Would you support the reintroduction of the death penalty?

Amirani · 18-03-2014 1:07pm

on the river wrote: »

being on a holiday camp for 20 years is not

justise just expense for the taxpayer and a nice break for the crimnial.

Have you ever been to prison? No? Then it would appear you don't have a clue what your talking about in relation to prison conditions.

on the river · 18-03-2014 1:08pm

NiallSparky wrote: »

Have you ever been to prison? No? Then it would appear you don't have a clue what your talking about in relation to prison conditions.

Did you?. if so Please enlighten me about prison life.

Amirani · 18-03-2014 1:10pm

on the river wrote: »

Did you?. if so Please enlighten me about prison life.

I've never been to prison no, but I'm not the one claiming I know exactly what the conditions are like in there.

You on the other hand seem to know all about them. Well, either that or you're content on posting sensationalist rubbish that adds nothing to the discussion.

kryogen · 18-03-2014 1:11pm

In theory yes

on the river · 18-03-2014 1:24pm

NiallSparky wrote: »

I've never been to prison no, but I'm not the one claiming I know exactly what the conditions are like in there.

You on the other hand seem to know all about them. Well, either that or you're content on posting sensationalist rubbish that adds nothing to the discussion.

John Lonergan was former governor of Mountjoy. It was him who raised the

issues of prison conditions and overcrowding.

The most 'sensational' thing is many high profile offenders are able to walk

free after 10 years in prison. while the victims try to cope with their attacker been released.

Crime is a serious matter and should not be called 'senationalist rubbish'

the death penalty is the only answer for victims who suffered

the trama and pain of their assalt. Many families suffer everyday

knowing that criminals walk free while their family member is either dead

or at breaking point .

Many victims cannot speak of their pain and hurt and left wondering about

how unfair the justise system really is .

Amirani · 18-03-2014 1:25pm

on the river wrote: »

John Lonergan was former governor of Mountjoy. It was him who raised the

issues of prison conditions and overcrowding.

The most 'sensational' thing is many high profile offenders are able to walk

free after 10 years in prison. while the victims try to cope with their attacker been released.

Crime is a serious matter and should not be called 'senationalist rubbish'

the death penalty is the only answer for victims who suffered

the trama and pain of their assalt. Many families suffer everyday

knowing that criminals walk free while their family member is either dead

or at breaking point .

Many victims cannot speak of their pain and hurt and left wondering about

how unfair the justise system .

What does any of that have to do with prison conditions?

on the river · 18-03-2014 1:34pm

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Another one who can't be bothered to read the argument in the article posted -

the victims are the only ones that suffer. i think their attacker should suffer too in the form of the death penalty.

the problem is the state 'could not be bothered' to serve a proper sentence on these criminals which leads to reoffending.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 1:41pm

on the river wrote: »

the victims are the only ones that suffer. i think their attacker should suffer too in the form of the death penalty.

the problem is the state 'could not be bothered' to serve a proper sentence on these criminals which leads to reoffending.

Apart from the mass speculation and unresearched opinion, what does any of this have to do with the news story you linked to, your post, or the reply of mine which you quoted? Seriously, I could tear your entire theory apart in two words, but because it's so bady presented, I'm not entirely sure I'd be accurate.

end of the road · 18-03-2014 3:44pm

on the river wrote: »

The tax payer would save millions on reintroducing the death penalty.

wrong, evidence shows it costs way more.

on the river wrote: »

Overcrowding solved in a shot

wrong

on the river wrote: »

Crime rates decrease dramatically

wrong, the evidence shows that the death penalty has no effect on crime rates

on the river wrote: »

Crime gangs would leave the country in fear of their lives.

considering the risk of members of these gangs being shot anywhere at anytime is very high yet many stick around, that shows that that statement is complete nonsense

end of the road · 18-03-2014 3:53pm

on the river wrote: »

John Lonergan was former governor of Mountjoy. It was him who raised the issues of prison conditions and overcrowding.

and John Lonergan is a man who knows what he is talking about and is well respected because he has actually experienced the system, unlike you

on the river wrote: »

the death penalty is the only answer for victims who suffered

the trama and pain of their assalt.
the death penalty isn't an answer to anything, hense why many countries don't have it

J_E · 18-03-2014 4:13pm

on the river wrote: »

the victims are the only ones that suffer. i think their attacker should suffer too in the form of the death penalty.

the problem is the state 'could not be bothered' to serve a proper sentence on these criminals which leads to reoffending.

