milking parlour build

jaymla627

Seen as how 2015 is just around the corner and a lot of lads are considering extending their parlour/getting into milk i thought id give a rundown of a parlour and the costs of a 14 unit we put in this year into an existing shed with us adding on a span 60x30

Secondhand 14 unit plant new stainless steel pans and new stalls 20 unit fitted 18,000 euro
New Augers/ secondhand orby feeders/meal bin 5,500 euro
Electrial parts/wiring 3,500
Concrete/blocks 13,000
Labour 7,000
Cladding/steel 4,000
Machinery hire/diseal 4,000
Bulk tank 6,000 litre 6000 euro
Wash down pump/water heater 2,000 euro
New esb connection 2,000 euro
Misc 5,000 euro

Total cost came in at 70,000 euro with ourselves doing all of the groundwork/building work on the shed extension so to sum it up anyone out there that thinks its possible to put in a parlour on the cheap it aint really possible unless your talking about something under 10 units that will fit into an existing shed.

stanflt

jaymla627 wrote: »

Seen as how 2015 is just around the corner and a lot of lads are considering extending their parlour/getting into milk i thought id give a rundown of a parlour and the costs of a 14 unit we put in this year into an existing shed with us adding on a span 60x30

Secondhand 14 unit plant new stainless steel pans and new stalls 20 unit fitted 18,000 euro
New Augers/ secondhand orby feeders/meal bin 5,500 euro
Electrial parts/wiring 3,500
Concrete/blocks 13,000
Labour 7,000
Cladding/steel 4,000
Machinery hire/diseal 4,000
Bulk tank 6,000 litre 6000 euro
Wash down pump/water heater 2,000 euro
New esb connection 2,000 euro
Misc 5,000 euro

Total cost came in at 70,000 euro with ourselves doing all of the groundwork/building work on the shed extension so to sum it up anyone out there that thinks its possible to put in a parlour on the cheap it aint really possible unless your talking about something under 10 units that will fit into an existing shed.

Fair play for posting figures

How many are you milking and how many do you intend on going to comfortably

Is the 6000 litre tank big enough

delaval

Thanks, really useful guide.

jaymla627

stanflt wrote: »

Fair play for posting figures

How many are you milking and how many do you intend on going to comfortably

Is the 6000 litre tank big enough

Milking 55 at the will be at 100 in 2015 have 50 heifer calves coming on with the potential to go to 250 plus if we can secure a 150 acre block beside us that should be coming up for lease shortly enough.
On the bulk tank issue will put in a outdoor silo one if we go over the 100 and leave in the existing tank for the shoulders of the year

kevthegaff

nice job! i put in a 14 unit 6yrs ago when lads were getting out, the machine+clusters were only 2-3yrs old. 6000 euros including iron work water heater hoses and a water pump. Meself and the friend welded up the frame in three nights, installed the machine meself(pulsators were a pain as they were cut and had to be rewired(took me a day alone), wired the shed meself to the fusebox, brother wired it to the fusebox and checked everything over. Bought a 3000 litre tank for 900 and got it installed for another 800. Put it in using timber logs:D. Anyway it was in an existing milking shed so that saved alot, and i got a technician to check pulsation, vacuum etc the following yr. 8-9k but i was fortunate cos lads were leaving dairying at the time. Also got the the parlour rewired last year!

jaymla627

kevthegaff wrote: »

nice job! i put in a 14 unit 6yrs ago when lads were getting out, the machine+clusters were only 2-3yrs old. 6000 euros including iron work water heater hoses and a water pump. Meself and the friend welded up the frame in three nights, installed the machine meself(pulsators were a pain as they were cut and had to be rewired(took me a day alone), wired the shed meself to the fusebox, brother wired it to the fusebox and checked everything over. Bought a 3000 litre tank for 900 and got it installed for another 800. Put it in using timber logs:D. Anyway it was in an existing milking shed so that saved alot, and i got a technician to check pulsation, vacuum etc the following yr. 8-9k but i was fortunate cos lads were leaving dairying at the time. Also got the the parlour rewired last year!

