True Detective [HBO] [** Spoilers **]

dirkmeister

squonk wrote: »

Frank didn't have to get stabbed. His big mouth got him the knife. I'd rather my chances walking out of the desert in good health than with a knife wound. OK, maybe the guys would have shot him as they drove away but they were getting back in their vehicles. Why antagonise them further. They're scumbags. There's a good few of them. Things are precarious enough without adding fuel to the fire which isn't going to end well. Maybe it was just poor writing. The whole occurance seemed as stupid as Colin's end.

He had $3.5 million worth of diamonds in his pocket, he wasn't going to give over his suit since he had just handed them the money.

Dyr

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

Rust was stabbed in the lower stomach and then the knife was ripped upwards lifting him off his feet, even if he somehow survived this he then decides to pull out the knife which is the worst thing he could have done. Here's the scene,

https://youtu.be/1D-KijfBtZE

Anyone who thinks he could have survived that needs there head examined.

farredler took a shotgun blast of rubber pellets at zero feet and all he had to worry about was pishing himself, such is telly.

Standman

That was very hard to follow. I really hadn't a clue who that girl was who was handcuffed to the radiator, or how they found her, or why there was suddenly a hard drive that it seemed like I was meant to know about, among many other things.

Fairly disappointing overall compared to last season but was a damn good effort leaving that aside. We need more TV like this.

hairyslug

Maybe it was just me but I thought there were to many side characters, too many to follow and know exactly what was going on.

What I loved about season one was its rawness, this season, I don't know, it was just lacking something. I enjoyed it but came back every week hoping that it would get the kick it needed

jcsoulinger

I enjoyed the series and would definitely watch another series if it was made.

I definitely feel tho that they were overly ambitious in what they tried to achieve in 8 episodes had they stretched the story out over a longer period it may have worked out a lot better.

Its a real shame as tv has offered little in the way of crime drama recently and this had all the ingredients to be a real gem, Its good and well worth watching imo, just with a little more attention to detail it could have been one of the greats.

3.10 To Yuma

So if there is to be a Season 3, who are we all hoping for?

I'm predicting it to be set in a New York/New Jersey/Philadelphia type environment.

Would love to see Ed Norton in a lead role

TerrorFirmer

TerrorFirmer wrote: »

This. First of all, there's no doubt that it wasn't as good as the first season, which truly was spectacular. Was season 2 as good as the first? No. Was it a worthy successor? Indisputably debatable.

But, was it a good Tv show? Absolutely, it was. Anyone who says it was 'the worst thing I've seen all year' needs to either watch more TV or stop watching shows they conveniently label as such, yet persist to the end, because it seems absolutely farcical to me to deem this in this bracket. Sure, it wasn't perfect, or what we might have expected, but in it's own right, True Detective S2 was engrossing TV with a very good finale.

That said everyone's entitled to an opinion and just as I deem it good TV, so is it valid to deem it it the worst thing to grace screens since MTV's 'Teen mom'. But take a step back for a moment and judge it on it's own merits - is it truly terrible TV? Could you honestly stand by an opinion that deems it - it's over complicated plot, admittedly, but very solid acting - as a stain on TV?

To me, it was disappointing in innumerable ways, there's no doubt about that. But at the end of the day, relatively speaking, it's still up there with the best that TV is offering at present. That finale to me was actually the high-point of the whole affair.

As a season, I'd give it a solid 7/10. Fantastic acting, great cinematography, a satisfying conclusion and honesty, to me, it tried it's best to live up to impossible hype.

Good TV, Farrell was incredible, and well worth a way to anyone on the fence. It's well worth a watch, plain and simple, in my opinion.

I wouldn't give this a rating as high as 7/10, and I wouldn't usually watch a show as bad as 7/10. I'm very selective (and a bit of a snob) when it comes to choosing TV shows. So it is definitely the worst TV show I've seen all year.

jcsoulinger

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I wouldn't give this a rating as high as 7/10, and I wouldn't usually watch a show as bad as 7/10. I'm very selective (and a bit of a snob) when it comes to choosing TV shows. So it is definitely the worst TV show I've seen all year.

