NBA Offseason Thread 2013-2014

Paully D

Just watched the 30 for 30 documentary 'Benji', about the basketball player Ben Wilson. Such a sad story

Here's part 1, with the rest of the parts easily available on YouTube:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i0nf7b0SzQI

BQQ

Shaw took the Nuggets job.

ButtersSuki

On Deng, given the counter-arguments posted above, I can admit to seeing some logic to it, though the negatives still outweigh it for me.
Here's why:

• With Rose back healthy and the Heat (Bosh and Wade) in decline the Bulls will be a real No. 1 contender in the East - if they keep Deng. They will not have that depth with a rookie in his place who's trying to learn the pro game
• You have a short window to win in the NBA, trading Deng for an unproven rookie is not a "win-now" move. To do this is essentially writing off next year for me and doubling down on 2015 which is a very risky strategy
• In addition to the above, yeah Boozer is overpaid and likely to be amnestied but again, a fully fit Bulls team (inc;. Rose, Deng and Boozer) have a real shot at taking down the Heat in a Playoff series. If I'm the Bulls, I roll the dice on that for next year and then blow it up for 2015
• If you do want to trade Deng for a draft pick (or to save money), why settle for #3? Why not go to Cleveland who clearly want someone in that position (see the rumoured Paul Pierce trade) and who have talked openly about trading the #1 pick? Deng has to be a more attractive proposition than Pierce (and I say that as a Celtics fan)
• I keep going back to this draft......there's no consensus #1 player...or #2,#3,#4,#5 for that matter....what if this all backfired and the player Chicago have their eye on goes before their pick? :eek:

Finally......if it does happen....and I couldn't resist this...and mods I am joking.....the big upside for Deng is he'd get to play with boards.ie fave John Wall! :pac::D:rolleyes:

For Forks Sake

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

I believe this Deng for Washington's Draft pick could be true. The Wizards were almost certainly going to take SF Otto Porter with the 3rd pick. They need a SF and Deng plays the position aswell.

The Bulls would most likely us the pick to take a big man. Probably Alex Len

I doubt it, that's covered with Boozer/Noah/Gibson.

There's a more pressing need for a SG, so (if) Len goes 1 and Orlando take a punt on Noel, that leaves either Oladipo or McLemore as the likely choices.

padraig_f

Couple of things playing into the Deng trade idea...

- Jimmy Butler is currently playing 2, but is possibly more of a natural 3 (was comfortable enough guarding Lebron in the playoffs). So you trade Deng, move Jimmy to the 3, and get more of a pure 2, like Oladipo in the draft (or a couple of decent free-agents available, JJ Reddick, OJ Mayo etc.).

- Deng has only 1 year to run on his contract, and could be looking for $10m+ this time next year. Two cheaper contracts of Butler + Oladipo may be more sustainable over the next few years in terms of the cap.

- Deng didn't have a great year this last year. I was happy for him to get the all-star the year before, but didn't think he deserved it this year, got it more on reputation. An all-star should be able to carry a team offensively to an extent, and he didn't do that this year with Rose out. Not a big knock on him, that's who he is, he's a guy that relies on others to create his shot, this last year with Rose out, he shot just 42% from the field, and 32% from 3, below-average numbers. He had some ligament problem with his hand that I thought he was going to get surgery on in the off-season, but he never did (not sure what the deal with that is), and I don't think his shot has been the same since.

Good defensively, good engine and solid offensive production with the right support, but that doesn't make you an irreplaceable player at $10m+. I agree with Paully, the likeliehood is the trade doesn't happen, and the Bulls would be happy to have Deng back, but I can also see why they're exploring trade options.

Dublin Red Devil

For Forks Sake wrote: »

I doubt it, that's covered with Boozer/Noah/Gibson.

There's a more pressing need for a SG, so (if) Len goes 1 and Orlando take a punt on Noel, that leaves either Oladipo or McLemore as the likely choices.

We're disussing it at http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056896254

For Forks Sake

Dublin Red Devil wrote: »

We're disussing it at http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2056896254

No, you're talking to yourself on the other thread. If a mod wants to move my post, then let them at it.

However, I was responding to a post in this thread.

