Firebird Super Q HW /HW+CH switch??

GHGW

Hi was looking for some advice on the following.

I have a Firebird Super Q 50-90 indoor boiler fully functioning no problems and serviced each year with Reillo burner.

There is a switch on the unit that allows user to select "HW only or HW and CH".

I know a zone controller would be required fitted to allow it to work per the boiler manual. I'm assuming the Zone controller shuts off the Radiator circuit and leaves the line running through the hot water tank open only?

At the moment both switch settings result in Heating and Hot Water.

My questions are..

1 How much hassle is it to fit a zone controller to the Rad line?

2 Would it require completely draining the rad system to fit in the zone controller?

3 Also how much to fit one approx?

4 How does the boiler receive a thermostat signal from the hot water tank to shut down or is it the usual termo on the boiler that shuts off when the water circulating is at 65 degrees in the circuit?

5 Could I DIY it myself?



In winter we use the boiler for heating and hot water with a few night hours of additional timed immersion. (large 42 inch tank) In summer I would prefer to just hit this HW only switch and let the system continue heating the tank for an hour or two daily without heating the rads also and turning the house into a sauna. Also is very handy if we want a small boost to ensure the tank is full throughout as it heats from the bottom and the bath tub is big.

Any advice much appreciated.

corkplumber

you would need to fit a motorised valve and cylinder stat. a room stat for zone heating and a motorised valve.

if the system is open vented . better getting in a pro. the system will need to be drained regardless.

Boiler lock out aswell would be important to stop short cycling and a balancing valved may be required.

GHGW

Thanks Cork plumber seems very complicated.

A few things..

I'm not looking to zone my house I just want to be able to use the "HW // HW and CH" switch to turn off the rads in summer.

You sure a motorized valve connected to the rad circuit closing it off at back of the boiler wont just do that?

The Firebird manual seems to say it will but perhaps its just painting a very simple picture.

corkplumber

GHGW wrote: »

Thanks Cork plumber seems very complicated.

A few things..

I'm not looking to zone my house I just want to be able to use the "HW // HW and CH" switch to turn off the rads in summer.

You sure a motorized valve connected to the rad circuit closing it off at back of the boiler wont just do that?

The Firebird manual seems to say it will but perhaps its just painting a very simple picture.

thats how its done. you can have a 3 port valve instead. but its all the same princible.

corkplumber

if you wanted to do it yourself. insolate rads and water. best to get a cylinder pipe stat and put termostatic rad valves on the rads. be careful and get advice if its an open vented system.

this will allow you to heat water to a required temp or isolate. the trvs will isolate space heating and you can just heat cylinder. It may still need a balancing valve.

this will not be controlled with your timer. but manually.

GHGW

Thanks for advice.

My plumbing knowledge is low so a lot of what your saying is very complicated to me.

I believe I have a vented hot water system with a sealed rad system if that makes sense.

So say i wanted to isolate/switch off the rad circuit right now manually is there a valve on the system behind my boiler to allow me manually lock out the rads but leave the line running up into my hot water cylinder open to heat when the boiler is switched on?

I'm assuming there should be manual valves on both in case a boiler ever needs to be removed/replaced or is it not standard practice?

corkplumber

not unless a summer manual valve was fitted to isolate the rads. usually requires a seperate flow pipe to the cylinder or a 4 pipe system.

your system is probably 2 pipes heats all. runs around a circuit heating rads and cylinder. In this case no you cant.

your heating system is sealed fully pumped with an expansion vessel and pump.


if you turn off one side of your each radiator. (turn to the right). this will allow only your cylinder to heat.

GHGW

Thanks looks like a 2 pipe system only so not a simple job.

The hassle of turning off all the valves every summer and back on would drive me mad especially as I adjusted them all for each room over the last few years.

Will have to get a pro in to have a proper look soon.

One last question unrelated to above.. can you tell me what length immersion should be in a 42 inch top entry tank.

I wanted to fit a 36 inch with dual elements and 18 inch stat.

When it was installed by a friend a few months back the tank size doubled but I think he only fitted teh old 27 inch and its only heating the top section of the tank.

Don't notice it in winter when the central heating is on and the immersion but in summer with no rads running we run out of hot water fast as we have a 3 bar shower fitted.

Cheers.

corkplumber

23/24 inch dual would be sufficent.

your issue maybe is your immersion stats are set to low . remove the cover and check its setting.

sorry didnt read your post in full. need a bigger hot water storage area. if you have a 3 bar shower with a pump fitted.otherwise quick shower. in and out.

GHGW

Have tried all settings up and down on the stat with no change.

Also tried sink and bath switch and it is less hot water available for sink setting and more for bath.

Used to have about same amount of hot water with the old tank so Im guessing the immersion is too short.

On some other sites I see it suggested that the tank will only ever heat to length of immersion and no deeper even with convection in the tank. So I'm assuming a 36 inch immersion will solve the issue.

Is a 36 inch OK to fit in a 42 inch tank some sites are say you need 7-8 inches below the immersion in my case it would be only 6 inches (42 inch tank 36 inch immersion)

corkplumber

GHGW wrote: »

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Is a 36 inch OK to fit in a 42 inch tank some sites are say you need 7-8 inches below the immersion in my case it would be only 6 inches (42 inch tank 36 inch immersion)

I dont think you will fit a 36 inch immersion into a 42 X 18 cylinder. best of luck if you can. never tried it. usually twin immersion cylinders are used.