Craft Beer: Prices and Snobishness!

Zymurgist

Actually what is the etiquette for refusing a bottle of beer once you find out the price?

In my case the bar man handed me an open bottle of Dr Rudi, i handed him a tenner and he gave me back three, and a receipt.

Would i have been out of order at that point to say, "actually i am not willing to pay €7 for that, can i have my money back please?"

Would the bar man have thrown a strop as he can't very well re-sell the bottle once opened.

Speak Now

I wonder is a pub the only place we buy something without asking or knowing the price first?

BeerNut

Zymurgist wrote: »

Would i have been out of order at that point to say, "actually i am not willing to pay €7 for that, can i have my money back please?"

Would the bar man have thrown a strop as he can't very well re-sell the bottle once opened.

Entirely depends on the pub. Any sane pub would take it back. A good barman would have warned you about the price when you ordered it. But bottled beer in pubs is pretty much a mug's game from beginning to end, IMO. €5, €7 -- if it's significantly dearer than draught it's daft.

The new white-label Dr Rudi isn't Irish, btw. It was brewed in Belgium.

Scortho

Do people not ask the price of things before ordering.
Also surely said pub had a beer list with prices similar to brewdock and porterhouse?

Passenger

BeerNut wrote: »

Entirely depends on the pub. Any sane pub would take it back. A good barman would have warned you about the price when you ordered it. But bottled beer in pubs is pretty much a mug's game from beginning to end, IMO. €5, €7 -- if it's significantly dearer than draught it's daft.

Yep. The fact that a pub can sell bottled beer for €7 and a nice tasty draught for €5 is incredible.

BeerNut

Scortho wrote: »

surely said pub had a beer list with prices similar to brewdock and porterhouse?

I don't think even Brew Dock and Porterhouse have a beer list that matches exactly with the content of their fridges.

Scortho

BeerNut wrote: »

I don't think even Brew Dock and Porterhouse have a beer list that matches exactly with the content of their fridges.

Maybe when I've drank them all, ill have that problem!:)
Even still if I spot something that I don't know the price off ill ask.

adamski8

Zymurgist wrote: »

Actually what is the etiquette for refusing a bottle of beer once you find out the price?

In my case the bar man handed me an open bottle of Dr Rudi, i handed him a tenner and he gave me back three, and a receipt.

Would i have been out of order at that point to say, "actually i am not willing to pay €7 for that, can i have my money back please?"

Would the bar man have thrown a strop as he can't very well re-sell the bottle once opened.

The equitte is they tell you the price before yoi hand over the cash and you can refuse. You cant ask for money back after you have given it.


Its a real pet peeve of mine that even when activily looking i cant see the price of beer im about to order. I do however ask (which i shouldnt have to do according to legislation)

adamski8

Zymurgist wrote: »

Actually what is the etiquette for refusing a bottle of beer once you find out the price?

In my case the bar man handed me an open bottle of Dr Rudi, i handed him a tenner and he gave me back three, and a receipt.

Would i have been out of order at that point to say, "actually i am not willing to pay €7 for that, can i have my money back please?"

Would the bar man have thrown a strop as he can't very well re-sell the bottle once opened.

The equitte is they tell you the price before yoi hand over the cash and you can refuse. You cant ask for money back after you have given it.


Its a real pet peeve of mine that even when activily looking i cant see the price of beer im about to order. I do however ask (which i shouldnt have to do according to legislation)

Scortho

adamski8 wrote: »

The equitte is they tell you the price before yoi hand over the cash and you can refuse. You cant ask for money back after you have given it.


Its a real pet peeve of mine that even when activily looking i cant see the price of beer im about to order. I do however ask (which i shouldnt have to do according to legislation)

In fairness have you seen the amount of beers on offer in the porter house?
They have a list for virtually all of them.
It's not like your bog standard pub that sells 5 or 6 types of beer.

The one that gets my nut up is people looking for prices for prescription meds.
The quantities differ patient to patient, and the amount of different drugs would give the Argos catalogue a good run for its money (sorry for ot rant)

Ravelleman

BeerNut wrote: »

But bottled beer in pubs is pretty much a mug's game from beginning to end, IMO. €5, €7 -- if it's significantly dearer than draught it's daft.

True that - I never buy bottles when there's an assortment of draught beers available as in most places bottles are arbitrarily priced higher.

