Limerick 2030 Economic Plan

MrLaurel

This was launched this morning and if it goes ahead, IF, it could transform the City centre to the way it should have been 10 years ago

From RTE website -
Limerick 2030 is aimed at transforming the city over the next two decades.
Under the plan, the Arthurs Quay Park area is to redeveloped, and the city's tax office at Sarsfield House is to be demolished to make way for a new city centre plaza, all linking with the River Shannon waterfront.
The aim of the plan is to reposition Limerick city centre as the main shopping area of the region and to create a vibrant location to attract knowledge-based jobs.
There are also plans for an innovation centre for start-up businesses and third level education.


Full Report here

http://www.limerickcity.ie/Planning/EconomicDevelopment/Limerick2030AnEconomicandSpatialPlanforLimerick/

Required Field

I had a quick read of the plan there... it's certainly quite aspirational and ambitious, but it's a bit vague on how to actually go about achieving the lofty aims. Hopefully something comes of it soon and we see a bit of action. Given the public ownership of the Opera site, there's no reason why they can't start the ball rolling over there.

And at least it recognises the fact that we need a mixture of culture, retail, enterprise and city-living to rejuvinate the place, rather than "everything will be fixed if we can just get an M&S!!!!".

Beaver1

this will go the same way as the regeneration, a pr stunt

bigpink

Do some basics right 1st in Limerick

Rightwing

Beaver1 wrote: »

this will go the same way as the regeneration, a pr stunt

Regeneration was anything but a stunt - it was a complete nightmare.

kilburn

Rays of sunshine come out as always

bazz26

Another Opera Centre site in the making, no doubt.

riverrocked

I read in the Irish Times that it is hoped to bring 5,000 jobs and my first thought was that 5,000 jobs over the course of 20 years is not that impressive for a city with higher unemployment rates than there were in the Great Depression in America.

kilburn

Thats 5000 jobs in the actual city centre, i dont ever recall that many jobs in office blocks and educational facilities in the city center in my lifetime

rainbowdash

Talk is cheap, its not the first place to come up with a big grand plan.

I remember watching reeling in the years and some long dead minister promising Luas or metro for Ballymun, and they are still waiting.

Ballymun just being a random example, Ennis, information age town, anyone remember that one?

Rightwing

rainbowdash wrote: »

Talk is cheap, its not the first place to come up with a big grand plan.

I remember watching reeling in the years and some long dead minister promising Luas or metro for Ballymun, and they are still waiting.

Ballymun just being a random example, Ennis, information age town, anyone remember that one?

Ya, that was the previous government, the worst in history for this region. They also had these 'gateways'. Muppets of the highest order.

pigtown

So they shouldn't have bothered?

aindriu80

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/once-in-a-generationopportunity-for-limerick-234184.html
http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/250m-plan-unveiled-to-transform-city-centre-29346281.html
http://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/limerick-set-for-transformation-with-250m-plan-1.1429589

As far as I can make out there are whole parts of Limerick are in effect derelict, so they are in effect starting from scratch. They are hardly going to come up with Haussmann Limerick but they should look at putting in at least one wide boulevard.

sleepyman

If they could get the likes of Northern Trust into the city from Plassey it would be a good start.Having 200 people having their lunch in town or going for a few drinks after work would help.I do like the look of the square where Dunnes Stores currently is.Where will the money come from though?They mention the EIB.It looks like the plan has drawn on alot of what's been mentioned here before

Mc Love

I've seen Northern Trust are opening new operations out near B&Q where that shop is in that empty building. Sign up on the side of the building

fl4pj4ck

^^ seen it the other day, and remembering someone mentioned Plassey I wondered if they are to open in another location

sleepyman

I can imagine the upgrading of O'Connell St & the plaza around the station happening.We could be still taking about the square that was meant to be bulit in Arthurs Quay/Dunnes Stores in 10 years time.I hope I'm wrong but we have heard about these nice fancy plans before.

pigtown

According to the Leader, the new courthouse will be built on Mulgrave Street beginning next year. The existing one in the city hall complex will then be refurbished for use by the council, leading to the redevelopment of the Potato Market.

vkid

pigtown wrote: »

According to the Leader, the new courthouse will be built on Mulgrave Street beginning next year. The existing one in the city hall complex will then be refurbished for use by the council, leading to the redevelopment of the Potato Market.