Just out of curiosity what have you watched that's better this year?

Its confusing you don't watch shows you rate less than a 7/10 yet you managed to watch all of this even tho its the worst TV you have seen all year.

jcsoulinger

jcsoulinger wrote: »

Just out of curiosity what have you watched that's better this year?

Its confusing you don't watch shows you rate less than a 7/10 yet you managed to watch all of this even tho its the worst TV you have seen all year.

I watched it because I'm in the precarious position where this TV show shares the same name of one of favourite TV shows of all time. I would usually give up after a few episodes, which I should have done around episode 3.

I finished The Wire and have started The Shield recently. The new season of Game of Thrones was the worst its been but was still miles ahead of this. I watched 3 episodes of Daredevil before dropping it. I'd say Daredevil is probably better than this, but I just can't stand superhero nonsense.

errlloyd

I really enjoyed TD:2. I also think the lessons of TD:2 will make the third season a lot better.

K-9

Just finished The Wire and starting Boardwalk Empire so I'm a bit spoilt.

Still, Season 1 left me wanting more, this one I'd be happy if they just left it at that. The finale was fine but the whole thing was probably 3 or 4 episodes too long for me, lots of needless filler stuff that was superfluous in the end.

The hook is what big stars they'll get in so I'll give any new series a go though!

Adamocovic

Mentioned before but surely the loss of Cary Fukyunaga was a HUGE reason people didn't rate it as highly as season 1.

The guy directed every episode in the first season. This year they used 6 different directors. I think what made the first season so good was the one director for all (a great one at that) so it felt more like a movie split into parts.

It was one director using his style, his idea of what the characters are thinking and his level of expectations in terms of what he wanted them to act like. With 6 different directors presumably having different opinions and style being used it turned into the normal tv format in my view. Still a good attempt and good season but was never going to have the same feel as the first due to this in my eyes.

Adamocovic

K-9 wrote: »

Just finished The Wire and starting Boardwalk Empire so I'm a bit spoilt.

Still, Season 1 left me wanting more, this one I'd be happy if they just left it at that. The finale was fine but the whole thing was probably 3 or 4 episodes too long for me, lots of needless filler stuff that was superfluous in the end.

The hook is what big stars they'll get in so I'll give any new series a go though!

I'd suggest Mr.Robot if you're looking for a new show. Mightn't be your cup of tea but so far I'm loving it and it's getting good reception. Renewed already and season 1 is still going.

Shred

InTheTrees wrote: »

So did colin farells character have a death wish?

I just dont get why he decided to lead the bad guys off into the wilderness. He could have lost them easily in the city.

Several reasons as I see it:

He realised he was screwed and didn't want to lead them to Bezzerides, plus he also wanted to give her enough time to get out. He was then also trying to make one final recording for his son and once he realised it wasn't going to upload just said screw it, he's not getting out of this (with a short range weapon against multiple bad guys, he really should have grabbed one of the rifles from one of the ones he did kill) and may as well go out in a blaze of glory.

Overall it certainly wasn't perfect and I did find it hard to keep up with it over the 8 episodes at times. But I did enjoy it and I actually preferred it to the first season as it had been ridiculously hyped up by a few people I know before I started watching, which probably ruined it for me.

Galwayguy35

Was a bit disappointed with the finale, but overall the series wasn't bad.

Thought Farrell played a blinder.

don ramo

jcsoulinger wrote: »

Just out of curiosity what have you watched that's better this year?

over the summer i was watching Deutchsland 83, Mr Robot, The Last ship, Tyrant, Ballers, Killjoys and Dark Matter, and true detective was the worse of the lot, killjoys and dark matter are here and there, but their both shows that are designed as multi-season shows,

so i dont expect as much from them as i would from true detective, which only has 8 episodes to tell it entire story, the first 4 shows i listed there just blow this outta the water, the other 3 are ok and watchable,

like ive already said i really dunno why i watched all 8 episodes of this, ive dropped about 8 or 9 shows over the last year or so, and true detective is another show ill be dropping, thats if it even comes back,

Adamocovic wrote: »

Mentioned before but surely the loss of Cary Fukyunaga was a HUGE reason people didn't rate it as highly as season 1.