For a while Porterhouse had the three varieties of Hop Head available all at different prices. If I remember correctly the small bottle was much pricier than the cask version and quite close to the kegged version - I can't recall which of those two was more expensive.

Caonima

BeerNut wrote: »

I don't think even Brew Dock and Porterhouse have a beer list that matches exactly with the content of their fridges.

I like the Porterhouse. When I first started going in there, the barman would offer me a taste of the beer I asked about... just a pint glass with a little sip. You kind of feel obliged to buy a pint of it after that. Most of the beers there were great, but couldn't get into the taste of that Brain Blasta one.

Right now, where I live, most bars have nothing but craft beers available, as do the offies. Makes a wonderful change from mank pints of Bud or Heineken...

Ravelleman

Caonima wrote: »

I like the Porterhouse. When I first started going in there, the barman would offer me a taste of the beer I asked about... just a pint glass with a little sip. You kind of feel obliged to buy a pint of it after that. Most of the beers there were great, but couldn't get into the taste of that Brain Blasta one.

All the Cottage Group places will do that for you.

As for Brain Blasta, I had a pint of that in WJ Kavanaghs on cask and thought it was sweet nectar. I tried it on cask in the Porterhouse last week and it was just ok. The other day I had a bottle and it was much worse. Anyway, that's not a very objective or useful assessment but it is a strange one.

Caonima

Ravelleman wrote: »

All the Cottage Group places will do that for you.

As for Brain Blasta, I had a pint of that in WJ Kavanaghs on cask and thought it was sweet nectar. I tried it on cask in the Porterhouse last week and it was just ok. The other day I had a bottle and it was much worse. Anyway, that's not a very objective or useful assessment but it is a strange one.

Nah, I've had experiences of the old good-pint-bad-pint at different places, too. Consistency is seemingly a difficult thing to have

Saruman

Caonima wrote: »

Nah, I've had experiences of the old good-pint-bad-pint at different places, too. Consistency is seemingly a difficult thing to have

Not really.
Consistency in cask is very difficult to achieve. Declan in WJ Kavanagh's is a trained cellarman and dealt with cask in the UK for years. They are his babies and he would sleep in the cellar if he was allowed. So cask in Kavanagh's should always be perfect. If it's not, Declan will take it off immediatly.

Porterhouse doesn't have somebody as well trained. Also the brain blasta on cask might have been the one sitting on the counter? The gravity fed one rather than the handpump from the cellar? If so, in this warm weather, that can never be in optimum condition as it can't be kept cool enough or at a constant temperature.

The bottle on the other hand is actually a slightly different beer I believe. Certainly Wrasslers in bottle is a very different beer to the tap version. Usually, brain blasta in bottle is outstanding but it suits a well conditioned cask a little better.

Seaneh

Right ladeens, picked up two Galway Bay beers from McCambridge's just now, 2.99 each so they are priced at the same point as O'Hara's and Galway Hooker and the likes. Picked up a Full Sail and s Stormy Port l. Looking forward to trying Stormy Port again.

BaZmO*

Seaneh wrote: »

Right ladeens, picked up two Galway Bay beers from McCambridge's just now, 2.99 each so they are priced at the same point as O'Hara's and Galway Hooker and the likes. Picked up a Full Sail and s Stormy Port l. Looking forward to trying Stormy Port again.

That's too expensive, blah, blah, it's a bleedin disgrace Joe, etc., etc.

Berty

Seaneh wrote: »

Right ladeens, picked up two Galway Bay beers from McCambridge's just now, 2.99 each so they are priced at the same point as O'Hara's and Galway Hooker and the likes. Picked up a Full Sail and s Stormy Port l. Looking forward to trying Stormy Port again.

Their delivery was only at around 10am this morning. You work fast. They were the first in Galway to get it for no reason other than they were the first on the delivery sheet.

We visited the Brewery yesterday and Chris, who appears to be some sort of Beer Yoda, gave us a run through on the products. My favourite was Full Sail by far.

Did any cork off licences order galway bay in yet?

Seaneh

Beer Baron wrote: »

Their delivery was only at around 10am this morning. You work fast. They were the first in Galway to get it for no reason other than they were the first on the delivery sheet.

We visited the Brewery yesterday and Chris, who appears to be some sort of Beer Yoda, gave us a run through on the products. My favourite was Full Sail by far.

