Management Company for apartments - FARCE!

Bowlardo

Have a meeting with the Management Company / committee tonight. The fees were €600 last year and now they are claiming they should go up this year. I am a bit confused.There are 8 apartment in our complex. The Management Company don’t provide bins. They hall ways are tiny and I don’t believe the clean them or if they do very rarely. So all I am paying for is insurance really oh and the cut the grass in the back garden about 8/10times a year. Live outside Dublin so consider this a bit of a farce really.

Could anyone with dealing of management companies for apartment let me know of their experience and what are there actual role other than taking money off me?

djimi

If you are leaseholder then you are a member of the management company. Ask them for a breakdown of costs and see where they came to a figure of €600 (which doesnt sound all that expensive tbh; not by the standards of a lot of places I have heard of which are approaching €1000 a year or more).

Paulw

If you own your unit, then you are part of that management company. You are a member.

Each year you should be getting detailed accounts showing where the money is spent.

You have a vote. You can vote for or against spending on any item on the list. Your directors must propose a budget for the coming year, which must be voted on by members of the management company.

D3PO

they don't pluck random figures out of thin air. Fees are based on budgets.

Before you go off on a rant moaning about the fees read the accounts, look at the budgets , turn up to the agm and actually have a clue about what is and isn't needed and propose solution's to reduce costs if that's what the case is.

Bowlardo

djimi wrote: »

If you are leaseholder then you are a member of the management company. Ask them for a breakdown of costs and see where they came to a figure of €600 (which doesnt sound all that expensive tbh; not by the standards of a lot of places I have heard of which are approaching €1000 a year or more).

The apartment are 20 years old. are worth well under 100,000 and as mention previously are not in dublin. no bins provided so thought it 600 is ok but anymore than that is a bit rich

Paulw wrote: »

If you own your unit, then you are part of that management company. You are a member.

Each year you should be getting detailed accounts showing where the money is spent.

You have a vote. You can vote for or against spending on any item on the list. Your directors must propose a budget for the coming year, which must be voted on by members of the management company.

Yes I own the apartment. I was not sure what the meeting was all about last year. In fairness they did give detailed accounts on it last year and they seemed sound in fairness.

good to know I can quiz them on all the expenditure. I do recall accounting bills, insurance where making up a large amount of the bills towards the unit

Lantus

Assuming this is a managment company in the normal sense then what is the meeting tonight? Is it an AGM?? If it is then 21 days prior to this meeting you should of received last years accounts and a full projected budget of the year ahead which will need to be voted on and approved by majority vote at the AGM. The fact that you dont seem to know what proportion is insurance or landscaping would seem to indicate that you either have not received or not yet read the documentation.

These requirements are statutory requirements and form part of the Multi Unit Development Act which came into force 2011. Worth reading and its free online. Also you you should get the ODCE handbook on management companies and read that because its a gold mine of info.

Paulw

Bowlardo wrote: »

good to know I can quiz them on all the expenditure. I do recall accounting bills, insurance where making up a large amount of the bills towards the unit

In fairness, insurance costs are a bit crazy for apartments. Not much can be done about it though. I would guess your insurance is almost half of your management fee.

djimi

Bowlardo wrote: »

The apartment are 20 years old. are worth well under 100,000 and as mention previously are not in dublin. no bins provided so thought it 600 is ok but anymore than that is a bit rich

The figure is not being pulled out of thin air. If there is an increase in fees then you need to find out why, and what has been done to ensure that any increase in costs has been minimized.

ted1

8*600 =4800.

That covers insurance, gardening, cleaning of common areas and sinking fund.

To be honest it doesn't seem to bad. if there is no bins provided where do you put your rubbish?

NinjaTruncs

Is there a lift.

Also since there are only 8 apartments you dontget very good economies of scale. Especially when it comes to the management agent fee or landscaping.

P. Breathnach

It's likely that at some time in the future major work will be required to maintain the building - things like roof repairs, new windows, servicing drains, resurfacing paths and car parking spaces.

A management company should be building up a fund for such work rather than hitting the residents with a big bill when some major work needs to be done.

With only 8 apartments at €600 a year each, I'd be worried that the charge is far too low to build up a proper sinking fund.

Citycap

There are too many apartment owners who are completely ignorant of how their apartment complex is run. Each owner is a shareholder of the management company. There is plenty of information available for those who are interested. If the management company is being run properly the financial accounts on which the annual charge is decided on by THE OWNERS at the A.G.M. should be available to all. Under the MUD Act it is the owners who decided the annual management charge at the A.G.M.

