The Jobbridge Scandal

Ann Landers · 09-04-2014 12:43pm

Well, that was my experience. Completely up to you whether you wish to believe it or not.

Daith · 09-04-2014 12:45pm

Unless it's backed up with dubious stats why would they believe it!

Ann Landers · 09-04-2014 12:47pm

Of course. :pac:

09-04-2014 12:47pm

Those figures are somewhat skewed when you consider that a large number never finished the placement. As well as the fact that people like a friend if mine were told that learning to use a power washer and make percolated coffee was a skill that they had learnt thanks to jobsbridge. My friend was working in a position which was advertised as an IT role yet was out washing his boss's jeep and getting lunch for staff more than anything else.

To try and defend a 9 month internship in a supermarket or as a farm labourer is just wrong. It's pure exploitation, simple as. You can wheel out all the stats and figures you want but it doesn't make them any less of a disgrace. Many of us worked in a supermarket when we were younger and the training was a couple if minutes on the first day and that was it. That people think its okay to exploit the young is nasty, there seems to be a certain reverse ageism in work when it comes to these schemes and defending them. It's almost as if people think that the young don't want to work or that they should be grateful to stack shelves in a supermarket for 9 months and earn nearly half what the other employees are

Xios · 09-04-2014 12:58pm

There are placements, they're called apprenticeships or going back to education. If farmers want cheap labour, then they should be training apprentices in a formal role that is backed by an awarding body. Not for some bull**** "Ah yeah, Paddy worked on me farm for 9 months" reference.

Permabear · 09-04-2014 12:58pm

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Permabear · 09-04-2014 12:59pm

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Ann Landers · 09-04-2014 1:04pm

Well, some people might say that but I didn't. And it's a pretty insulting assumption for you to make. Interesting what you fall back on when there are no stats available.

runawaybishop · 09-04-2014 1:05pm

I think you need a dose of cop the **** on.

Xios · 09-04-2014 1:08pm

Yes, they do. However the key difference between an apprenticeship/education scheme is that they follow strict guidelines of operation, they're monitored and there is a guaranteed reward after completion.

Somehow I don't see this 9 month role yielding anything near the results of the above schemes/initiatives.

garp · 09-04-2014 1:14pm

Permabear. Would you please stop dropping in stats of 34.6 or 61.8% without giving direct links to where you are taking them from and by that I do not mean linking to the full document which may or may not contain said stats. Direct link to page or gtfo. 98% of them could be wrong

Permabear · 09-04-2014 1:17pm

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Tony EH · 09-04-2014 1:19pm

Profit that is made on the back of peoples exploited labour IS dirty.

osarusan · 09-04-2014 1:19pm

I see you have finally got around to looking at the Indecon report you were pretending you have already read (and criticising others for not having read).

Ironic really, given an earlier post.

Permabear · 09-04-2014 1:20pm

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Guy:Incognito · 09-04-2014 1:23pm

Are the happiness stats got from the questions asked in the final month of the internship that the poster that works for the council described as the only time anyone checked on the interns?

I cant see many badmouthing a company they are hoping will give them a job In the next few weeks.

PopePalpatine · 09-04-2014 1:24pm

Laissez-faire twats are usually devoid of empathy for the poor.

That's why you never see libertarians speak out against sweatshops.

Permabear · 09-04-2014 1:25pm

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Ann Landers · 09-04-2014 1:25pm

Evidently.

runawaybishop · 09-04-2014 1:27pm

The problem is that this is another job that requires on the job training and a wage, not a 9 month internship.

osarusan · 09-04-2014 1:35pm

I've read it. You hadn't when you took the 89% stat from the Indo and never checked it. Now you have looked at the Indecon report and are quoting the lower figure.

You haven't read all of it though, or you wouldn't be still arguing that the live register is a valid control group for comparison with jobbridge figures.

And for people commenting on the Indecon report, the survey did include those who had left the internship early. It is pretty unbiased in my opinion, although uses words it shouldn't. It indicates that jobbridge internees do indeed have a better percentage of subsequent employment, in comparison to a weighted control group.

coffee_cake · 09-04-2014 1:37pm

http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs12122-006-1006-z#page-1

Can't CP; the jobs pay above average and enough to lift them out of poverty

Permabear · 09-04-2014 1:38pm

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KyussBishop · 09-04-2014 1:52pm

Citation needed - almost all of the economic literature on that is highly debatable/interpretable, and a lot of it uses selectively interpreted stats, put out by think-tanks with a bad reputation for corrupt research, conflicts of interest, and general propaganda.