The guy directed every episode in the first season. This year they used 6 different directors. I think what made the first season so good was the one director for all (a great one at that) so it felt more like a movie split into parts.

It was one director using his style, his idea of what the characters are thinking and his level of expectations in terms of what he wanted them to act like. With 6 different directors presumably having different opinions and style being used it turned into the normal tv format in my view. Still a good attempt and good season but was never going to have the same feel as the first due to this in my eyes.

thats actually a pretty unique situation, and not allowed be used as an excuse, every show on tv has multiple directors, probably 10 of more, most directors may only shoot 3 or 4 episodes of a 24 episode season, there is so much post production that needs to be done that its more or less impossible to direct every episode, game of thrones has had 18 directors so far, for 50 episodes, person of interest has had 37 for 90 episodes, and both are great shows,

they had a nice thing going for the first season, but they never planned adequately for a second season, they were asking for 2 years to make it, which was never gonna fly, just amateur stuff really, kinda embarrassing really,

a great writer and showrunner are whats essential, you look at game of thrones they have DB Weiss and David Benioff running and writing the majority of the thing, they get the right directors in to do the right episodes, but they make sure the directors know what they want, the director get a bit a freedom here and there, but the story needs to feel the same from one episode to the next,

RDM_83 again

This season was such a waste, its not the worst show out there by a very long stretch but it could have been good.
Its pointless making comparisons to a lot of other shows because this is a very big budget HBO show, you don't Man United had a good game when they do better than a broke 1st division team, its about what you do with the resources at your disposal.
Ruined by a plot that managed to be both predictable and confusing at the same time and Fair City level dialogue, occasionally it shone but it never stuck.
Won't bother with season 3 unless it gets good reviews.

Amazingfun

Absolutely loved this season...and the finale was brilliant. Broke my heart...but brilliant.

If the show gets a few Emmy noms I hope Vince Vaughn is in the running, some of his finest work ever as "Frank".

Can't wait to see what they cook up for Season 3!

A Primal Nut

Thought it was poor overall. The case itself was a run-of-the-mill murder case with nothing particularly interesting. The reveals were unexciting and underwhelming, left it impossible to care. All the big moments and reveals involved bit part characters who we knew nothing about. The finale was decent, if the first seven episodes were better it probably would have been more dramatic.

Also, why was Ray still on the case if he left the police? I know he still had an interest because he worked for Frank, but this was more than that...he was working directly with Ani and Paul; even carrying guns alongside them as they were investigating.

Aenaes

A Primal Nut wrote: »

Also, why was Ray still on the case if he left the police? I know he still had an interest because he worked for Frank, but this was more than that...he was working directly with Ani and Paul; even carrying guns alongside them as they were investigating.

Davis (the black State Attorney that Ray found dead in her car) hired the three of them as an independent investigation ostensibly as a missing persons task force trying to find Irina Rulfo but really to find evidence of collusion between Vinci officals and Attorney General Geldof. Ray had a private investigator's licence since he was working for Frank.

Ray was reluctant to join the investigation until Davis promised him the State Attorney's office would lend their support to his custody case.

Tipsy McSwagger

Amazingfun wrote: »

Absolutely loved this season...and the finale was brilliant. Broke my heart...but brilliant.

If the show gets a few Emmy noms I hope Vince Vaughn is in the running, some of his finest work ever as "Frank".

Can't wait to see what they cook up for Season 3!

There's more chance of Bill Cosby getting a lifetime achievement award than this show winning anything.

Dyr

Tipsy McSwagger wrote: »

There's more chance of Bill Cosby getting a lifetime achievement award than this show winning anything.