Chris is a great lad, have had many drunken chat about brewing and techniques.

And yeah was going to the bus station this morning and ran in and grabbed the two bottles.

ciaran76

So the opposite to beer snob happened me on Saturday.

Went to my closest pub to my house to watch football with my mates.
Anyway I asked the barman (young fella in early 20's) had he any beers not Bud,Coors etc

He said like what?

I named O'Hara and Galway Hooker and he said ye what?
Repeated again and he said are they real beers and I said yes been on the market a good few years I said. You can get them in Dunnes Stores.

He laughed and said we dont do beers like that. I said why not and he couldnt answer me.

I was annoyed more by his reaction than anything else and his lack of knowledge of local Irish beer.

I hadnt been in that pub for over 2 years and they had just recently got new owners so took a chance going down to it.

Will be giving it a miss again I suppose.

BaZmO*

ciaran76 wrote: »

So the opposite to beer snob happened me on Saturday.

Went to my closest pub to my house to watch football with my mates.
Anyway I asked the barman (young fella in early 20's) had he any beers not Bud,Coors etc

He said like what?

I named O'Hara and Galway Hooker and he said ye what?
Repeated again and he said are they real beers and I said yes been on the market a good few years I said. You can get them in Dunnes Stores.

He laughed and said we dont do beers like that. I said why not and he couldnt answer me.

I was annoyed more by his reaction than anything else and his lack of knowledge of local Irish beer.

I hadnt been in that pub for over 2 years and they had just recently got new owners so took a chance going down to it.

Will be giving it a miss again I suppose.

There are an awful lot of barmen in Ireland that haven't a clue about any beers other than the usual macro fare.

the beer revolu

BaZmO* wrote: »

There are an awful lot of barmen in Ireland that haven't a clue about any beers other than the usual macro fare.

I once had a young bar man think I was taking the mick out of him by asking for a pint bottle of Guinness. It was in kerry.

Speak Now

Most bar men think im taking the piss when i ask have they got any pale ale. I usually get told that they only have "real" ale! No demand for the weak stuff :rolleyes:

Scortho

Jerry Seinfeld wrote: »

Most bar men think im taking the piss when i ask have they got any pale ale. I usually get told that they only have "real" ale! No demand for the weak stuff :rolleyes:

You should give them a really hoppy ipa,
See what real ale is!
Anyone else find it ironic that most pubs have the words Ales and Porters outside the pub, yet the only ale they sell is smithwicks and the closest thing to porter is Guinness (is it a stout or a porter debate can be had elsewhere)?

BaZmO*

Scortho wrote: »

You should give them a really hoppy ipa,
See what real ale is!
Anyone else find it ironic that most pubs have the words Ales and Porters outside the pub, yet the only ale they sell is smithwicks and the closest thing to porter is Guinness (is it a stout or a porter debate can be had elsewhere)?

Well Guinness (Stout) is a form of Porter.

Scortho

BaZmO* wrote: »

Well Guinness (Stout) is a form of Porter.

I know, but you have people who argue that its a separate beer style from porter, hence why I put it in brackets

the beer revolu

Careful now!

Saruman

Martyn Cornell covers it on his blog.

Short answer is, there's no real modern difference between a stout or a porter.

Lovely Bloke

Saruman wrote: »

Martyn Cornell covers it on his blog.

Short answer is, there's no real modern difference between a stout or a porter.

in his opinion

Saruman

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

in his opinion

Everything in life is an opinion.

BaZmO*

Saruman wrote: »

Everything in life is an opinion.

“Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.”
― Oscar Wilde

Saruman

BaZmO* wrote: »

“Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.”
― Oscar Wilde

Do craft beer drinkers not buck that trend? We don't drink what mass media/marketing tells us to drink. We drink what tastes good to us.

Of course... then we go out and tell other people to drink such and such a beer, it's brilliant and said person gives at a go.

Not so different after all

ciaran76

Out tonight with a work thing an I ask for a 8 degree beer.
Bar man said he has none.

I reply I see it in a fridge over the other side. He says that bar is closed. I said you have beer there so could I get it please.
He said there is no staff to go there. I said I'll get it and he said no don't I'll get it. Not sure if beer from that fridge will scan on this side. I said ring it in at 4.50 everyone will be happy.

