Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread 2013/2014

opr

whatawaster wrote: »

The problem is we were already making significant losses each year and you're asking that the owners put their hands into their pockets to fund spending. Obviously they weren't willing to do that to the extent you'd like, but that's their right as owners I guess. It shouldn't be expected of them, they aren't that type of owner. They themselves are answerable to shareholders.

They're owners of a business as such I expect them to show foresight in what that business needs to get where they want it to go. Companies usually run on projections, future profits etc. If they cannot see that you need to invest money to make money they should never have bought the club. The idea of the club investing only what it makes is fine in the long term but short term we needed money. I think they've done a wonderful job in many aspects but you can't expect once you've cut the club to the bare bones for it to rebound from a standing start. It needed an initial push which was investment now. The plan may come good but it will be over the course of a decade and it really didn't need to happen that way had they shown better long term thinking.

Opr

Kess73

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Well Dom, at least you're smart enough to know the likely outcome for our current policy. I bristle at those who seem to believe we can do what we're currently doing and claim that it is genuinely trying to compete for a CL place.

Where are all the posts making such claims?

Not a dig, but I don't see anyone saying we (as things stand right now) look like we are in a position to compete for a CL slot.


Now if we bring in two or three quality signings between now and the end of the window, I might think we have a decent shot at competing for a CL slot, but right now I think we are looking closer to competing for a Europa slot than a CL slot.

5starpool

messinkiapina wrote: »

So no news today other than the ongoing Suarez saga?

No, and no news on that either.

Super-Rush

Madrid not interested anymore apparently.

http://www.thisisanfield.com/2013/07/luis-suarez-latest-report-claims-real-no-longer-interested/

whatawaster

opr wrote: »

They're owners of a business as such I expect them to show foresight in what that business needs to get where they want it to go. Companies usually run on projections, future profits etc. If they cannot see that you need to invest money to make money they should never have bought the club. The idea of the club investing only what it makes is fine in the long term but short term we needed money. I think they've done a wonderful job in many aspects but you can't expect once you've cut the club to the bare bones for it to rebound from a standing start. It needed an initial push which was investment now. The plan may come good but it will be over the course of a decade and it really didn't need to happen that way had they shown better long term thinking.

Opr

They have invested - a couple of hundred million.

I also think they tried to do it the way you suggest initially - they came in, kept most of the high earners at the club and spent a fair sum of money of Carroll, Henderson, Downing, Suarez and Enrique.

It didn't work out so a new strategy was born, I guess. There was appalling waste in the squad. Now there's much less.

They have actually been investing in the last 3 years. They, as the owners, have been absorbing losses (all of which diminishes their capital) and more recently been providing loans to the company.

LuckyLloyd

Kess73 wrote: »

Where are all the posts making such claims?

Not a dig, but I don't see anyone saying we (as things stand right now) look like we are in a position to compete for a CL slot.


Now if we bring in two or three quality signings between now and the end of the window, I might think we have a decent shot at competing for a CL slot, but right now I think we are looking closer to competing for a Europa slot than a CL slot.

I'm confused, if all we're trying to do is maybe compete for a EL spot why isn't everyone fuming?

Essentially, we're two months in and we've made a few squad additions plus upgraded goalkeeper.

If we lose Suarez I can't see us coming near replacing him. I'm also highly sceptical of us paying the money required to get the likes of a Soldado anyway.

==================

You seem to be confident that we'll get more points than last year, right? What's that based on?

Dickerty

5starpool wrote: »

No, and no news on that either.

To be fair, today was a travel day to Bangkok, so maybe tomorrow...

5starpool

Kess73 wrote: »

Where are all the posts making such claims?

Not a dig, but I don't see anyone saying we (as things stand right now) look like we are in a position to compete for a CL slot.


Now if we bring in two or three quality signings between now and the end of the window, I might think we have a decent shot at competing for a CL slot, but right now I think we are looking closer to competing for a Europa slot than a CL slot.

