Problem recouping owed bill money from former housemate

KerranJast

Hi all,

Think I may have no comeback here but I'll ask anyway. The situation:

• We're renting from landlady. She gave us slight cut in rent if one of us (me) collected rent for her rather than her having to individually chase 4 people every month.
• Bills are nearly all registered in my name. Internet, Sky, bins etc.
• New housemate moved in last Sept. Insisted on having a rent book signed when she gave me rent & bill money. That was fine I did so.
• She moved out in mid May 2013 owing approx €310 in bills to me personally
• Despite me providing detailed breakdowns of bills and the landlady and a 3rd party verifying the numbers all add up, she's insisting on saying she's paid me all she owes and more despite still owing me almost €180.

Am I entitled to a copy of the rent book that I've signed so I can follow this up? Anybody have a similar situation happen to them before?

Pawwed Rig

Can you take it out of her deposit?

You can ask her for a copy of the rent book but I don't see how you could force the issue. You may be looking at legal route if you want to pursue it.

The_Conductor

If you personally signed a rent-book for her- it would appear that you were subletting to her (that is the only conclusion I can come to- by you signing the rent-book, and not the owner of the property). This is a bigger mess than you appear to appreciate. I would contact FLAC and/or Threshold for advise on this- there are all sorts of implications you haven't considered, the least of which may be the rent/bills owed to you.

I can fully appreciate the owner not wanting to rent the property to 4 separate people- most owners would baulk at the suggestion- however once you go down the road you've gone down- you're most probably in a letting/subletting situation- with amongst other things- tax implications.

Pawwed Rig

I took it that the OP was the anchor tenant and was just collecting rent on behalf of the landlord which is something that would be fairly common. However, if it is as Conductor describes then there could be all sorts of implications. I would suspect this is an informal arrangement where there is a 1 out 1 in situation. This was fairly common in the past but I would guess that on a strict reading of the law a new lease should be made each time a new tenant moves in along with a new PRTB registration.
OP could you clarify whose name was on the lease?

KerranJast

Cheers for the replies. The lease hasn't changed in about 3 years. It was originally signed by myself and 3 other housemates (2 of which since moved out).

The problem tenant got her own lease from the landlady afaik.

TBH I didn't know the implications of signing the rent book. Afai was concerned I was just informally collecting the rent for the landlady. She paid ESB too and I passed money for that on.

Remainder of bills were organised ourselves.

Pawwed Rig

I wouldn't be overly concerned with signing the rent book.
If there was a separate lease then I can't see an issue. The bills can come from her deposit.

KerranJast

Problem there is she didn't pay rent for May so deposit was covering that.

pwurple

KerranJast wrote: »

Problem there is she didn't pay rent for May so deposit was covering that.

Yet another reason to never agree to deposit covering rent. Sorry OP. you can appeal to their good nature, write a few letters, but otherwise you are stuck.

Any evidene of the bills? Did you give receipts for money she gave, or is it her word against yours.

The_Conductor

Unfortunately- I'm inclined to agree.
This is one of the reasons why people don't go for these lets rent 4 ways solutions.
OP- I'd seriously suggest just biting the bullet and splitting her bills among the remaining tenants- its highly unlikely you're going to get the money back from her, and you're only going to get a headache chasing her.

Don't put yourself in a situation like this again- it doesn't work.

KerranJast

I didn't agree to deposit covering rent. She just refused to give me rent for May saying the deposit should cover it.

Good nature isn't what I would ascribe to this person. She's been a nightmare housemate and we're glad to be rid of her, landlady included.

I've copies of all the bills. The rent book shows what money she gave me.

Pawwed Rig

I would also suggest having a bill in each tenants name rather than all in yours.
I would ask my landlord to share in the loss too if they are the ones that allowed the deposit to be used as rent. Having said that you would be asking them rather than demanding as I can't see how they would be under any obligation.
You could still try the legal route against the tenant that moved out.

KerranJast

The_Conductor wrote: »

Unfortunately- I'm inclined to agree.
This is one of the reasons why people don't go for these lets rent 4 ways solutions.
OP- I'd seriously suggest just biting the bullet and splitting her bills among the remaining tenants- its highly unlikely you're going to get the money back from her, and you're only going to get a headache chasing her.

Don't put yourself in a situation like this again- it doesn't work.

We'll there's only 2 of us left as other girl moved out at end of May too having paid up all what she owed.

It's unfair to put it on my housemate as he's covered his share. Going to have to just bite the bullet. Landlady has already said she will be warning off anyone looking for reference for her as she has caused nothing but trouble since she moved in.

djimi

KerranJast wrote:

Landlady has already said she will be warning off anyone looking for reference for her as she has caused nothing but trouble since she moved in.

Tell her to be careful doing this; its generally accepted that it's not a good idea to give a bad reference. If she wants a reference simply refuse; it says all that needs to be said without the need to actually bad mouth the person.

D3PO

djimi wrote: »

Tell her to be careful doing this; its generally accepted that it's not a good idea to give a bad reference. If she wants a reference simply refuse; it says all that needs to be said without the need to actually bad mouth the person.

Whilst that may be true in a work reference situation theres absolutely no reason not to give a bad reference to a bad tenant.

telling a prospective LL that she didn't pay her last months rent and left owing money for bills is perfectly fine and cannot get you in trouble if its factual.

djimi

Im just relaying what I have been told. To be honest, simply saying "Im sorry, Id prefer not to give a reference for this particular tenant" says as much as any bad reference you could ever give. As a landlord I would prefer to wash my hands of a tenant like that and not invite any more hassle onto myself.

D3PO

djimi wrote: »

Im just relaying what I have been told. To be honest, simply saying "Im sorry, Id prefer not to give a reference for this particular tenant" says as much as any bad reference you could ever give. As a landlord I would prefer to wash my hands of a tenant like that and not invite any more hassle onto myself.

I don't ascribe to the attitude of its not my problem any more though. You assume that says as much as a bad reference but not everybody can read between the lines, they may think its just a case that you had no involvement with the tenant for example as it may have been handled by an agency etc.

It a tenant acts the boll0x you should have no problem in telling somebody of it. If somebodies accommodation choices became limited based on their previous behavior you might find their future behavior changes as a result.

Nobody wants a bad tenant, just because you no longer have to deal with them doesn't mean you should be content with that.

djimi

Its not so much a case of "its not my problem anymore" as it is that I dont want to have a former tenant back in contact screaming that I gave them a bad reference. Even if Im in the right and there isnt much they can do about it, Id still sooner not have the hassle; if you give someone a bad reference and they decide to make life awkward for you then you still have the hassle of having to answer for your comments and finding proof to back it up etc. Much easier to justify declining to give a reference, and if someone cant read between the lines as to what that means when it blatantly obvious then it really is their own problem!

D3PO

what hassle. If they called you up screaming at you hit the little red button to end the call.

As for proof you have the proof via the rent book, not that you would need it unless they decided to take a legal case against you which as a concept is pretty laughable.

It is different in a work reference scenario as you could be taken to the LRC if you cannot substantiate your comments and its much easier for somebody to go through that process, which is why it is said that you shouldn't give a detailed reference in a work scenario and certainly not a negative one.

Thinks like Djimi was a lazy worker cannot be substanciated, saying Djimi didn't pay their last months rent however can.

djimi

Fair enough; if its not going to potentially cause hassle down the line then give whatever reference you feel is necessary.

KerranJast

TBH I don't see her giving the landlady's name as reference anyway. She knows she wouldn't get any joy there.