James McClean moves to Wigan to help career

dixiefly

http://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/international/2013/0813/467834-mcclean-move-good-for-career-ireland/

I have to say fair play to McClean, he weighed up his situation and decided that it was important from a career point of view to drop a division and also took a pay cut to make sure that he got the move.

Lets hope it works out for him and that he gets the game time to maintain his push for a place in the national team.

Cant help comparing and contrasting with Stephen Ireland who has allowed his career to go into freefall.

cson

Talent wise, Championship is about his level. Stephen Ireland is a different situation altogether; the guy has enough talent to be playing in a top 10 EPL club but absolutely zero application.

The_Kew_Tour

Remember that game when he came on against Czech Republic to standing ovation as if he was the new Messi?

Something about the water up in Derry.

dixiefly

cson wrote: »

Talent wise, Championship is about his level. Stephen Ireland is a different situation altogether; the guy has enough talent to be playing in a top 10 EPL club but absolutely zero application.

In fairness to him he is realistic enough to make the assessment that it probably is his level and was not cocky enough to hold out for a premier league side.

Regarding Stephen Ireland, he had the talent to be a top 10 EPL club player. I suspect that boat has passed even if he has a miraculous improvement in application.

EdenHazard

I don't buy the 'he's found his level' stuff, he' obviously not a champions league player(as in high end cl, not talking about Basel, Celtic etc..€") but hell prob spend the next 7 years in and out of the EPL. I'd be surprised if he drops below top end championship

wandatowell

Fair play to him, tough call to make but he showed courage to make it.

StephenHendry

very good signing for wigan, together with grant holt it will help wigan alot with getting back to the pl this season. it looks like they will lose mccarthy so getting a few good signing is what owen coyle needs to do. mcclean did well against utd , prob should have scored in the first half

dundalkfc10

cson wrote: »

Talent wise, Championship is about his level. Stephen Ireland is a different situation altogether; the guy has enough talent to be playing in a top 10 EPL club but absolutely zero application.

Well his 1st half a season in the EPL showed that he can cut it at EPL level when on form.

Dempsey

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Well his 1st half a season in the EPL showed that he can cut it at EPL level when on form.

His 'form' disappeared when clubs studied what he does and made tactical tweaks to deal with him and he couldnt deal with tactics used on him.

Coillte_Bhoy

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Remember that game when he came on against Czech Republic to standing ovation as if he was the new Messi?

Something about the water up in Derry.

Why? was the attendance wholly Derry people? i think the reaction was more to do with wth the fact that trap finally was going to give an up and coming player a chance after previously ignoring his premiership form

The_Kew_Tour

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Why? was the attendance wholly Derry people? i think the reaction was more to do with wth the fact that trap finally was going to give an up and coming player a chance after previously ignoring his premiership form

I had Derry lads telling me he be at a top 4 club within 2 seasons. Maybe they forgot to tell me its a Championship top 4 club;)

Coillte_Bhoy

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I had Derry lads telling me he be at a top 4 club within 2 seasons. Maybe they forgot to tell me its a Championship top 4 club;)

Ya maybe some people got carried away at the beginning, understandable i suppose when its been so long since we've seen any exciting young raw talent bursting through onto the big stage. Im still not sure about him, really hopes he makes it, like the cut of him.

newballsplease

Bit of a one trick pony i feel. Defenders know how to deal with him now, and he hasnt really adapted to it.

dundalkfc10

Dempsey wrote: »

His 'form' disappeared when clubs studied what he does and made tactical tweaks to deal with him and he couldnt deal with tactics used on him.

You could say the same about Coleman in his 2nd season, and then he turned it around last year and after Zabeletta was prob next best RB in the league

EdenHazard

I hate when people say that thing about him being 'found out' as if he is some sort of chancer who blagged his way into top level football. If it was a Spanish player it would be has been double marked which he wasn't able to cope with but because its McClean he was 'found out.' I think its in reaction to the euphoria that surrounded him when he first emerged and also I'd say a lot of people deriding him would be Trapattoni followers. He has stamina and by wingers standards has an alright ball into the box, he won't be back at the Brandywell anytime soon I reckon. I think he'll be very good this season and I wouldn't really say I'm a big fan of him, just he has showed and possesses enoguh attributes to be a decent winger.

brianregan09

I don't feel he moved for his career more Di Canio didn't think he was great and shipped him out

dundalkfc10

EdenHazard wrote: »

I hate when people say that thing about him being 'found out' as if he is some sort of chancer who blagged his way into top level football. If it was a Spanish player it would be has been double marked which he wasn't able to cope with but because its McClean he was 'found out.' I think its in reaction to the euphoria that surrounded him when he first emerged and also I'd say a lot of people deriding him would be Trapattoni followers. He has stamina and by wingers standards has an alright ball into the box, he won't be back at the Brandywell anytime soon I reckon. I think he'll be very good this season.

100% agree

cson

cson wrote: »

Talent wise, Championship is about his level. Stephen Ireland is a different situation altogether; the guy has enough talent to be playing in a top 10 EPL club but absolutely zero application.

