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The Jobbridge Scandal

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    #4022
    Tombi!
    Registered Users Posts: 6,689 ✭✭✭Tombi!


    dxhound2005 wrote: »
    There are currently 2772 vacancies nationally, 62 in County Louth. There must be 15,000 unemployed in Louth. How does the Dole pick out which unemployed person they will force on to a placement? It must be a bit of a lottery.

    AFAIK you can be forced to apply but not to go on one. They can say "we got you an interview at X. Go to it" and that's that. If you don't get the spot then it's not your fault. You can act like a goddamn idiot and not get it.


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    #4023
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    I thought it was to bypass the minimum wage? According to you?

    It's both. Graduates need experience but companies are unwilling to put out entry level positions since our minimum wage laws are so high. Jobbridge lets them bypass the minimum wage and take on workers they wouldn't otherwise be able to.

    The graduate for their part receives experience in their chosen field which puts them at an advantage over other graduates and when finished jobbridge they will be eligible for jobsplus which gives the company a financial incentive to offer the graduate a full time job.


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    #4024
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    It's both.

    No it's not.


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    #4025
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    No it's not.

    It is. See above for details.


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    #4026
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    It is. See above for details.

    No it's not. Not matter how much you type wrong stuff it still doesn't make it correct.

    As I said companies that abuse the scheme should be barred. It's a pity there are people in the world who would want someone working for less than the minimum wage.


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    #4027
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    No it's not.

    It is. See above for details


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    #4028
    Grandpa Hassan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭Grandpa Hassan


    Daith wrote: »
    No because an internship is not a job and is not classified as a job.

    To do so would be against what the scheme is for. If the company is unwilling to create a job it shouldn't use this scheme to bypass the minimum wage.

    That's exactly what the scheme is supposed to do. A company can't afford to bring someone in on a permanent basis on minimum wage so an internship provides an opportunity for someone to get experience AND possibly help the company to grow so that it can create a job.

    S


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    #4029
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Grandpa Hassan wrote: »
    That's exactly what the scheme is supposed to do. A company can't afford to bring someone in on a permanent basis on minimum wage so an internship provides an opportunity for someone to get experience AND possibly help the company to grow so that it can create a job.

    S

    I've highlighted the relevant point. To create a job. Not have the intern perform that job.


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    #4030
    Grandpa Hassan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭Grandpa Hassan


    Daith wrote: »
    No because an internship is not a job and is not classified as a job.

    To do so would be against what the scheme is for. If the company is unwilling to create a job it shouldn't use this scheme to bypass the minimum wage.

    That's exactly what the scheme is supposed to do. A company can't afford to bring someone in on a permanent basis on minimum wage so an internship provides an opportunity for someone to get experience AND possibly help the company to grow so that it can create a job.

    Some companies abuse it, and these should be called out and punished. Also people don't have to do those nonsense internships.


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    #4031
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Grandpa Hassan wrote: »
    Some companies abuse it, and these should be called out and punished. Also people don't have to do those nonsense internships.

    Abuse it by having the intern do an actual job to bypass the minimum wage.


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    #4032
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    No it's not. Not matter how much you type wrong stuff it still doesn't make it correct.

    As I said companies that abuse the scheme should be barred. It's a pity there are people in the world who would want someone working for less than the minimum wage.
    What I posted is exactly how the scheme works. Now you may think that's not true but you would be wrong.

    The scheme does work. There are success stories but you have to be a hard worker the company would be mad to loose.


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    #4033
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    What I posted is exactly how the scheme works. Now you may think that's not true but you would be wrong.

    The scheme is not there for employers to bypass the min wage. You are wrong. Again.

    Companies that do that should be reported.


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    #4034
    Grandpa Hassan
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭Grandpa Hassan


    Daith wrote: »
    I've highlighted the relevant point. To create a job. Not have the intern perform that job.

    Where did I say the intern was performing the job? The intern does an internship as the company can't afford to create a job. And maybe that leads to the creation of a job if the intern helps the company, And if not then they have got some experience

    It is simply not true to say that every internship replaces a job.

    Some do, for sure, and these should be reported


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    #4035
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Grandpa Hassan wrote: »
    Where did I say the intern was performing the job? The intern does an internship as the company can't afford to create a job. And maybe that leads to the creation of a job if the intern helps the company, And if not then they have got some experience

    No I was highlighting your correct point. It may create a job but is not a job.
    Grandpa Hassan wrote: »
    It is simply not true to say that every internship replaces a job.

    Some do, for sure, and these should be reported

    I agreed with you here.


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    #4036
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    The scheme is not there for employers to bypass the min wage. You are wrong. Again.

    Yes it is. That's exactly what the scheme is for. The scheme works by allowing employers to bypass minimum wage laws and take on people in graduate level positions they wouldn't otherwise be able to.

    This is a win win situation since the graduate gets experience that puts him at an advantage over other graduates and the company gets to grow off the extra labor.


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    #4037
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    Yes it is. That's exactly what the scheme is for. The scheme works by allowing employers to bypass minimum wage laws and take on people in graduate level positions they wouldn't otherwise be able to.
    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    The purpose of jobbridge is to provide entry level positions in which companies are unwilling to pay minimum wage.

    Entry level/graduate level are jobs not work placements. Jesus.

    Using a job bridge internship to replace an entry level job is not what the scheme is for.


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    #4038
    Tombi!
    Registered Users Posts: 6,689 ✭✭✭Tombi!


    The scheme was made for people to get experience. That's all. There is an incentive for people to take someone on Jobbridge due to it being free labour.