We are not really in proper contention for an EL slot through the league at the moment either as that is only 5th barring a top 5 team winning one of the cups, which they usually do in fairness, but still. 5th is more likely than 4th obviously, but not that much more so at the moment. 5 weeks left though to change things, and I'll be damned if I'm not going to have about 8 different unshakeable opinions in that timeframe! I'll also be heading to 3 games before the window closes (including the testimonial), but I'll happily (or not so, as the case may be) rabble rouse in here for the time being.

Apart from all the other 40 day periods that have been ore important, this is without doubt the most important 40 day period in our clubs existence!

T-K-O

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Just like last summer. Or the summer before. Or the summer before. Slight changes in details, but this is the third year in a row where we're saying 'if X happens we'll just need Y to craic the CL'.

All summers are not equal. Last summer the owners got it wrong. This summer they have a chance to right those wrongs. It's early days with FSG, I'll forgive last summer....for now.

Before that benson and hedges facked the club over, on and off the pitch. Pointless even discussing their reign of terror.

NEDDURC

whatawaster wrote: »

They have invested - a couple of hundred million.

I also think they tried to do it the way you suggest initially - they came in, kept most of the high earners at the club and spent a fair sum of money of Carroll, Henderson, Downing, Suarez and Enrique.

It didn't work out so a new strategy was born, I guess. There was appalling waste in the squad. Now there's much less.

They have actually been investing in the last 3 years. They, as the owners, have been absorbing losses (all of which diminishes their capital) and more recently been providing loans to the company.

I think this is broadly correct. They supported Kenny in the transfer market and he bought to suit his 4-4-2 style. I think with the appointment of BR they let it be known that they had to move to a sustainable model.

Basically, they following a model similar to Arsenal. Try to sign promising young players for reasonable money and low / average wages while bringing through more acadamey players. However, the problem is Arsenal are probably at least 5 years ahead of us here with a stadium built. Wenger problem has been his stuck to this model of signing all prospects rather than the finished product.

If we take BR at his word and we manage to sign 2/3 quality players then I think we all agree that we'll be in a very healthy position for the start of the season. It's proving difficult to get these top players when the market is being bloated by some crazy money at the moment.

Pedalstool

I don't see why everything has to happen instantly. I thought when Rodgers took over it would take 3 years to get into the champions league if everything went well.

We are essentially competing for 4th. Chelsea, Utd and City have such vast resources, we just can't compete with them.

Both Arsenal and Tottenham are much further down the road than us in terms of squad development so it will take time to catch up.

For me Rodgers is laying solid foundations for the future. I'll give him time. I have no doubt the owners will give him another 2 years at the very least.

murpho999

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

That's the problem and the most important point. I don't think the squad as it stands today is better than what we had in the summer of 2010. It's very close either way.

As for Rodgers, he may yet be delighted to have the career Hodgson has had.

Why are you comparing these?

The 2010 team was very strong but starting to break up.

Now we're in the middle of a rebuilding process and it's just going to take time.

Club tried to do it fast in Summer 2011 and got their fingers burnt.

They have now taken a new direction with a longer term approach I don't get why people don't understand that.

LuckyLloyd

murpho999 wrote: »

Why are you comparing these?

The 2010 team was very strong but starting to break up.

Now we're in the middle of a rebuilding process and it's just going to take time.

Club tried to do it fast in Summer 2011 and got their fingers burnt.

They have now taken a new direction with a longer term approach I don't get why people don't understand that.

Because we don't think it will work!!!

opr

whatawaster wrote: »

They have invested - a couple of hundred million.

They bought something which was hugely undervalued in a distressed sale. The majority of the debt was even taken away from the sale. The got this club for an absolute steal.

whatawaster wrote: »

I also think they tried to do it the way you suggest initially - they came in, kept most of the high earners at the club and spent a fair sum of money of Carroll, Henderson, Downing, Suarez and Enrique.

It didn't work out so a new strategy was born, I guess. There was appalling waste in the squad. Now there's much less.

