NBA Offseason Thread 2013-2014

Paully D

With the 2012-2013 season over, I thought I'd create an offseason thread. We had one last year which worked well as we were able to put everything in the one place.

NBA Draft: June 27th
Summer League: July 12th

Notable free agents (taken from another forum who got them from Hoops World, so don't blame me if there's anything wrong :pac: ):

PG:
Jeff Teague (Restricted)
Jarrett Jack
CP3
Jennings (R)
Calderon

SG:
OJ Mayo
Tony Allen
Monta
Kevin Martin
JR Smith
Redick
Tyreke (R)

SF:
Iggy

PF:
Josh Smith
Brand
David West
Blair
Millsap

C:
Dwight
Bynum
Kaman
Dalembert
Pekovic
Splitter (R)
Al Jefferson

Stories to look out for are the free agent moves of players like Howard and Paul, the coaching carousel and what older franchises who need to rebuild (such as the Celtics) decide to do.

For Forks Sake

Make of this what you will...http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1681550-rajon-rondo-reportedly-tried-to-fight-doc-rivers-during-celtics-team-meeting

padraig_f

Looks like Doc Rivers to the Clippers is off. I thought it made a lot of sense all round, the Celtics will be rebuilding for the next few years so probably need picks & building-blocks more than an elite coach, and the Clippers have a lot of talent that needs managing, could've been a great match.

Will be a shame if we lose him to broadcasting, he's one of the top 4 coaches in the NBA I think (along with Popovich, Thibodeau and Carlisle), would be a pity to lose one of them.

Paully D

Cleveland have reportedly offered the Celtics two second round picks for Paul Pierce.

ButtersSuki

padraig_f wrote: »

Looks like Doc Rivers to the Clippers is off. I thought it made a lot of sense all round, the Celtics will be rebuilding for the next few years so probably need picks & building-blocks more than an elite coach, and the Clippers have a lot of talent that needs managing, could've been a great match.

Will be a shame if we lose him to broadcasting, he's one of the top 4 coaches in the NBA I think (along with Popovich, Thibodeau and Carlisle), would be a pity to lose one of them.

This was always doomed to failure as you can't trade coaches. Doc has p*ssed a lot of people off in Beantown so it's unlikely he'll be back and with is 5 year contract that likely means TV work. As a C's fan I wish him all the best whatever he decides.

stuchyg

Was hoping someone would create this thread. What odds you think we could get on CP3 being named player/coach at this stage.

Paully D

Looks like the Rivers deal is back on.

Woj has reported that the Clippers will send an unprotected first round pick in 2015 to the Celtics for him. Clippers and Rivers are working out the length of the deal at the minute, and ESPN have reported that, obviously enough, Chris Paul has said he will sign up for a 5 year max deal if/when Rivers joins.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--clippers-finalizing-deal-with-celtics-to-hire-doc-rivers-as-coach-202137296.html

Talks started again on Sunday when the Clippers offered the Celtics a first-round pick to free Rivers from his contract with Boston, sources said.
The Clippers, Celtics are agreeing upon a 2015 unprotected first-round pick, a league source told Yahoo! Sports.

Rivers and the Clippers are still working on the language of a five-year, $35 million contract, and no agreement will be in place until those details are finalized, sources said.

Rivers told the Clippers that he was no longer interested in the position on Friday, but pressure from the franchise's star player, Chris Paul, stayed strong on Clippers management over the weekend and Los Angeles reconsidered its unwillingness to give Boston a first-round pick, sources said.

Clearly, Rivers' telling the Clippers he no longer had interest in the job – and the Celtics setting a Friday deadline for a deal – were negotiating postures to leverage the Clippers back with a better offer.

The NBA will still need to approve the deal.

Rivers had gone into the weekend planning to decide his future with the Celtics, and sources said he had been leaning strongly toward returning next season to fulfill the three years and $21 million left on his contract. With the Celtics moving into a rebuilding phase, several sources told Yahoo! Sports that Boston management preferred draft-pick compensation over paying for an elite coach.

padraig_f

ButtersSuki wrote: »

This was always doomed to failure as you can't trade coaches. Doc has p*ssed a lot of people off in Beantown so it's unlikely he'll be back and with is 5 year contract that likely means TV work. As a C's fan I wish him all the best whatever he decides.

