The Jobbridge Scandal

Guy:Incognito

Permabear wrote: »

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Did you read the question?

Here is the post BTW

Permabear wrote: »

Because of the economic crash?

Until late 2008, it was relatively easy for an inexperienced 18-year-old to get a job in a supermarket. After the crash, and hundreds of thousands of lost jobs, even supermarkets were deluged with CVs from experienced workers, many of them with degrees. What chance did the 18-year-old have of getting that minimum-wage job then? None.

So give the supermarkets the people for free instead of the few that would have been hired is some sort of solution?

Is there a glut of full time shelf packer jobs that the supermarkets are struggling to fill because they can't find people with 9 months experience? Or will it be a conveyor belt of 9 month internships doing jobs that require no experience then still not being able to get a job when they are done?

garp

Permabear wrote: »

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So instead of educating the great unwashed for the IT market you feel that they are better off spending their time stacking shelves or washing cars and that time will then lead them into better employment within the IT sector? Or we could try and retrain folk for the jobs that are available.

Permabear

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Permabear

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Guy:Incognito

Permabear wrote: »

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So if a graduate goes and does an internship in a related company then goes on the dole after because there isn't a job, but 3 months later gets a job in a supermarket, that's a success for jobbridge? Because its counted in the 61.4%.

Xenji

Permabear wrote: »

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The whole scheme originally was for 3rd level graduates to gain experience in their chosen field of study after they graduated, which I have no issues with and was a good idea, but the government has stood idly by and let it mutate into what we have now after some businesses found out a way to exploit it to their own gain.

Guy:Incognito

everdead.ie wrote: »

It is a much higher rate of employment after completing it then their is if you just stay on the dole. .

If all 400,000 on the dole could do an internship for the next 9 months that 61.4% figure would have the decimal point moved about 2 places to the left.

Is there a figure for the amount of people that get a new job within 6 months of losing the old one compared to 6 months after an internship?

Guy:Incognito

Permabear wrote: »

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Is giving them to a supermarket for free for 9 months going to create any full time jobs for them? Again, I doubt theres a shortage of people the supermarkets could give jobs to so what exactly are we giving them this 9 months experience for?

Permabear

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everdead.ie

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

If all 400,000 on the dole could do an internship for the next 9 months that 61.4% figure would have the decimal point moved about 2 places to the left.

Is there a figure for the amount of people that get a new job within 6 months of losing the old one compared to 6 months after an internship?

Last year the live register (not a measure of unemployment) dropped by almost 8% So people are leaving the dole but at a much lower rate.

everdead.ie

Permabear wrote: »

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Hardly for just white collar professionals but the applicant should be learning something from their internship not just time keeping.

Xenji

@Permabear are you using the Indecon Report to get your figures?

Guy:Incognito

Permabear wrote: »

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No one disputed that. Its the link to jobbridge that people are disputing because there may well be none in a large amount of cases.

The other point is there should be no shelf stacker internships or any other job that people generally pick up in a very short time and are paid to do.

Permabear

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Xenji

everdead.ie wrote: »

Last year the live register (not a measure of unemployment) dropped by almost 8% So people are leaving the dole but at a much lower rate.

You have 80,000 plus people on activation schemes with new ones lke the Gateway being reguraly announced, these people are not deemed to be on the live register, but are still in reciept of social welfare, so that figure is very skewed and is never realistic.

PopePalpatine

Permabear, have you checked the ratio of Jobbridge internships against job vacancies in the industries in which these internships are offered?

everdead.ie

Xenji wrote: »

You have 80,000 plus people on activation schemes with new ones lke the Gateway being reguraly announced, these people are not deemed to be on the live register, but are still in reciept of social welfare, so that figure is very skewed and is never realistic.

Total in activation schemes in February 2013 83,421
Total in activation schemes in February 2014 85,119

The number in activation schemes is fairly constant so comparisons between this year and last year are completely valid.


Sorry source http://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/lr/liveregistermarch2014/#.Uz60Ndd4dvs

guinnessdrinker

If we break it down a little bit.

What makes the Jobbridge scheme appealing to the employer? Take a retail outlet as an example.

