The Jobbridge Scandal

Garrigai

ABajaninCork wrote: »

To expand further on my last post. This morning, whilst searching for an old mail, I came across an e-mail I sent to the Dept of Social Protection nearly TWO years ago to the day. I've posted an excerpt of the questions I raised below:

• Was there a benchmarking exercise carried out to determine what the criteria should be for an internship?
• What quality checks are carried out to ensure the system is not abused? (i.e. the position offered is indeed an internship with a real opportunity to learn and train, and not a ‘cheap labour’ role.)
• What sanctions (if any) are taken against employers who are shown to abuse the system?
• Could prospective interns be discriminated against on grounds of age for example?
• How is the success of the employee measured? Is this recorded?
• Are there any statistics showing the number/percentage of people who have been successful in obtaining permanent employment following the successful completion of an internship?

To date, I have not received a reply from the department or my local TD's to whom I copied the e-mail.

I guess no surprises there...

I'm sure if you met them face to face they would promise to respond to get rid of you, then you would never hear from them again

Xenji

ABajaninCork wrote: »

Sorry. but when I see canned b******s being spouted, I had to reply!

Lol been there done that :pac:

Ann Landers

SeanSouth wrote: »

My strong impression is that people are not taking on these types of internships.

I really hope not.

B.A._Baracus

Was in my local FAS/Intreo/What ever they changed their name to
Saw loads of jobs listed and thought it was great. Was ready to get my phone out and start taking down numbers until... you guessed it. Top of each page posted up had "internship" - urgh.

There had to have been 10 pages on the window and each page has 3-4 job listings. All internships. One caught my eye: "Warehouse operative" and then went on to blow the position out. lol.

I am amazed there is any paid jobs being created these days. I know there is hardly any, but I am suprised at the hardly any!

dxhound2005

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

Was in my local FAS/Intreo/What ever they changed their name to
Saw loads of jobs listed and thought it was great. Was ready to get my phone out and start taking down numbers until... you guessed it. Top of each page posted up had "internship" - urgh.

There had to have been 10 pages on the window and each page has 3-4 job listings. All internships. One caught my eye: "Warehouse operative" and then went on to blow the position out. lol.

I am amazed there is any paid jobs being created these days. I know there is hardly any, but I am suprised at the hardly any!

There are 6600 in Jobbridge placements at the moment and 2750 vacancies. Out of a workforce of something like 2.2 million. To me your post gives the impression that Jobbridge is a much more significant factor in employment/unemployment. I just took the first County on the list, Carlow and this is what is available on Jobbridge. 31 positions dating back to the beginning of February.

For every Jobbridge vacancy you saw the employer would have to have a certain number of fully paid employees. And the Live Register numbers do say that there is a big increase in employment, not hardly any as you contend.

http://intern.jobbridge.ie/Default.aspx?q=sjDArutve/3w53BLzNXooesjqRrGoX95L6zX310XQ+ZkPrjRXZfgnq9aCED/CBaEB7/EYciwt/RC+LOlNxs8UD9LAjj7M2Lo3u/cRXi0yliyP7RK7hJYFN5Gsp8+RANXSYBeOqEYtCqemWWEJdAziz9+vtGCYaMQMuy5jzXVd0sfV26ZiZV1AtDLuiMMZ4YdvvqI0PRMQpyMQ//ulCkhW+l4iceCn7/nTqJSqGeecF0WlrhRwEk5eHgVEeU55JZ3FjlbfsY6x8Zr8mG5jXdwAq4ciytM00z1ozmuvCrC6AlDERc1/IhNXmPFQtPl5ya2CldENQJlbk+Uzqd7NL6es8Y6o2CYS8exunaxVHAcK1YWfA2cJpJd30mRvclq6PoL8cMj8ivPUW4Xb9qzmVwivQ==

B.A._Baracus

So dxhound why is there so many unemployed?
I mean, from your post Jobbridge isnt an issue. There are more and more jobs being created. So why?

dxhound2005

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

So dxhound why is there so many unemployed?
I mean, from your post Jobbridge isnt an issue. There are more and more jobs being created. So why?

The actual numbers unemployed in any country depend on the overall population obviously. So the fact that our population has increased by well over a million in the last 20 years or so means that there are more employed and unemployed. The percentage unemployed now is around the long term average.

The only period when unemployment was significantly lower in the last 30 years was during the height of the boom. Even then there were 100,000 on the dole despite the fact that hundreds of thousands had arrived here from abroad to work. So I cannot explain that. Unemployment was much worse percentage wise in previous recessions, as high as 18%. And in those days we only had emigration, people leaving to work, hardly any immigration, people arriving to work which is happening now.

PopePalpatine

SeanSouth wrote: »

3) The real problem that we've got in today's labour market place is that staff are too expensive to hire. The government that introduced the minimum wage has an awful lot to answer for. The minimum wage is set at a level where less employees can be hired for basic level work. A very powerful piece of legislation designed to protect workers that has actually resulted in less work for the people that it tries to protect.

Something tells me the average minimum wage employer isn't going to hire more people if they can pay <€8.65/hr.