The amount of earthing that the electrian put in was unreal cost 700 euro alone for that every single metal part in the parlours earthed, well worth it though have milked in places that had stray voltage pure nightmare

Viewtodiefor

jaymla627 wrote: »

Seen as how 2015 is just around the corner and a lot of lads are considering extending their parlour/getting into milk i thought id give a rundown of a parlour and the costs of a 14 unit we put in this year into an existing shed with us adding on a span 60x30

Secondhand 14 unit plant new stainless steel pans and new stalls 20 unit fitted 18,000 euro
New Augers/ secondhand orby feeders/meal bin 5,500 euro
Electrial parts/wiring 3,500
Concrete/blocks 13,000
Labour 7,000
Cladding/steel 4,000
Machinery hire/diseal 4,000
Bulk tank 6,000 litre 6000 euro
Wash down pump/water heater 2,000 euro
New esb connection 2,000 euro
Misc 5,000 euro

Total cost came in at 70,000 euro with ourselves doing all of the groundwork/building work on the shed extension so to sum it up anyone out there that thinks its possible to put in a parlour on the cheap it aint really possible unless your talking about something under 10 units that will fit into an existing shed.

Nice job looks well thought out!

Here is another example of an upgrade done this year in existing parlour. 10 unit can extend to 14

New machine with ten units will drive 14 if needed. Incl 2*2 pulsation,swing arms,back bars, kerbing €23000 incl vat

Installed all machine myself

Equipment hire 1200
Concrete 1500
Blocks. 400
Steel for frame. 700
Labour. 2500
Wash down pump hoses n tank 800
Electrical parts 350

Total €30500 incl vat
Less grant on parlour €8000
Vat back. €3000

Cash cost €19000

Timmaay

Very useful thread!! I'm not positive at all what I'm doing moving forward, currently got a 6unit milking 70cows, which is ok, but to hit the quota and produce more of a seasonal supply curve I can see myself milking 85/90 next year at the peak (90/6, 15rows, no thanks!). Most lightly option at the second is to fire on two more units, which would mean 11rows, I could add on the extra 2 units next Jan when only the winter ladies are in the parlour, probably cost me say 5grand all in, once I get hold of an old 2nd hand parlour to use the jars etc. Other option is just sit tight for next year, and do something like viewtodie in 2014/15, 19grand with the grant is very reasonable, I've seen some nice newish 2nd hand parlours also, likes of this looks decent, might sound abit pricey in comparison to 19k new, but the cashman feeders alone are worth a good few quid.

Biggest problem for me spending money on a new parlour now is I'm still unsure about the land base moving forward, also a 10unit would not fit into the existing parlour building, cowflow is poor as is, 8units will be about as many as I'd get away with, so its back to a job like jays in a new shed for 50k+

Viewtodiefor

Timmaay wrote: »

Very useful thread!! I'm not positive at all what I'm doing moving forward, currently got a 6unit milking 70cows, which is ok, but to hit the quota and produce more of a seasonal supply curve I can see myself milking 85/90 next year at the peak (90/6, 15rows, no thanks!). Most lightly option at the second is to fire on two more units, which would mean 11rows, I could add on the extra 2 units next Jan when only the winter ladies are in the parlour, probably cost me say 5grand all in, once I get hold of an old 2nd hand parlour to use the jars etc. Other option is just sit tight for next year, and do something like viewtodie in 2014/15, 19grand with the grant is very reasonable, I've seen some nice newish 2nd hand parlours also, likes of this looks decent, might sound abit pricey in comparison to 19k new, but the cashman feeders alone are worth a good few quid.

Biggest problem for me spending money on a new parlour now is I'm still unsure about the land base moving forward, also a 10unit would not fit into the existing parlour building, cowflow is poor as is, 8units will be about as many as I'd get away with, so its back to a job like jays in a new shed for 50k+

Saw that one advertised and thought it looked a decent parlour kid u got it for 10k it might be worth it. That type cashman feeder making about 250 each s/h newer type around 450each. So I'd be looking at 7500 for machine which isn't too bad. Plus your labour etc for installing it

Going forward...

Great thread.

Milking 74 through a six unit. Two hours from start to finish so not too bad. Space isn't limited and could squeeze in two more with new troughs as the shed is atm. Finding a window to do the work is my problem, cows are always milking.

Dump line, feeders, drafting and more importantly, getting rid of the slow milkers make a massive difference to output in smaller parlours. Also, I think there's a notion amongst farmers that one hour is the absolute maximum, which is nonsense imo.

Timmaay

Going forward... wrote: »

Dump line, feeders, drafting and more importantly, getting rid of the slow milkers make a massive difference to output in smaller parlours. Also, I think there's a notion amongst farmers that one hour is the absolute maximum, which is nonsense imo.