We know the net figures don't show this to be the case. They gave Comolli complete autonomy to spend a net figure of around 30m. It just so happened with our huge outgoings that he struck gold. Please lets not pretend like many would have you believe that they gave the club a vast fortune to blow.

whatawaster wrote: »

They have actually been investing in the last 3 years. They, as the owners, have been absorbing losses (all of which diminishes their capital) and more recently been providing loans to the company.

They haven't in real terms. Yes if you look at the pocket level of spending they've had to dip into funds. In real terms though the new TV money has come into the equation. This club is now a hugely attractive prospect in terms of revenue, value etc. It's disingenuous in the extreme to claim they have spent money they don't expect to get back. I'm not saying that's a bad thing but I'm not going to sit and listen to the fact they have invested in this club by providing loans. It's their club ffs, if we needed money in the short term to make that business function they should hardly be herald as some sort of kindness. What we needed was money to take the club to the next level not petrol money to keep the car running until we can get to the pass machine for them.

Opr

Gbear

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Because we don't think it will work!!!

What do you think would work?

We spent about 20m nett last season. It's not unreasonable to assume that we'll spend the same this summer and we'll get another player or 2 in.

Do you think we are just spending that money incorrectly?
Do you think that we're holding back and spending less than we could?

murpho999

murpho999 wrote: »

Why are you comparing these?

The 2010 team was very strong but starting to break up.

Now we're in the middle of a rebuilding process and it's just going to take time.

Club tried to do it fast in Summer 2011 and got their fingers burnt.

They have now taken a new direction with a longer term approach I don't get why people don't understand that.

I thought Rodgers had 3 years to get CL football ? Hardly that long term.

Vanolder

murpho999 wrote: »

Why are you comparing these?

The 2010 team was very strong but starting to break up.

Now we're in the middle of a rebuilding process and it's just going to take time.

Club tried to do it fast in Summer 2011 and got their fingers burnt.

They have now taken a new direction with a longer term approach I don't get why people don't understand that.

Many fans today just want a sugar daddy to come in a throw money at it. Unless we are spending millions certain fans will never be happy. We don't have that money tho, not to the level others do. We are going down a different road and fella's are just going to have to suck it up. There ain't no quick fix.

I am pie

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Because we don't think it will work!!!

Who is we? Lucky and Lloyd?

murpho999

rarnes1 wrote: »

I thought Rodgers had 3 years to get CL football ? Hardly that long term.

Well it's longer term than 3 matches that most posters here gave him.

Raif Severance

Hypothetical Situation:

Let's say Arsenal is close to Bidding 50M for Suarez.

Rodgers urges Ayre to make a late Phone Call to Real. And all they would give us are Morata and Jese but no Additional Cash for Suarez.

So which would you choose, 50M and Suarez goes to Arsenal or 2 unproven but talented Spanish Youngsters from Real but no Cash?

Kess73

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'm confused, if all we're trying to do is maybe compete for a EL spot why isn't everyone fuming?

Essentially, we're two months in and we've made a few squad additions plus upgraded goalkeeper.

If we lose Suarez I can't see us coming near replacing him. I'm also highly sceptical of us paying the money required to get the likes of a Soldado anyway.

==================

You seem to be confident that we'll get more points than last year, right? What's that based on?

You seem to be doing nothing but taking what people say and trying to twist it into something else.

Where did I say I think the club are aiming to compete for a Europa slot? Nowhere because you just made that up.

I said based on the squad we currently have, all I think is not unrealistic to expect to compete for a Europa slot.

That is based on the players we currently have. Now that could change a lot between here and the end of the window IF we bring in some genuine quality.

I did not say I am happy with anything or that I would settle for anything.


As for me thinking we will get more points this season, well that is based on me thinking the current squad of players is good enough to compete for a Europa slot, something we struggled to even do last season. I think the squad right now is a little better than the one that finished the season so would expect to see an increase as a result.

