The Jobbridge Scandal

entropi

flutered wrote: »

not a nice remark, especially from a mod

Mods are regular posters too, you know. Especially so when outside of their own forum/fora.

flutered

entropi wrote: »

Mods are regular posters too, you know. Especially so when outside of their own forum/fora.

that should not matter, a mod should be above reproach, regardless of the fourm, i have got many a pm for less, which is one of the reasons i rarely post on boards any more, one law for mods another for..

Iwasfrozen

flutered wrote: »

that should not matter, a mod should be above reproach, regardless of the fourm, i have got many a pm for less, which is one of the reasons i rarely post on boards any more, one law for mods another for..

He didn't post anything wrong.

flutered

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

He didn't post anything wrong.

no, just a sly dig

Iwasfrozen

flutered wrote: »

no, just a sly dig

Are we supposed to ban sly digs in after hours?

JONJO THE MISER

Ye can thank F.G for this,will never vote for them again.
No matter how bad F.F were they never had schemes where they made people work for nothing, its all part of there scheme to turn us more like America, where workers can be treated like **** and cut down on entitlements, FG were always economic right wing.

Iwasfrozen

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

Ye can thank F.G for this,will never vote for them again.
No matter how bad F.F were they never had schemes where they made people work for nothing, its all part of there scheme to turn us more like America, where workers can be treated like **** and cut down on entitlements, FG were always economic right wing.

Actually jobbridge is Burton's pet so if you're going to blame anyone...

entropi

flutered wrote: »

that should not matter, a mod should be above reproach, regardless of the fourm, i have got many a pm for less, which is one of the reasons i rarely post on boards any more, one law for mods another for..

Above reproach? Mods are not immaculate or flawless, regardless of what you think. We know that standards should be set and met, but that being said, we are not automatons and tend to have some fun every now and again, this includes posting comments just like many others would. We follow the same set of rules as everyone else here, so no, there is no separate law that caters for mods. This is the last thing I'll post about on this matter.

By the way, I seen no sly dig in that post either.


Back on topic: this scheme was Burton and Bruton's lovechild, wasn't it? If it was not for the abuse by a lot of companies trying to get out of paying a minimum wage to people, it would work as intended (as a way for recent graduates to gain experience).

Not a NSA agent

JONJO THE MISER wrote: »

Ye can thank F.G for this,will never vote for them again.
No matter how bad F.F were they never had schemes where they made people work for nothing, its all part of there scheme to turn us more like America, where workers can be treated like **** and cut down on entitlements, FG were always economic right wing.

Its labour, not FG. Hence why I wont go near labour.

_Tombstone_

Not a NSA agent wrote: »

Its labour, not FG. Hence why I wont go near labour.

They're all the same, how do you not realise this.

MuchoLoco

Doing a 9 month internship to be paid minimum wage when completed fxxx this greedy country

PopePalpatine

^ Expect the Randroids Jobbridge shills to ignore you.

Iwasfrozen

MuchoLoco wrote: »

Doing a 9 month internship to be paid minimum wage when completed fxxx this greedy country

Surely the greedy person is the one who wants more money?

If the minimum wage in this country weren't so prohibitively high we wouldn't need jobbridge to give graduates a chance.

_Tombstone_

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Surely the greedy person is the one who wants more money?

If the minimum wage in this country weren't so prohibitively high we wouldn't need jobbridge to give graduates a chance.

It needs to go up to €11.50

‘Living wage’ set at €11.50, a third more than minimum wage

Burton expects report to call for minimum wage increase

OECD: Ireland’s minimum wage lags behind median wage

Iwasfrozen

_Tombstone_ wrote: »

It needs to go up to €11.50

‘Living wage’ set at €11.50, a third more than minimum wage

Burton expects report to call for minimum wage increase

OECD: Ireland’s minimum wage lags behind median wage

So everyone worth less than 11.50 an hour loses their job? Great idea.

If a person can't get a minimum wage job they're not worth 18k. They may be worth 15k or 13k and be willing to work for this amount. But the minimum wage prevents them from doing this and instead forces them into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

_Tombstone_

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

So everyone worth less than 11.50 an hour loses their job? Great idea.