Worse have established successful careers in the premier league though. Stephen Hunt for example has played for 3 different Premier league clubs. If i racked my brains hard enough i could probably think of more down through the years.

Neil3030

Di Canio probably heard about the poppy ordeal and shipped him off.

COYVB

dixiefly wrote: »

Regarding Stephen Ireland, he had the talent to be a top 10 EPL club player. I suspect that boat has passed even if he has a miraculous improvement in application.

Ireland has always worked extremely hard for Villa to be fair to him, the problem is that unless a team is built around him he's essentially useless - and nobody is going to build a team around him at this stage

EdenHazard

Yeah Ireland is a hard worker its just while he's very talented, it does not justify building a team around him.

Vurnon San Benito

I remember the days he burst onto the scene - I was one of few at the time unconvinced by him. A one trick pony with limited ability, and I'm not entirely sure he has the attitude or mentality to be adapt his game/vary his game.

A decent player and will do well in the Championship with his delivery, but bottom 8 of the Premier League is about as high as he'll go I'd assume.

Shows how badly the ROI have fallen when he is considered one of the most exciting players in the squad.

Neil3030

Neil3030 wrote: »

Di Canio probably heard about the poppy ordeal and shipped him off.

ROFL!

I dont think Di Canio is in any place to be making judgements on players based on their political stances or ideologies given the furore he entered the Stadium of light in himself so somehow i doubt that was the case

gustavo

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Why? was the attendance wholly Derry people? i think the reaction was more to do with wth the fact that trap finally was going to give an up and coming player a chance after previously ignoring his premiership form

Did Trap really "ignore" his form for that long ? As far as I can recall he was called up relatively early after getting a few games with Sunderland.

dundalkfc10

gustavo wrote: »

Did Trap really "ignore" his form for that long ? As far as I can recall he was called up relatively early after getting a few games with Sunderland.

He should have been called up when he was at Derry, but thats another debate

CSF

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

He should have been called up when he was at Derry, but thats another debate

Dunno about that, Daniel Kearns was the LOI player everyone was bigging up at the time.

dundalkfc10

CSF wrote: »

Dunno about that, Daniel Kearns was the LOI player everyone was bigging up at the time.

Not by most Dundalk fans, he IMO and many others I spoke to around Oriel, he was very much over-rated although had potential

He has had a difficult enough time in England so far but in fairness to him Kearns has been given a new contract at Peterbrough after an excellent pre-season.

Coillte_Bhoy

gustavo wrote: »

Did Trap really "ignore" his form for that long ? As far as I can recall he was called up relatively early after getting a few games with Sunderland.

Maybe you're right. My recollection is that he seemed to wait a long time to give him is first cap, he may well have been in the squads

CSF

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

Not by most Dundalk fans, he IMO and many others I spoke to around Oriel, he was very much over-rated although had potential

He has had a difficult enough time in England so far but in fairness to him Kearns has been given a new contract at Peterbrough after an excellent pre-season.

Has been getting rave reviews in his early league games too.

Very overrated player

Dempsey

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

You could say the same about Coleman in his 2nd season, and then he turned it around last year and after Zabeletta was prob next best RB in the league

Coleman has a terrific attitude, the same cannot be said of McClean.

dsmythy

We're turning into the English the way we desperately pin the next big thing on any half decent player below a certain age.

Paully D

I never really got caught up in the hype and continually said that he had a long way to go before he could start kicking off for not being given game time with Ireland, but nevertheless I'm disappointed how this ended up turning out.

I think the best and worst thing to happen to him was Martin O'Neill and his coaching staff, Steve Guppy especially. Of course O'Neill gave him his debut and thus a platform to become a millionaire, but last summer O'Neill brought Guppy in to work with the wingers and McClean was never the same. They tried to get him to become more of a thinker, to weigh up his options when he got on the ball etc rather than being instinctive. Instead of just getting the ball, flying down the wing and swinging over a cross, he started to drift inside on his right foot, laying the ball off to the central midfielders and the moving back out wide while the ball was lumped from one end of the pitch to the other. It completely took him out of his comfort zone.

He's also a confidence player, and the ridiculous poppy incident (from the point of view of people giving him needless abuse over it) knocked his confidence completely. It was clear that the forced changed in his playing style, our awful tactics and form under O'Neill, combined with the incident meant he was no longer enjoying his football.

One thing McClean has going for him is he is an extremely hard worker on the pitch. He will always track back and cover a lot of ground, and that will get you places, especially in the Championship. At Wigan I'm sure he'll be allowed to play with the bit of freedom he was denied last season at Sunderland and should get his confidence back. Unfortunately he has the brain the size of a pea when it comes to social networking which means he brings a lot of needless trouble on himself and he still needs a huge amount of PR training or he risks alienating himself no matter where he plays.

I hope it works out for him anyway.

GLaDOS

I think at Wigan he really has a chance to regain his form and confidence. Be nice to see him back in the PL next season with Wigan. Think he can still make a big contribution to the Irish team.