My workmates think I am out to wind up beer staff up.
By the way there was plenty of staff. I had 15 workmates out so decided to go somewhere else.

Can't believe pubs have staff who don't encourage sales from beer they have in the bar.

irish_goat

I was at the fleadh in Derry during the week. Went into the only pub that sells Irish beer, bottles of Hilden. Asked for a bottle and got told they had taken them off the shelves for the week because of how busy it was.

So in a week long celebration of Irish music and culture they had taken away the only beer that was actually Irish... :rolleyes:

Herb Powell

^That's bizzare.

the beer revolu wrote: »

I once had a young bar man think I was taking the mick out of him by asking for a pint bottle of Guinness. It was in kerry.

Whatever about draught Guinness, bottled Guinness is very tasty!

Losty Dublin

ciaran76 wrote: »

Out tonight with a work thing an I ask for a 8 degree beer.
Bar man said he has none.

I reply I see it in a fridge over the other side. He says that bar is closed. I said you have beer there so could I get it please.
He said there is no staff to go there. I said I'll get it and he said no don't I'll get it. Not sure if beer from that fridge will scan on this side. I said ring it in at 4.50 everyone will be happy.

My workmates think I am out to wind up beer staff up.
By the way there was plenty of staff. I had 15 workmates out so decided to go somewhere else.

Can't believe pubs have staff who don't encourage sales from beer they have in the bar.

Opposite story to yours but with a happy ending for me.

A few months ago I was drinking in Baker's Corner and I asked if they had any decent bottles. The barman took me out to the Off Licence, told me to pick out whatever I wanted and that he'd serve them to me all night long.

Plus they were rang up at off prices for the evening. Cheap date

ciaran76

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Opposite story to yours but with a happy ending for me.

A few months ago I was drinking in Baker's Corner and I asked if they had any decent bottles. The barman took me out to the Off Licence, told me to pick out whatever I wanted and that he'd serve them to me all night long.

Plus they were rang up at off prices for the evening. Cheap date

Ha ha nice.

Kenny's in Lucan is also like this.

Lovely Bloke

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Opposite story to yours but with a happy ending for me.

A few months ago I was drinking in Baker's Corner and I asked if they had any decent bottles. The barman took me out to the Off Licence, told me to pick out whatever I wanted and that he'd serve them to me all night long.

I've had this in The Hole In The Wall in Castleknock

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Plus they were rang up at off prices for the evening. Cheap date

:eek: not this bit though, I got everything in the offo for a fiver though.

***************************************

Lads, I'm uncomfortable with approaching and/or accosting the barmen in premises that don't stock Craft Beers - it's not really their fault, it's the owner or manager who should be feeling your ire, the barman is only there doing a job. It's kind of pathetic to take it out on them really.

What I do is look around the taps, then lean over and look in the fridges - if I see no craft beers I ask, if I'm told no, I leave it at that - unless the person I'm talking to is obviously a person in authority. I might decide to drink a macro, or I might decide to drink tap water.

What is the point of making a barman's night uncomfortable? Should he leave his job if the management refuse to stock craft beer? Why should a barman in a pub that serves only macros know anything about beer - it's obvious at this stage that if a pub isn't stocking at least a couple of craft beers then they don't care about the beer, from a high level - and they don't care that their customers might care either - there can be absolutely no bar owners or managers at this stage who haven't been at least offered bottles of something crafty - if they refuse it, then that's a sign that we (craft beer afficionados) shouldn't be in there in the first place.

BaZmO*

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Lads, I'm uncomfortable with approaching and/or accosting the barmen in premises that don't stock Craft Beers - it's not really their fault, it's the owner or manager who should be feeling your ire, the barman is only there doing a job. It's kind of pathetic to take it out on them really.

What I do is look around the taps, then lean over and look in the fridges - if I see no craft beers I ask, if I'm told no, I leave it at that - unless the person I'm talking to is obviously a person in authority. I might decide to drink a macro, or I might decide to drink tap water.

What is the point of making a barman's night uncomfortable? Should he leave his job if the management refuse to stock craft beer? Why should a barman in a pub that serves only macros know anything about beer - it's obvious at this stage that if a pub isn't stocking at least a couple of craft beers then they don't care about the beer, from a high level - and they don't care that their customers might care either - there can be absolutely no bar owners or managers at this stage who haven't been at least offered bottles of something crafty - if they refuse it, then that's a sign that we (craft beer afficionados) shouldn't be in there in the first place.