For Forks Sake

padraig_f wrote: »

Couple of things playing into the Deng trade idea...

- Jimmy Butler is currently playing 2, but is possibly more of a natural 3 (was comfortable enough guarding Lebron in the playoffs). So you trade Deng, move Jimmy to the 3, and get more of a pure 2, like Oladipo in the draft (or a couple of decent free-agents available, JJ Reddick, OJ Mayo etc.).

- Deng has only 1 year to run on his contract, and could be looking for $10m+ this time next year. Two cheaper contracts of Butler + Oladipo may be more sustainable over the next few years in terms of the cap.

- Deng didn't have a great year this last year. I was happy for him to get the all-star the year before, but didn't think he deserved it this year, got it more on reputation. An all-star should be able to carry a team offensively to an extent, and he didn't do that this year with Rose out. Not a big knock on him, that's who he is, he's a guy that relies on others to create his shot, this last year with Rose out, he shot just 42% from the field, and 32% from 3, below-average numbers. He had some ligament problem with his hand that I thought he was going to get surgery on in the off-season, but he never did (not sure what the deal with that is), and I don't think his shot has been the same since.

Good defensively, good engine and solid offensive production with the right support, but that doesn't make you an irreplaceable player at $10m+. I agree with Paully, the likeliehood is the trade doesn't happen, and the Bulls would be happy to have Deng back, but I can also see why they're exploring trade options.

fwiw, Sam Smith doesn't think the Deng trade is a runner: http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/bulls-aim-find-contributor-no-20.html

Dublin Red Devil

For Forks Sake wrote: »

No, you're talking to yourself on the other thread. If a mod wants to move my post, then let them at it.

However, I was responding to a post in this thread.

Whatever you're having yourself.



(I'm posting this in the wrong palce but) McLemore is the obviously choice over Oladipo. Personally I think McLemore will be drafted before Chicago would potential pick 3rd. So if the rumor is true and The Bulls go down the SG route. It would have to be Oladipo

For Forks Sake

Now this would be interesting from an Irish perspective: http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--celtics-will-consider-assistant-jay-larranaga--other-youthful-candidates--for-head-coaching-job-155145849.html

The Boston Celtics will consider several younger and lower-profile candidates for the franchise's coaching vacancy, including assistant coach Jay Larranaga, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

After two seasons as a head coach in the NBA Development League, Larranaga, 38, made a strong impression on coach Doc Rivers and the Celtics' front office during the 2012-13 season.

Larranaga will coach the Celtics' summer league entry in Orlando, allowing general manager Danny Ainge a better look at him.

With Rivers and his $7 million salary headed to the Clippers, the Celtics are moving into a rebuilding phase. They expect to have a young roster and no longer want to pay an elite coach's salary.

Rivers also has a strong interest in bringing Larranaga to the Clippers as part of his coaching staff, league sources told Yahoo! Sports.

Larranaga reached the playoffs in each of his two seasons with Erie of the D-League and set a team record with 32 victories in a season. Before getting the assignment in Erie, he played 12 seasons of professional basketball in Europe, including a stint as player-coach for the Irish National team.

Larranaga, the son of Miami (Fla.) basketball coach Jim Larranaga, spent the summer of 2012 as an assistant coach on the Ukraine national team under former longtime NBA head coach and current basketball broadcaster Mike Fratello.

padraig_f

For Forks Sake wrote: »

fwiw, Sam Smith doesn't think the Deng trade is a runner: http://www.nba.com/bulls/news/bulls-aim-find-contributor-no-20.html

Maybe that specific one to the Wizards is a non-runner, but I do think there's something going on there. I see now Wojnarowski has a piece:
Bulls, Luol Deng talking contract extension

Sounds like the opposite of the original story, but could be part of the same thing...i.e. discuss a cheaper extension, if it's going to be too expensive, may need to do a trade this year, rather than lose him next year for nothing.

ButtersSuki

This one has been floating for a few weeks now but gained a degree of credibility it didn't have until now - just warched this morning's PTI podcast from the US and heard Mike Wilbon and Tony Kornheiser discussing a possible trade between the Clippers and LA for Blake Griffin and Dwight Howard.

