GERMANY admits mass immigration threatens 'social peace'

jimgoose

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Really?
Perhaps The Guardian made it up:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2011/jul/16/east-timor-immigrants-fled-northern-ireland-violence

That story is about poor terrified people from East Timor fleeing from the middle of a crowd of Unionists and Republicans flaking seventeen shades of sh!te out of each other. Hardly a case of immigration causing problems, is it??

jimgoose

The Backwards Man wrote: »

If every country sealed their borders overnight, dumped all their immigrants in the Arctic Ocean, banned sex without a licence, and executed everyone who wasn't earning £100,000 a year, what would happen to the Daily Mail?

I don't know, but sod the Daily Mail - is this fella running for the Dáil?

WilyCoyote

jimgoose wrote: »

That story is about poor terrified people from East Timor fleeing from the middle of a crowd of Unionists and Republicans flaking seventeen shades of sh!te out of each other. Hardly a case of immigration causing problems, is it??

Have a look at this, jimgoose:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jun/21/race-northern-ireland-romanian-gypsies

jimgoose

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Have a look at this, jimgoose:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jun/21/race-northern-ireland-romanian-gypsies

Oh for furk's sake, Neo-Nazi Loyalists - that's all we need. Seig, Hi!!

conorhal

Old and grey wrote: »

Inane post!
Immigration has fcuk all to do sectarnism in NI.

Except for that whole plantation thing, and few hundred years later and those bloody Scots still haven't integrated!
It makes you a wee bit pessimistic about this multiculturalism thing doesn't it?

Grayson

conorhal wrote: »

Except for that whole plantation thing, and few hundred years later and those bloody Scots still haven't integrated!
It makes you a wee bit pessimistic about this multiculturalism thing doesn't it?

There's a difference between migration and organised invasion/displacement.

Legs.Eleven

WilyCoyote wrote: »

http://www.independent.ie/irish-news/over-1000-arrests-in-operation-targeting-pickpockets-and-muggers-29427809.html

Well, if the Link above is to be believed then the perpetrators are not Romas but Romanians. 610 of them out of a total of just over 1100.

I'm stating (repeatedly) that Romas are NOT Romanian and to refer to Romas as Romanian is false. What part of that sentence is difficult for you to comprehend?

This would infer that Romanians are not Romas

What part of that sentence is difficult for you to comprehend?

All of it.

Hmmmm. Any views on this Legs.Eleven?

Ah look! The Independent. :rolleyes:


They're referring to Roma gypsies in this article, not Romanians (notice how they called them, "Romanian nationals" and not simply Romanians....fundamental differences between the idea of citizenship and simply being a national). These right-wing papers need to differentiate between the two. I acknowledged that Roma gysies cause problems and it's an issue that has to be dealt with. Yes, the Roma gypsies might have originated from Romania (where they cause problems as well) but they're not to be confused with ordinary Romanian citizens, who, as citizens of an EU state thus EU members have the right to travel and work in other EU countries just as we do....unlike "Romanian Nationals". These right-wing papers seem intent on muddying the waters by referring to them as "Romanian Nationals" or even "Romanian" instead of simply calling them Romani gypsies.


Difference between a national and a citizen:

National

1. The term “National” is the concept of International.
2. It has been broader significance.
3. National of State includes all persons who are political members of the State and who owe allegiance to the State.
4. A person may continue his national, even after he looses his nationality.
5. Nationality is not accompanied with the residence.
6. The National can not have the fundamental rights
Citizen

1. The term “Citizen” is the concept of country.
2. It has been a narrower significance. It usually signifies the permanent allegiance to a country.
3. But all nationals may not possess citizenship.
4. A person may not live in the country if he looses his citizenship.
5. Citizenship is accompanied with the residence.
6. The citizen has the fundamental rights.




So that's what I think, WileyCoyote.

Edit: If you can find me evidence that Romanian citizens are a cause for worry, then I'd be grateful to see that. I've no interest in seeing the never-ending articles related to crimes committed by the Roma.