If a person can't get a minimum wage job they're not worth 18k. They may be worth 15k or 13k and be willing to work for this amount. But the minimum wage prevents them from doing this and instead forces them into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

Minimum wage jobs have turned into jobbridges.

Iwasfrozen

_Tombstone_ wrote: »

Minimum wage jobs have turned into jobbridges.

Exactly. And your idea would force even more people into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

Instead scrap jobbridge and scrap the minimum wage. Allow those who are worth <18k a chance to gain experience in the work place and the capital necessary to fund further training / education instead of being forced into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

Xenji

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Exactly. And your idea would force even more people into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

Instead scrap jobbridge and scrap the minimum wage. Allow those who are worth <18k a chance to gain experience in the work place and the capital necessary to fund further training / education instead of being forced into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

With the cost of living and extortionate prices you find in this country, a job paying below the minimum wage is not going to allow you to fund further training or education, unless you are paying no bills, live rent free, have no car or social life and even then you will be saving for years.

This also would make many more people homeless and push people and families further into poverty, rental and retail prices are far too inflated as it is and the retail and service industries, the main users of the scheme and who are constantly telling us how sales are consistently down, scrap the minimum wage and they will drop even further leading to more business closures.

It may sound simple to just scrap the minimum wage, but it will have serious knock on effects all through the economy and society, affecting workers, the unemployed and business owners.

Iwasfrozen

Xenji wrote: »

With the cost of living and extortionate prices you find in this country, a job paying below the minimum is not going to allow you to fund further training or education, unless you are paying no bills, live rent free, have no car and even then you will be saving for years.

This also would make many more people homeless and push people and families further into poverty, rental prices are far too inflated as it is and the retail and service industries, the main users of the scheme who are constantly telling us how sales are consistently down, scrap the minimum wage and they will drop even further leading to more business closures.

It may sound simple to just scrap the minimum wage, but it will have serious knock on effects all through the economy and society.

Those who are worth more than 18k a year will be unaffected by the removal of minimum wage laws. The only people who will be affected are those who are currently worth less than 18k. Those who are worth 13k or 15k and are willing to work for that amount would be able to do so. As things are now those people have a choice between long term unemployment or jobbridge.

The retail and service industries will also benefit as more people working will increase aggregate demand. Rather than forcing people into poverty, scrapping the minimum wage will allow them the means to work, earn money and get dignity. Helping the most vulnerable by cutting the bottom few rungs off a ladder is ridiculous.

Xenji

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Those who are worth more than 18k a year will be unaffected by the removal of minimum wage laws. The only people who will be affected are those who are currently worth less than 18k. Those who are worth 13k or 15k and are willing to work for that amount would be able to do so. As things are now those people have a choice between long term unemployment or jobbridge.

The retail and service industries will also benefit as more people working will increase aggregate demand.

If a person is being paid below the minimum wage and the retail and service industry keep there prices what they are now, they will suffer and not benefit as these people will barely have enough money to get by, let alone have money left over for anything but the bare necessities.

Iwasfrozen

Xenji wrote: »

If a person is being paid below the minimum wage and the retail and service industry keep there prices what they are now, they will suffer and not benefit as these people will barely have enough money to get by, let alone have money left over for anything but the bare necessities.

Do the unemployed and people on jobbridge currently contribute to the profits of the retail and service industry? Absolutely. When they have more money they'll contribute even more.

Scrapping the minimum wage, bringing more people into the work place will increase aggregate demand. Not lower it.

Not a NSA agent

I cant wait to live in this world where companies have X amount they need to spend on wages instead of hiring 10 people for the least amount of money possible.

Instead of 10 people working for 10k we can get 11 people working for 9k. There's no way places will just hire 10 people at 9k. Reducing the wages will create more work that needs to be done.

_Tombstone_

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

Do the unemployed and people on jobbridge currently contribute to the profits of the retail and service industry? Absolutely. When they have more money they'll contribute even more.

Scrapping the minimum wage, bringing more people into the work place will increase aggregate demand. Not lower it.

