Can I get my independent research recognised as a PhD?

marchantnick

I am an ecologist in my thirties, educated to MSc level and with six years of professional experience. For the last two years I have been working with a research group overseas, and have collected a lot of interesting data. I am now back in Ireland and plan to write up the research with between 3 and 6 journal articles. A manager in the NGO is supervising me through the process and provides good advice. The results are interesting, and if I do a good job with the write up then I am confident that I will get published in high-impact journals.

Assuming I can get these published in good journals, then I feel I will have developed my skills in research, and I'm wondering if I could get this recognised. I have not followed the standard path for a PhD (3-4 years of supervision within a university), but by doing it independently and in my spare-time, then I feel I am displaying equivalent skills, even thought they are outside of the university environment. I have developed the research, collaborated with other scientists, reviewed the literature, analysed the data, and now I will write journal articles. The research is novel and a contribution to science, all articles are in pursuit of a common research topic, and when submitted for publication they will go through the peer-review process to ensure that they meet a sufficient standard.

So I was wondering if anyone could give me any advice on this? I would like to continue in academia, but my lack of a PhD currently prevents that. I'm going to write up this research independently, and is possible I'd just like someone to review it all, determine whether it meets the standard of a typical PhD, and if so, to award the qualification. Has anyone heard of a system like this in Ireland, the UK or the rest of Europe?

Thanks in advance!

MuireannO

something like this might be interesting for you - http://www.uio.no/english/research/doctoral-degree-and-career/drphilos/

Ravelleman

MuireannO wrote: »

something like this might be interesting for you - http://www.uio.no/english/research/doctoral-degree-and-career/drphilos/

That's not a PhD.

And unfortunately, I doubt the OP could even apply given the unusual entry requirements.

robp

marchantnick wrote: »

I am an ecologist in my thirties, educated to MSc level and with six years of professional experience. For the last two years I have been working with a research group overseas, and have collected a lot of interesting data. I am now back in Ireland and plan to write up the research with between 3 and 6 journal articles. A manager in the NGO is supervising me through the process and provides good advice. The results are interesting, and if I do a good job with the write up then I am confident that I will get published in high-impact journals.

Assuming I can get these published in good journals, then I feel I will have developed my skills in research, and I'm wondering if I could get this recognised. I have not followed the standard path for a PhD (3-4 years of supervision within a university), but by doing it independently and in my spare-time, then I feel I am displaying equivalent skills, even thought they are outside of the university environment. I have developed the research, collaborated with other scientists, reviewed the literature, analysed the data, and now I will write journal articles. The research is novel and a contribution to science, all articles are in pursuit of a common research topic, and when submitted for publication they will go through the peer-review process to ensure that they meet a sufficient standard.

So I was wondering if anyone could give me any advice on this? I would like to continue in academia, but my lack of a PhD currently prevents that. I'm going to write up this research independently, and is possible I'd just like someone to review it all, determine whether it meets the standard of a typical PhD, and if so, to award the qualification. Has anyone heard of a system like this in Ireland, the UK or the rest of Europe?

Thanks in advance!

Well if you can register for a PhD thesis by publication programme maybe its possible. Finding a supervisor is the biggest hurdle. I don't know how many Irish institutions accept a PhD thesis by publication though.

Ostrom

I've never heard of this myself. Some U.S. colleges offer 'papers' model PhD's but these always require substantial coursework. A PhD is always examined by major thesis, which must be supervised from start to completion by a permanent university staff member with a PhD, reviewed by a second reader, and examined by an external examiner. Many years ago DSc degrees were awarded by papers, but this practice has long died out (the degree no longer exists outside honorary use as best I know).

El Siglo

efla wrote: »

I've never heard of this myself. Some U.S. colleges offer 'papers' model PhD's but these always require substantial coursework. A PhD is always examined by major thesis, which must be supervised from start to completion by a permanent university staff member with a PhD, reviewed by a second reader, and examined by an external examiner. Many years ago DSc degrees were awarded by papers, but this practice has long died out (the degree no longer exists outside honorary use as best I know).

The DSc is still kicking around, in TCD it's something like ten years worth of publications and something similar in Queen's where it's a year long course and your publications (see here). Also, UCD is doing the papers model of the PhD and so is Oxford and a few other places in the UK. It's getting pretty popular but I wouldn't entirely agree with it myself.