In fairness this season managed to put more people to sleep than even bill cosby

hof1982

The overwhelming feeling has to be one of frustration for me. The series could have been so much better. Ultimately they tried to cram too much in without enough key character development and so it was hard to feel invested in any of the characters, Farrell's aside.

I thought the finale was good and we finally saw VV's capability, maybe helped by the fact there was less of the painfully irrelevant conversations with the wife.

Adamocovic

don ramo wrote: »

thats actually a pretty unique situation, and not allowed be used as an excuse, every show on tv has multiple directors, probably 10 of more, most directors may only shoot 3 or 4 episodes of a 24 episode season, there is so much post production that needs to be done that its more or less impossible to direct every episode, game of thrones has had 18 directors so far, for 50 episodes, person of interest has had 37 for 90 episodes, and both are great shows,

I am aware it was unique to have one director for the entire first season, for me that is a factor that could have contributed to making the first season so big and successful. You don't have to tell me that shows use mutliple directors, I think everyone who watches TV knows. My point is for what made season 1 stand out the fact that only one director (and a great one at that) was used for every episode has to be a factor.

The second season was good on its own. It was as I said more of a TV format (with multiple directors) than the first which I said felt like a movie in the way it was made.

I don't agree with your opinion that the Emmy winning director who directed every episode of the first season creating a unique and standout show being changed to using 6 different directors is "not allowed be used as an excuse" to why this season wasn't as brilliantly done. It still was good tv but not at the level of the first.

I know it is all down to opinions but I don't see whats wrong with my opinion that using one director for the entire first season gave it a unique style and consistent flow to it that made it so popular. Not to mention how good a director he is.

delly

Adamocovic wrote: »

I'd suggest Mr.Robot if you're looking for a new show. Mightn't be your cup of tea but so far I'm loving it and it's getting good reception. Renewed already and season 1 is still going.

Just wanted to say that I'd never heard of this until you recommended it. Ep01 down and it was really good, very edgy and tense, with a great soundtrack and great lead in Malek. Looking forward to how it progresses.

don ramo

Adamocovic wrote: »

I don't agree with your opinion that the Emmy winning director who directed every episode of the first season creating a unique and standout show being changed to using 6 different directors is "not allowed be used as an excuse" to why this season wasn't as brilliantly done. It still was good tv but not at the level of the first.

yeah he did create a unique vision, and credit to him and all, but even at that it wasnt the greatest season of tv either, in 10 years times true detective season 1 isnt gonna resonate in my memory as one of the great season of tv, it doesnt now either,

and every other show out there better than it had multiple directors and yet still managed to have a consistent feel to them throughout multiple seasons, never mind standalone seasons,

now at the end of the day the directors never really came in for criticism, i blame pizzolatto, it was his show, he created it and wrote it, he took all the glory season 1 gave him, and now he can take all the criticism season will give him, even season 1 was only good for 6 episodes, the last 2 it fell off a cliff, a terrible ending to what could have been a great season of tv, but in the end it was only average with some great performances,

symbolic

Amazingfun wrote: »

If the show gets a few Emmy noms I hope Vince Vaughn is in the running, some of his finest work ever as "Frank".

Let's face it, he peaked in 96.

Halloween Jack

symbolic wrote: »

Let's face it, he peaked in 96.

Back then he was money....

Arytonblue

Been following the thread since the first season, thought I'd post my thoughts for the craic. Seems S2 was quite divisive in terms of people's impressions, and in general I found it watchable and somewhat entertaining but inevitably I came away with the view that it just disappointed in terms of the characters, story and writing. It's quite hard not to end up comparing it to S1 which I thought was fantastic. Is that unfair? Maybe, but then it is the second series of the same show with the same writer so I think it's fair game personally.