I was confused about this, with conflicting reports if it was allowed or not. My understanding now is, the NBA don't want coaches being traded for active players. So instead of the old deal of Rivers&KG for Jordan&Bledsoe, or whatever, it's now just Rivers for a 1st-round pick.

Marc Stein: "Nothing official til NBA has its say. But since there is no player component here, likelihood is that first-rounder for Doc would be OK'd"

Looking at the latest Wojnarowski report, seems pretty close to being done.

leggo

And now we play the waiting game: waiting for the NBA to approve and waiting for the inevitable second trade that'd send Garnett to LA (and perhaps Bledsoe to Boston).

Pierce to Cleveland would be a great move for the Cavs. It'd put them in the race for the 8th-spot of the playoffs, and if they were to get it it would be an interesting tempter for LeBron should they look to re-recruit him. IF they were to do so, that'd be an interesting prospect for Pierce to resign, leaving them with LeBron, Kyrie, Pierce and Varejao. Not saying all of that could happen...but you'd have to figure it's lingering in the minds of the Cavs' office.

Meanwhile Boston get to build around Rondo, Avery Bradley, Jeff Green and...cap space, I suppose.

padraig_f

leggo wrote: »

Meanwhile Boston get to build around Rondo, Avery Bradley, Jeff Green and...cap space, I suppose.

Hire Vinny del Negro, tell Rondo not to rush back from his ACL, and go all-out for Andrew Wiggins in 2014.

stuchyg

Yea id say some of the tanking could be epic next season. Do ppl remember the hype for LBJ coming to thr league. Is it the same for Wiggins

leggo

padraig_f wrote: »

Hire Vinny del Negro, tell Rondo not to rush back from his ACL, and go all-out for Andrew Wiggins in 2014.

As much as I love the idea of Del Negro being a one-way ticket to the #1 pick, I wouldn't put it past him to even make a mess of that plan and end up taking Boston to the playoffs.

Masked Man

looks like a 3yr/$21m deal for Doc.

Possibly (probably!) stupid question: what's the difference between a protected and unprotected pick?

Wonder what will happen with KG, especially if the league blocks him going to the Clippers.

Dublin Red Devil

It's basically confirmed now. Doc Rivers and Kevin Garnett to the Clippers. DeAndre Jordan and 2 1st round Draft picks to Celtics

padraig_f

Masked Man wrote: »

looks like a 3yr/$21m deal for Doc.

Possibly (probably!) stupid question: what's the difference between a protected and unprotected pick?

Wonder what will happen with KG, especially if the league blocks him going to the Clippers.

Protected means it's deferred while it falls in a certain range. e.g. the Bulls currently own a first-round pick from the Bobcats:

top-12 protected in 2013
top-10 in 2014
top-8 in 2015
unprotected in 2016

Because the Bobcats are picking in the top 12 this year, they keep the pick for this year. As soon as their pick comes outside the protected range, the Bulls will get it.


Example of why it's used....a few years ago the Clippers traded Baron Davis and a first-round pick (unprotected) to the Cavs. They foolishly didn't protect the pick, because it only had a 2% chance to win the lottery. That 2% chance won the draft-lottery and the Cavs got the pick (Kyrie Irving). Had the Clippers protected the pick, they'd have had the number 1 pick that year.

So protecting it kind of ensures it's a medium-value asset, and you're not giving away too much.

For this one it doesn't really matter, because if the Clippers make the playoffs (almost certain), they won't even be in the lottery, so their pick can't be in the top 14.

ButtersSuki

The ongoing saga between Doc Rivers, the Celtics and the Clippers may be nearing a resolution. After initially balking at surrendering a first round pick for the right to hire Rivers, the Clippers re-engaged Boston on Sunday and have agreed to send an unprotected 2015 first round pick to Boston, a league source confirmed to SI.com.

The Clippers and Rivers have agreed on the framework of a three-year, $21 million deal--the same length and salary Rivers had on his contract with the Celtics.

Yahoo! Sports first reported the restarted talks between LA and Boston.
One of the final hurdles could be the NBA. The collective bargaining agreement doesn't allow coaches to be traded, and in recent public comments commisioner David Stern made it clear that an earlier trade scenario that would have sent Rivers and Kevin Garnett to Los Angeles for a package headlined by DeAndre Jordan and draft considerations would not get league approval.