SeanSouth

Most employers wouldn't touch job bridge with a barge pole.
To do so risks getting a very negative disgruntled person into your work environment. Who the hell wants that.

The figures stand for themselves. There are approximately 30,000 employers in the Dublin area. On average there are 25 new job bridge adverts posted every day so less than one internship per 1000 employers per day.

If jobbridge was the gravy train for employers that everyone here thinks it is then why isn't every employer into it and making a killing.

I would hire two Interns in the morning, but only in circumstances where they sought out our company , demonstrated that they have a clearly thought out plan, know what they want to achieve from the process in terms of skills and experience. They will need to demonstrate strong motivation, interest and energy and a track record of achievement and resourcefulness.

No interest at all in hiring negative people who present themselves as victims of recession, victims of government or victims of anything else. These people will wear you down. Jobbridge can be a very good option for certain types of people and good for employers but no good at all for the "victimised" and in my view they should stay away from it

ABajaninCork

SeanSouth wrote: »

Most employers wouldn't touch job bridge with a barge pole.
To do so risks getting a very negative disgruntled person into your work environment. Who the hell wants that.

The figures stand for themselves. There are approximately 30,000 employers in the Dublin area. On average there are 25 new job bridge adverts posted every day so less than one internship per 1000 employers per day.

If jobbridge was the gravy train for employers that everyone here thinks it is then why isn't every employer into it and making a killing.

I would hire two Interns in the morning, but only in circumstances where they sought out our company , demonstrated that they have a clearly thought out plan, know what they want to achieve from the process in terms of skills and experience. They will need to demonstrate strong motivation, interest and energy and a track record of achievement and resourcefulness.

No interest at all in hiring negative people who present themselves as victims of recession, victims of government or victims of anything else. These people will wear you down. Jobbridge can be a very good option for certain types of people and good for employers but no good at all for the "victimised" and in my view they should stay away from it

Yawn....

I see you neatly skipped over the responses to your last post. Why??

darkpagandeath

It's the same attitude that Tds have. Working for free gives you dignity apparently. Can we pay them with dignity instead of 90k a year ?

Fred Swanson

This post has been deleted.

Holsten

SeanSouth wrote: »

Most employers wouldn't touch job bridge with a barge pole.
To do so risks getting a very negative disgruntled person into your work environment. Who the hell wants that.

The figures stand for themselves. There are approximately 30,000 employers in the Dublin area. On average there are 25 new job bridge adverts posted every day so less than one internship per 1000 employers per day.

If jobbridge was the gravy train for employers that everyone here thinks it is then why isn't every employer into it and making a killing.

I would hire two Interns in the morning, but only in circumstances where they sought out our company , demonstrated that they have a clearly thought out plan, know what they want to achieve from the process in terms of skills and experience. They will need to demonstrate strong motivation, interest and energy and a track record of achievement and resourcefulness.

No interest at all in hiring negative people who present themselves as victims of recession, victims of government or victims of anything else. These people will wear you down. Jobbridge can be a very good option for certain types of people and good for employers but no good at all for the "victimised" and in my view they should stay away from it

Wow.

I pity anyone who has to work under you. Jesus!

dharma200

another scandal
http://visualartists.ie/jobs-ops/intern-vol/art-education-officers-hugh-lane-gallery-dublin-jobbridge-internship/

one needs a degree of course....... wtf......

col.in.Cr

I just secured a paid position two months before my jobsbridge internship ended,my advice is to be pick a large company to do your internship with if possible.

Grandpa Hassan

dharma200 wrote: »

another scandal
http://visualartists.ie/jobs-ops/intern-vol/art-education-officers-hugh-lane-gallery-dublin-jobbridge-internship/

one needs a degree of course....... wtf......

That actually looks like one of the better ones. They aren't going to be flush with cash, and might not be able to make that a full time position. Art education leveraging social media....that's the kind of experience that the intern can sell to future employers in that sector

dharma200

dharma200 wrote: »

another scandal
http://visualartists.ie/jobs-ops/intern-vol/art-education-officers-hugh-lane-gallery-dublin-jobbridge-internship/
one needs a degree of course....... wtf......

I would think that this is what Internships are about. Organisations that have little funding and can offer invaluable training in a specialised field. It's the ones offering internships in shelf stacking and such like in the private sector that are the problem.

sligoface

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

So dxhound why is there so many unemployed?
I mean, from your post Jobbridge isnt an issue. There are more and more jobs being created. So why?

He can't answer those types of questions,, he just likes to try to defend the scheme because he's a fine gaeler. He tried to tell me that I was overstating the impact of the scheme on unemployment in Sligo earlier in the thread. This story just ran in our local newspaper, stating that we have the highest percentage of people on internships in the country. http://sligoweekender.ie/2014/03/27/sligo-highest-rate-people-jobbridge/

People seeking work can see plainly the amount of internships vs. the amount of paid jobs on the fas website and it is sickening. Yes there are many more in employment than on Jobbridge but most of them have not been made unemployed in the last few years due to the recession, and most are not recent graduates. Those two groups are being screwed big time because employers have little incentive to offer paid positions when they can take on free labour through a government sponsored scheme.