I don't think aiming for a Europa slot is good enough, but that is where I personally think the squad is right now on the 25th July 2013. Ifthe squad come the end of the window is the exact same as now, well then that is tough sh1t on Rodgers because my expectations for his second season will be the exact same as they were when last season ended and that is that I will expect us to be in a similar position to what Spurs were in with two games to go. Cups would be a bonus.


Also the answer to why am I not fuming is a very simple one. The transfer window is not closed and I am not going to lose the rag over it as I am unable to tell in advance what players will or will not be signed in the coming month or so. Come the start of September I will have a better idea of what sort of team I will be going to the grounds to watch most weeks, and I can decide for myself then if I am happy or not with what I am going to see. But until then I am not going to jumping with joy from false hope or gnashing my teeth in frustration of what might be.

But to touch on the points thing, I take it by the tone of your posts that you think we will not get more points next season. Why is that and do you expect us to get a similar points total or worse still slip back to the 52 disaster of the season before?

LuckyLloyd

Gbear wrote: »

What do you think would work?

We spent about 20m nett last season. It's not unreasonable to assume that we'll spend the same this summer and we'll get another player or 2 in.

Do you think we are just spending that money incorrectly?
Do you think that we're holding back and spending less than we could?

Improving the first 11
We spent 20m net but we slashed wages and left the squad unbalanced to start the season
Yes - Allen and Borini were poor purchases
Yes - with TV Deal in the equation there is flexibility to spend more. I think the club is going to start showing profit in future sets of accounts. As Opr says, waiting for that to happen before you spend is bad business

Vanolder

Raif Severance wrote: »

Hypothetical Situation:

Let's say Arsenal is close to Bidding 50M for Suarez.

Rodgers urges Ayre to make a late Phone Call to Real. And all they would give us are Morata and Jese but no Additional Cash for Suarez.

So which would you choose, 50M and Suarez goes to Arsenal or 2 unproven but talented Spanish Youngsters from Real but no Cash?

I'd be too distracted by the Swedish Bikini team dancing around my bedroom to make an informed decision like that...

I am pie

Raif Severance wrote: »

Hypothetical Situation:

Let's say Arsenal is close to Bidding 50M for Suarez.

Rodgers urges Ayre to make a late Phone Call to Real. And all they would give us are Morata and Jese but no Additional Cash for Suarez.

So which would you choose, 50M and Suarez goes to Arsenal or 2 unproven but talented Spanish Youngsters from Real but no Cash?

Cash.

whatawaster

opr wrote: »

We know the net figures don't show this to be the case. They gave Comolli complete autonomy to spend a net figure of around 30m. It just so happened with our huge outgoings that he struck gold. Please lets not pretend like many would have you believe that they gave the club a vast fortune to blow.

No, but spending 30m while maintaining a wage bill higher than we can afford has the same effect as a bigger spending spree. All the club could probably afford that season was to pay the players' wages and break even on transfers. Instead we kept those wages and invested around 30 million on transfers. At the end of the day that came out of the owners pockets. The fact that it was spent quite poorly is the real issue.

They haven't in real terms. Yes if you look at the pocket level of spending they've had to dip into funds. In real terms though the new TV money has come into the equation. This club is now a hugely attractive prospect in terms of revenue, value etc. It's disingenuous in the extreme to claim they have spent money they don't expect to get back. I'm not saying that's a bad thing but I'm not going to sit and listen to the fact they have invested in this club by providing loans. It's their club ffs, if we needed money in the short term to make that business function they should hardly be herald as some sort of kindness. What we needed was money to take the club to the next level not petrol money to keep the car running until we can get to the pass machine for them.

Opr

I'm not saying they've lent us money they don't expect to get back. But if they'd lent us more and our transfer spending had gone down in subsequent years due to loan repayments you'd have fans complaining that they are ripping us off.

Gbear

Raif Severance wrote: »

Hypothetical Situation:

Let's say Arsenal is close to Bidding 50M for Suarez.

Rodgers urges Ayre to make a late Phone Call to Real. And all they would give us are Morata and Jese but no Additional Cash for Suarez.