Would actually suit both teams for a variety of different reasons but not sure this will happen. Howard would get to play with Paul and away from D'Antoni whilst the Lakers would love the nightly highlight reel Griffin would give them. This one could go some distance. I think Griffin long term would become a better player under Rivers, but it may not be his call. If Howard got back to being a 20-10 guy and played at near Defensive Player of the Year level like he did for a few years he improves the Clippers no end, while BG can be the face of a run and gun Lakers as a legit 20-10 guy himself.

As the Lakers have moved heaven and earth to keep Howard this will take a lot to make it happen, but it looks on paper to be a win-win.

leggo

Ooh, I can't see Howard and Paul as a good match. If him and Griffin had trouble co-existing due to Blake not getting that Chris was 'the guy', adding Howard to the mix would be disastrous. And Chris Paul would definitely still have to be 'the guy' there, it's the only way they succeed. I don't think Dwight has the legs left to be a top 10, never mind a top 5, guy anymore. But Howard's ego probably wouldn't allow him to be a small fish in an even smaller pond. He needs a guy who'll be the engine of the team and make him effective without wanting to hog the limelight.

For that reason he'd fit much better at Houston, where James Harden is a proven team player who has shown he has no problem letting others take the headlines while he does the work.

ButtersSuki

They've had a bit of a bromance going all year with both saying they'd like to be team mates "at some stage". Atlanta have openly stated they'd like to bring both players together this summer- even publishing fan letters saying as much in contravention of league rules for which they were fined. With Doc arriving at the Clipps, Paul is pretty much guaranteed to stay so I wouldn't rule anything out just yet, though I can't see the Lakers giving him up considering what they've put into acquiring him.

Houston is attractive fom coaching and playing perspectives but I just think given Howard's ego it's not a big(cool/prestige/marquee) enough team for him.

ButtersSuki

The rumor mill continues to churn as we get closer to Thursday’s NBA draft. Here’s a round-up of the most noteworthy trade rumors from late Monday and Tuesday.

• ESPN.com: “The Cavs continue to mull their options at No. 1. They are engaged in trade talks with a number of teams. Sources say the Thunder, Timberwolves and Blazers have been the most proactive in trying to get the No. 1 pick — but so far neither team has persuaded the Cavs to move out of the top pick.”
• HoopsWorld.com: “There was some commentary yesterday suggesting that LaMarcus Aldridge had requested a trade from the Blazers (completely untrue), but that hasn’t stopped teams from trying to tempt the Blazers into a deal. The Cleveland Cavaliers are said to have offered both the No. 1 overall pick and the No. overall 19 pick in exchange for Aldridge and were turned away, while there have been rumblings that new Suns general manager Ryan McDonough has made at least one pass at Aldridge involving Marcin Gortat.”
• Yahoo! Sports: “The Atlanta Hawks are dangling their two first-round picks for a trade in hopes of moving up in Thursday’s NBA draft, possibly as high as the top five, sources tell Yahoo! Sports. … The Hawks also are intrigued by UCLA small forward Shabazz Muhammad, a source said.”
• SportsCity.com: “Eric Bledsoe and Caron Butler are expected to be packaged in a draft-day trade for Orlando’s Arron Afflalo, addressing the Clipper need for a shooting guard.”
• ESPN.com: “The Sacramento Kings are looking to acquire a second first-round pick and are using guard Jimmer Fredette as bait. Sources say the Kings have reached out to a number of teams in the mid-to-late first round in an attempt to secure another pick. Both the Indiana Pacers and Utah Jazz are potential destinations for Jimmer. Kings coach Mike Malone is enamored with both Tim Hardaway Jr. and Tony Snell, but the Kings feel that they can get them much lower in the draft.”
• New York Post: “The Knicks have offered future second-round picks and future considerations (cash) to Portland in an attempt to regain the rights to small forward Kostas Papanikolaou, according to sources. … The Knicks drafted Papanikolaou last June in the second round with the 48th overall pick, telling the media he would be ready to arrive in the NBA for the 2013-14 season. But in desperation, with almost no assets left, Grunwald dealt Papanikolaou in the Raymond Felton sign-and-trade so he could avoid matching Jeremy Lin’s monster contract offer.”
• Houston Chronicle: “The Rockets are in advanced talks on a cap-clearing trade of forward Thomas Robinson, with a deal potentially ‘imminent,’ a person with knowledge of their plans said on Tuesday. … The Cleveland Cavaliers and San Antonio Spurs have shown interest in Robinson, according to another individual with knowledge of the Rockets efforts to move Robinson’s $3.5 million salary next season.”
• ESPN.com: “The Cleveland Cavaliers and the Milwaukee Bucks are among the teams that have expressed trade interest in Boston Celtics star Paul Pierce, according to sources with knowledge of the talks. … The Celtics do remain hopeful of acquiring a first-round pick for Pierce this week in conjunction with Thursday’s draft. But sources said the Celtics have shown an inclination to try to work with Pierce to get him to a favorable destination — which essentially translates to a contending team — if they indeed decide to trade him by week’s end.”
• Sporting News: “If the Celtics can unload Pierce to a team with enough cap space to absorb his salary, they will get a trade exception worth Pierce’s salary, or $15.3 million. And if that happens, the plan is already in place. According to a source, the Celtics have a sign-and-trade offer ready for Atlanta forward Josh Smith that would be the top priority in free agency.”
• ESPN.com: “According to a source, Cleveland offered the No. 1 pick, Tristan Thompson and Dion Waiters to try and land Minnesota’s Kevin Love. But new Timberwolves president Flip Saunders won’t move Love.”
• Timberwolves president Flip Saunders: “Have to chuckle at all the trade comments, proposals and some suggestions. DO enjoy them but please think first lol.”
• Charlotte Observer: “An NBA source with knowledge of the situation adamantly denied Tuesday that the Charlotte Bobcats are shopping small forward Michael Kidd-Gilchrist as a trade commodity.”