WilyCoyote

A post siesta eloquent bit of semantic damage limitation there Legs.Eleven. Have you ever thought of going back to the auld sod and joining that esteemed bunch in politics. You'd be a shoe in .

Legs.Eleven

WilyCoyote wrote: »

A post siesta eloquent bit of semantic damage limitation there Legs.Eleven. Have you ever thought of going back to the auld sod and joining that esteemed bunch in politics. You'd be a shoe in .

You have to stoop to that, do you? A sign of a man out of his depth and proven wrong.


Edit: I did just have a siesta. How did you know?

Hitchens

Old and grey wrote: »

Inane post!
Immigration has fcuk all to do sectarnism in NI.

Conorhal has taken the time to explain it to you #156

(he shouldn't really be wasting his time on you)

Sir Humphrey Appleby

Hitchens wrote: »

Conorhal has taken the time to explain it to you #156

(he shouldn't really be wasting his time on you)

Speaking of wastes of time!
He explained fcuk all.
There is a hell of a difference between modern day immigration and the forced plantion that he describes.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Hitchens wrote: »

Conorhal has taken the time to explain it to you #156

(he shouldn't really be wasting his time on you)

Having failed to define "deterrent" in the death penalty thread, are you also now confessing a practical definition of the word "immgration"?

Hitchens

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Having failed to define "deterrent" in the death penalty thread, are you also now confessing a practical definition of the word "immgration"?

Priceless!

(you just keep on giving)

Hitchens

Old and grey wrote: »

Speaking of wastes of time!
He explained fcuk all.
There is a hell of a difference between modern day immigration and the forced plantion that he describes.

badly rattled!
:D

Legs.Eleven

Hitchens has to revert to correcting spelling mistakes? Ye another man out of his depth. Tis a sorry sight.

conorhal

Old and grey wrote: »

Speaking of wastes of time!
He explained fcuk all.
There is a hell of a difference between modern day immigration and the forced plantion that he describes.

Numbers, mass imigration, like plantation is a numbers game.

By 2020 1 in 5 of our population will be foreign born. As to 'forced' plantation, nobody forced the Scots to migrate, but nobody in our governent asked us if we wanted to accept 20% of our population from foreign lands, aif like that 'racist' citizenship referendum :rolleyes:, the question of how many migrants Ireland would be willing to accept was put to the people tomorrow, I think you can probably guess what the resounding reply would be.

Another characteristic of plantation is large seperate self segregating comunities, I bet you can't wait for this monstrosity!
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=279_1349636635

Hitchens

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

Hitchens has to revert to correcting spelling mistakes? Ye another man out of his depth. Tis a sorry sight.

When you're losing an argument you're prone to errors like that!

Legs.Eleven

Hitchens wrote: »

When you're losing an argument you're prone to errors like that!

Yeah? :rolleyes:




Btw, it's against the charter.

humanji

Hitchens, stop being a grammar Nazi. It's against the forum charter.

GatesOfVienna

Romanians are the best educated people in the EU iirc. Unfortunately, western Europe is suffering from mass unemployment. We simply arent able to take another mass wave of immigrants. Some people seem to think that we can absorb an infinite amount of immigrants. This is not the case. We have one of the highest foreign born populations in the world(17% and rising fast) and 14% unemployment. We are exporting college graduates and importing shelf stackers and call centre employees. Its simply unsustainable.

Hitchens

humanji wrote: »

Hitchens, stop being a grammar Nazi. It's against the forum charter.

Is calling a member a NAZI acceptable to the forum charter? Please clarify.

Mr_Maestro

GatesOfVienna wrote: »

Romanians are the best educated people in the EU iirc. Unfortunately, western Europe is suffering from mass unemployment. We simply arent able to take another mass wave of immigrants. Some people seem to think that we can absorb an infinite amount of immigrants. This is not the case. We have one of the highest foreign born populations in the world(17% and rising fast) and 14% unemployment. We are exporting college graduates and importing shelf stackers and call centre employees. Its simply unsustainable.

Best educated people in Romania ? On what basis do you make that claim ? Any sources ?