So which would you choose, 50M and Suarez goes to Arsenal or 2 unproven but talented Spanish Youngsters from Real but no Cash?

Unproven and unmotivated. Real to Liverpool is a hell of a step down.
A squad player who has already tried and failed at Real and sees Liverpool as an interesting step might well relish the chance to be a starter in the PL in a young team.

A player like Morata or Jese who has been lead to believe for years that he could be Reals next big thing but hasn't even had a chance to explore that yet would be much less willing.

dogbert27

Wenger is supposed to have 70 mill to spend. I don't think he will spend 50 mill of that on just 1 player.

In the mean time while this saga is dragging on we are losing time in the transfer window not knowing if we need to buy players to compliment Suarez or to replace him.

LuckyLloyd

Kess73 wrote: »

But to touch on the points thing, I take it by the tone of your posts that you think we will not get more points next season. Why is that and do you expect us to get a similar points total or worse still slip back to the 52 disaster of the season before?

Don't think Suarez will be here on September 2nd and I don't think the replacements we sign will replace his production.

Kess73

5starpool wrote: »

We are not really in proper contention for an EL slot through the league at the moment either as that is only 5th barring a top 5 team winning one of the cups, which they usually do in fairness, but still. 5th is more likely than 4th obviously, but not that much more so at the moment. 5 weeks left though to change things, and I'll be damned if I'm not going to have about 8 different unshakeable opinions in that timeframe! I'll also be heading to 3 games before the window closes (including the testimonial), but I'll happily (or not so, as the case may be) rabble rouse in here for the time being.

Apart from all the other 40 day periods that have been ore important, this is without doubt the most important 40 day period in our clubs existence!

I can only assume you are not being serious with your closing line and you are just taking the pee out of people who trot out a variation of that line a number of times every season.

Dickerty

Raif Severance wrote: »

Hypothetical Situation:

Let's say Arsenal is close to Bidding 50M for Suarez.

Rodgers urges Ayre to make a late Phone Call to Real. And all they would give us are Morata and Jese but no Additional Cash for Suarez.

So which would you choose, 50M and Suarez goes to Arsenal or 2 unproven but talented Spanish Youngsters from Real but no Cash?

Neither!!

But in reality - would sell to Arsenal. At least that would give us time to buy players that have been scouted. Maybe Soldado and Erikson. Arsenal would be better, but so would we.

And who's to say Suarez won't push for a move from Arsenal to Real in 2 years? Even if they get him, I think they are 4 or more players away from a CL or PL competing team...

MD1990

we should hopefully start spending some serious cash on players
because when u look at Norwich & Southampton's spending its safe to say the new tv deal will help u to take some risks in the transfer market

murpho999

murpho999 wrote: »

Well it's longer term than 3 matches that most posters here gave him.

Most? Really?

I'd say that's BS tbh

Pedalstool

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Don't think Suarez will be here on September 2nd and I don't think the replacements we sign will replace his production.

I thought Coutinho and Sturridge did that quite well at the end of last season.

LuckyLloyd

I am pie wrote: »

Who is we? Lucky and Lloyd?

Off the top of my head, I'd feel confident saying that Mr.Alan, rarnes1, 5starpool, daithijjj, Opr, jesus_thats_gre and Strongbow10 have reservations about the current strategy from reading their posts.

LiamoSail

opr wrote: »

. They gave Comolli complete autonomy to spend a net figure of around 30m.
Opr

Why does Comolli get referenced here and not Dalglish? Was it not Dalglish who publicly stated he had the final say on players signed?

I'd also add that while the net figure may have been low, it can't be forgotten that in and around £50m was essentially pissed against the wall, when you consider the resale values of the players involved

With all the drama about Suarez, there's been no links with a top CB, has there?

Hopefully there's something going on behind the scenes..

LuckyLloyd

Pedalstool wrote: »

I thought Coutinho and Sturridge did that quite well at the end of last season.

So Suarez is replaced already! Huzzah!