leggo

ButtersSuki wrote: »

They've had a bit of a bromance going all year with both saying they'd like to be team mates "at some stage". Atlanta have openly stated they'd like to bring both players together this summer- even publishing fan letters saying as much in contravention of league rules for which they were fined. With Doc arriving at the Clipps, Paul is pretty much guaranteed to stay so I wouldn't rule anything out just yet, though I can't see the Lakers giving him up considering what they've put into acquiring him.

Houston is attractive fom coaching and playing perspectives but I just think given Howard's ego it's not a big(cool/prestige/marquee) enough team for him.

I dunno, I would've said the same last year, but having completely flopped under the weight of pressure that comes with being a top guy on a top franchise, I could see him now being attracted to a smaller franchise with championship aspirations.

Of course this is all just me speculating on what I think his best move would be (with media talk my only source). It all depends on what Howard wants. Though if he does just want a big franchise, why not just re-sign with the Lakers?

ButtersSuki

leggo wrote: »

I dunno, I would've said the same last year, but having completely flopped under the weight of pressure that comes with being a top guy on a top franchise, I could see him now being attracted to a smaller franchise with championship aspirations.

Of course this is all just me speculating on what I think his best move would be (with media talk my only source). It all depends on what Howard wants. Though if he does just want a big franchise, why not just re-sign with the Lakers?

It's not working with him and Kobe, nor with him and D'Antoni.

As big a star as Paul is, he's a facilitator more than Kobe will ever be so that's going to be a huge attraction to Howard. Plus if he stays in LA, he'll still be in the biggest media market in the world so he can still be ummmm, "D12"/"Superman" and take all of the extras that go with that.:rolleyes:

Paully D

The Lakers messed it all up when they rejected Phil Jackson. He'd have got Kobe and Howard working together and everyone playing team ball. They could have had a great shot but pissed it all away when they took D'Antoni because they were worried about how Nash would fit in under Jackson.

padraig_f

Report: Rockets looking at Cavs at 19, Bulls at 20 for Thomas Robinson


The Bulls don't reallly need a PF, but trading a 20th pick for a 5th overall from a year ago would be a nice bit of business. Haven't been following T Robb too much, but here's John Hollinger's profile from a year ago:

John Hollinger wrote:

Thomas Robinson Hollinger Stats

Scouting report
+ Beastly power forward who dominates on glass. Athletic, tough-minded finisher.
+ Perimeter game needs work. Moves need refinement. Should be solid defender.