Agreed with all that, I have come to the conclusion also that hiring a milker say 10times a month would only set me back 5grand a year, small change in comparison to in my case of spending 50k+ upgrading the current 6unit parlour to a new 10/14unit, which would only really knock off max an hour at most from the current 3hrs (per day total) it takes me now from clusters on to clusters off. Those 10 free milkings a month would mean a hell of alot more to me than shorter milking times! (I picked 10 a month as an average, covers say taking a long weekend off here and there, along with maybe every sat or sun morning to allow for hangover sleep ha!). My main reason for wanting to go to 8units at least is I'll be pushing on the cow numbers next year abit, then if alot more come 2015 I'd be balancing out the cost of a new 14unit etc against the extra income that I get, rather than being able to milk in 40mins etc!

Mulumpy

Timmaay wrote: »

Agreed with all that, I have come to the conclusion also that hiring a milker say 10times a month would only set me back 5grand a year, small change in comparison to in my case of spending 50k+ upgrading the current 6unit parlour to a new 10/14unit, which would only really knock off max an hour at most from the current 3hrs (per day total) it takes me now from clusters on to clusters off. Those 10 free milkings a month would mean a hell of alot more to me than shorter milking times! (I picked 10 a month as an average, covers say taking a long weekend off here and there, along with maybe every sat or sun morning to allow for hangover sleep ha!). My main reason for wanting to go to 8units at least is I'll be pushing on the cow numbers next year abit, then if alot more come 2015 I'd be balancing out the cost of a new 14unit etc against the extra income that I get, rather than being able to milk in 40mins etc!

Have to agree with you Tim ive a seven unit parlour milking 60, parlour 40 years old would love to upgrade but ive a lad milking 20 times a month cos have ofj and would still have to pay him when its built.

jaymla627

Going forward... wrote: »

Great thread.

Milking 74 through a six unit. Two hours from start to finish so not too bad. Space isn't limited and could squeeze in two more with new troughs as the shed is atm. Finding a window to do the work is my problem, cows are always milking.

Dump line, feeders, drafting and more importantly, getting rid of the slow milkers make a massive difference to output in smaller parlours. Also, I think there's a notion amongst farmers that one hour is the absolute maximum, which is nonsense imo.

If your a one man show i think its a given, i was told by about five farmers in the area i was crazy putting in the parlour i did and what was wrong with a good six unit your only wasteing your money, what i class as crazy is the lads that have no problem spending 60,000-70,000 grand on a tractor but when it comes to upgrading the parlour thats so far down the list it dosent even register.

Timmaay

jaymla627 wrote: »

i was told by about five farmers in the area i was crazy putting in the parlour i did and what was wrong with a good six unit your only wasteing your money

Ha, plenty of lads I know who have spent wayy more money than you did for less units (ie they went to town on gadgets, acrs/flowmeters etc etc), I'd personally have no problem spending 60/70grand on a setup like yours down the line, but need to prioritize spending for now on things that will give a better return, both financially, and reducing my workload.

kevthegaff

i have a 12 unit basic, takes about an hour in the evening, an hour and a half in the evening milking 90 cows. I done the milking a couple of weeks ago in a 20 unit, the worst thing i ever did, all i was thinking afterwards was putting in a bigger parlour, the thought tho only lasted a half an hour!. I will eventually add on more units or replace the machine with cluster removers and upto 18-20 units but only when i can afford it. The only machine i care about on the farm is the milking parlour. But if it would save me an hour in the day and i could afford it i definitely upgrade. Time is money:D

delaval

We are putting 21 rows through one and 17 through another at peak excellent drafting on both.
Do not see the need to spend 150k when we pay milkers

Sam Kade

jaymla627 wrote: »

Seen as how 2015 is just around the corner and a lot of lads are considering extending their parlour/getting into milk i thought id give a rundown of a parlour and the costs of a 14 unit we put in this year into an existing shed with us adding on a span 60x30

Secondhand 14 unit plant new stainless steel pans and new stalls 20 unit fitted 18,000 euro
New Augers/ secondhand orby feeders/meal bin 5,500 euro
Electrial parts/wiring 3,500
Concrete/blocks 13,000
Labour 7,000
Cladding/steel 4,000
Machinery hire/diseal 4,000
Bulk tank 6,000 litre 6000 euro
Wash down pump/water heater 2,000 euro
New esb connection 2,000 euro
Misc 5,000 euro

Total cost came in at 70,000 euro with ourselves doing all of the groundwork/building work on the shed extension so to sum it up anyone out there that thinks its possible to put in a parlour on the cheap it aint really possible unless your talking about something under 10 units that will fit into an existing shed.