Jobbridge is not helping the unemployed to get jobs, it just makes it look like the government has done something to help the jobless when in fact it has the opposite effect. Companies now realize they have no need to pay wages for any position from barman to solicitor. How can this be helping the unemployed?

Our jobless rate is much higher than what is reported, and would be seen to be much higher if it weren't for emigration and people on schemes being excluded from official numbers. Those are absolute facts. And immigration, especially among young people is anything but modest, any of my friends who could afford to have left, and many of the foreign workers I know have moved back since the recession hit. Anyone who thinks this scheme is helping, or that things have greatly improved, must have their head buried deep in the sand.

tomwaterford

Deleted User wrote: »

I would think that this is what Internships are about. Organisations that have little funding and can offer invaluable training in a specialised field. It's the ones offering internships in shelf stacking and such like in the private sector that are the problem.

this is actually something I agree with....you could just about understand internships for ones out of collage in an area where there is strong possibilitys of promotion and payrises quickly...sort of a rising payscale like an apprenticeship...to provide much needed experience quickly...

internships replacing min wage jobs are a disgrace and unacceptable

a good idea on paper but disaster in reality

Idbatterim

The displacement rate for actual "real" jobs would be around one third of the job bridge total, if even that. You cant blame the companies for taking whats on offer, free labour, do people turn down free money on welfare? people will take what they are offered. I think the scheme has it's pro's and con's, luck, research and attitude will play a large part in the outcome..

Our jobless rate is much higher than what is reported, and would be seen to be much higher if it weren't for emigration and people on schemes being excluded from official numbers. Those are absolute facts. Any talk about immigration into Ireland offsetting this is really convoluted and clutching at straws to find some way to deny the obvious.

True.

sligoface

Idbatterim wrote: »

The displacement rate for actual "real" jobs would be around one third of the job bridge total, if even that. You cant blame the companies for taking whats on offer, free labour, do people turn down free money on welfare? people will take what they are offered. I think the scheme has it's pro's and con's, luck, research and attitude will play a large part in the outcome..

But we can certainly blame the government and that's what most of us are doing. As for luck, research and attitude, they will mean little to an employer who has the option of taking on free labor. Host companies don't have to take you on after the nine months, they can just get another intern by changing the name of the position when they take out the ad. And you will have to compete with free labor in any other companies you apply to in the field, so it really is silly for anyone to take these positions because you are not likely to get a job from it from either the host company or anywhere else. If free labor is available, jobs won't be, it's that simple.

Idbatterim

yeah I agree with that for the most part, I wouldnt say none get offered a paid position, but I'd say its 10% or less of the total...

Guy:Incognito

Idbatterim wrote: »

The displacement rate for actual "real" jobs would be around one third of the job bridge total, if even that. You cant blame the companies for taking whats on offer, free labour, do people turn down free money on welfare? people will take what they are offered. I think the scheme has it's pro's and con's, luck, research and attitude will play a large part in the outcome..

True.

I disagree. It's like saying you cant blame someone for taking my TV because I left my door open. It's taking the piss out of people, right to their faces.

Stavros Murphy

€238

Guy:Incognito

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

€238

€239

Stavros Murphy

€238 a week. I had a lad I took on as his boss went bust, I kinda inherited the contract he was on. His pay was €360 a week. I genuinely couldn't look him in the eye as I handed him his pay cheque each week. In the end I knocked it on the head as bad business, I h

Guy:Incognito

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

€238 a week. I had a lad I took on as his boss went bust, I kinda inherited the contract he was on. His pay was €360 a week. I genuinely couldn't look him in the eye as I handed him his pay cheque each week. In the end I knocked it on the head as bad business, I h

I get that €188 + €50 is €238 but tbh you've lost me.

Guy:Incognito

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

I inherited a contract with one employee who was on €360 a week. I couldn't look him in the eye as I paid him each week. €238.00 a week on Jobbridge? I'd feel like I was riding their wife tbh, just couldn't do it. Who the fcuk wants €238.00 a week? For working? It's a ride. If you're being ridden, insist on chocolates and flowers at the very least.

ah so desu ka

sligoface

Stavros Murphy wrote: »

€238 a week. I had a lad I took on as his boss went bust, I kinda inherited the contract he was on. His pay was €360 a week. I genuinely couldn't look him in the eye as I handed him his pay cheque each week. In the end I knocked it on the head as bad business, I h

I agree with your sentiment but I'm confused, if you had an intern you wouldn't have been handing him a paycheck, interns are paid into their bank acct by the DSP.

Edit: ok, think you meant you had an employee you paid 360 per week. That's a wage I'd gladly work for rather than be on the dole or jobbridge!

Stavros Murphy

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

I get that €188 + €50 is €238 but tbh you've lost me.

Would you like to live on that? With a wife and kids? I felt like I was riding him, and I hate the idea of doing people, so I knocked it on the head. I had a chat with him and he got a better job. I feel paying €238 a week is inflicting misery on people, and I'm not into that.