"I would say, in the language of diplomacy, that the teams are aware that the collective bargaining agreement doesn't authorize trades involving coaches' contracts," Stern told ESPN Radio. "The only consideration that can be done here in player transactions is other players, draft picks and a very limited amount of cash. But coaches' contracts don't qualify as extra consideration — or acceptable consideration — in player contracts. The teams know that. It has been confirmed to them. What the rules won't allow can't be gotten around by breaking it up into two transactions."

When asked by host Stephen A. Smith about the possibility of two separate transactions—Rivers being let out of his contract, followed by a Garnett-Jordan trade, or vice versa—Stern scoffed at the suggestion.

"If you would think that those, now, after being all over the media for the last week or whatever, are separate transactions, [then] when you get back from Miami, Stephen, I have a bridge that connects to Brooklyn that I would very much enjoy selling to you," Stern said.

Should this version of the Clippers deal fall apart, it's becoming less and less likely that Rivers returns to Boston. Rivers has a strong interest in coaching the Clippers. The Denver Nuggets, which reached out to Boston two weeks ago, dangling a first round pick in exchange for Rivers, re-engaged the Celtics over the weekend with a similar offer, according to a source. The Nuggets were told Rivers isn't interested in coaching in Denver at this time. If the Clippers deal crumbles, there are strong indications that Rivers would return to broadcasting, where he would command an annual salary in the neighborhood of $2 million per year.


Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/nba/news/20130623/doc-rivers-boston-celtics-la-clippers-trade-donald-sterling/#ixzz2X7SWGVmA

If Stern doesn't approve it it's dead in the water (remember the Chris Paul to the Lakers trade anyone?). Were it just a pick for Rivers I'd say the C's were being shortchanged, but obviously both deals are connected. The C's will likely get a coach for a few mil less per year than Rivers was making so I'm pretty sure that's been factored into Ainge's thinking on this.

Dublin Red Devil

Just a reminder to NBA fan. The 2013 NBA Draft is just 3 days away.

Date

---

June 27, 2013

Time

---

Midnight (Irish Time)

Location----Barclays Center, Brooklyn NY

Network----ESPN


Discuss at...

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056896254&page=10

padraig_f

ButtersSuki wrote: »

If Stern doesn't approve it it's dead in the water (remember the Chris Paul to the Lakers trade anyone?). Were it just a pick for Rivers I'd say the C's were being shortchanged, but obviously both deals are connected. The C's will likely get a coach for a few mil less per year than Rivers was making so I'm pretty sure that's been factored into Ainge's thinking on this.

Oh yeah, the Celtics would definitely be getting the worse end of that deal, but if Rivers wants to go, they probably have no choice but to get what they can for him.

No point in hanging onto a coach who doesn't want to be there, if you think he'll walk at the end of his contract anyway. And as I speculated with the Vinny del Negro masterplan, it may be in the Celtics' best interest to have a worse coach next year, now they are committed to rebuilding.

ButtersSuki

Done deal now according to various reports in the US media.

Rivers to Clipps for a 2015 unprotected pick. Seems a small price to pay from the Clipps point of view as you'd assume barring a major catastrophe they'll make the Playoffs putting that pick at best No. 17 and at worst No. 30. Not so amazing for the Celtics when you see it like that.

Doesn't look like KG is going to be joining him....for the moment at least, though I suspect this will be the hottest topic come All Star Break next Feb.

stuchyg

Docs gone and it I'd likely that pp will get waived or traded. Strong chance for me that kg retires if he doesn't go to the clips

padraig_f

Ooh, didn't think I'd have an interest in the top end of the draft...
Report: Luol Deng to the Wizards for the No. 3 pick discussed

I think Marc Stein is pretty reliable, but lots more of these options get explored than acted on, so still far from likely at this stage.

ButtersSuki

padraig_f wrote: »

Ooh, didn't think I'd have an interest in the top end of the draft...
Report: Luol Deng to the Wizards for the No. 3 pick discussed

I think Marc Stein is pretty reliable, but lots more of these options get explored than acted on, so still far from likely at this stage.

Wow, a legit all star for a no. 3 pick in what's generally considered a weak draft? Thought Thibs loved him? Looks strange if true IMO.

killwill

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Wow, a legit all star for a no. 3 pick in what's generally considered a weak draft? Thought Thibs loved him? Looks strange if true IMO.

I dont think Thibs can keep both Deng and Butler happy with minutes next season. Something has to give. They are both great defensive players but Butler offers more on offence.

Masked Man

Cheers padraig

ButtersSuki

killwill wrote: »

I dont think Thibs can keep both Deng and Butler happy with minutes next season. Something has to give. They are both great defensive players but Butler offers more on offence.