That plan has also been going around for years. The court is to go in that yard across from the Fire Station. Closer to the jail also. Was mooted 2006/2007 if i remember rightly. Check the archiseek forum for more info. Hope it happens but I;m not holding my breath.

sleepyman

Looking at the renders I wonder will they have to demolish the tourist office to accomodate the square?

bigpink

Hopefully its an awful tourist office

johnmolloy554

bigpink wrote: »

Hopefully its an awful tourist office

<Snip>


Mod Post: Comments about the spelling or punctuation used by other posters will be taken as, but not limited to, back seat moderation, baiting, bullying, or being a wannabe grammer/punctuation nazi.

I don't care who does it, or who the intended target is. The outcome from here in will be a yellow card. This can be considered an announcement for the forum as a whole.

Itsdacraic

sleepyman wrote: »

Looking at the renders I wonder will they have to demolish the tourist office to accomodate the square?

Well they seem to planning to basically rebuild Arthurs Quay shopping center so I'd say they'd have no qualms about knocking the tourist office.

sleepyman

True-I wonder will they have to buy out Dunnes Stores?Surely they're not just going to say 'yeah grand knock that builiding' & Arthurs Quay aswell

Engine No.9

sleepyman wrote: »

True-I wonder will they have to buy out Dunnes Stores?Surely they're not just going to say 'yeah grand knock that builiding' & Arthurs Quay aswell

Nah, they'll have to buy out Dunnes. It was on the table for discussion with the Opera centre development once it became public property, that much I do know. And judging by the picture they might have to take a good chunk of the opposite side of Ellen Street, maybe even the old Roches Car Park (I don't actually know what that's serving as now???).

pigtown

So I've had a chance to look through this proposal and two things stick out
1) An analysis of traffic in the city centre.
Page 95 of this document http://www.limerickcity.ie/Planning/EconomicDevelopment/Limerick2030AnEconomicandSpatialPlanforLimerick/An%20Economic%20and%20Spatial%20Plan%20for%20Limerick_Appendices.pdf has an interesting view on how traffic should be managed in Limerick. It is difficult to explain without a streetmap in front of you but the main points appear to be a desire to reduce the amount of traffic on the quays, a rethink of the many one-way streets and the orbital route, and a reduction in the volume of traffic using the Brown Thomas end of O'Connell St.

2) The economic strategy for the city centre.
A main plank of this is the new third level campus that will be a joint venture between UL, LIT, & MIC. This is in very early stages of development and the exact nature of this venture has yet to be decided. A site in the Opera site has been earmarked however the point is made more than once that the redevelopment of this site is a priority and if the new third level campus is not agreed upon soon enough then an alternative site is suggested, 'east of the Opera site'.

A €50 million seed fund for new start up companies in the mid-west.

Possibly the most exciting initiative is the Limerick Technology & Innovation Hub. This would be a high profile 3-5,000sqm space, co-located with the new Economic Development and Planning Directorate of Limerick City and County Council with outreach links to UL & LIT. It would offer high quality, flexible business space with shared services, common networking and ‘interaction space’ for knowledge firms. It would also contain training areas, conference facilities and exhibition space.
It would essentially be a smaller version of Silicon Docks in Dublin, where the sheer number of like minded professionals allows for major innovation and entrepreneurship.

The more I read of this proposal the more impressed I am. They appear to have thought of everything (bar public transport improvements but you can't have it all I suppose).

Itsdacraic

pigtown wrote: »

Possibly the most exciting initiative is the Limerick Technology & Innovation Hub. This would be a high profile 3-5,000sqm space, co-located with the new Economic Development and Planning Directorate of Limerick City and County Council with outreach links to UL & LIT. It would offer high quality, flexible business space with shared services, common networking and ‘interaction space’ for knowledge firms. It would also contain training areas, conference facilities and exhibition space.
It would essentially be a smaller version of Silicon Docks in Dublin, where the sheer number of like minded professionals allows for major innovation and entrepreneurship.