OP I'd speak to an academic about it, someone fairly close to your field. Arrange, a meeting and show him/her your work. I know some of the universities have gone onto this structured PhD racket (UCD, TCD and UCC) as far as I can recall but I think some of the other places are a bit more traditional (Queen's definitely is, we're still in the 1970s but it's incredibly bureaucratic). You might not avoid some of the fees or red-tape but you could get a thesis written up or papers written up and submitted earlier than usual (there's no regulation saying that it can't be done in less time, they're more worried about you going over the time these days).

robp

efla wrote: »

I've never heard of this myself. Some U.S. colleges offer 'papers' model PhD's but these always require substantial coursework. A PhD is always examined by major thesis, which must be supervised from start to completion by a permanent university staff member with a PhD, reviewed by a second reader, and examined by an external examiner. Many years ago DSc degrees were awarded by papers, but this practice has long died out (the degree no longer exists outside honorary use as best I know).

I think its actually getting more common to do it by papers rather then less common. It is often done over 3 years and finishes with an oral examination. Doing the work previously is to some extent unusual though.

cailleach an airgid

I'm completing my PhD by publication, and my second supervisor completed hers by publication also (in UL). She was on a traditional PhD program and mine is structured (loosely, but structured nonetheless!). My eventual 'thesis' will incorporate my papers with 'linking' sections and an introduction and conclusion section, which will have a lot in common with a monograph but will likely be shorter. This is common enough in my discipline (particularly in Scandanavia, but the practice is becoming more widespread).

In some ways, its great, because I will have four or five high ranking papers published when I finish, and others who have done PhDs this way have said that it does make the viva less stressful, as your work has been peer reviewed already. The big issues (as far as I can see), are that journals have such a long review process that you need to be writing for publication extremely early on, and if you get turned down by a journal after a lengthy review process, you need to start again and this can be a huge hold up. Also, it means that if I say something in my methods paper (which I'm writing now) and in two years time, my overall project has taken a different shape, I can't go back and 'change' already published material - friends of mine have warned me about this, so planning becomes a matter of extreme urgency!

In terms of the OP, I'm not sure what the protocol is in this case, however, I would agree that a paper based PhD (like a traditional monograph) needs to be supervised by a full time, experienced academic, who can shape the work from the start to create a cohesive project that's at the level it needs to be at. I would feel going to talk to a suitably qualified, experienced academic who specialises in a field similar to yours is the best bet - they can guide you best of all.

WhirlEsme

Apologies for butting in on this thread, but this means of gaining a PhD by publication has piqued my interest - especially in terms of it's feasibility.

@cailleach an airgid: Do you mind me asking what discipline you're in? I'm just wondering how well this works for all different subjects. Likewise, was it difficult to come across a willing supervisor (given that your PhD is unlike the 'traditional' model).

cailleach an airgid

No problem (however I'm defo not an expert only registered 10 months and can only talk from my own limited experience!). I'm in clinical therapies, and while my first supervisor (who did her phd years ago) went the traditional route, my second went by publication. I'm aware of people in other health and social science disciplines choosing this route (medicine, education, psychology etc). It seems it works week if your research is in a few stages. Like, if I was planning an intervention for a particular client group. I might publish one systematic review of the area, to demonstrate the need. I might do another based on focus group and survey methodology, to gather information about the clients needs and wants. I might do a third based on the outcome of the intervention, designed based on the results of the first and second paper. I might do a fourth, surveying therapists on their experiences of rolling out the intervention. They're just all what would traditionally be separate chapters, with some material to link (like a lit review and conclusion) but presented as papers.

Does that make sense? And of course that's one hypothetical example from CT, it could be papers based on different stages (qual, quant, methodological, theoretical etc) of any study.

I THINK that is what it is - hope that makes sense/helps/isn't wildly off the mark ;-)

WhirlEsme

@cailleach an airgid: Thanks for the detailed reply It's a very interesting concept. Best of luck with your studies!

marchantnick

Hi everyone, thanks for the replies.

Yes I have spoken to a number of academics in different universities in Ireland, and many said that they preferred their students to prepare a series of publications (with a linking introduction / conclusion) rather than a bound thesis. Personally I think this makes a lot of sense, as journal articles are much more likely to be read and referenced by other academics than PhD theses - at least in the field of biology.

In reply to cailleach an airgid (thanks for the reply), I am already being supervised by the manager of the NGO and a specialist in the subject. The manager is an academic with a good track record, but while working full-time with the NGO he is based overseas and does not have a full-time academic position (although he is a research fellow). So as it stands I feel that I have a good supervision team, who give very good feedback on my work. I would be happy to work with a third supervisor from an Irish university, but I don't strictly need one. The main problem for me is finding a university that offers a flexible model for the PhD.

