is very little forward thinking in this country as it is.

Wanderer2010

7upfree wrote: »

From your earlier post:

"Do you really lay all the blame on the militant reputation of Waterford at the seat of our three TDs"

In your rush to defend Government incompetence you have, effectively, blamed the people of Waterford city.

And what, pray tell, is a "typical Waterford head"?

I've already given examples of other places jumping up and down and being given their own way, but when it's Waterford it's because we are "militant"? WTF. Seriously?

And as for who is going to rebuild for us - is that a serious question??!!

Shame you didnt respond to my points on how government works and that I support the efforts of Waterford Crystal people etc and just continued on your rant about how its the TDs fault and the Government should just hand you a better Waterford. Who as you say has "jumped up and down and got their way"? Im intrigued to find out..

As for typical Waterford head, I meant on issues such as the city, jobs etc people like YOU who sit back and put all of the blame for our woes on TDs or people who you work with who didnt back unions etc etc, I see it in the pubs in this city, the sense of entitlement from a certain faction is staggering. We should have more jobs, we should have more wages, we should have better roads, more shops etc etc. If you try to explain logic to these people they just stare at you dumbfounded before returning to their anti-Waterford conspiracy. If there is a sense that some companies wont invest here, its because enough of our militant reputation has spread to cause fear. I have seen it, I have heard it, I know what Im talking about.

If you are not part of the solution 7UPFree, you are part of the problem.

ziedth

7upfree wrote: »

Without the spin Sully? That post has answered questions that have been asked. Where is the problem with it? Without wearing your FG hat.......:)

You have been warned countless times to cut that **** out, I'm going to be as clear as I can be. Your getting a one week ban however if you continue with this craic on your return it'll be a month off and after that it's permanent.

Roanmore

7upfree wrote: »

I would imagine all four would have been done simultaneously? If so, why not?

So Waterford gets evaluated before the other 3 cities and you complain? Did you or Max Powers read the link in the OP?
You and Max Powers have not addressed the question I asked earlier about why Waterford is so expensive, instead you decided to move the debate on to the Waterford TD's who (and I and not defending them in the slightest) have no influence on this decision.
Seriously lads, if you are going to start a "everybody is against Waterford" rant please make sure it is legit because otherwise you sound delusional and pathetic.
There are a lot of other issues where Waterford are getting a raw deal but when you highlight this issue as one you are making yourselves out to be a bunch of whingers especially when the reason for the scheme not going ahead is laid out so clearly in the link posted in the OP (and the poster who started the OP twice in this thread ignores what it says and posts his own review of it "full steam ahead for Cork, Limerick and Galway as you would (unfortunately) come to expect these days" and "The bike thing is not a massive issue but its just another kick when we are down i suppose. no sense of entitlement, Waterford was recommended for the bike scheme and the suddenly we are off it. Its rolled out to all the other cities". )

Imagine if they turn around and say it's going ahead in any of those cities but it's too costly to pay for itself so the taxpayers are going to stump up money everybody here would justifiably be up in arms complaining about the cost.

O Riain

How is the cost in Waterford too high and also how is that Galway with a significantly smaller population than limerick(to the tune of 20,000 less) gets more bikes? 200-250 bikes when cork gets 300? Seriously lads cork is around 5 times the size of Galway and it only gets between 50-100 bikes more?

wellboytoo

Looks to me like the numbers just didn't add up which also explains why there are more bikes in Galway than Cork, tourist numbers simples.
For only the second time only I agree with Sully fight the real battles guys this is not one of them

CatFromHue

O Riain wrote: »

How is the cost in Waterford too high and also how is that Galway with a significantly smaller population than limerick(to the tune of 20,000 less) gets more bikes? 200-250 bikes when cork gets 300? Seriously lads cork is around 5 times the size of Galway and it only gets between 50-100 bikes more?

I'm only new to Waterford but I'd guess that Galway gets alot more tourists than Waterford. Any time I've been down there you would easily spot a few tourists.

I hadn't really been to Waterford before I started working here but now that I'm here I'm surprised it was even considered for the Bike Scheme, I just don't see it as being big enough for it.

Sully

wellboytoo wrote: »

For only the second time only I agree with Sully fight the real battles guys this is not one of them

I'm taking a screengrab of this. :pac: :P

fuzzy dunlop

Wanderer2010 wrote: »

The other cities have more multi national companies setting up and investing there, creating a lot of employment. The other cities have a much higher population that Waterford. The other cities have the need for this scheme and the money behind it. Do you really lay all the blame on the militant reputation of Waterford at the seat of our three TDs. They dont even have a voice or any power in the Dail whatsoever. I know it they know it and the dogs on the street know it. Stop blaming them for every little thing that goes wrong in Waterford.

All nonsense of course. Galway has to be one of the most unfriendly cities for cycling in Europe without a doubt.Limerick is hardly better. The urban sprawl there is riduculous and a national shame. Its population is also not that much greater than Waterford. Its amazing that a population difference between Limerick and Galway of over 20000 and Galway is automatically still in the game. Yet a smaller drop between Galway and Waterford and Waterford is excluded. Yet realistically there is hardly any difference at all, But the real issue here is that Waterford is more suited to this than any of the others because it is reasonably compact.The workforce in the three other cities is predominanty outside the commuter range of using bicycles. And Waterford doesn't have a miliitant reputation that stands up to scrutiny especially not compared to Galway, Limerick and Cork. But I agree with you about one thing our politicians have no voice or power. Which is the perfect reason to dispose of them.

Max Powers

Roanmore wrote: »

So Waterford gets evaluated before the other 3 cities and you complain? Did you or Max Powers read the link in the OP?
You and Max Powers have not addressed the question I asked earlier about why Waterford is so expensive, instead you decided to move the debate on to the Waterford TD's who (and I and not defending them in the slightest) have no influence on this decision.
Seriously lads, if you are going to start a "everybody is against Waterford" rant please make sure it is legit because otherwise you sound delusional and pathetic.
There are a lot of other issues where Waterford are getting a raw deal but when you highlight this issue as one you are making yourselves out to be a bunch of whingers especially when the reason for the scheme not going ahead is laid out so clearly in the link posted in the OP (and the poster who started the OP twice in this thread ignores what it says and posts his own review of it "full steam ahead for Cork, Limerick and Galway as you would (unfortunately) come to expect these days" and "The bike thing is not a massive issue but its just another kick when we are down i suppose. no sense of entitlement, Waterford was recommended for the bike scheme and the suddenly we are off it. Its rolled out to all the other cities". )

Imagine if they turn around and say it's going ahead in any of those cities but it's too costly to pay for itself so the taxpayers are going to stump up money everybody here would justifiably be up in arms complaining about the cost.

As the original poster, this has really blown up over the weekend. Look lads, i think i said in my original post its not a massive deal, we would all prefer 20 jobs instead of any bikes, it just seems like another kick when you we are down, if we were never on the list, it wouldnt be as bad but on it, the off it for what seems like made up finanical reasons, seems a bit dodgy is all. I dont think its worth contacting my TD about, lack of jobs, investment etc is worth contacting your TD about, I should think we all agree on that. Just to clarify also, i dont think there is any sense of entitlement around here, a lot of anger
is around though.

Trotter

The anger is not necessarily that we weren't included in the scheme. It's more that its yet another thing that fits into the valid perception that no matter what, Waterford just can't get a break. While its not something I'm overly devastated by considering my belief that a huge amount of Waterford people want cyclists off the road either way, it is another example of a step forward that others are taking that we aren't.

While this isn't a significant step to miss, when taken in the same glance as the general apparent policy of running Waterford into the floor, it does add to the frustration.