I am pie

Pedalstool wrote: »

I thought Coutinho and Sturridge did that quite well at the end of last season.

Trying to replace a player is always difficult, sometimes you are better to spend the wedge in a different part of the pitch and back what you have. Sturridge, Coutinho + 1 other new player playing wide of the 3, maybe an AMF to play behind maybe a serious CB to lock up the defence.

For all the suarez hot air we seem to have forgotten that our main problem was conceding goals last year, stupid ones.

Kess73

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Don't think Suarez will be here on September 2nd and I don't think the replacements we sign will replace his production.

So ifs and buts is all that you are basing things on.



I was replied to you based on who is at the club right now. Not if this player is gone or if we don't sign this player or that player.


So try the question I asked please, as I answered when you asked why I think we will get more points.

But to touch on the points thing, I take it by the tone of your posts that you think we will not get more points next season. Why is that and do you expect us to get a similar points total or worse still slip back to the 52 disaster of the season before?

and base it on our squad as it stands right now.



We can of course revisit the opinion as players come and go, but right now we only have the current squad to base an opinion on as anything else if based on maybes.

LuckyLloyd

murpho999 wrote: »

Well it's longer term than 3 matches that most posters here gave him.

I didn't give him 3 games to be fair to me. I gave him zero for the record.

PhiloCypher

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I'm confused, if all we're trying to do is maybe compete for a EL spot why isn't everyone fuming?

Essentially, we're two months in and we've made a few squad additions plus upgraded goalkeeper.

If we lose Suarez I can't see us coming near replacing him. I'm also highly sceptical of us paying the money required to get the likes of a Soldado anyway.

==================

You seem to be confident that we'll get more points than last year, right? What's that based on?

One could just as easily ask you the flip side of that equation , what makes you so confident we wont accrue more points this season, and why do you and your ilk seem to think your negative outlook on everything is somehow more valid then others more optimistic one ?

I am pie

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Off the top of my head, I'd feel confident saying that Mr.Alan, rarnes1, 5starpool, daithijjj, Opr, jesus_thats_gre and Strongbow10 have reservations about the current strategy from reading their posts.

Impressive.

Let's make lists and take sides.

With fans like you....

LuckyLloyd

Kess73 wrote: »

So ifs and buts is all that you are basing things on.



I was replied to you based on who is at the club right now. Not if this player is gone or if we don't sign this player or that player.


So try the question I asked please, as I answered when you asked why I think we will get more points.




and base it on our squad as it stands right now.



We can of course revisit the opinion as players come and go, but right now we only have the current squad to base an opinion on as anything else if based on maybes.

We haven't upgraded our starting 11 in any significant way. We might come in and around last year's total with the current squad and be a few points either side depending on how well we run with suspensions / injuries / bounce of the ball.

LuckyLloyd

PhiloCypher wrote: »

One could just as easily ask you the flip side of that equation , what makes you so confident we wont accrue more points this season, and why do you and your ilk seem to think your negative outlook on everything is somehow more valid then others more optimistic one ?

What does that mean exactly? It's a discussion forum. People have opinions. I think my opinion is correct because it's the opinion I reached.

LuckyLloyd

I am pie wrote: »

Impressive.

Let's make lists and take sides.

With fans like you....

I was merely responding to the post suggesting that I was out on my own on this stuff. I'm not.

Vanolder

Pedalstool wrote: »

I thought Coutinho and Sturridge did that quite well at the end of last season.

Coutinho is the key!! Like I said previous, if we can get another two starters in, with one being an attacker, I think we will be in just as good as position as we are with Suarez.

Pedalstool

I think LuckyLloyd has argued himself into such a corner he can't see the wood for the tree's. I have done the same myself on occasion, I think the best thing is to take a step back.

The argument has lost all basis in reality and is now being fought on if's and maybe's.

The one thing I can't grasp is how anyone expects us to get into the Champions league immediately.

It took Man City half a billion and 3 years? When they did get there they still weren't able to compete.

Patience.