I don't think anybody has said that they have had a go at the staff. What's wrong with asking for something different? The conversation has been more to do with ignorance of bar staff towards something, that in fairness has become less and less of a niche market. Bartending for a lot of people is a trade, and it's quite surprising that a lot of staff can be quite clueless to changes in their own trade, and this especially applies to owners too.

ciaran76

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

What is the point of making a barman's night uncomfortable? Should he leave his job if the management refuse to stock craft beer? Why should a barman in a pub that serves only macros know anything about beer - it's obvious at this stage that if a pub isn't stocking at least a couple of craft beers then they don't care about the beer, from a high level - and they don't care that their customers might care either - there can be absolutely no bar owners or managers at this stage who haven't been at least offered bottles of something crafty - if they refuse it, then that's a sign that we (craft beer afficionados) shouldn't be in there in the first place.

I see it a different way to be honest. If my customers are asking me for something that we don't stock a few times. I will eventually bring it up with my manager and say do you know we have been asked a few times to get x,y or z.

My manager might then say look into it see whats going on and bring him a report on what benefits we have from doing it and what would happen if we didn't.

I don't work in a bar or restaurant but if a few of your customers demand/request something then you should bring it up to your manager.

I am sure this is the same for most businesses?

Grayditch

If the beer was in another fridge, there's a good chance he was just being a lazy git. Either way, I've worked in bars enough to know what makes barmen considered he's been accosted, and that wouldn't be one

Losty Dublin

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Lads, I'm uncomfortable with approaching and/or accosting the barmen in premises that don't stock Craft Beers - it's not really their fault, it's the owner or manager who should be feeling your ire, the barman is only there doing a job. It's kind of pathetic to take it out on them really.

What I do is look around the taps, then lean over and look in the fridges - if I see no craft beers I ask, if I'm told no, I leave it at that - unless the person I'm talking to is obviously a person in authority. I might decide to drink a macro, or I might decide to drink tap water.

What is the point of making a barman's night uncomfortable? Should he leave his job if the management refuse to stock craft beer? Why should a barman in a pub that serves only macros know anything about beer - it's obvious at this stage that if a pub isn't stocking at least a couple of craft beers then they don't care about the beer, from a high level - and they don't care that their customers might care either - there can be absolutely no bar owners or managers at this stage who haven't been at least offered bottles of something crafty - if they refuse it, then that's a sign that we (craft beer afficionados) shouldn't be in there in the first place.

Fair point and I'd never take any umbrage on the bar staff for not stocking such and such; as you say it isn't their choosing what's on the shelves and taps.

With that in mind, the ease of how the barman was comfortable enough to take me into the off sales, urge me to pick out what I wanted, have it on hand as required, well it says that this has happened here more than once and that it's acceptable for them to do this. Granted, they probably lose a bit of money doing it as I'd have expect to have paid going rates for the beer but it's going over and above the call of duty and it impressed myself and my company that evening.

irish_goat

Hope you gave him a tip!

Seaneh

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Opposite story to yours but with a happy ending for me.

A few months ago I was drinking in Baker's Corner and I asked if they had any decent bottles. The barman took me out to the Off Licence, told me to pick out whatever I wanted and that he'd serve them to me all night long.

Plus they were rang up at off prices for the evening. Cheap date

The lads in Lohan's in Salthill will do this too, and if you're having a meal they only charge you off sale prices. If you ask them to throw 4 or 5 in the fridge they will and keep them for you for the night.

Saruman

Seaneh wrote: »

The lads in Lohan's in Salthill will do this too, and if you're having a meal they only charge you off sale prices. If you ask them to throw 4 or 5 in the fridge they will and keep them for you for the night.

McCambridges also do it right?

Losty Dublin

irish_goat wrote: »

Hope you gave him a tip!

Course I did.

Serve beer at room temperture.

Seaneh

Saruman wrote: »

McCambridges also do it right?

I've never ordered beer there so I don't know to be honest...

Seaneh

Losty Dublin wrote: »

Course I did.

Serve beer at room temperture.

Room temp is far too warm for almost every beer style.

BaZmO*

Seaneh wrote: »

Room temp is far too warm for almost every beer style.

He's a bad tipper so