Why didn't you go for a straight exit and have the dairy offset?

jaymla627

delaval wrote: »

We are putting 21 rows through one and 17 through another at peak excellent drafting on both.
Do not see the need to spend 150k when we pay milkers

Three issues i see with that amount of rows 1. I wouldnt personally spend upwards of 5 and a half hours plus a day milking cows why should you expect someone else to do it.
2. Your last couple of rows of cows are spending 4 hours plus a day standing on concrete which is the main reason in large herds with long milking times the last two rows look like s...t for 90% of the year.
3. Staff retention/getting staff if your looking for staff and you interview a top class lad who ticks all the boxes but he also has another job offer same wages/conditions but it involves say ten rows of cows with hour and half machine on machine off milkings 99% of the time what job is he going to take.

mahoney_j

delaval wrote: »

We are putting 21 rows through one and 17 through another at peak excellent drafting on both.
Do not see the need to spend 150k when we pay milkers

If I was u de laval I'd splash the cash and stick in a 60 bay rotary parlour with acrs .freind milks about 280 in one in an hour and 15 minutes and swears it was the best money he ever spent.sure it'll keep the tax man away from u as well!!!!!!.

kevthegaff

lads i get bored milking for over an hour, but thats cos im milking 7 days a week, the minute i get a good few quid, there is gona be changes around here:D:D

dungfly

jaymla627 wrote: »

Seen as how 2015 is just around the corner and a lot of lads are considering extending their parlour/getting into milk i thought id give a rundown of a parlour and the costs of a 14 unit we put in this year into an existing shed with us adding on a span 60x30

Secondhand 14 unit plant new stainless steel pans and new stalls 20 unit fitted 18,000 euro
New Augers/ secondhand orby feeders/meal bin 5,500 euro
Electrial parts/wiring 3,500
Concrete/blocks 13,000
Labour 7,000
Cladding/steel 4,000
Machinery hire/diseal 4,000
Bulk tank 6,000 litre 6000 euro
Wash down pump/water heater 2,000 euro
New esb connection 2,000 euro
Misc 5,000 euro

Total cost came in at 70,000 euro with ourselves doing all of the groundwork/building work on the shed extension so to sum it up anyone out there that thinks its possible to put in a parlour on the cheap it aint really possible unless your talking about something under 10 units that will fit into an existing shed.

jaymla627 thanks so much for posting such details and photos. Iam going to upgrade an old parlour too and was fascinated by your expansion of the build and parlour. Could you post more pictures of the parlour building (roof and especially the railway supports and what looks like a crush at one side of the building). Can you tell us any more about the building expansion, such as mass concrete, things you outsourced or didn't. Particularly interested in the roof, walls, supports etc. I have the same old feeders, where did you source extras, what would you recommend/lessons learnt/ costs? Very impressed here. Well done!

delaval

jaymla627 wrote: »

Three issues i see with that amount of rows 1. I wouldnt personally spend upwards of 5 and a half hours plus a day milking cows why should you expect someone else to do it.
2. Your last couple of rows of cows are spending 4 hours plus a day standing on concrete which is the main reason in large herds with long milking times the last two rows look like s...t for 90% of the year.
3. Staff retention/getting staff if your looking for staff and you interview a top class lad who ticks all the boxes but he also has another job offer same wages/conditions but it involves say ten rows of cows with hour and half machine on machine off milkings 99% of the time what job is he going to take.

1 I have no prob doing it and we pay the two guys well one guy here 10 and other 8 years

2 yes this is a very real issue cows on concrete but I must say they are not looking ****e. The slow walkers and penicillin are kept beside parlour.

3 Staff retention refer to point 1.

delaval

mahoney_j wrote: »

If I was u de laval I'd splash the cash and stick in a 60 bay rotary parlour with acrs .freind milks about 280 in one in an hour and 15 minutes and swears it was the best money he ever spent.sure it'll keep the tax man away from u as well!!!!!!.