Analysis
Robinson was a no-brainer pick when he fell to No. 5 in the draft. His prodigious rebounding alone was a major reason to nab him, as he racked up the best defensive rebound rate and the best overall rebound rate of any prospect. Robinson accomplished both by comfortable margins, despite Kansas having played the nation's toughest schedule. Between Robinson and DeMarcus Cousins, the Kings should absolutely destroy opponents on the glass.

Robinson also has some skill to get shots at the basket, especially posting up or making quick moves off the dribble. He is a bit short for a 4 and shot only 50 percent on 2s, an indication that he may have some issues finishing against size. Similarly, his other stats are more solid than great.

Still, he's such an overwhelming force on the glass that he almost can't help but be a productive NBA power forward, and he is athletic enough that his game may evolve in several directions.

Paully D

I also see reports that LaMarcus Aldridge could be put on the trade block (Chad Ford, ESPN) and wants to join the Bulls. He'd be a superb pick up and it would mean the end of Carlos Boozer who is a great guy but just a poor fit for us.

Hard to believe we traded Aldridge for Tyrus Thomas back in the day, but that Bobcats pick from that trade would be a nice bit of trade bait if such a deal was to go ahead.

I'd be over the moon if we were to get him.

ButtersSuki

Paully D wrote: »

I also see reports that LaMarcus Aldridge could be put on the trade block (Chad Ford, ESPN) and wants to join the Bulls. He'd be a superb pick up and it would mean the end of Carlos Boozer who is a great guy but just a poor fit for us.

Hard to believe we traded Aldridge for Tyrus Thomas back in the day, but that Bobcats pick from that trade would be a nice bit of trade bait if such a deal was to go ahead.

I'd be over the moon if we were to get him.

Aldridge would be a huge acquisition is Rose and Deng back healthy and they don't have to give up much for him. A starting five of Rose, Deng, Noah, Aldridge and Hindrich wold be pretty strong, ESP. if they can keep Gibson, Butler and Belenelli too.

Only problem I see is I can't imagine anyone will be queuing up to take Boozer.........

Paully D

ButtersSuki wrote: »

Aldridge would be a huge acquisition is Rose and Deng back healthy and they don't have to give up much for him. A starting five of Rose, Deng, Noah, Aldridge and Hindrich wold be pretty strong, ESP. if they can keep Gibson, Butler and Belenelli too.

Only problem I see is I can't imagine anyone will be queuing up to take Boozer.........

It'd be Deng going the other way if we were to get Aldridge. Boozer would have to be amnestied as no one in their right mind would touch his contract.

So if this was to happen we'd be looking at the situation Padraig talked about where Butler would take over the role in place of Deng and we'd get something for Deng rather than losing him for nothing (as I would be very sceptical of reports that we are opening talks on a new contract, Deng's agent said there's no truth in it) and we could use what we save on Boozer to strengthen elsewhere.

I'd be all for it. Rose, Aldridge and Noah would be a very good trio.

stuchyg

Would that trio work where you have rose driving to the basket on most possessions. Lma especially likes the ball in hand

limerickfc

Would love if OKC got in on the thomas robinson trade, he'd be another great piece for next season.
On the bobcats shopping MKG, its a bit premature do ya not think, i mean i know he's had a terrible season in terms of shooting but i think he's been very solid other than that.

limerickfc

Carl Landry now a free agent too, he could turn any on the edge team into a contender if he was willing to take a pay cut.

ButtersSuki

Charming or desperate? That’s always a fine line when it comes to courtship.

The Lakers began placing billboards around Los Angeles urging center Dwight Howard to re-sign when he becomes an unrestricted free agent next month. The billboards feature photographs of Howard alongside the word “STAY” and a corresponding “#STAYD12″ hashtag.

Howard, 27, averaged 17.1 points, 12.4 rebounds and 2.4 blocks in his only season with the Lakers after being acquired from the Magic in a four-team blockbuster trade last summer. The seven-time All-Star told reporters after the Lakers were swept by the Spurs in the first round of the playoffs that he planned to “step away” before considering his free agency options.
“I’m going to step away from everything for a couple weeks and clear my head before I do or talk about anything, as far as next season,” Howard said in April. “I think I deserve that. That’s what I’m going to do.”
Lakers GM Mitch Kupchak told Lakers.com this week that he believes Howard is a Hall of Famer.