NIMAN

As a Derry City fan, I was more than glad to see him move as we got some money out of it. Of course I would like to see him do well as he's one of our own, but I do think he was struggling a bit in the EPL.

He has a fantastic level of fitness and will run forever for you, which is often enough to make it these days in football, but I will admit he is limited when it comes to skill level. He can cross a ball for sure, but he is lacking the tricks that a winger often needs.

I really enjoyed watching him at the Brandywell, and he was probably too good for LoI football, but watching him in England he is a bit head-down, run aimlessly at times.

But he's raking in plenty of cash so fair play to him. I think regular football at a lower level will do him good.

Paully D

NIMAN wrote: »

As a Derry City fan, I was more than glad to see him move as we got some money out of it. Of course I would like to see him do well as he's one of our own, but I do think he was struggling a bit in the EPL.

He has a fantastic level of fitness and will run forever for you, which is often enough to make it these days in football, but I will admit he is limited when it comes to skill level. He can cross a ball for sure, but he is lacking the tricks that a winger often needs.

I really enjoyed watching him at the Brandywell, and he was probably too good for LoI football, but watching him in England he is a bit head-down, run aimlessly at times.

But he's raking in plenty of cash so fair play to him. I think regular football at a lower level will do him good.

Derry must be kicking themselves that they didn't take Sunderland's offer of buying out his sell on clause (15%) for £500,000 last summer now. They got £300,000 from the Wigan deal.

dundalkfc10

Dempsey wrote: »

Coleman has a terrific attitude, the same cannot be said of McClean.

How so, because of a few remarks he made on twitter?

Thats nothing got to do with his attitude on the training ground or during a game!

Amirani

He's a decent squad player for Ireland to have. I wouldn't like us to ever be in a position where he'll be a definite starter.

I think that Championship level is the right one for him to be at at this point in time. He has a big season ahead of him.

Super-Rush

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

You could say the same about Coleman in his 2nd season, and then he turned it around last year and after Zabeletta was prob next best RB in the league

Kyle Walker and Glen Johnson are streets ahead of Coleman.

EdenHazard

Super-Rush wrote: »

Kyle Walker and Glen Johnson are streets ahead of Coleman.

No, you are wrong, really really wrong.

CSF

EdenHazard wrote: »

No, you are wrong, really really wrong.

I'm with him on that one.

EdenHazard

Walker was so bad for Spurs last season so unless he's judging it based on media perception there is no way walker is streets ahead of coleman.

dundalkfc10

Glen Johnson seriously?

I forgot about Walker but Johnson is not as good as Coleman

G.K.

Johnson, yes, excellent RB. And Rafael, and Aszpilicueta.

After that, Coleman's probably next. Only rival really is Rangel. I don't rate Walker.

NIMAN

Paully D wrote: »

Derry must be kicking themselves that they didn't take Sunderland's offer of buying out his sell on clause (15%) for £500,000 last summer now. They got £300,000 from the Wigan deal.

We got nowhere near £300k from the deal. Its reported to be more like half of that.

A lot depends on what James moved to Wigan for. It was reported as £2m at first, but it is thought to be closer to the £1m mark.

Plus Derry only get 15% of the profit Sunderland make, so they can deduct what they paid us for him in the 1st place from their profit, then pay 15% of that.

As for James' attitude, I think he is renowned for having a fantastic attitude to playing and training. His work rate is 100%. If you want to consider stuff he says on Twitter as a reason to run hom down, or the fact that he chose not to wear a poppy on his shirt, then you are as shallow as those in the UK media who attack him.

COYVB

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

You could say the same about Coleman in his 2nd season, and then he turned it around last year and after Zabeletta was prob next best RB in the league

Matty Lowton says hi

SantryRed

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

He should have been called up when he was at Derry, but thats another debate

No way.

LuckyLloyd

I like McClean. Plays the game properly, hard working and tough as nails. Fantastic athlete with a hammer left boot.

But his delivery is wildly inconsistent and decision making poor. I think he should be good enough to play at Championship level for a long time but isn't going to feature much at the top level. Never should be more than an option for Ireland. If he's racking up caps, Ireland won't be qualifying for much.

population

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

I like McClean. Plays the game properly, hard working and tough as nails. Fantastic athlete with a hammer left boot.

But his delivery is wildly inconsistent and decision making poor. I think he should be good enough to play at Championship level for a long time but isn't going to feature much at the top level. Never should be more than an option for Ireland. If he's racking up caps, Ireland won't be qualifying for much.

Whereas with McGeady and Whelan racking up caps all will be rosey.

CSF

population wrote: »

Whereas with McGeady and Whelan racking up caps all will be rosey.

McGeady is much better than McClean

LuckyLloyd

population wrote: »

Whereas with McGeady and Whelan racking up caps all will be rosey.

Both are superior players to McClean! McGeady, while incredibly frustrating, is a better option for us. Brings far more to the table. McClean won't annoy fans as much, but he won't annoy defenses as much either.

In the 1988 - 2002 era, a player like McClean wouldn't have got many if any caps for us. That he's in contention at all is a sorry commentary on the current Irish squad.