I suppose I am a bit frustrated by the concept in general, as it seems that the only way to get a PhD in Ireland is to register for 3/4/5 years and pay a lot of money (15 - 25k euro depending where you do it). If I do a good job with these papers and get published well, then I think that the work would be equivalent to a PhD, and I suppose I just need someone to assess it and decide whether it meets the standard of a PhD. I appreciate that there are other advantages to doing a PhD in an academic environment, and if so I would be happy to register for one year and do all of that, but as it stands there doesn't seem to be an option in Ireland.

I'll probably end up having to go to the UK to be honest, I know that they have more flexibility there - e.g. http://www.sunderland.ac.uk/research/research_degrees/phdbyexistingpublishedworks/.

airneal

Have a look at the Open University also! Good luck!!

marchantnick wrote: »

Hi everyone, thanks for the replies.

Yes I have spoken to a number of academics in different universities in Ireland, and many said that they preferred their students to prepare a series of publications (with a linking introduction / conclusion) rather than a bound thesis. Personally I think this makes a lot of sense, as journal articles are much more likely to be read and referenced by other academics than PhD theses - at least in the field of biology.

In reply to cailleach an airgid (thanks for the reply), I am already being supervised by the manager of the NGO and a specialist in the subject. The manager is an academic with a good track record, but while working full-time with the NGO he is based overseas and does not have a full-time academic position (although he is a research fellow). So as it stands I feel that I have a good supervision team, who give very good feedback on my work. I would be happy to work with a third supervisor from an Irish university, but I don't strictly need one. The main problem for me is finding a university that offers a flexible model for the PhD.

I suppose I am a bit frustrated by the concept in general, as it seems that the only way to get a PhD in Ireland is to register for 3/4/5 years and pay a lot of money (15 - 25k euro depending where you do it). If I do a good job with these papers and get published well, then I think that the work would be equivalent to a PhD, and I suppose I just need someone to assess it and decide whether it meets the standard of a PhD. I appreciate that there are other advantages to doing a PhD in an academic environment, and if so I would be happy to register for one year and do all of that, but as it stands there doesn't seem to be an option in Ireland.

I'll probably end up having to go to the UK to be honest, I know that they have more flexibility there - e.g. http://www.sunderland.ac.uk/research/research_degrees/phdbyexistingpublishedworks/.

cailleach an airgid

It sounds like you have a good topic and high skill in the area-hopefully you can find an institution with the flexibility you need - good luck!

PhoenixParker

cailleach an airgid wrote: »

My eventual 'thesis' will incorporate my papers with 'linking' sections and an introduction and conclusion section, which will have a lot in common with a monograph but will likely be shorter. This is common enough in my discipline (particularly in Scandanavia, but the practice is becoming more widespread).

This is probably what you'll need to do, write the papers, then rewrite them with an introduction, links and a conclusion to make the whole thing into a PhD which can be submitted, and then evaluated by an extern examiner.

marchantnick wrote: »

I suppose I am a bit frustrated by the concept in general, as it seems that the only way to get a PhD in Ireland is to register for 3/4/5 years and pay a lot of money (15 - 25k euro depending where you do it). If I do a good job with these papers and get published well, then I think that the work would be equivalent to a PhD, and I suppose I just need someone to assess it and decide whether it meets the standard of a PhD.

You will probably have to be registered for three years, which would be 15k - 20k in fees, and not for very much from the university, however that's currently the way the system works. I will say that writing three papers in 3 - 6 months sounds very ambitious, and you'll need at least an extra 3 - 6 months to write up as a PhD.

If I were you now, I'd talk to a few potential supervisors and ask them to tak e you on as a research student. Look in particular for people who have research you intend to cite. They will be more inclined to agree since the extra citations will be good for them.

Read up on the regulations in the university you're interested in, push to go part time (it'll be cheaper), ask the supervisor if they have any funding that they could use to cover part or some of your fees, also ask the organisation you work for. There are tax breaks for funding research, paying university fees etc. as far as I know. It might for instance be possible to pay your fees directly from your company, and you take a reduction in salary. That would mean your fees come out of your pre-tax salary. There is a potential benefit to your company too, in having the link to a major university on the papers they publish, so ask them to pay the fees.

Register as a student this year, write the papers, get them in line for publication. That will take at least a year. When that's all done, take the papers and combine them into a PhD thesis, and you'll probably find you're into your 3rd year and eligible to submit.