Reflux

MurdyWurdy

Hi - I'n looking for some advice on reflux. I know there are a few threads on it but nothing that recent. Our baby is almost 4 weeks old and is suffering from it at the moment and I'm getting progressively more stressed about it and tired because we're getting even less sleep than you'd normally get with a newborn. The main problem is not the spitting up, it seems to be a mild enough case as reflux goes but that we can't get him to sleep lying flat - meaning both he and us are not getting enough sleep. He can be fast asleep after being fed and be put in his crib but within minutes he's crying out in pain and gets very distressed. It must be horrible for him, I remember how awful heartburn was when I was pregnant!

I did see a paediatrician about a different issue yesterday and discussed it with her. He's feeding well and putting on weight so it's not causing any harm to him but I'm worried the lack of sleep will. He'll sleep no problem on me or in a Fisher Price rock n play (it 's a rocker thing that has the baby in a seated position) but I know neither are safe for him to sleep overnight. All the advice is to keep him flat on a firm mattress but it just isn't working for us. We've raised the head of the cot but it doesn't help. I did get a sling yesterday so I can babywear and keep him upright during the day so that might help but it's the nights that are concerning me really.

Anyone have any other suggestions? Is there anything the pharmacist can give for it? I will go back to doc if it doesn't improve but I want to try what I can - I need the sleep and I hate hearing him in be in pain apparently heat/humidity can aggravate it so I'm hoping when the weather cools it might improve too.

Mrs W

There's a clevamamma pillow you can get that will keep him elevated and Try keeping him upright for 30 mins after every feed.

How many oz is he on?

MurdyWurdy

He's exclusively breastfed so i've no idea how much he is getting! He's a really good feeder though.

I've been awake with him now for over 2 hours and can't get him down - I'm like a zombie. He was fed 2 hours ago but I can only get him to fall asleep on me still, not in his crib or Moses basket thing we have in the sitting room.

MOTM

Ours doctor prescribed zantac for our boy. It worked brilliantly. Acid reflux gone (eventually). http://www.drugs.com/zantac.html

yellow hen

MOTM wrote: »

Ours doctor prescribed zantac for our boy. It worked brilliantly. Acid reflux gone (eventually). http://www.drugs.com/zantac.html

Oh murdy you have my absolute sympathy. Our little boy who is now 20 weeks suffered with this until about 15 weeks. We were stressed exhausted and heartbroken to see him in do much pain. As he was gaining weight, moving seemed too concerned. In the end we went to crumlin hospital and they watched him have a refluxy episode and agreed he needed medication. Personally I found he was worse when breastfed so I moved him completely over to formula. The comfort formula would help here but my little man couldn't mange the thickness if it so i had him on baby gaviscon to thicken his feed. The paediatrician also prescribed Zantac. It takes about 5 days to fully kick in but it changed him completely. He was on it for 2 weeks and we took him off and he completely relapsed to his old form. We put him back on (having discussed with pharmacist first) and he was in it for another 3 weeks and then we gradually weaned him off. By 15 weeks he was off everything. We were fully prepared for the reflux to last longer so it was a bonus to see it gone at that stage. It is a horrible thing to watch in your baby so I think try the gaviscon first. If brrastfeeding, you can express a little and mix it in that and syringe it into his mouth. You don't need a prescription for the gaviscon either so you could try this first.

Also put towels etc under his mattress to elevate it. Anything you can do that helps. Good luck xxxx

MOTM

MOTM wrote: »

Ours doctor prescribed zantac for our boy. It worked brilliantly. Acid reflux gone (eventually). http://www.drugs.com/zantac.html

I forgot to mention, when he went on formula, we used SMA staydown. Really good. He was like a changed baby .
Gaviscon, infacol etc had no impact for him.

Anniebell

Getting major flashbacks of when my little man was small here!!

He's now 18 months and off Zantac since 14 months but we had a year of absolute hell with reflux so you have my utmost sympathy.

I totally emphathise with the exhaustion. It's indescribable to people who haven't experienced it.

After an awful night and day of nearly 24 hours of constant screaming, we ended up in A&E and he was prescribed Zantac. It helped so much and reduced the screaming and was a massive improvement so it's something you might consider.