PhiloCypher

PhiloCypher wrote: »

One could just as easily ask you the flip side of that equation , what makes you so confident we wont accrue more points this season, and why do you and your ilk seem to think your negative outlook on everything is somehow more valid then others more optimistic one ?

In fairness, there's nothing to suggest as yet there'll be an improvment on last year. The signings so far have been just ok. Big players need to come into the team to push us on. Plus it looks likely we are losing our best player.

A negative outlook by some could be seen as a realistic one by others.

opr

whatawaster wrote: »

No, but spending 30m while maintaining a wage bill higher than we can afford has the same effect as a bigger spending spree. All the club could probably afford that season was to pay the players' wages and break even on transfers. Instead we kept those wages and invested around 30 million on transfers. At the end of the day that came out of the owners pockets. The fact that it was spent quite poorly is the real issue.

I'm not saying they've lent us money they don't expect to get back. But if they'd lent us more and our transfer spending had gone down in subsequent years due to loan repayments you'd have fans complaining that they are ripping us off.

I've never said that I think they will take money out of the club or that they're looking to rip us off. I just think given the club position with the remnants of the successful period that we had a shot of doing things a different way by front loading money that we didn't take and as a result things are falling apart much like many said they would. If we hadn't had that advantage over many clubs and lets say we were Aston Villa I might even think the approach was the best one to have taken.

It was the fact that we still had the opportunity to invest a decent amount of money and had enough quality that it wouldn't have taken megabucks because we had something to work with. We needed 3/4 first team players. Financial success is built on the pitch. I shudder to think how it will effect all areas of the club in the coming years without CL football over another extended period.

I think I've been quite consistent on all of these points and I made the exact same argument at the close of the last window and before. I posted this shortly after the last window closed.

I'd say in terms of being streamlined as a club we're a supercar of the automotive world. Young vibrant manager, young squad, low wage bill, new revenue streams, bigger TV deals etc. We've been turned from a loss making club into a finely tuned financial machine which will start turning good profits even without CL money. I commend FSG on many of the things they've done but from our current position some foresight is needed into what happens next. By all means clear the decks in the way that has happened but for god sake start the building process.

We need investment now, not in three years time when the club has the money in the bank. I do worry that when guys like FSG trim a company in the way they've done with us surely it's usually for flip and sale purposes? If you're in it for the long haul I fail to see how guys as smart as them don't give more money to the new manager knowing it's a future investment. Naive in soccer terms they may be but not in sporting/investment terms. They know how the level of the wage bill impacts directly on a clubs performance. They know Brendan needed more money than he got this summer. They know our squad isn't big enough. Yet even though they know all this they left our manager hanging.

The money that is injected into the club now isn't some gamble based on the profitability of the club in the future with CL revenue. This club is going to become profitable over the next couple of years regardless of CL money. At the moment though we could do with some of that money now to make the push towards the CL places this season.

CL remains vitally important, not only in terms of added revenue but in terms of this clubs relevance. At the moment we live hugely off our past as one of the traditional big clubs. We've also been lucky that the huge exposure the club gained through the success we had under Benitez in Europe continued to give us new fans worldwide in incredible numbers. Now the PL has superclubs popping up left and right while we are fading into the background. Young fans are being lost, a new generation of supporters, each passing year it becomes harder to crack the top four having spent another year outside it, each year that our rivals remain within the top four cements their position further.

Over the next few years without CL football our star players are not going to hang around. Gerrard will have left the stage and even our young stars will begin to question if they should move on. At that stage the situation may become unrecoverable. One of the things that makes this club a viable attempt towards cracking the top four presently is that from the clubs recent European years we still have some proper top four players which we obtained during those years or attracted in the afterglow of that relatively successful period. Making the push now makes the most sense as in the coming years we might not have or be able to attract the kind of players to ever make the push again.

I think that post is looking pretty band on the money at the moment.

Opr

murpho999

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I didn't give him 3 games to be fair to me. I gave him zero for the record.

Exactly and because of this he and the club can do nothing right.