“He’s our future,” Kupchak said.
The Lakers uploaded photos of the billboards to Twitter on Wednesday. ESPNLA.com reports that there will be “six or seven” billboards in total; photos show the billboards are already up at the Staples Center and on Hollywood Boulevard.
A Dwight Howard billboard on Hollywood Boulevard. (@Lakers)

The Orange County Register asked a Lakers spokesman for a comment on the billboard strategy.
“[Howard] is very important to both our present and future,” the spokesman replied.
Howard can re-sign with the Lakers for up to five years or he can sign with outside suitors for up to four years.

moneyman

The book isn't completely closed on T-Rob, but he had a pretty awful rookie season. He's a little undersized, he has poor hands, was atrocious finishing at the basket and couldn't hit a jumper to save his life. Now that's a pretty harsh account of his rookie season, but I saw pretty much every Kings game and from what I've read/saw, it didn't improve a whole lot in Houston. What's worse is that at times he looked like he didn't want to bother with defense, not even pretending to care. That said, he's an excellent athlete, not necessarily a high flyer (though he can get up), but runs the floor like a guard and has a strong upper body. His rebounding will hopefully improve as he was a good rebounder in college and that's something that almost always translates to the NBA.

But I wouldn't be getting excited about him, especially not for a team like OKC. He's a while away from contributing significantly on a bad team, never mind getting any real burn on one of the best teams in the league. I'm not writing him off, he's a hard worker and can find a role for himself, but the signs so far haven't been promising.

padraig_f

stuchyg wrote: »

Would that trio work where you have rose driving to the basket on most possessions. Lma especially likes the ball in hand

I have a feeling you could see Rose adjust his game a little bit after the injury. Not sure the way he was playing was going to be sustainable long-term. You don't want to over-react to the ACL, because it also happened to guys playing different styles (e.g. Rondo, Rubio), but he was starting to get banged up before that too.

Maybe look at Tony Parker as a model, dual-threat of scorer/passer off the pick-and-roll, rather than primarily a scorer, as he's been up to now. I think that might be a more sustainable style of play, and someone like LaMarcus Aldridge could be a good partner for that (you could still go to Aldridge in the post as well, and have Rose play off that).

I'm sure Rose isn't going to go totally away from the style that won him the MVP, but some comments he made while out injured (can't remember the exact quotes now), made me think he'd adjust his style a bit.

Paully D

padraig_f wrote: »

I have a feeling you could see Rose adjust his game a little bit after the injury. Not sure the way he was playing was going to be sustainable long-term. You don't want to over-react to the ACL, because it also happened to guys playing different styles (e.g. Rondo, Rubio), but he was starting to get banged up before that too.

Maybe look at Tony Parker as a model, dual-threat of scorer/passer off the pick-and-roll, rather than primarily a scorer, as he's been up to now. I think that might be a more sustainable style of play, and someone like LaMarcus Aldridge could be a good partner for that (you could still go to Aldridge in the post as well, and have Rose play off that).

I'm sure Rose isn't going to go totally away from the style that won him the MVP, but some comments he made while out injured (can't remember the exact quotes now), made me think he'd adjust his style a bit.

Agreed.

Rose, to me anyway, seems like the type of guy who would facilitate if it gave the team a better chance of winning. As it was, when he was fit, our best chance of winning was to let him basically do everything, but if we got another player in who likes the ball in his hands a bit more like Aldridge, I think Rose would adjust to that without too much hassle.

He has his big contract, he has his shoe deal. He's made for life now financially, the next step is a ring and I'm sure he'd do what it takes to win.

stuba

Adrian Wojnarowski reporting that the Celtics and Nets are trying to work out a trade with Garnett, Pierce and Terry to Brooklyn and Humphries, Wallace, Bogans, Evans, Shengalia and 3 first round picks going to Boston.

Could be the massive overhaul Celtics are looking for. An expensive deal for the Nets too. A Williams, Iso-Joe, Pierce, Garnett, Lopez starting 5 would be interesting even if it was only for a year, or 2 max.