Do you think long-term imprisonment is a holiday or something? You'd swear criminals want to hop into jail with the way you talk about it.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 4:49pm

Cydoniac wrote: »

Do you think long-term imprisonment is a holiday or something? You'd swear criminals want to hop into jail with the way you talk about it.

When John Gilligan left prision after spending 17 years there he looked like someone who had just spent a few weeks in the sun.

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 4:54pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

When John Gilligan left prision after spending 17 years there he looked like someone who had just spent a few weeks in the sun.

Have you seen his picture in the Independent...

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 4:55pm

end of the road wrote: »

and John Lonergan is a man who knows what he is talking about and is well respected because he has actually experienced the system,

John Lonergan is a lunatic. I remenmber when Larry Murphy was released from prison Lonergan was on the radio and said Larry Murphy should be "left alone" yes you heard it right Larry Murphy should be "left alone". Lonergan is completely mad its no wonder the prison system is the way it is with the likes of him running it.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 4:56pm

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Have you seen his picture in the Independent...

Yes he has suffered more in the past few weeks than the 17 years he spent in prison.

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 4:59pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Yes he has suffered more in the past few weeks than the 17 years he spent in prison.

Did he tell you that when you visited his house with a pitchfork?

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 5:01pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

John Lonergan is a lunatic. I remenmber when Larry Murphy was released from prison Lonergan was on the radio and said Larry Murphy should be "left alone" yes you heard it right Larry Murphy should be "left alone". Lonergan is completely mad its no wonder the prison system is the way it is with the likes of him running it.

What do you suggest in the alternative?

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 5:05pm

OldNotWIse wrote: »

What do you suggest in the alternative?

At the very least the public need to be aware of his movements.

But if we listen to John Lonergan he should be free to run wild in the community:rolleyes:

JuliusCaesar · 18-03-2014 5:08pm

No, I would absolutely NOT support any reintroduction of the death penalty.

JuliusCaesar · 18-03-2014 5:09pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

But if we listen to John Lonergan he should be free to run wild in the community:rolleyes:

"Run wild"??? Where, exactly, did John Lonergan say that? Please do give the source. There's a big difference between 'left alone' and 'free to run wild'. I can believe that Lonergan spoke against vigilantee-ism; but sure Larry Murphy was under observation by the Gardaí.

end of the road · 18-03-2014 5:09pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

When John Gilligan left prision after spending 17 years there he looked like someone who had just spent a few weeks in the sun.

no he didn't

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 5:13pm

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

"Run wild"??? Where, exactly, did John Lonergan say that? Please do give the source. There's a big difference between 'left alone' and 'free to run wild'. I can believe that Lonergan spoke against vigilantee-ism; but sure Larry Murphy was under observation by the Gardaí.

He said Larry Murphy should be "left alone" which means letting him roam free in the community.

end of the road · 18-03-2014 5:13pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

John Lonergan is a lunatic.

no he's not, he's well respected and knows what he's talking about unlike tabloid types

Mr Williams wrote: »

I remenmber when Larry Murphy was released from prison Lonergan was on the radio and said Larry Murphy should be "left alone" yes you heard it right Larry Murphy should be "left alone".

and he was right, he should be left alone apart from the guardai monitoring him

Mr Williams wrote: »

Lonergan is completely mad

no he's not.

Mr Williams wrote: »

its no wonder the prison system is the way it is with the likes of him running it.

oh? well at least he has ran a prison, you haven't and never will, so i'd take whatever he says over you any day, now go away, your tabloid style nonsense is boaring everyone

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 5:14pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

At the very least the public need to be aware of his movements.

But if we listen to John Lonergan he should be free to run wild in the community:rolleyes:

Run wild in the community? Sensationalise much?? Is it ok if he walks calmly and at a moderate pace?

Like it or not, he has done his time and there is no legal provision for following his every move. I guess the supervisory mechanism you have in mind is the tabloid type - pictures of him wearing a hoody ducking into or out of a train station, and hysterical facebook warnings about "recent sightings". Sorry but that doesn't help anyone, it just fuels the mob mentality.

He is on the sex offenders reg. He's hardly likely to be given a job where he will be a danger to others. He will also probably be required to sign on in garda stations at frequent intervals.

What do you want? Larry Murphy FM that broadcasts an updated location every thirty seconds? Have you any idea how much man power and revenue that would cost? Not to mention the elephant in the room thats jumping up and down saying, "knowing where one sex offender is will not keep you safe. We must all be vigilante for our own safety all of the time".