I'll give you a job, €2 an hour, maybe 20 hours a week spread over 6 days. That's all I think you're worth.

We'll see how much starbucks you'll buy.

CatFromHue

flutered wrote: »

not a nice remark, especially from a mod

It was a tongue in check joke, I wasn't being serious.

Just some black humour.

Iwasfrozen

_Tombstone_ wrote: »

I'll give you a job, €2 an hour, maybe 20 hours a week spread over 6 days. That's all I think you're worth.

We'll see how much starbucks you'll buy.

First off you would have to offer more than 188 a week. That's the bottom line offer.

Secondly, you are free to offer me €2 an hour but since my current job pays me more than €2 an hour I will refuse. If my current employer threatens my wages I will join another company.

Again. The removal of minimum wage laws will not affect people who already earn <18k a year. It will offer those who are not worth 18k a year but may be worth 13k or 15k a year the opportunity to work for that amount of money as they would otherwise be forced into long term unemployment or jobbridge.

More money in the system will increase aggregate demand, benefiting the retail and services sector.

People who can only earn 15k a year would buy more starbucks than the unemployed. But the government forces these people, through minimum wage laws into unemployment instead. The minimum wage hurts the most vulnerable.

PopePalpatine

There's no room for empathy in Iwasfrozen's world, where every day there's a Two Minutes' Hate consisting of a slideshow showing poor people.

_Tombstone_

_Tombstone_ wrote: »

It needs to go up to €11.50

Many small companies would go to the wall if this was the case. You would have more and more shops doing like Dunnes. As few hours as possible for the high earners, while bringing in cheaper workers and letting them go after a year or so.

In an ideal World it would be great. Unfortunately, we don't live in an ideal World.

Having done a JobBridge internship and gaining employment from that internship, I can see its merits. However, when I see internships offered in shop work, laundry, and other manual low skill jobs, it defeats its purpose.

scamalert

Iwasfrozen wrote: »

First off you would have to offer more than 188 a week. That's the bottom line offer.

how about 188+50e to cover your food,tax,commuting for 5 days :rolleyes:

Right Turn Clyde

The single greatest flaw with Jobbridge is that it includes blue-collar type 'internships'. They're the ones that tend to be hugely exploitative. Internships are largely the domain of white-collar, professional occupations.

An intern shouldn't earn their company much money. They're simply there to gain experience, do some low-priority work and allow the company to cherry-pick future employees (that's the real benefit to the company).

However, you have people doing manual labour Jobbridge internships, working bloody-hard and with the company paying nothing. That's disgraceful in this day an age.

Personally, I think Jobbridge contains a good idea. It's just been implemented horrendously. I done a legal internship and I know other people who have done the same. We all found them very successful.

I think Jobbridge should be remodelled and aimed solely at people looking to enter 'professional' careers. That's the only environment where internships work.

dxhound2005

Right Turn Clyde wrote: »

The single greatest flaw with Jobbridge is that it includes blue-collar type 'internships'. They're the ones that tend to be hugely exploitative. Internships are largely the domain of white-collar, professional occupations.

An intern shouldn't earn their company much money. They're simply there to gain experience, do some low-priority work and allow the company to cherry-pick future employees (that's the real benefit to the company).

However, you have people doing manual labour Jobbridge internships, working bloody-hard and with the company paying nothing. That's disgraceful in this day an age.

Personally, I think Jobbridge contains a good idea. It's just been implemented horrendously. I done a legal internship and I know other people who have done the same. We all found them very successful.

I think Jobbridge should be remodelled and aimed solely at people looking to enter 'professional' careers. That's the only environment where internships work.

That's a new phrase in the argument "blue collar". Usually it is "menial". But still nobody has explained to me how legally you could exclude certain employers or certain types of employment from this scheme. Who wants to come up with the list?

The people on the dole ignore many of the "blue collar adverts", which is why they go unfilled. Effectively it is self regulating.

Anyway the importance of the whole thing is being massively overestimated by people on this thread. It is 6,000 or so people out of a workforce of 2.4 million at any given time. There are 150,000 long term on the dole who just ignore it.