There is no doubt that we need to address the milking time situation. Cow numbers and quota grew rapidly here through opportunities that I couldn't pass up. Land also was bought so concrete was low on the list and still is.
We are fortunate that we have 3 parlours though one need attention (7k) to go properly. We have too many cows for two parlours and not enough till 2015 to operate 3 as of now it would require 3 milkers and we will stick it out for another while.

On your point re rotary. Lovely parlours to milk in, huge initial cost and running costs are high. 60 point for 250 cows is over kill but you must build big for expansion as they can't be extended. I have a friend in the UK with an 80 bale with one man putting 80 out every 10 minutes that's 100 mins for his 750 cows.

My plans are for groups of no more than 250 through 24 unit parlour. It's the max number that 1.5 men can handle with one guy milking from end of Ai till dry off.

jaymla627

delaval wrote: »

1 I have no prob doing it and we pay the two guys well one guy here 10 and other 8 years

2 yes this is a very real issue cows on concrete but I must say they are not looking ****e. The slow walkers and penicillin are kept beside parlour.

3 Staff retention refer to point 1.

Just to throw a curve ball at yeah so did yeah ever do the figures on how much money you would save a year in wages if you knocked one hour a day of each milking doing simple maths 28 hours week x 44 weeks = 1232hours x 15 euro hour= 18,480 euro a year not to mention happier cows

kevthegaff

delaval wrote: »

There is no doubt that we need to address the milking time situation. Cow numbers and quota grew rapidly here through opportunities that I couldn't pass up. Land also was bought so concrete was low on the list and still is.
We are fortunate that we have 3 parlours though one need attention (7k) to go properly. We have too many cows for two parlours and not enough till 2015 to operate 3 as of now it would require 3 milkers and we will stick it out for another while.

On your point re rotary. Lovely parlours to milk in, huge initial cost and running costs are high. 60 point for 250 cows is over kill but you must build big for expansion as they can't be extended. I have a friend in the UK with an 80 bale with one man putting 80 out every 10 minutes that's 100 mins for his 750 cows.

My plans are for groups of no more than 250 through 24 unit parlour. It's the max number that 1.5 men can handle with one guy milking from end of Ai till dry off.

how many cows are ye milking delaval, is it 3 separate parlours and is it all the one block, just wondering

delaval

kevthegaff wrote: »

how many cows are ye milking delaval, is it 3 separate parlours and is it all the one block, just wondering

3dairy farms only two milking at the moment till post quota. If it was all together that would have built by now

delaval

jaymla627 wrote: »

Three issues i see with that amount of rows 1. I wouldnt personally spend upwards of 5 and a half hours plus a day milking cows why should you expect someone else to do it.
2. Your last couple of rows of cows are spending 4 hours plus a day standing on concrete which is the main reason in large herds with long milking times the last two rows look like s...t for 90% of the year.
3. Staff retention/getting staff if your looking for staff and you interview a top class lad who ticks all the boxes but he also has another job offer same wages/conditions but it involves say ten rows of cows with hour and half machine on machine off milkings 99% of the time what job is he going to take.

Did you not post recently in Moorepark thread about 'poster boys' and the lack if sheds and OWP's.
In sheds cows spend months on concrete and they don't look shyte!!!!!

kevthegaff

if i had a lad fulltime, there would be no upgrade in milking facilities. But as it stands ill prob change the parlour in the nxt 5 yrs either extend the existing to a 16-18 unit or put in a new machine.

jaymla627

delaval wrote: »

Did you not post recently in Moorepark thread about 'poster boys' and the lack if sheds and OWP's.
In sheds cows spend months on concrete and they don't look shyte!!!!!

Therez a thing called cubicles and rubber mats does help alot, a new greenfield site in england milking 700 cows have no concrete exposed in their sheds even the feed areas are rubber matted along with the holding yard there was a trend on british farming forum about it before it crashed was really impressive.

Timmaay

kevthegaff wrote: »

if i had a lad fulltime, there would be no upgrade in milking facilities. But as it stands ill prob change the parlour in the nxt 5 yrs either extend the existing to a 16-18 unit or put in a new machine.