It's widely known that low aggregate demand (such as that caused by high unemployment...), keeps people in general out of the workforce - and entertaining the idea that cutting the minimum wage, will reduce unemployment among the young/unskilled, is (for the 4th-5th - but happy to make it 'N'th - time) the 'fallacy of composition', since getting rid of the minimum wage can reduces wages, then aggregate demand, and then business profits and employment levels (even among the young/unskilled).

Except the stats do not show that Job Bridge is effective at getting people off social welfare - this is actually, again, a different form of the 'fallacy of composition':
Job Bridge helps people on social welfare, compete more effectively against other people on social welfare, for job positions - so the '61.4% success rate' stats for Job Bridge, do not represent a contribution, to overall reduction in people on welfare.

Whereas you want them being paid by government, while working in unskilled roles to subsidize business - you don't merely want to eliminate the minimum wage, you actually want the state to subsidize business (showing you are more neoliberal than libertarian).

Repeated misrepresentation of facts, that multiple other posters have rebutted, without those rebuttals being addressed, is pretty much soapboxing - and many posters have already openly twigged the disingenuous nature of this.

Cantona's Collars · 09-04-2014 1:53pm

Possibly the most vague job:rolleyes: description I've seen:

http://jobseeker.fas.ie/Default.aspx?q=B+fomdowzS8kaDnSlUDk1zaMUPiFEeNrNWjviinu490thmC2C0u+DHAzwKBT+ViW1yKmIvzG93X66hKUpj/LVPPXcFnwRqRLwij/zfgWGGIYE99Fdw6FUjUUhvvPLKMFialZuRXNh/LkPU4VxDqTLM15yuRzSQV+gD2G9vU8iwwSrhXuUX9WHiJudlHZGZimxrFeerYk/sXQMcx5aOjPyhm7h56B6qhVc0m4iLctWURJhubszQow1HwoJ1vYRE+RiTZPtUUXUR36k/n6Om39WlI8/EA6Sw36MC5t606zjupV2pNUZcgN1m2aSEjgLhNoBkdPZpT+nEgTsaKRMKWDKG2f05igtwZ1K0NvkGYiMPfzo5RL3mKJOHPOs8hiSZegMtKsAaMAT7fi1Chlp8BXuqPx13Cxup/JvPEm6KIMDbhbEJdj24HLsE2kpx8u8t4lLN+aVRhwhf9Kuq3Y32oe/3QQp4TlTYqp

No doubt the intern will end up washing lorries.

KyussBishop · 09-04-2014 1:54pm

Again, the fallacy of composition: Eliminating a 'high' minimum wage, does not mean a reduction in unemployment, but it can potentially mean a reduction in wages paid, aggregate demand, business profits and then an increase in unemployment.

Xios · 09-04-2014 1:55pm

My point was, that this role doesn't require 9 months of training. It's a role that requires doing. That's all, you don't need 9 months of intern training to learn how to cut grass, use a ride on mower and sow seeds. To suggest otherwise is absolutely absurd. It's clearly a manual labour job. It would take 1 or 2 weeks tops to perfect these skills. Not 9 ****ing months.

In 9 months, you could have a level 5 FETAC in horticulture.

On one hand, you have a private firm benefitting from manual labour for a menial role. On the other, you get a qualified individual with much better career prospects or ongoing education.

Cantona's Collars · 09-04-2014 1:58pm

Out of curiosity I went through the list of jobs in Wexford,internships in a pet shop,a golf course,a store room,a night porter,shop assistant,a coffee shop to name a few.

What kind of experience does anyone expect to get from any of those roles?

Backstreet Moyes · 09-04-2014 1:59pm

In my job i learned to use a scanner so i learned a new skill. Took me 5 seconds but i learned a new skill so throw me in the 89%.

Daith · 09-04-2014 2:00pm

Yes but apparently certs like this are all useless unlike the valuable training you get with a Job Bridge placement*.

The Jobbridge Scandal

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