    That's where it ends. It is not to replace jobs or paid internships. To think it's to bypass the minimum wage laws shows how and why companies are taking advantage of the scheme by refusing to advertise jobs as jobs and instead requiring you to work, for no wage at all, by being a waiter, car washer, a salesman or whatever

    And before anyone thinks to say "well you get paid an extra fifty euro so that's your wage", you're still below the minimum wage and if you or anyone else makes an internship just so you don't have to pay someone but can afford to pay someone, you're scum

    There was a user here who did hire two interns I think it was because at the start should could not afford, but needed employees and watned to train them into the job via Jobbridge. So she did just that. Which is something that scheme is for. It is not for people to replace jobs with.


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    #4039
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    Entry level/graduate level are jobs not work placements. Jesus.

    Using a job bridge internship to replace an entry level job is not what the scheme is for.
    They are jobs yes. But the company may not be able to take on as many graduates as they might like due to our draconian minimum wage laws. This is detrimental to the company and the graduate.

    Allowing the company to bypass minimum wage laws allows them to take on more people than they otherwise could which as I've explained in my last post is win win.

    And don't call me Jesus.


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    #4040
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    They are jobs yes. But the company may not be able to take on as many graduates as they might like due to our draconian minimum wage laws. This is detrimental to the company and the graduate.

    Allowing the company to bypass minimum wage laws allows them to take on more people than they otherwise could which as I've explained in my last post is win win.

    It's not win win because the intern should be getting the min wage. Graduate/entry level jobs have always had a limit for numbers. This limits them further.


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    #4041
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    It's not win win because the intern should be getting the min wage. Graduate/entry level jobs have always had a limit for numbers. This limits them further.

    It limits their pay but pay isn't important at that level. It increases their chances of getting experience however and that's worth way more than money at that stage in your life.


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    #4042
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    It limits their pay but pay isn't important at that level. It increases their chances of getting experience however and that's worth way more than money at that stage in your life.

    No no. You see the job should have being a paying job but the company decided to save some money so now it's a job masquerading as an internship which is against the whole point of the scheme.


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    #4043
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    No no. You see the job should have being a paying job but the company decided to save some money so now it's a job masquerading as an internship which is against the whole point of the scheme.

    The point of the scheme is to allow the company to take on more people than they otherwise would be able to.

    So more graduates get experience than would otherwise.


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    #4044
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    The point of the scheme is to allow the company to take on more people than they otherwise would be able to.

    No it's to allow a job to take on an intern. You are really not getting this.

    How are you so sure the company can't afford to? How are you sure they just want to save money but they could easily hire them at an actual wage?


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    #4045
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    No it's to allow a job to take on an intern. You are really not getting this.

    How are you so sure the company can't afford to? How are you sure they just want to save money but they could easily hire them at an actual wage?

    The company may or may not be able to take on graduates but removing the cost allows them to take on more than they otherwise would be able to. Which means more graduates gain experience.


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    #4046
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    The company may or may not be able to take on graduates but removing the cost allows them to take on more than they otherwise would be able to. Which means more graduates gain experience.

    As interns. Not doing the same job as other people actually hired yes? Cos it's just a work placement for those guys.

    Intern ≠ job/graduate position/entry level


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    #4047
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    As interns. Not doing the same job as other people actually hired yes?

    As interns. What jobs they'll be doing depends on the company obviously.


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    #4048
    Daith
    Registered Users Posts: 4,955 ✭✭✭Daith


    Iwasfrozen wrote: »
    As interns. What jobs they'll be doing depends on the company obviously.

    Right because they're on work placements not in graduate level jobs. Good stuff!


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    #4049
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Daith wrote: »
    Right because they're on work placements not in graduate level jobs. Good stuff!
    They're gaining experience that puts them at an advantage over other graduates. That's the only thing that matters.


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    #4050
    pharmaton
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,192 ✭✭✭pharmaton


    Beekay wrote: »
    I posted up about six months ago that I got myself an jobridge internship as a front-end web developer/graphic designer.

    I had no experience. Had completed a four month course in digital web design in FAS and was just after starting a 6 month part-time night course in web development in NCI.

    Just under a month left and I'm glad to report the experience has been great and the company offered me a position full-time.

    Sounds good. I've posted repetitively about the positives of my internship but it seems that only those who haven't done one and those who disapprove of the current Government and economic policies really get a say in what is right or wrong about them. It's bonkers.

    The post earlier about someone doing 80 something hours having been forced into an internship as part of a FAS course has got to be the most purest form of bs i have read yet. You can't do a FAS course and an internship together, its basic stuff. You can't exceed more than 40 hours and you can't be forced to do an internship by the local DSP. There are rigorous interview processes and in some cases aptitude tests and for many positions, especially those in the public sector, garda clearance and not forgetting those which require some previous qualification or relevance in the area.
    I went through several interview processes and clearance before being finally accepted, I veritably campaigned for the post as I knew the experience would be invaluable and an addition to my skillset.

    If you really want to find out about internships the only way to really do that is to apply for one.
    I'm not suggesting all internships are going to be that good but there certainly does appear to be a huge smear campaign from the anti job bridge brigade across on boards. I can't be bothered even reading half the shet about it anymore.


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    #4051
    Iwasfrozen
    Registered Users Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭Iwasfrozen


    Great post I would say when people are having a hard time finding employment it's easy to blame someone or some thing else instead of asking themselves why they didn't get the job and how can they improve themselves.

    Jobbridge is a convenient scapegoat for people.


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