*Oh and to be clear, I'm not saying they don't, I've just never seen anybody or any information supporting the fact.

humanji

Hitchens wrote: »

Is calling a member a NAZI acceptable to the forum charter? Please clarify.

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=63152137&postcount=20

Stick to the topic.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Hitchens wrote: »

When you're losing an argument you're prone to errors like that!

Ah, the old "I'll focus on the typos to hide the fact that I have no idea what I'm talking about" gambit. Always amuses.

Now, I believe the original point was that you believed that immigration was the cause of social unrest in Northern Ireland. You going to back that up, run and hide, carry on implying that plantaion and immigration are the same thing, or point out that I've mis-typed "plantation"?

WilyCoyote

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

You have to stoop to that, do you? A sign of a man out of his depth and proven wrong.


Edit: I did just have a siesta. How did you know?

Your webcam was on

WilyCoyote

Immigration is the movement of non native people into new lands to settle

Plantain is a type of cooking banana

That should clear that up.

Next!

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

WilyCoyote wrote: »

Immigration is the movement of non native people into new lands to settle

Plantain is a type of cooking banana

That should clear that up.

Next!

It really is best to try and not confuse him.

HITCHENS - I see you thanked the post - I assume an on-topic reply is not forthcoming?

Hitchens

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

It really is best to try and not confuse him.

HITCHENS - I see you thanked the post - I assume an on-topic reply is not forthcoming?

Trolling alert !!!

Friend Computer

Don't worry, we're well aware of what you're doing. But thanks all the same.

humanji

Hitchens banned and I'll be handing out more bans to the rest of you if you don't cut out the bickering, insults, accusations, grammar nazism and/or everything else that's mentioned in the charter.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

So - back on topic: is mass immigration actually threating social peace? I've sen no evidence of it in Berlin and other someoen else said Sweden is quite calm. Is this a Daily Mail stir=up, or might it actually have substance?

Gummy Panda

If Roma doesn't equal Romanian, why do they generally have Romanian passports/National ID cards?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Gummy Panda wrote: »

If Roma doesn't equal Romanian, why do they generally have Romanian passports/National ID cards?

Do they?

Gummy Panda

Princess Consuela Bananahammock wrote: »

Do they?

Yes.

dd972

humanji wrote: »

Hitchens banned and I'll be handing out more bans to the rest of you if you don't cut out the bickering, insults, accusations, grammar nazism and/or everything else that's mentioned in the charter.

Peter himself would be proud. ( probably go over the head of those not 100% up to speed with UK culture ).

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Yes.

And you know this because you work in passport control, or...?

Legs.Eleven

Gummy Panda wrote: »

If Roma doesn't equal Romanian, why do they generally have Romanian passports/National ID cards?

Can you prove that?

Gummy Panda

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

Can you prove that?

Wallet inspector.

I love how much effort people put in to disfranchise an ethnic group so that their Romanian friend can be more acceptable.

crockholm

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Oooooooo, snap!

To give an opinion,there does appear to be greater numbers of begging gypsies in the small city I live in,than in previous years.

Grayson

Gummy Panda wrote: »

If Roma doesn't equal Romanian, why do they generally have Romanian passports/National ID cards?

They're gypsies. They travel. they wander around that area of the world.

here's the wiki article on them which shows a breakdown on their populations across eastern europe

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roma_(Romani_subgroup)

hedgehog2

In the next 20 yrs I can see the far right parties taking a huge percentage of the vote in many European countries.
The EU as a whole hss become a monster within and will be less appealing to be a part of going forward.
There was no thought put into a lot of the disastrous policies and allowing a lot of countries join.
It wont end well and it cannot continue as it is,the great plan to create an economic super Europe was never going to happen since only a handful of countries can actually produce goods and the rest sponge of the bread winners.
Drastic measures are rewuired to shape a Europe able to compete with Asia and the last time I looked Brussels were too busy blowing smoke up their own behinds to even contemplate what to do or what will become of this failing EU.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Wallet inspector.