They don't have to pay a wage to the intern, they don't have to pay employer's PRSI to Revenue.

Why should the company incur the expence of employing someone for 10 to 20 hours for week when the can get an intern for 40 hours a week for free?

Xenji

everdead.ie wrote: »

Total in activation schemes in February 2013 83,421
Total in activation schemes in February 2014 85,119

The number in activation schemes is fairly constant so comparisons between this year and last year are completely valid.


Sorry source http://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/lr/liveregistermarch2014/#.Uz60Ndd4dvs

You can add emigration into that figure as well, even the IMF reckon we would have an unemployment rate of around 20% if people had stayed.

Using figures from OECD and IMF reports, it shows Ireland has suffered one of the biggest increases in unemployment since the start of the crisis, and claims that the official figures underestimate the reality.

http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/almost-10-of-irish-young-people-emigrated-during-recession-263566.html

everdead.ie

Xenji wrote: »

You can add emigration into that figure as well, even the IMF reckon we would have an unemployment rate of around 20% if people had stayed.



http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/almost-10-of-irish-young-people-emigrated-during-recession-263566.html

I'm well aware of the economic realities our country faces I'm only pointing out that the rate of unemployment is going down and you have a better chance of securing employment statistically if you do a job bridge internship.
Given a multitude of reasons for example

Good refrences
Proven work ethic
skills for some (I think everyone should be learning some skills from sales to technical)


It is also worth noting the increase in employed people which shows that the numbers aren't all people emigrating although it is a contributing factor.

Guy:Incognito

everdead.ie wrote: »

Total in activation schemes in February 2013 83,421
Total in activation schemes in February 2014 85,119

The number in activation schemes is fairly constant so comparisons between this year and last year are completely valid.


Sorry source http://cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/lr/liveregistermarch2014/#.Uz60Ndd4dvs

Does the 61.4% of people getting jobs hold out across all the other schemes too? I doubt the government would want to add them to the jobbridge figures because at a guess I'd say its less otherwise we'd be hearing about it.

Permabear

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everdead.ie

Guy:Incognito wrote: »

Does the 61.4% of people getting jobs hold out across all the other schemes too? I doubt the government would want to add them to the jobbridge figures because at a guess I'd say its less otherwise we'd be hearing about it.

The majority of the activation schemes are back to education. I have no idea what the figures are like though.

Ann Landers

Permabear wrote: »

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A whole 28% percent? Wow.

Throughout this thread, success stories have been acknowledged. It's also noted that they have been in the minority, a point that is nicely demonstrated by the above statistic.

ABajaninCork

Ann Landers wrote: »

A whole 28% percent? Wow.

Throughout this thread, success stories have been acknowledged. It's also noted that they have been in the minority, a point that is nicely demonstrated by the above statistic.

Actually, that figure seems pretty high. I'm not sure I believe that, and think the figure would be a little lower. I'd love to know how the figures were arrived at.

guinnessdrinker

Permabear wrote: »

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Why didn't those 28% of companies not just hire a person in the first plase then? Employment costs? Opportunity to get free labour for 9 months?

I know a first hand account of a person that completed a nine month internship in the retail sector at 40 hours per week. At the end of the 9 months the company kept her on...... but only gave her a part time position at approx 20 hours per week. The same company have since hired more interns.

The statistics quoted don't show us this type of detail unfortunately.

PopePalpatine

They also don't show how many paid employees have had hours reduced as their employers take on interns.

everdead.ie

PopePalpatine wrote: »

They also don't show how many paid employees have had hours reduced as their employers take on interns.

Intresting actually if you check the cso figures http://www.cso.ie/en/releasesandpublications/er/lr/liveregistermarch2014/#.Uz7Av9d4dvs

It shows part-time workers have actually decreased from
March 2011 86,155
March 2012 88,716
March 2013 89,798
March 2014 79,811

So about 10,000 less people work part time now as did a year ago and by 7,000 since before jobBridge started.

So the overall number of part-timers in the economy is actually dropping a trend noted by the Central bank today.

Permabear

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Permabear

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