Ever tried. Ever failed. No matter. Try again. Fail again. Fail better.

adrian522

Sunday

18 Miles @ 8:52 m/m

First proper long run of the training cycle and the legs are feeling it now. Met up with the club mates for the normal Sunday morning long run. This took us through 10 Miles including a chance meeting with Catherina McKiernan. Pace was solid for this bit and quite enjoyable.

The second half of the run was on my own. The first part of this was fine but as the miles ticked by I found it more difficult to keep within the recommended HR range. Even at slower paces the HR was up at the upper end of the range so I wasn't really able to pick up the pace at all so tried to just keep it steady.

The last mile or so was tough, no need to worry about pace as it was all about completing the miles at this stage.

Also bumped into Pacing Mule with about 3 miles to go, he was in good form and out on a 10 miler.

Glad this one is in the bank.

Total for the week:

Miles: 57

Supplementary Training:

Myrtle: 1
Darkside Core: 1
General Strength Session: 1
Hartman Routine: 1 (Maybe another tonight).

Happy with that. 16 Weeks to go.

Murph_D

Nice one A. Nice and early in the plan to be up to 18. Is this a club plan or something else?

ps Darkside Core? Sounds like a Star Wars sequel. :pac:

adrian522

It's the P&D 18 week plan. It's a week early for the 18 miler, but I wanted to get it out of the way and save the 15 Miles for the after the Beer Mile next week!

Darkside Core: http://www.beginnertriathlete.com/cms/article-detail.asp?articleid=486

Pacing Mule

Didn't realise you only had 3 to go at that point. Very fresh looking for 15 miles in !

adrian522

Ha Ha, didn't feel too fresh, last mile or so was a struggle!

adrian522

Sunday PM:

Hartman AIS routine.

Monday:

Rest + Core Routine

Tuesday

MLR - 11 Miles @ 8:21 m/m

Good run this evening, great weather, so cycled home and straight out the door. After a rest day yesterday I'd loads of energy so the miles ticked off fairly easily.

Headed up around Marlay Park. Loads of people out running, walking etc. Good vibe up around there. Picked up the pace for the last 5 miles.

13 Miles on the plan for tomorrow.

adrian522

Wednesday

13.1 Miles @ 9:02 m/m

Apart from what was posted above I did some Beer Mile training as well as a Mytle routine and an AIS session last night. Didn't feel too bad today.

Headed out today for the club mid-week run. Unfortunately the pace they are going at is a bit too slow to be useful for me. There was only 4 of us as well so couldn't really persuade anyone to pick up the pace.

Not sure, possibly have to do these alone from here on. Anyway after 7 or 8 miles I was on my own and picked it up a bit. The last few miles were a bit of a struggle, not too bad pace wise but back to back long runs has my legs complaining a small bit.

Been thinking about Dunshaughlin, is there any point to running this race? I've not done any 10K work in 3 or 4 weeks, and I'd just be interrupting marathon training for little benefit.

On the other hand some faster running may do me some good also. Decisions, Decisions.

Bungy Girl

adrian522 wrote: »

Been thinking about Dunshaughlin, is there any point to running this race? I've not done any 10K work in 3 or 4 weeks, and I'd just be interrupting marathon training for little benefit.

On the other hand some faster running may do me some good also. Decisions, Decisions.

Ah go on, if only for the cake and sangwidges after!

I would go so far as to suggest that, just maybe and perhaps, the Beer Mile could be considered more of an interruption to marathon training

adrian522

Not really, the beer mile is only really 4 x 400m at a fairly conservative pace, with 1 min between each one. Won't miss any marathon training.

For the 10K I'll have to drop my Thursday medium long run and just do a recovery. I'll have to cut the Sunday long run a bit. The week after I'll have to drop the Tuesday tempo run, hopefully be recovered by Wednesday.

On the other hand good fitness boost from the 10K race I think. I guess I'll decide on the week of the race.

Bungy Girl

adrian522 wrote: »

Not really, the beer mile is only really 4 x 400m at a fairly conservative pace, with 1 min between each one. Won't miss any marathon training.

Gosh, I'd be out with a minimum 2 day hangover

adrian522 wrote: »

For the 10K I'll have to drop my Thursday medium long run and just do a recovery. I'll have to cut the Sunday long run a bit. The week after I'll have to drop the Tuesday tempo run, hopefully be recovered by Wednesday.

Impressive juggling!

adrian522 wrote: »

On the other hand good fitness boost from the 10K race I think. I guess I'll decide on the week of the race.

You're crumbling. See you there.

adrian522

Thursday

5 Recovery Miles @ 9:30 m/m

I got these done at lunchtime as I've to go to Ikea tonight, which is something I hate doing. The sofa I bought there is falling apart so they are replacing it but I've to go and pick out a replacement. My one night of having some free time is gone.