I love how much effort people put in to disfranchise an ethnic group so that their Romanian friend can be more acceptable.

Ah, another one! Thread is dead. Long live the thread. Good night folks!

Legs.Eleven

Gummy Panda wrote: »

Wallet inspector.

I love how much effort people put in to disfranchise an ethnic group so that their Romanian friend can be more acceptable.

She's not part of said ethnic group (and most Romanian citizens aren't. They make up 3.2% of the population according to the article above) that are responsible for many of the petty crimes committed in cities around Europe but people think she is and hold it against her. Their attitudes towards her immediately change because they presume Romanians and Romani gypsies are the exact same thing highlighted by the attitudes of some posters on this thread.

I personally would not like to be mistaken for one either, would you? People have serious prejudices against them regardless of whether they commit crimes or not....dare I say, they're hated?

Take this quick example: Many of the teachers in my academy are Romanian. Parents have refused to have their kids taught by them presuming they were Romani gypsies. Does that sound fair to you?

Makes me laugh how people pretend they wouldn't care if they were in her shoes just like they wouldn't mind being mistaken for an Irish traveller in Ireland or the UK. Me arse you wouldn't mind!:rolleyes:

Makes me laugh when people decide to forget that we have our own group of travellers here who've settled in the UK and have a terrible rep (deservedly or undeservedly, I don't know). I would've hated for people to have had the same opinion of me there simply because I come from the same country as them (not that all Romani gypsies come from Romania, as highlighted above). You can honestly tell me you'd be perfectly okay with that?

Edit: Romani gypsies don't exclusively come from Romania. As someone pointed out, they're gypsies so don't, for the most part, have a fixed abode.

Legs.Eleven

Romani gypsies are judged on the actions of a minority of them, so why is it fair that a population as big a Romania's is judged by such a tiny percentage? That's all I'm trying to get across.

TheLastMohican

Legs.Eleven wrote: »

..........................................................................................................
...................................................................

Edit: Romani gypsies don't exclusively come from Romania. As someone pointed out, they're gypsies so don't, for the most part, have a fixed abode.

That's why their Passports state

NATIONALITY

---

No fixed abode

Legs.Eleven

TheLastMohican wrote: »

That's why their Passports state

NATIONALITY

---

No fixed abode

How many are passport holders do you think?


Someone else claimed most of them say, "Romania" and I'm still waiting for the proof.

Legs.Eleven

Interesting website:

http://www.epha.org/a/5680

Second class citizens?
The event ’’Are Roma people European citizens like any others?’’ took place in the context of the European Year of Citizens and highlighted that one of the fundamental prerequisites for active citizenship - sense of belonging - is not something that can easily be achieved through supra-national EU citizenship alone. Although many Roma are now EU passport holders, their way of life often transcends national borders and opportunities are being sought wherever they present themselves, with many multinational families. The limits of the ’’right to live and work anywhere in the EU’’ were also pointed out in a number of national contexts as residency and other rights, including access to healthcare and social benefits, are directly tied to employment status, and permanent work contracts are hard to obtain for non-qualified migrants such as many individuals of Roma origin. Without employment, the fate of Roma communities in Western Europe is often completely arbitrary and comparable to that of undocumented migrants.

dd972

Roma are actually of Indian origin hence a darker look than the average Romanian who would pass as Spanish or Italian.

Even English gypsies most of whom are of Romanichal origin have this slight Indian or darker hue although they're white.

kunst nugget

dd972 wrote: »

Roma are actually of Indian origin hence a darker look than the average Romanian who would pass as Spanish or Italian.

Even English gypsies most of whom are of Romanichal origin have this slight Indian or darker hue although they're white.

I thought that they were discernible by their small hands, beady eyes and their inability to cross rivers without eating a bulb of garlic…

Pumpkinseeds

The Romanian government have an interesting take on EU directives. Given that they were told to get rid of the huge amounts of horse and carts in the country in order to comply, they decided to slaughter the horses and pass them off as beef to the rest of Europe. Should be interesting to see what other novel interpretations they come up with.