If this is not happening it is because the company is not being run in accordance with the law. This usually occurs when owners are ignorant of the law or don't give a damm. A quick check with the Companies Office will find out who the Directors are and if annual accounts are being lodged. If they are not people would want to get interested very quickly before the Company is struck off

Ray Palmer

I'd be really worried about the sinking fund if I was you. I was dealing with a property that was grossly underfunded so it cost us a lot. Each resident had to pay 7k on top of the annual charge which had to go up dramatically to deal with the lack of fund over 20 years.

Bowlardo

ted1 wrote: »

8*600 =4800.
That covers insurance, gardening, cleaning of common areas and sinking fund.
To be honest it doesn't seem to bad. if there is no bins provided where do you put your rubbish?

I pay for my own wheelie bins

NinjaTruncs wrote: »

Is there a lift.
Also since there are only 8 apartments you dontget very good economies of scale. Especially when it comes to the management agent fee or landscaping.

No lift. The garden is 20 ffet by 30 feet

P. Breathnach wrote: »

It's likely that at some time in the future major work will be required to maintain the building - things like roof repairs, new windows, servicing drains, resurfacing paths and car parking spaces.
.

I presume new windows would be for communial windows? there is hardly any in the(small) halls so can't see that being an issue. There are no paths around it just a car park. car park space are already decent. not much to be done with the place. they keep in good nic now that I think of it

Citycap wrote: »

There are too many apartment owners who are completely ignorant of how their apartment complex is run. Each owner is a shareholder of the management company. There is plenty of information available for those who are interested. If the management company is being run properly the financial accounts on which the annual charge is decided on by THE OWNERS at the A.G.M.

Thanks Citycap for you enlightening response. So we are all part of the one big apartment family. it warms my cockles it does

StillWaters

Bowlardo wrote: »

I presume new windows would be for communial windows? there is hardly any in the(small) halls so can't see that being an issue.

No, all windows, including the ones in your apartment.

the_syco

Has there been any flooding in your area? And no, I don't care if it has affected your apartments or not.

Citycap

Bowlardo wrote: »

I pay for my own wheelie bins


No lift. The garden is 20 ffet by 30 feet

I presume new windows would be for communial windows? there is hardly any in the(small) halls so can't see that being an issue. There are no paths around it just a car park. car park space are already decent. not much to be done with the place. they keep in good nic now that I think of it


Thanks Citycap for you enlightening response. So we are all part of the one big apartment family. it warms my cockles it does

I don't know what you are getting at but each apartment complex is supposed to be run as a limited company and registered as such. It must comply with the provisions of the Companies Acts and with the Multi Unit Development Act. Because we did not have a history of apartment living in this country many people bought in ignorance and were hoodwinked by our builder friends. They were not aware of annual budgets, sinking funds, annual management charges, election of directors. The best run apartment companies are the ones where the owners i.e shareholders take an active part and ensure that there either is a good managing agent in place or alternatively the residents take it on board and run it themselves. I am a member of a management committee of a complex with 55 apartments in Dublin. We run the complex on a voluntary basis with a small committee getting expenses to cover attendance at meetings etc. Because we have taken an interest we have managed to have excellent cleaners, landscapers and a general freelance handyman who have worked with us for years.
But with the bigger complexes unless there is a very active owners committee keeping an eye on the managing agent you will be ripped off

the_syco

Citycap wrote: »

But with the bigger complexes unless there is a very active owners committee keeping an eye on the managing agent you will be ripped off

OP; on this note, check if any current projects were done by friends of management at a higher rate than usual.

The_Conductor

OP- the biggest single item in your expenditure is insurance. Its also most probably the fastest rising cost you have. You can't really leverage insurance companies against one another- as the complex is so small- companies just aren't going to be interested in it at a reasonable cost.

As alluded to above- there is also the issue of the sink fund. The MUD bill specifies what should be considered minimum sink fund contributions per unit (you can always ignore this- but it has to be voted on at the AGM).

Bins- lots of places don't include them- being in or out of Dublin means absolutely nothing.

You're really arguing in the dark here- you need to get a copy of your lease, alongside the last few years annual accounts of the Management Company- find out what your obligations and responsibilities are- and what those of the Management Company are- and how these are being met in the day-to-day running of the complex.