A lot of talk on one of the other logs of a really tough session being 2 x 20 mins @ 10 Mile race pace. Won't mention my 4 miles @ tempo which is supposed to be 10 Mile to HM Pace.

Like BON I'll be running it more by feel than by pace.

Myles Splitz

adrian522 wrote: »

A lot of talk on one of the other logs of a really tough session being 2 x 20 mins @ 10 Mile race pace. Won't mention my 4 miles @ tempo which is supposed to be 10 Mile to HM Pace.

Like BON I'll be running it more by feel than by pace.

Best of luck with the session. Just remember to gradually build into the pace.

Trying to hit the ground running actually negates some of the benefit as you have to slowly build up the HR and the lactate build up, do this too quickly and it your are spiking blood lactates to the point where you are not running the session as planned.

It also means that it shouldn't start feeling uncomfortable till near the end of the first repetition.

adrian522

My Session from P&D is 9 Miles with 4 @ LT Pace, so it will be 2 miles easy, then building into the tempo pace and 2 mile cool down afterwards.

I did the same session 2 weeks ago and found it very tough. As the plan goes on the Tempo increases from 4 miles to 5, then 6 and eventually 7 Miles.

Myles Splitz

adrian522 wrote: »

My Session from P&D is 9 Miles with 4 @ LT Pace, so it will be 2 miles easy, then building into the tempo pace and 2 mile cool down afterwards.

I did the same session 2 weeks ago and found it very tough. As the plan goes on the Tempo increases from 4 miles to 5, then 6 and eventually 7 Miles.

Sorry

Misread your last post. 1st few LT sessions always tend to be the toughest but like anything once the body gets used to them the become more tolerable.

menoscemo

adrian522 wrote: »

A lot of talk on one of the other logs of a really tough session being 2 x 20 mins @ 10 Mile race pace. Won't mention my 4 miles @ tempo which is supposed to be 10 Mile to HM Pace.

Like BON I'll be running it more by feel than by pace.

It's totally different depending on the athlete.
LT pace is only 10 mile pace if you run 10 miles in approx 60 minutes (6 minute/mile) or HM pace if you are a 60 minute half marathoner!! Now 4 miles @ LT pace for that person is just 20 or 24 minutes running.

I'd guess your LT pace is closer to 7 min/mile? That would make 4 miles @ LT tougher for you than a 5/6 minute miler as you would be running 28 minutes @1 Hour pace rather than 20-24.......

I was pretty much your pace when I followed P&D first time and I ended up doing a lot of these runs just above HM pace. If I remember rightly I started out doing them at 7:20/mile and finished off doing them at closer to 7 as my fitness improved.

The plan peaks at 7 miles @ LT which when you think of it for a 7 minute miler (at 1 hour pace) is ridiculous as it's asking you to cover 49 minutes @ 1 hour pace. For me that's not a training session; it's a race!! For the likes of you or me we can't feasibly do these fixed distance sessions at our true 1 hour pace.

Just my take on it for what it's worth

Notwork Error

adrian522 wrote: »

My Session from P&D is 9 Miles with 4 @ LT Pace, so it will be 2 miles easy, then building into the tempo pace and 2 mile cool down afterwards.

I did the same session 2 weeks ago and found it very tough. As the plan goes on the Tempo increases from 4 miles to 5, then 6 and eventually 7 Miles.

7 miles at LT!:eek: That's probably 50ish minutes at one hour pace, that well over the top is a race in my opinion. I couldn't pull that session off and is why I generally don't like generic mileage based plans, everything else in the plans are perfect regards structure and such but mileage should not and cannot be the determinant of ability and sessions, they should be based on time and ability which generic plans don't take into consideration.

Edit:didn't see Meno's post

belcarra

Adrian - I'm at about your pace and I've always limited a Tempo run to 40 mins maximum (of the faster stuff).
That could be 2 x 20mins, or 1 x 40, but I'd never go above that duration.

adrian522

Myles Splitz wrote: »

Sorry

Misread your last post. 1st few LT sessions always tend to be the toughest but like anything once the body gets used to them the become more tolerable.

No worries. Yeah, hopefully they'll get a bit easier. Haven't really done much tempo stuff in a long while.

menoscemo wrote: »

It's totally different depending on the athlete.

LT pace is only 10 mile pace if you run 10 miles in approx 60 minutes (6 minute/mile) or HM pace if you are a 60 minute half marathoner!! Now 4 miles @ LT pace for that person is just 20 or 24 minutes running.

I'd guess your LT pace is closer to 7 min/mile? That would make 4 miles @ LT tougher for you than a 5/6 minute miler as you would be running 28 minutes @1 Hour pace rather than 20-24.......