The more I read of this proposal the more impressed I am. They appear to have thought of everything (bar public transport improvements but you can't have it all I suppose).

Similar initiatives to this in both Cork and Galway have failed miserably. The center in Galway cost 45m to build and is basically empty. The one in Cork has 50% occupancy but very few of the companies are actually tech related and are just in there cause they will pay rent.

Kess73

Itsdacraic wrote: »

Similar initiatives to this in both Cork and Galway have failed miserably. The center in Galway cost 45m to build and is basically empty. The one in Cork has 50% occupancy but very few of the companies are actually tech related and are just in there cause they will pay rent.

Had the very same thing come to mind. A lot of what has been announced looks like it has been inspired by the Cork initiative in particular, and that was hardly a massive success in a city that was starting from a higher point than Limerick will be.


Also some of the seed funds look very low, and will be worth even less in ten years and more.

The €50m seed fund for new start up companies is not that big a figure when one looks at the timeframe it is to be spread over, and also at how much €50m would get you right now in sustainable new businesses let alone what it would get in the future.


I really like some aspects of the plan and I commend any attempt to improve an ailing city, but I cannot help but think that how low a starting point the city has in some respects has been glossed over, rather than looking at the low starting points, seeing them for what they are and then planning from those points.


Said it in other threads but what would have been a great example for Limerick is what happened in Liverpool with the Liverpool One project. That was a huge mix of retail, residential, commercial, and tech growth, coupled with green areas etc.

Liverpool and Limerick have a hell of a lot of similarities and as someone who currently lives in both and has grown up in both, I tend to see those similarities very easily. Limerick in 2013 actually reminds me a lot of Liverpool in the late 80's/early 90's.

Unemployment rates far higher than the national average, business closure rates that were above national average, retail closure rates that were amongst the highest for any city in the country, a poor public image, mocked in the media on a regular basis, residential city living on the decline, sprawling estates within minutes of the city centre (many with poor reps) etc etc.

Other similarities would be a top class university, big sporting reputation, similar them and us attitude towards the rest of the country, prone to slagging off their own city but just as prone to defending it against outsiders.

Even things like having potential catchment areas nearby is a similarity.

With the Liverpool One project, Liverpool managed to meet a lot of those problems head on, and it made a massive difference to the city in pretty much all the ways I see people on here suggest things for Limerick.

The Liverpool One project is not perfect by any means, but I do think it's template could be adapted for a city like Limerick, and I do firmly belive that a Limerick One project could have justas big an impact on Limerick

Engine No.9

Kess73 wrote: »

Had the very same thing come to mind. A lot of what has been announced looks like it has been inspired by the Cork initiative in particular, and that was hardly a massive success in a city that was starting from a higher point than Limerick will be.


Also some of the seed funds look very low, and will be worth even less in ten years and more.

The €50m seed fund for new start up companies is not that big a figure when one looks at the timeframe it is to be spread over, and also at how much €50m would get you right now in sustainable new businesses let alone what it would get in the future.


I really like some aspects of the plan and I commend any attempt to improve an ailing city, but I cannot help but think that how low a starting point the city has in some respects has been glossed over, rather than looking at the low starting points, seeing them for what they are and then planning from those points.


Said it in other threads but what would have been a great example for Limerick is what happened in Liverpool with the Liverpool One project. That was a huge mix of retail, residential, commercial, and tech growth, coupled with green areas etc.

Liverpool and Limerick have a hell of a lot of similarities and as someone who currently lives in both and has grown up in both, I tend to see those similarities very easily. Limerick in 2013 actually reminds me a lot of Liverpool in the late 80's/early 90's.

Unemployment rates far higher than the national average, business closure rates that were above national average, retail closure rates that were amongst the highest for any city in the country, a poor public image, mocked in the media on a regular basis, residential city living on the decline, sprawling estates within minutes of the city centre (many with poor reps) etc etc.

Other similarities would be a top class university, big sporting reputation, similar them and us attitude towards the rest of the country, prone to slagging off their own city but just as prone to defending it against outsiders.

Even things like having potential catchment areas nearby is a similarity.

With the Liverpool One project, Liverpool managed to meet a lot of those problems head on, and it made a massive difference to the city in pretty much all the ways I see people on here suggest things for Limerick.