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 5:15pm

JuliusCaesar wrote: »

"Run wild"??? Where, exactly, did John Lonergan say that? Please do give the source. There's a big difference between 'left alone' and 'free to run wild'. I can believe that Lonergan spoke against vigilantee-ism; but sure Larry Murphy was under observation by the Gardaí.

I think there was a book called that. Something about foxes...? Run Wild, Run Free?

end of the road · 18-03-2014 5:17pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

He said Larry Murphy should be "left alone" which means letting him roam free in the community.

no it doesn't, wrong again

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 5:17pm

end of the road wrote: »

no he didn't

Really ?

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 5:21pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Really ?

I'm not really sure what exactly you are trying to prove with this picture. "He looks too good...send him back in for another stint"??

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 5:22pm

OldNotWIse wrote: »

I'm not really sure what exactly you are trying to prove with this picture. "He looks too good...send him back in for another stint"??

He looks like somebody who has just come back from a nice holiday.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 5:24pm

end of the road wrote: »

no it doesn't, wrong again

Lonergan does not believe the public have a right to know where Larry Murphy is.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 5:27pm

OldNotWIse wrote: »

Run wild in the community? Sensationalise much?? Is it ok if he walks calmly and at a moderate pace?

Like it or not, he has done his time and there is no legal provision for following his every move. I guess the supervisory mechanism you have in mind is the tabloid type - pictures of him wearing a hoody ducking into or out of a train station, and hysterical facebook warnings about "recent sightings". Sorry but that doesn't help anyone, it just fuels the mob mentality.

He is on the sex offenders reg. He's hardly likely to be given a job where he will be a danger to others. He will also probably be required to sign on in garda stations at frequent intervals.

What do you want? Larry Murphy FM that broadcasts an updated location every thirty seconds? Have you any idea how much man power and revenue that would cost? Not to mention the elephant in the room thats jumping up and down saying, "knowing where one sex offender is will not keep you safe. We must all be vigilante for our own safety all of the time".

It wouldn't cost anything for the public to keep tabs on Larry Murphy.

Would you not want to know if Larry Murphy was living in your area ?

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 5:32pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

It wouldn't cost anything for the public to keep tabs on Larry Murphy.

Would you not want to know if Larry Murphy was living in your area ?

For the public to keep tabs on him? Ah now I have you. We are all supposed to stop what we are doing and jump on the bandwagon and spread hysteria for the sake of it. Did it ever occur to you that some of us have jobs and study and lives that we want to get on with? That we are happy with the judiciary doing their job, and we will do whatever we can to keep ourselves and our loved ones safe, as we would whether it is Larry Murphy or Mary Poppins living beside us? That bricking someone's window/following them around the supermarket/posting "white van" messages on our female friends fb profiles does not actually keep anyone safe??

I have a category of people in my head that fit your description. I call them "It's a disgrace Joe".

Holsten · 18-03-2014 5:32pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Would you not want to know if Larry Murphy was living in your area ?

I know I wouldn't.

Ignorance is bliss in this situation.

You're more in danger of nearly anyone else than you are of Larry Murphy. You could possibly have a murderer, rapist, bugler living right next to you right now, Mr. Williams.

OldNotWIse · 18-03-2014 5:32pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

He looks like somebody who has just come back from a nice holiday.

I've come back from boozey holidays looking worse

on the river · 18-03-2014 5:34pm

end of the road wrote: »

and John Lonergan is a man who knows what he is talking about and is well respected because he has actually experienced the system, unlike you
the trama and pain of their assalt.
the death penalty isn't an answer to anything, hense why many countries don't have it

firstly you say my argument is wrong without giving any alternative suggestions.

secondly you endorse criminals to continue on their inspeakable ways by

saying it . 'isnt the answer'.

It seems you dont hold any views on this topic whatsoever.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 6:33pm

Heres another good candidate for the death penalty.

Why should the people of east wall have to live in fear of this animal ?

http://www.thestar.ie/star/sicko-sex-beat-back-on-the-streets-35667/

end of the road · 18-03-2014 6:51pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Lonergan does not believe the public have a right to know where Larry Murphy is.

and i agree with him, i'm not having ferrel vidulanty vermin roming around like wild animals, its much easier and cost effective to keep the system we have of not informing the public

end of the road · 18-03-2014 6:54pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

It wouldn't cost anything for the public to keep tabs on Larry Murphy.

it ultimately would, the public are not qualified enough to do such a job, it must be left to the experts aka the guardai to do such a job.