Don't know if anybody here watches him but Brad Jones (AKA The Cinema Snob) posted a review of the season. He rambles a bit but I think he hits the same points that I did when I watched it. It's not just that the story was convoluted or out of the realms of fantasy, it was that there was no clear structure as to who was doing what, why and how. The so-called bad guys go from slightly sleazy and corrupt to full on Bond villain in the finale. I hate shows that spoon-feed the audience as much as the next but this was the other extreme end of the spectrum. Far too many characters with seemingly important roles come and go by quickly with little explanation as to their goals or motivations, with crucial information often flying by with little time to fully take it in far too often.(That might just be me though)

Season 1's story was from the beginning a detective story about a girl's brutal murder with a ritualistic nature. The story evolved from there gradually and was well paced as Rust and Marty uncover widespread corruption, collusion between local government, churches and generally unsettling characters. We see almost everything through their perspective and come to understand the effect of these revelations, piece by piece, on them and the overall plot. S2 begins with a murder but by almost a 1/3 in it's been completely lost in the endless subplots and backstories with diamonds, railway corridors, real estate deals, casino takeovers and Vince Vaughn's strangely hairless eyebrows. I also felt that S2's setting had nowhere near the effect of what deep Louisiana had on S1 in setting a dark, sinister atmosphere with an incredible sense of dread. Endless highway shots simply don't do this.

I felt that Farrell and Mcadams had some decent on-screen chemistry(despite some clunky dialogue) and they were by far the best characters who should have been our lead detectives. Kitsch is a fine actor but his character was almost pointless and his whole gay but not gay subplot just felt like a cheap trope. Vaughn's character simply did not belong in a True Detective show, at least not as a main character. He and his incredibly annoying wife had the exact same scene/conversation about a thousand times throughout the season, completely tedious stuff. That sequence with Bezzerides and Woodrough discovering the shack in the forest had great tension and atmosphere and gave me some flashbacks to S1, and yet we're constantly cut back to Vinnie and wifey staring menacingly at the floor, ruining a rare good moment. In general I thought the acting was fine, particularly from Farrell and McAdams.

Not gonna get into too much detail but I also didn't understand why the story of Bezzerides being molested/abused as a child was suddenly brought up so late in the season? Was it hinted at previously? This seemingly crucial event has shaped her character and it's just thrown in at the end and we're supposed to take it in when we've already spent so long with her in the show. I understand the whole party sequence with drugs triggered this memory but it just felt so sloppily done.

End of the day I thought it was fine, and I didn't think I cared about it enough to write all that! Sorry for the long ramble, had to get it out.

thegreengoblin

I somehow stuck with it to the end. It was just about watchable and I kept giving it as many chances as I could but it just left me with a huge sense of disappointment.

It was relentlessly grim from start to finish. Where was the hope? I wasn't after a classic happy ending but having invested over eight hours in the show it would have been nice to walk away feeling a little upbeat but all we're left is a vague notion of an expose of some sorts. There was no humour of any sort, which even the darkest shows need from time to time. The only time I laughed was at stuff that viewers were not meant to laugh at, which is never a good sign. Frank stumbling through the desert hallucinating was gas craic altogether. The same with Colin Farrell's cocaine freakout, and the Hollywood sex party. Laughable stuff.

Once I heard they were casting Vince Vaughn as the main villain I immediately lowered my expectations. So I knew I shouldn't have been so unimpressed with him but even allowing for that he was atrocious. You know. All those short lines. So many of them. Impress the viewers. Maybe. I think. :rolleyes:

Farrell was decent but his mumbling was incoherent at times. Speak up man! It's bad enough that the plot is so bloody convoluted without one of the man characters talking like he's constantly gargling his throat.

Woodrugh's character was interesting enough but having him killed off before the finale was a joke. It's like they couldn't fit him into the final hour so let's just get rid of him.

And Kelly Reilly, where to begin? Her character was useless and did barely anything so maybe I'm being harsh on her but she seems to have only one acting face: a pout.

The best scene was the shootout which was as good as anything I've ever seen. It was Heat-like in its brutality and intensity, and I thought maybe the show had redeemed itself but then it moves on to a few months later and it loses momentum.

The fact that the show needed to be explained so much says it all. I want to be able to follow a story without resorting to going online after to see wtf that was all about. Very disappointing all round.