The Liverpool One project is not perfect by any means, but I do think it's template could be adapted for a city like Limerick, and I do firmly belive that a Limerick One project could have justas big an impact on Limerick

Somebody get this post to the city planners...ASAP

seachto7

Half of those gob****es wouldn't be able to point out Liverpool on a map.

pigtown

Itsdacraic wrote: »

Similar initiatives to this in both Cork and Galway have failed miserably. The center in Galway cost 45m to build and is basically empty. The one in Cork has 50% occupancy but very few of the companies are actually tech related and are just in there cause they will pay rent.

I don't know a whole lot about those two buildings but I do know the Limerick proposal is different in that it will be co-located with the Economic Development and Planning Directorate of Limerick City and County Council, an outreach/commercialization link with UL/LIT, the new Single Business Portal (reformed Local Enterprise Boards), and the SVC (Seed & Venture Capital) office. It will deal both with start ups and businesses that have outgrown the Hartnett (LIT) and Nexus (UL) incubation centres. It is also hoped to locate the new LSAD fashion incubator on site. Its focus would be broad; ICT, Digital Media, Telecoms, Medi-Tech, Tourism and also Technical and Professional Services.

Kess73 wrote: »

Had the very same thing come to mind. A lot of what has been announced looks like it has been inspired by the Cork initiative in particular, and that was hardly a massive success in a city that was starting from a higher point than Limerick will be.

Do you think they shouldn't try?

Kess73 wrote: »

Also some of the seed funds look very low, and will be worth even less in ten years and more.

The €50m seed fund for new start up companies is not that big a figure when one looks at the timeframe it is to be spread over, and also at how much €50m would get you right now in sustainable new businesses let alone what it would get in the future.

€50 million over 5 years seems like alot to me. That would fund a heck of a lot of new business. It is advised that this fund be actively promoted from the Innovation Hub itself.

Kess73 wrote: »

Said it in other threads but what would have been a great example for Limerick is what happened in Liverpool with the Liverpool One project. That was a huge mix of retail, residential, commercial, and tech growth, coupled with green areas etc.

Liverpool and Limerick have a hell of a lot of similarities and as someone who currently lives in both and has grown up in both, I tend to see those similarities very easily. Limerick in 2013 actually reminds me a lot of Liverpool in the late 80's/early 90's.

Unemployment rates far higher than the national average, business closure rates that were above national average, retail closure rates that were amongst the highest for any city in the country, a poor public image, mocked in the media on a regular basis, residential city living on the decline, sprawling estates within minutes of the city centre (many with poor reps) etc etc.

Other similarities would be a top class university, big sporting reputation, similar them and us attitude towards the rest of the country, prone to slagging off their own city but just as prone to defending it against outsiders.

Even things like having potential catchment areas nearby is a similarity.

With the Liverpool One project, Liverpool managed to meet a lot of those problems head on, and it made a massive difference to the city in pretty much all the ways I see people on here suggest things for Limerick.

The Liverpool One project is not perfect by any means, but I do think it's template could be adapted for a city like Limerick, and I do firmly belive that a Limerick One project could have justas big an impact on Limerick

The Liverpool One project certainly is a great success and I hope to one day get to visit it but I fear you are not comparing like with like. Liverpool city region has a population of 1.5 million. Being generous, the Limerick city region including Ennis (20,000), Limerick (100,000), Shannon (10,000) and Nenagh (10,000), has a population of 150,000, 10 times smaller.

Liverpool One has a total floor area of 170,000sqm. Proportionally, a Limerick One project would include 17,000sqm of retail space however the proposed redevelopment of Arthurs Quay and Penneys/Debenhams, is to include almost 43,000sqm.

So while you are correct in all of your comparisons between the two cities, the sheer difference in size, and also strategic location, mean a simple comparison is not suitable. Limerick 2030 is our city's version of Liverpool One.

seachto7 wrote: »

Half of those gob****es wouldn't be able to point out Liverpool on a map.

Which gob****es? Aecom, GVA, and ThinkingPlace? The companies who drew up this report. Maybe you're right, I can't say I know much about them.