I was pretty much your pace when I followed P&D first time and I ended up doing a lot of these runs just above HM pace. If I remember rightly I started out doing them at 7:20/mile and finished off doing them at closer to 7 as my fitness improved.

The plan peaks at 7 miles @ LT which when you think of it for a 7 minute miler (at 1 hour pace) is ridiculous as it's asking you to cover 49 minutes @ 1 hour pace. For me that's not a training session; it's a race!! For the likes of you or me we can't feasibly do these fixed distance sessions at our true 1 hour pace.

Just my take on it for what it's worth

Thanks N. I did pretty much at 7:20 the last time and I'd imagine this time will be pretty similar. I haven't run a half or 10 Mile in a while but I'd imagine my half/10 Mile pace to be a little faster than that, about 7:00 - 7:10 maybe.

Notwork Error wrote: »

7 miles at LT!:eek: That's probably 50ish minutes at one hour pace, that well over the top is a race in my opinion. I couldn't pull that session off and is why I generally don't like generic mileage based plans, everything else in the plans are perfect regards structure and such but mileage should not and cannot be the determinant of ability and sessions, they should be based on time and ability which generic plans don't take into consideration.

Edit:didn't see Meno's post

Thanks NE. That 7 Mile session won't happen until much later in the plan so I'd hope I'd be better able for it then. Hopefully anyway. Even 7 Miles at HMP sounds like a very tough session to me.

belcarra wrote: »

Adrian - I'm at about your pace and I've always limited a Tempo run to 40 mins maximum (of the faster stuff).
That could be 2 x 20mins, or 1 x 40, but I'd never go above that duration.

Yeah, 40 mins is about as much as I've ever done at tempo, less probably usually split into sections like 2 x 20min or 3 x 10. Did 3 x 15 one time I that I can remember.

I think part of the issue is tempo means different things to different people. It can mean anything from Marathon Pace up to close to 10K pace depending on who you talk to.

menoscemo

adrian522 wrote: »

Yeah, 40 mins is about as much as I've ever done at tempo, less probably usually split into sections like 2 x 20min or 3 x 10. Did 3 x 15 one time I that I can remember.

7 miles @ HMP is just about feasible once you build up to it, but just remember that is not really LT (or one hour) pace as a Half Marathon will take you around 90-92 minutes.

That's why I am saying not to be too worried about the chatter on other logs over LT pace tbh....

I think there are two ways to do these sessions for us; either do them at a slightly slower pace (i.e. HMP) and base them on distance or imagine they are designed for someone with an LT pace of 5 min/mile and do them based on time. That would mean instead of doing 4 miles @ LT do 20 minutes and instead of 7 miles do 35 minutes (etc.)

adrian522

Thanks, I agree, I think I'd run them closer to HM pace. In the book he recommends they be run in the range of 10 Mile to HM Pace. Sometimes I find it difficult to hit race pace in training so it might be a bit slower but as long as the effort feels like HM to 10 Mile Effort I'm happy enough.

He also gives a HR range so that helps to ensure I'm not overdoing it.

adrian522

Thursday PM:

Some random strength stuff, not core specific but stuff I like to do for strength:

2 x 10 Squats with Dumbell
2 x 10 Single Leg Squats(each leg)
2 x 10 Single Leg Deadleft with Dumbell(each side)
2 x 10 Lunges with Dumbell(each side)
2 x 10 Calf raises with Heel Drop(each leg)
2 x 10 Step ups (each leg)
2 mins skipping both legs
1 min skipping single leg (1 min each leg)

Finished off with epic beer mile session. Happy with my days work. Need to source more Moosehead.

adrian522

Friday

9 Miles with 4 @ Tempo Pace

Got out for this after work, started with 3 miles easy, gradually picking up the pace then into the 4 tempo miles and finished with 2 miles easy/recovery.

It went well I thought. It was tough at times but I guess that is the point. I did this up in Tymon and there were few enough people around so that helped.

The pace was around 7:00 - 7:10 m/m. The HR was in the upper end of the recommended range(154-170). My mind started to wonder to the longer tempos to come but I guess one workout at a time.

Up next, recovery run + beer mile.

Mile|Pace|HR
1|9:14|127
2|8:39|136
3|8:23|145
4|7:07|164
5|7:16|167
6|6:57|170
7|7:06|171
8|8:55|153
9|9:01|148

adrian522

Saturday AM

5 Miles Recovery - 9:26 m/m

Strava contends this was a 4.9 mile run, but that is nonsense, 5 miles if it was a step.

Recovery run done, wasn't too bad but could feel the effects of yesterday.

Now for some core and stretching.

adrian522

Saturday PM

I finished off the recovery morning with the usual Core routine and the AIS stretch session. This took longer than I thought.

Anyway, the main event of the evening.

The Irish Beer Mile Championships.