My son was also EBF until starting solids at 7 months and even then there were certain acidic foods we were told to avoid as they'd aggravate his symptoms.

With regard to positions for sleeping. Whatever works! My son slept upright on my chest until about 5 months old. It was literally the only way he'd get a decent hour or twos sleep straight. He eventually progressed to sleeping bedside me in his sidecar cot but always more comfortable on a raised mattress and on his tummy. Or else on his side with a rolled up blanket in front and behind to stop him rolling onto his back.

Even now at 18 months he sleeps on his tummy automatically when he goes into his cot so it's obviously what he's most comfortable with.

Best of luck with whatever you decide to do.

cyning

My little girl had silent reflux too: it was mild but there was no way I could get her to sleep lying flat. The sling made an enormous improvement during the day and we had naps in the bouncer (I had a toddler rocker fisher price one it went even flatter for naps). At night we tried raising Moses basket but ended up with her sleeping on me for part of the night. I used give her baby gaviscon: it really helped at night moreso than the day. I know it's over the counter but do discuss it with phn or gp first. As I said we were lucky that it was mild. I also started drinking fennel tea because she was quite colicky too and for us it seemed to help the reflux aswel. No clue why. She was been supplemented with formula at that stage so when we took her off of it that definitely helped too.

Also sometimes reflux in breastfed babies can be caused by a forceful let down: because the milk is hitting baby so fast it causes them to spit up. So you could try expressing off the first bit of milk and letting babs feed then. If you start the fennel tea so important to try that as it also helps increase supply.

The combination of all the above had her sleeping flat in about a week. Ye all must be wrecked from it

MurdyWurdy

Thanks for the support ladies - I'm feeling really teary today (delayed baby blues maybe?) so its great to have somewhere to share.

I spoke to the PHN this morning too which helped - she has given me some information and suggested a few things. Raising the head of his crib (which we had done) and changing my feeding position as well as keeping him upright for 30 minutes after his feeds. I might send my mum to the pharmacy as well and see what they say about the Gaviscon/Infacol os something like that. She is coming over in an hour to take him out for a walk so I can sleep. I have him in the sling at the moment and he seems happy enough in it so it seems a good way to keep him upright.

I spoke to my husband earlier about it, he said we can discuss what we can do to help - you know what men are like, always wanting a solution! I'm just hoping this is not a long term thing. He was such a good sleeper for the first two weeks (although he had the heavy, hoarse, congestive breathing) so maybe it's the heat. At least it's the weekend so I have some help from hubby at night and for the next two days. He's very good in the evenings but the nights by myself are hard and I don't want him exhausted for work.

Although, while writing this he vomited down my top while in the sling. I am covered in baby puke!

Nead21

My 12 week old went through this exact thing when he was 5 or 6 weeks. It was awful and incredibly stressful.

Breast milk is lighter and easier to digest so i personally dont think changing to formula is going to help.

My little man was very windy also so i used gripe water and changed to soya milk. It lasted about 2 weeks and then he seemed to just grow out of it. Im still on soya milk and have cut down on other dairy products. Dont know if it actually helped but something changed anyway.

My friend's little girl also had reflux and she was given zantac. She's also exclusively bfing.

yellow hen

MurdyWurdy wrote: »

He's very good in the evenings but the nights by myself are hard and I don't want him exhausted

I was the same but honestly you'll have to ask him to help you out; it's just too stressful mentally and physically on your own. I cried a lot when o had reflux... Don't be afraid to ask for help hon. Try the gaviscon first before going down the road of prescribed medication... It might be enough to help him keep the food down. Xx

theLuggage

Plus one on the SMA staydown formula - it's amazing. Our baby's reflux got much better on it - though it didn't clear completely. We also used baby gaviscon - it wasn't bed enough to be prescribed something for, it didnt really bother her. Only problem was you cant mix gaviscon with the staydown formula as it makes it too thick. It smells awful and it was a struggle to get it into her - eventually got the hang of what worked for her tho. Keeping her upright for 30mins after feeding was the best. I would put her in her swing chair if I needed to do something and then transfer her up to bed, otherwise in the arms till time to put her down.