Mr Williams wrote: »

Would you not want to know if Larry Murphy was living in your area ?

couldn't care to be honest, if a guarda told me in confidents that he was in my area i could actually be trusted with the information and trusted to keep it to myself unlike the tabloid types

end of the road · 18-03-2014 6:57pm

on the river wrote: »

firstly you say my argument is wrong without giving any alternative suggestions.

secondly you endorse criminals to continue on their inspeakable ways by

saying it . 'isnt the answer'.

It seems you dont hold any views on this topic whatsoever.

go back and read the thread, i've all ready given my views, i'm not repeating myself over and over again like you and mr williams, same thing over and over again, boaring

on the river · 18-03-2014 7:37pm

end of the road wrote: »

go back and read the thread, i've all ready given my views, i'm not repeating myself over and over again like you and mr williams, same thing over and over again, boaring

could not find anything only the response of negative posting of pointing out

what posters said wrong and giving no opinion at all yourself.

frankly this is boring . by repeating yourself you are just going round in circles with no clear logic.

mrsbyrne · 18-03-2014 7:46pm

The reality is none of us know who or what lives amongst us. If we've learned anything over the last 20 years it should be that.
I'm not saying we should be walking around in fear and trepidation just be sensible and be safe especially with kids
No death penalty.

Amirani · 18-03-2014 8:37pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Heres another good candidate for the death penalty.

Why should the people of east wall have to live in fear of this animal ?

http://www.thestar.ie/star/sicko-sex-beat-back-on-the-streets-35667/

As has been pointed out previously, capital punishment for sex offences causes an increase in murdered rape victims.

You clearly care nothing about victims and only about your lust for blood.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 8:45pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

He looks like somebody who has just come back from a nice holiday.

Do you know exactly what conditions he was held under? I mean actually "know" - not have read in some trashy tabloid or imagined because you think it migth help your point?

If so, please tell. If not, you are in no position to criticise either the prison service or its personnel (current or past).

J_E · 18-03-2014 9:13pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Heres another good candidate for the death penalty.

Why should the people of east wall have to live in fear of this animal ?

http://www.thestar.ie/star/sicko-sex-beat-back-on-the-streets-35667/

Ah yeah, link a Star article, that's pretty legit citation there.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock · 18-03-2014 9:14pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

Heres another good candidate for the death penalty.

Why should the people of east wall have to live in fear of this animal ?

http://www.thestar.ie/star/sicko-sex-beat-back-on-the-streets-35667/

How about these guys? Should these "beasts" have been executed?

on the river wrote: »

could not find anything only the response of negative posting of pointing out

what posters said wrong and giving no opinion at all yourself.

frankly this is boring . by repeating yourself you are just going round in circles with no clear logic.

Here ya go, from a few months ago:

I oppose the death penalty on three counts, all of which I have stated numerous times in this thread:
1 - Fallability.
2 - Cost (both of appeals and leaving the EU).
3 - Pointlessness.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 10:02pm

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Do you know exactly what conditions he was held under? I mean actually "know" - not have read in some trashy tabloid or imagined because you think it migth help your point?

If so, please tell. If not, you are in no position to criticise either the prison service or its personnel (current or past).

Gilligan and his pals look like they were having the time of their lives inside Portlaoise prison.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 10:05pm

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

How about these guys? Should these "beasts" have been executed?

What did they do ?

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 10:06pm

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

How about these guys? Should these "beasts" have been executed?

Here ya go, from a few months ago:

I oppose the death penalty on three counts, all of which I have stated numerous times in this thread:
1 - Fallability.
2 - Cost (both of appeals and leaving the EU).
3 - Pointlessness.

A rope or a bullet doesnt cost much.

Mr Williams · 18-03-2014 10:10pm

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Do you know exactly what conditions he was held under? I mean actually "know" - not have read in some trashy tabloid or imagined because you think it migth help your point?

If so, please tell. If not, you are in no position to criticise either the prison service or its personnel (current or past).

I'm not the only one who thinks Lonergan is a useless waster.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/kevin-myers/how-can-the-governor-of-western-europes-worst-and-most-violent-prison-become-a-media-luvvie-26530883.html

Amirani · 18-03-2014 10:13pm

Mr Williams wrote: »

I'm not the only one who thinks Lonergan is a useless waster.

http://www.independent.ie/opinion/columnists/kevin-myers/how-can-the-governor-of-western-europes-worst-and-most-violent-prison-become-a-media-luvvie-26530883.html

And what does Kevin Myers know about the running of prisons?

Regardless, he's actually criticising the conditions in Mountjoy. Hardly backs up the holiday camp argument.

Would you support the reintroduction of the death penalty?

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