Pre Race

Headed out to the beer mile stadium (now the official name of the track I think) after some Dublin Bus related setbacks. Off the bus at the wrong stop followed by the 2 Kevins who obviously thought I looked like I knew where I was going. A phone call to Meno later and we were sorted. Time for some pre race chatting to some eager spectators.

Anyway, by 7:30 we are all ready to go.

Race:

Disaster strikes right from the of as I cant get the beer open, takes me a long time to get it open and as a result I was the last one to embark on the running leg.

Beer 1: 39 Seconds

First running lap, didn't want to go too hard. Quite worried that I couldn't belch at all on this lap, tried not to get too out of breath.

Lap 1: 97 Seconds.

No issues with the second beer, opened without issue, drinking it took a few goes but as long as I was under 1 minute I was happy enough.

Beer 2: 52 Seconds

Second lap, more of the same, keep it relaxed. The burps came without issue here. I'd overtaken a few by now so was happy not to be last.

Lap 2: 97 Seconds.

Third beer was similar to number two, took a while to get it down but never felt close to puking so happy enough.

Beer 3: 55 Seconds

Third lap I was thinking "I'm going to get through this", one more beer to go. Working a bit harder on this lap but feeling confident.

Lap 3: 97 Seconds (again).

last beer, wasn't as horrible as I was expecting, got through it in just about 1 minute, training paying off.

Beer 4: 61 Seconds

Last lap, no more beer to take, took off as fast as I could, flew past pacing mule thinking I'll do a really fast last 400. That lasted about 100m, fell of a cliff, felt quite ill. I knew I'd be ok but I needed to slow right down. Pacing Mule passed me on the back straight and I just let him go. Down the home straight I'd recovered a bit and put on a bit of a sprint for the line.

Lap 4: 95 Seconds.

Finish time 9:58, happy with the sub 10. Very consistent 400 times, could have gone faster without the early mishap, and a bit more aggressive with the running but didn't want to crash and burn.

Post Race:

The less said about this the better. I cut my finger trying to open a celebratory beer. Turned out to be worse than I first thought and I needed a trip to the swift care clinic. Thanks to KC and Emer for the lift and also to Dubgal and bungy girl for helping out.

Finished up with a few beers in Synnots. Good craic in there with a few familiar and a few new faces.

Hit up the Burrito place on the way home and bumped into 2 fellow competitors in TRR and Shels4ever. Time for bed and hopefully some re-hydration prior to Sundays long run.

adrian522

Sunday

Long Run 15 Miles @ 8:30 m/m

After some procrastination finally got out in mid-afternoon for this. Followed the well worn path down to the Phoenix Park and back. I'm not going to lie, this run wasn't overly pleasant. The last few miles were a bit of a struggle with GI issues to the fore.

I'm hoping I'm not running these too fast, easy for the most part so I guess I should be ok.

3 weeks into the marathon plan now, this week has delivered:

59 Miles
2 Core Sessions
1 Myrtle Routine
2 AIS Sessions
1 General Strength Session

adrian522

Monday:

Rest, no running at all. No core or strength work either. Cycled in and out of work so there is that

Tuesday:

Medium Long Run - 11 Miles @ 8:29 m/m

I can't pretend that this went very well. The plan for these runs is to start slowly, build to a nice steady pace and finish with a few faster miles.

The start was ok but I was too fast near the start. I tried to slow it down then, but I felt completely spent with about 4 miles to go. I don't know if I over heated or was dehydrated or what but the last few miles my HR was too high and I couldn't hold a pace at all. Hopefully just one of those days.

i think in general I am doing these too fast, should be slower earlier, with a few miles towards the end in the 8:20 range, but none faster than 8 mins.

Ososlo

How's your hand?

Dubgal72

Ososlo wrote: »

How's your hand?

Yes how is it?

adrian522

Grand thanks, got it seen to on Saturday night. Need to go back on Saturday to get the stitches out, but not really affecting me at all other than needing to keep the area dry.

Needless to say I never want to see that deeply into my insides ever again.

adrian522

Wednesday

MLR (again) - 14 Miles @ 8:51 m/m


Really wasn't feeling the love for this run. First time in a long time I would have much preferred to plant myself on the couch than lace them up.

Anyway, procrastination aside, I got out the door shortly after 7. The first few miles are mainly uphill and it wasn't until around 5 miles I started to get into it.

Wanted to keep this easy as I feel I've been doing these too fast. Was much happier with my pacing except for one random mile that came out of nowhere at about 7:48. Much closer to marathon pace than easy or steady and wasn't expecting it at all when it popped up.

Anyway, kept it easy enough until 5 miles to go when I upped it a little bit but kept it relaxed, hitting around 8:30 for most of those miles.

Happy with this. Changed this week around a bit, now its recovery + strides the next 2 days and have a crack at Dunshaughlin on Saturday if there is any life in my legs at that point.