Out daughter is 9 months now and back to aptimal milk and on solids, no gaviscon. Her reflux is totally gone except when we give dairy so trying to introduce it slowly. The amount of muslin cloths we used to go through during a feed! Its like a distant memory so hang in there - it does go away! Usually when they begin sitting it starts to improve.

Rachineire

Wondering if your baby is lactose intolerant? my LO was and it was a cause of his reflux. I have a friend as well who EBF and she cant have dairy as it upsets her baby's stomach, causes lots of wind and spitting up.

We got Zantac for my little boy after 4 months of reflux- he was a changed baby after 3 days, wish we had figured it out months earlier as he had silent reflux and we just thought he was a fussy baby. We also keep his mattress elevated in his cot, and the Clevamama sleep positioner is great as well.
And dont feel bad about handing the baby over to your husband when he gets in from work. Minding a fussy and needy baby all day is MUCH more exhausting than a day of work. I have recently gone back to work and its SO much easier than being at home all day with baby. Raising a child is one of the hardest things we will ever do, dont be afraid to ask for help, ifyou dont take care of yourself you cant take care of little one! I know its tough but it gets so so so much easier each week, you might not notice it at the time because it feels like the stage your in is going to last forever but don't despair! I hope you get something sorted for your little boy!

MurdyWurdy

Thanks all we got the baby gaviscon today. The pharmacist was reluctant to give it to such a young baby without him seeing a doc so we took him to the doc this morning to make sure it def was reflux.

We had a very bad night last night where he only slept on us, we couldn't put him down in his cot it even his rocker without him screaming in pain. Fingers crossed the Gaviscon works. He did a good bit of vomiting today but was good at his last feed but I'm not going to jinx it yet!

The Gaviscon is a bit of a pain in the ass though because he's exclusively breastfed so there's no bottles to put it in! We got a little syringe from the chemist instead but it can be hard to give it to him after his feeds because he is so sleepy then. I really really don't want to switch to formula, if possible so hopefully we can make it work.

He's been asleep for the last 3 hours but I'm dreading the night, about 10pm I always get a sinking feeling about what's ahead!

theLuggage

You can give gaviscon before a feed or during a feed. I did before - it was the only way she drank it coz she was so hungry!

There are great websites out there - unfortunately cant find the one about the gaviscon and when you can give it!

Also you shouldnt have to swop to formula for reflux as far as I know but if you do I actually have a full sealed tin of SMA staydown if you're in dublin, can give to you, just pm.

Good luck with the gaviscon!

cyning

Like that the gaviscon was a pain in the neck for me too, but I put it in a bottle and gave it that way. As in the sachet mixed with 15 mil of water but just in a bottle. If you express a bit of milk you can give it that way too. I'd occasionally mix it in within an oz of freshly expressed breast milk if I was having problems with it.

CaraMay

You have my total sympathy - reflux is a terrible dose. My son was lactose intolerant and suffers/ed from reflux as a result. He is on nutramigen with zoton since 5 months and is doing great now.

I would suggest you out all dairy from your diet if you are goign to continue breast feeding to see if that improves matters. I always had and have the cot raised. I got a reflux wedge for changing his nappy and also for his cot. I let him sleep during the day in his chair and definitely didnt turn on the swing part of it.

Gavison didnt work for us and it constipated him. TBH, I would spend the money going to a specialist who deals with childhood reflux and get a full and proper diagnosis early on. The lack of sleep is a killer but is unlikely to improve until you get the tummy problems sorted out.

yellow hen

CaraMay wrote: »

You have my total sympathy - reflux is a terrible dose. My son was lactose intolerant and suffers/ed from reflux as a result. He is on nutramigen with zoton since 5 months and is doing great now.

I would suggest you out all dairy from your diet if you are goign to continue breast feeding to see if that improves matters. I always had and have the cot raised. I got a reflux wedge for changing his nappy and also for his cot. I let him sleep during the day in his chair and definitely didnt turn on the swing part of it.

Gavison didnt work for us and it constipated him. TBH, I would spend the money going to a specialist who deals with childhood reflux and get a full and proper diagnosis early on. The lack of sleep is a killer but is unlikely to improve until you get the tummy problems sorted out.

The is really interesting. I've posted this on another windy baby thread but here goes again....