How many are you hoping to milk post quota, and what number would you be happy to milk on yourown, or say with no full time labour Kev? I don't think I'd be happy myself with much over the 100 with no help, especially not if I stick out the wintermilk. I think the route of going 150, hire someone fulltime, and put in a low cost no frills parlour would be more suited to me, that of course is dependent on the land becoming available beside me, and then the risk of having to employ someone, what if they leave and I can't replace them etc etc!

whelan1

Timmaay wrote: »

How many are you hoping to milk post quota, and what number would you be happy to milk on yourown, or say with no full time labour Kev? I don't think I'd be happy myself with much over the 100 with no help, especially not if I stick out the wintermilk. I think the route of going 150, hire someone fulltime, and put in a low cost no frills parlour would be more suited to me, that of course is dependent on the land becoming available beside me, and then the risk of having to employ someone, what if they leave and I can't replace them etc etc!

am on my own at the minute- well my da will help if i need and my husband is doing a tiny bit- but no paid labour and its great.... got a lad to milk for me friday evening and saturday morning as i was away and there was water in the milk, no text from dairies bit protein was down .18% and fat was down too.....its an awful lot of hassle getting the right person and you dont want to kill yourself either

kevthegaff

Unless im going back into the software industry or leasing another farm, i wont get a fulltime lad with me,. just think its too costly unless i get to 150 and i duno is that too many on my land. Ill go to 120 post 2015. if i can rent or buy 40-50 acres for silage and replacements i could go to 140-150. The only problem i find with going up in numbers is springtime which i should get in some help. Also its too hilly for alot of contractors so i end up doing all the tractor work which kills me in springtime. Ill definitely do something about the parlour if im upping the numbers, 7-8 rows is enough for me(i get bored especially as i have been milking since january). if i have a surplus of $$ i might put an extra few units on this year, as the pit is long enough for 18 units and the augers are long enough for 18.

delaval

jaymla627 wrote: »

Therez a thing called cubicles and rubber mats does help alot, a new greenfield site in england milking 700 cows have no concrete exposed in their sheds even the feed areas are rubber matted along with the holding yard there was a trend on british farming forum about it before it crashed was really impressive.

Funny how people build fancy sheds for dry cows that are designed to mimic the outdoors?????
Are sheds for cows or people?
A spring herd calving to grass only needs cubicles for 30% of their cows to milk at back end.
Building at €2500/ cow for 4 weeks milking or dry cows is nuts. Outdoor cubicles or pads the answer!!!!!???

jaymla627

dungfly wrote: »

jaymla627 thanks so much for posting such details and photos. Iam going to upgrade an old parlour too and was fascinated by your expansion of the build and parlour. Could you post more pictures of the parlour building (roof and especially the railway supports and what looks like a crush at one side of the building). Can you tell us any more about the building expansion, such as mass concrete, things you outsourced or didn't. Particularly interested in the roof, walls, supports etc. I have the same old feeders, where did you source extras, what would you recommend/lessons learnt/ costs? Very impressed here. Well done!

All building work/ground work was done by ourselves and a local lad done all the block work/plastering with a local concrete crew doing the floors/pit/holding yard etc this was all done the one day with 11 loads of concrete and a telescopic pump in about three hours was a super job with everything laser leveled etc....
The frame is made up of rsj's joined up with steel barriers and five steel thrushes joining up the whole lot, the crush was a homemade job done for about 300 euro.
My top tips in my expirence would be make sure you leave plenty of room for expansion and lots of room at the front of the parlour; if your not sure about how your going to design your parlour layout get professional help,put in plenty of skylights over the parlour pit cows prefer bright spaces, dont build up your parlour walls to high cows are a lot more settled when they can see around them

Going forward...

delaval wrote: »

Funny how people build fancy sheds for dry cows that are designed to mimic the outdoors?????
Are sheds for cows or people?
A spring herd calving to grass only needs cubicles for 30% of their cows to milk at back end.
Building at €2500/ cow for 4 weeks milking or dry cows is nuts. Outdoor cubicles or pads the answer!!!!!???

You have to compare like for like. For a start, that shed is in Scotland.

But it's clear there are vastly different systems, land quality, weather etc involved. I don't disagree with you on spending money on reseeding, roads, fencing, water etc but for many Irish farmers, winter is a reality and is a tad longer than your one so milking indoors is very much part of that. Sheds are a necessity, I have nothing too fancy but cows are safe and comfortable.

delaval

Going forward... wrote: »

You have to compare like for like. For a start, that shed is in Scotland.

But it's clear there are vastly different systems, land quality, weather etc involved. I don't disagree with you on spending money on reseeding, roads, fencing, water etc but for many Irish farmers, winter is a reality and is a tad longer than your one so milking indoors is very much part of that. Sheds are a necessity, I have nothing too fancy but cows are safe and comfortable.