Ah....Butler was 8.6 points, 1.4 assists and 4.0 rebounds per game last year, Deng was 16.5, 3.0 and 6.3 in the same categories.

Only thing Butler has over Deng right now is youth.

This makes me wonder how sick Deng was in the Playoffs and if there is lasting damage to that.

Joaquin223

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Ah....Butler was 8.6 points, 1.4 assists and 4.0 rebounds per game last year, Deng was 16.5, 3.0 and 6.3 in the same categories.

Read into the numbers man, that's in 12 fewer minutes a game and a reduced role in the offense with Deng around. They had pretty much the exact same numbers in the playoffs. Purely cost-cutting move by the Bulls, and wouldn't be a bad one either if they like someone at 3.

ButtersSuki

Joaquin223 wrote: »

Read into the numbers man, that's in 12 fewer minutes a game and a reduced role in the offense with Deng around. They had pretty much the exact same numbers in the playoffs. Purely cost-cutting move by the Bulls, and wouldn't be a bad one either if they like someone at 3.

Yes I can do the math but Deng was clearly sick in the Playoffs and Butler was tailor made to hurt Miami given his size, strength and explosiveness. His stats also increased in the Miami series over those of the Nets series, bolstering his averages as a result.

I'm not saying he's bad or anything (!) but are you going to make a call they're comparable over 12 playoff games for Butler versus 7 for Deng or a full regular season for both? You're not comparing like with like.

Butler clearly has huge upside and potential but if Rose is back healthy next year he'll likely have less of the ball than he did this year.

Deng is a legit All Star. Butler has played just 2 seasons in the NBA.

I'd be willing to bet if he's healthy and in Chicago next year Deng's stats will be better than Butler's next year, and they most definitely will if he's with the Wizards.

The draft is weak this year, this makes no sense to me unless Deng isn't recovering from his illness. Money? No. This is Chicago. Luxury tax isn't an issue for them.

Paully D

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Money? No. This is Chicago. Luxury tax isn't an issue for them.

Many people think that, but money is actually a huge issue for this front office. They do whatever they can to avoid paying any sort of luxury tax and only ended up paying it last year, for the first time ever, because they made a complete balls of trying to trade Hamilton at the deadline.

The Bulls are all in on trying to get a superstar free agent in 2014. Boozer will be amnestied next year and its a matter of time before Deng is moved on.

The fact they wont delve into the luxury tax has been a huge frustration for me and many other fans.

Joaquin223

Paully D wrote: »

The Bulls are all in on trying to get a superstar free agent in 2014. Boozer will be amnestied next year and its a matter of time before Deng is moved on.

Yes, this would seem to be the plan, and a good one at that. They have the legitimate superstar player in Rose, which is always one of the biggest challenges for a team trying to get over the top. They have the coach. Then a nice long-term core in Noah, Butler, Taj - all of whom are attractive trade pieces as well if something arises.

Getting a high draft pick for Deng when you have a guy giving you most of his production at a fraction of the price is a very shrewd piece of business.

Now, far more interesting question. If you're Cleveland, what do you do with the number 1 pick?

Dublin Red Devil

I believe this Deng for Washington's Draft pick could be true. The Wizards were almost certainly going to take SF Otto Porter with the 3rd pick. They need a SF and Deng plays the position aswell.

The Bulls would most likely us the pick to take a big man. Probably Alex Len

Paully D

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

I believe this Deng for Washington's Draft pick could be true. The Wizards were almost certainly going to take SF Otto Porter with the 3rd pick. They need a SF and Deng plays the position aswell.

The Bulls would most likely us the pick to take a big man. Probably Alex Len

I'd be amazed if we took Len if the deal goes ahead. Part of the deal is Okafor + #3 for Deng, so we'd have Noah and Okafor at that position meaning Len isn't necessary.

I think a wing is far, far more likely if the proposed trade goes ahead.

That said, I'd be very surprised if this happens. The Bulls are just trying to raise Deng's value to get something rather than losing him for nothing next year, but something many aren't considering is that there's very little chance of Deng re-signing with the Wizards next season in any case (he would easily pick up a nice deal with a team much closer to contending) so it would be a pretty pointless move on their part to have him just for one year.

The most realistic scenario is that this trade comes to nothing, the Bulls take Dieng on Thursday night and the Wizards take Potter.