Our lil lad had reflux but it was probably on the milder end of the spectrum. When I was bfeeding, I expressed a little milk and mixed the gaviscon in and spooned it to him ( sounds messy but it was actually fine). He was also on Zantac which worked great. I stopped bfeeding at 6 weeks as the reflux seemed to improve when I have him formula. By 14/15 weeks he was off both and doing great. He now however suffers horrendously from wind at night time. He's also constipated most of the time. I've been to the doc and phn who were all but useless so this weekend, after alot of debate, we moved him to nutramigen.

Here's the confusing part.... Yesterday was his first day on the new formula. He went to sleep at 7am and at 7:30 woke in a desperate state. It took me 40 mins to work wind out of him and calm him down. After cursing a lot to myself and feeling so guilty, i said I'd revert back to the old formula. Then lo and behold, the little monkey slept from 8pm to 5am...in 4.5 months he's never managed to do this!!!! I am so confused now. Caramay how did your little one adapt to taking that formula? We've given him the new formula all day today so god knows what's ahead tonight! Also caramay, was your little one constipated at all?

CaraMay

How much did you give yellow hen? Until 13 months he only ever got 5oz bottles. He took well to nutramigen but then anything would have been an improvement. Do you have him on anything else?

He was constipated. Seemingly a warm bottle will help that and also water with brown sugar in it. It settles after a while. I don't think its a great move to mix the feeds though.

yellow hen

I'm making the same size bottles as I did on his previous formula (how could you give less?) do he's getting 6oz bottles. I'm not mixing the formula as such..he has completely moved over to nutramigen. If it doesn't help, he'll go back to aptimil. I felt I had to try something as he's getting worse and the docs don't seem to be able to offer any advice. He's getting lactulose twice a day as the doc told me not to give brown sugar. He also takes about an oz of warm water every day but he's still constipated. Were you told by the doc to only give 5oz bottles? What age was your daughter? I feel so stressed out by it all. I jus feel like there's no real support or advice out there. My phn told me to increase his solids and cut way back in bottles..even to give him a little weetabix for breakfast.....he's 4.5 months old for christs sake!

CaraMay

The problem with reflux is that its trial and error. See how much he should be having per day and split that into smaller bottles. Even now at 18 months his largest bottle is 7 oz.

Why no sugar?

Think about it, if he has a lot in his tummy then its more likely to come up. At 5 months he was on nutramigen and a small bit of fruit mainly pear (apples and banana not good for reflux) but I don't remember when he started weetabix. He use a lot of sweet potato and carrot but nothing too heavy.

Rachineire

Just a warning if you havnt had a nutramagen poo yet, its very different from other formula poos and smells to high heaven! what my doctor recommended for me was to water down the bottle a bit. I was doing 6oz bottles so he said ok put 5 scoops in a 6oz bottle. the nutramagen is thicker than regular formula so this helps them at the start a bit. so he was getting 5 5oz (but with 6oz of water) of the formula a day, so 25 oz per day. make sense? Ive increased it over the last couple of weeks to now he is on an 8oz bottle (with 7 scoops of the formula). he keeps pretty much all of it down now besides a little bit with a burp, where as before he was puking up half a bottle.

MurdyWurdy

We're in day 3 of the Gaviscon and things are getting better. Friday and Saturday night were bad but last night was a lot better. I think the fact it was cooler helped too. We have a wedge to prop up his cot and make a big effort to keep him sitting upright for 30 minutes after he gets the Gaviscon (which we are mixing with expressed breast milk, he won't eat it otherwise). We also have introduced a dummy and a gro bag ( he wasn't big enough before) which seems to help him settle and the dummy seems to distract him.

He went 4 hours between some of his feeds last night which hasn't happened since he was 2 weeks. He's still obviously in pain when he is lying in his cot because he makes all the horrible grunting, congestive noises but it's not bad enough to wake him up.