I totally agree but I know of two men who broke them selves with sheds. I know there were other issues at play.
Some people go over the top and calving to growth is part of the answer.
I know a guy in Scotland milking 750 spring calvers with topless cubicles and all is well. He will roof if selling farm as unlike here buildings add value to their farms

mf240

The way I look at it is that cows will need a cubicle each even if their only in for six weeks.

It makes the winter easier on man and beast and the option is there to milk on for the winter.

I would prefer to have a nice shed than an off farm investment or a fancy jeep or car or a massive house.

I have no plans to be the richest man in the graveyard, but I am fond of my cows and work with them seven days a week so I like to make things as comfortable and user friendly as possible.

Going forward...

Topless cubicles. Surely there must be a rule against them. All sounds rather barbaric tbh.

Markcheese

Going forward... wrote: »

Great thread.

Milking 74 through a six unit. Two hours from start to finish so not too bad. Space isn't limited and could squeeze in two more with new troughs as the shed is atm. Finding a window to do the work is my problem, cows are always milking.

Dump line, feeders, drafting and more
importantly, getting rid of the slow
milkers make a massive difference to
output in smaller parlours. Also, I think
there's a notion amongst farmers that
one hour is the absolute maximum,
which is nonsense imo.

Rather than looking at spending 100000 on a parlour could you get a lad to relief milk for either a few morning or a few evenings a week , might get you an occasional weekend or Sunday off.
If it's a regular thing you could probably come to an hourly rate...

delaval

Going forward... wrote: »

Topless cubicles. Surely there must be a rule against them. All sounds rather barbaric tbh.

Barbaric?????

Sam Kade

delaval wrote: »

Barbaric?????

He probably doesn't realize that cows wear leather jackets:)

yellow50HX

delaval wrote: »

I totally agree but I know of two men who broke them selves with sheds. I know there were other issues at play.
Some people go over the top and calving to growth is part of the answer.
I know a guy in Scotland milking 750 spring calvers with topless cubicles and all is well. He will roof if selling farm as unlike here buildings add value to their farms

intresting thread, but like most things i just love wading in to throw a few spanners around.

topless housing and open sheds may be cheaper to have but whats the knock effect with your waste storage. i know cows have been living in the open for thousdands of years but being in a nice big open grassland is rather diffent then being in closed in shed.

The upgrades that were done over the last number of years with the FYM scheme have transformed the infratsuce within most irish farms, with the amont of rain we get in this country over the winter the old open yard and open tanks used to fill up quite quickly.

off the top of my head im not sure what size slurry tank would be required but housing for around 40 cows in a cubile shed uses up a full 4 bay 12.5 foot tank in a covered setup. you could double that with the amount of water that falls on the roof over a winter. if you rise the numbers up to 200-300 thats a huge amount of storage required and then there is spreading it, not much fun having full tanks and nowhere to spread. I would say that the overall extra costs of slurry storage and handling and spreading would be not much more then the cost of roofing the shed. it also makes feeding silage a working with the cows indoors a whole lot easier. And thats not taking into account the dairy washings and collection yards for dairy herds

a simple roofed cubicle shed and feeding passage is defo worth it, not only in terms of waste water reducion but also in making working conditions a lot eiser on man and beast. being able to feed and check teh cattle out of teh wind and rain at 5am on a miserable january is a godsend

Timmaay

This argument is done to death by now! Yes a nice big portal shed with cubicles, underground slurry and a nice feeding passage are the easiest and most ideal way to winter cows, but that all costs a shed load of capital, nobody but the banks would win in the case that you start out with a greenfield, and spend a million in concrete before the 1st cow gets milked! Without lads being initiative and going with the likes of topless cubicles, outwintering pads, and even just outwintering the animals in dry fields etc, we would be shy alot of large dairyfarmers who have started from very little!! The same people who bash outwintering pads are up moaning that land is too fragmented in Ireland etc etc, the likes of these low capital dairyfarmers are well and truly not letting land fragmentation hold them back! Same thing with the JE verse HO, yes the HO gives more milk, end of the story, but the JE offers a solution where using HOs would make very little financial sense. Having come from a different industry with my previous jobs, the strangest thing I find among farmers is the whole attitude of they themselves are right and everyone else (esp Teagasc ha) are utterly wrong, and yourman who goes off the beaten track at all is considered a clown (to quote Jay!).