Fingers crossed it continues to improve. I feel human again today, even though I am still awake a good bit at night keeping him upright and burping/cleaning up baby vomit.

yellow hen

MurdyWurdy wrote: »

We're in day 3 of the Gaviscon and things are getting better. Friday and Saturday night were bad but last night was a lot better. I think the fact it was cooler helped too. We have a wedge to prop up his cot and make a big effort to keep him sitting upright for 30 minutes after he gets the Gaviscon (which we are mixing with expressed breast milk, he won't eat it otherwise). We also have introduced a dummy and a gro bag ( he wasn't big enough before) which seems to help him settle and the dummy seems to distract him.

He went 4 hours between some of his feeds last night which hasn't happened since he was 2 weeks. He's still obviously in pain when he is lying in his cot because he makes all the horrible grunting, congestive noises but it's not bad enough to wake him up.

Fingers crossed it continues to improve. I feel human again today, even though I am still awake a good bit at night keeping him upright and burping/cleaning up baby vomit.

His murdy, I've been there and remember it only too well!! I hope the gaviscon helps. Try feed him in an upright position to prevent back flow of milk. I used to bfed lying down and it used to make the reflux worse. Hope it improves soon but in any case take comfort in the fact that its very very common and it does pass.

theLuggage

MurdyWurdy wrote: »

We're in day 3 of the Gaviscon and things are getting better. Friday and Saturday night were bad but last night was a lot better. I think the fact it was cooler helped too. We have a wedge to prop up his cot and make a big effort to keep him sitting upright for 30 minutes after he gets the Gaviscon (which we are mixing with expressed breast milk, he won't eat it otherwise). We also have introduced a dummy and a gro bag ( he wasn't big enough before) which seems to help him settle and the dummy seems to distract him.

.

Dummy is actually very good for reflux, something to do with the saliva going down. So encourage that. Ours sucks her thumb but she definitely used to suck the dodi more when her reflux was worse.

MurdyWurdy

theLuggage wrote: »

Dummy is actually very good for reflux, something to do with the saliva going down. So encourage that. Ours sucks her thumb but she definitely used to suck the dodi more when her reflux was worse.

Yeah, I read that too so that's why we gave it a go. I also read it distracts babies from pain too. Anything that helps is welcome!

He seemed so much better today so fingers crossed we have an ok night. It's nice to hear from others that have been through it anyway

MurdyWurdy

theLuggage wrote: »

You can give gaviscon before a feed or during a feed. I did before - it was the only way she drank it coz she was so hungry!

There are great websites out there - unfortunately cant find the one about the gaviscon and when you can give it!

Also you shouldnt have to swop to formula for reflux as far as I know but if you do I actually have a full sealed tin of SMA staydown if you're in dublin, can give to you, just pm.

Good luck with the gaviscon!

That's very kind of you! I am in Dublin so if we do switch to formula I'll let you know I spent all evening breastfeeding him so the formula is looking more tempting each day. He's a guzzler which is part if the reason for the reflux, i think. We'll stick with bf for the moment anyway and see how we go.

MurdyWurdy

My little man got weighed today and put on 7oz in 5 days - he's a little chubster so the spitting up isn't having an affect on hus weight anyway. Last night he went 4 hours between all his feeds and slept a good bit between that so it's much more under control. The Gaviscon and keeping him upright have really worked for us, luckily for us he could be so much worse.

I'm like a different person today because I had a decent enough nights sleep. The tiredness and helplessness were really getting to me and I had a few days of being very low. I appreciate the support and gearing that othe people had been through similar things

How Strange

The constant feeding is probably the 6 week growth spurt. It's the toughest one (in my opinion) so stick with it and you'll notice a big difference once he's through it. It usually lasts 2-3 days.

Nead21

It's really hard going and when they are distressed and everything you're doing is not helping, you start doubting yourself.

We only had to use gaviscon for a couple of days...i hated using it...and after a few weeks he just seemed to be fine. Hopefully your son will be the same.

Did you try soya milk instead? Someone else mentioned fennel tea...i drink that also. I think it all helped in my case.

sunshiner

my daughter is 7 weeks, she has bad refux. She vomits after ever feed, a couple of times,she looks in pain. I am combo feeding. She has been constipated for 2 days she went today. I decided to change her formula to Hipp Organic to see if it helps. I tried infacol with no help.i started the gaviscon my OH thinks its helped but im not so sure. I started her on the bottles of boiled water she doesnt drink much. She is going mad on the dummy so that kind of soothers her.