F.D

interesting stuff and fairy play for people putting up costs and showing there set up
i am surprised at how lads can justify not spending money on there place of work and making life easier on them selves
one question, how much per cow do people have in there head to spend on a milking parlour
i am not in milk but looking but as a part time farmer we are investing a lot into making things easier for ourselves, and if i was going milking it would this would be a factor included in making an investment as well as the cost benifit

70k for the parlour shown does not seem a lot to spend across 100 cows
I know milk prices are high as well as costs but am i missing something

yellow50HX

Timmaay wrote: »

This argument is done to death by now! Yes a nice big portal shed with cubicles, underground slurry and a nice feeding passage are the easiest and most ideal way to winter cows, but that all costs a shed load of capital, nobody but the banks would win in the case that you start out with a greenfield, and spend a million in concrete before the 1st cow gets milked! Without lads being initiative and going with the likes of topless cubicles, outwintering pads, and even just outwintering the animals in dry fields etc, we would be shy alot of large dairyfarmers who have started from very little!! The same people who bash outwintering pads are up moaning that land is too fragmented in Ireland etc etc, the likes of these low capital dairyfarmers are well and truly not letting land fragmentation hold them back! Same thing with the JE verse HO, yes the HO gives more milk, end of the story, but the JE offers a solution where using HOs would make very little financial sense. Having come from a different industry with my previous jobs, the strangest thing I find among farmers is the whole attitude of they themselves are right and everyone else (esp Teagasc ha) are utterly wrong, and yourman who goes off the beaten track at all is considered a clown (to quote Jay!).

i know what your saying but farmers need to be imaginative with how they do stuff too. like you say outwintering on stand off pads and on stubble is certainly a way (we partially outwinter cows on beet during the day to reduce our slurry storage and handling and silage costs). do that is not always praticale when every bit of grassland is needed. most lads have good enough sheds already that can be modified. the number of fellas that now have housing in the old hay barn or silage pit is growing. with many guys looking to expand in the coming years that may not always be a solution. however i do think the hidden costs of open sheds need to be flushed out too like extra slurry storage and handling, and being cold and wet all the time, ho many of us use an old tractor with no cab to feed out silage during the winter?

jersey101

Been to visit a fair few operations over the ladt year with college and i have seen alot of different setups from stand off pads to out wintering on kale and turnips, self feeding off pit faces and sheds, any stand off pads i saw if they worked they were a brilliant job and if they didnt they were a night mare, one of the sheds i seen was a 300 cow shed cost 1000 cubicle and was the nicest shed i ever seen real bright and very airy

Timmaay

I only flicked through this quickly, but afew pages on low cost parlours in the IFJ today, in fairness some farmers have put in a parlour for very low costs. Although one of the articles was about some lad with a 14unit dairymaster with all the bells and whistles, 15000 stg per unit!

Going forward...

Thought you had an extra zero there Tim, until I read the article myself.:eek: He is happy with it and after spending his life getting his farm set up, it was the final piece in the jigsaw.

Good value alright in second hand and if you're crafty yourself, more savings can be had. All for every conceivable gizmo in tractors but I prefer a simple parlour.

mahoney_j

Going forward... wrote: »

Thought you had an extra zero there Tim, until I read the article myself.:eek: He is happy with it and after spending his life getting his farm set up, it was the final piece in the jigsaw.

Good value alright in second hand and if you're crafty yourself, more savings can be had. All for every conceivable gizmo in tractors but I prefer a simple parlour.

Where do u spend more time every day and which mSkes you more?????.stick the gizmos in the parlour,reduce the time you spend in it and make milking a pleasant job for man and beast ,

Going forward...

They won't make me more money or speed up the job that much. I'm perfectly happy milking in it and I'm sure it's not the limiting factor in allowing the cows to express their full potential. Just my personal opinion. If it comes down to gizmos in a parlour or front/cab suspension on a tractor, I'll go with the tractor tbh. My spine will be more thankful I reckon.

Basic, no frills parlour does not mean sub standard milking or a hell hole to work in.

Timmaay

I'd prefer basic with both and pay some other bugger to do both machinery work and milk ha! Automatic feeding to yeild is the one thing I'd consider though, esp with my spread in cow yeilds and calving pattern. I know fairly well myself which cows to givs extra feed to now, but abit messy with tailtape for when the relief milker is in.