Pre Game handshakes?

False Prophet

Who's terrible idea was that
Ive nothing against coping other sports but it looks dreadful in gaa.
Nothing wrong with the old way of shaking hands with opponent before and after game. Alot more natural than this modern rubbish.

WesternZulu

Hardly makes a difference.

It would have been great fun after something like 'semplegate' a few years ago...if only it was implemented earlier :pac:

corny

Contrived.

InchicoreDude

Why change something that doesnt need to be changed? Are we going to have situations in a few years like we have in the premiership where certain players wont shake hands? And all the **** that goes with that????

davegrohl48

Seen this pre game handshake thing and was sickened by it You'll be at games n everyone will be staring at it thinking 'What is this charade' The traditional token handshake followed by shoulder Its what we are accustomed to it sets a hard hitting championship tone

Jimminy Mc Fukhead

Like the weigh in at a boxing fight.

There would have been some great handshakes in the past Meath - Cork and Meath - Dublin in the late eighties, Tyrone - Armagh ten years ago.

ethical

Pig ignorant and barbaric would be one way of describing the actions of a player coming on and being jostled or jostling his opponent,if the referee took appropriate action and sent the offending muckspreader off it would put an end to something that has no part in the game,or at least its not in the rules.

Hammer Archer

InchicoreDude wrote: »

Why change something that doesnt need to be changed? Are we going to have situations in a few years like we have in the premiership where certain players wont shake hands? And all the **** that goes with that????

First thing that came to my mind. The Premier League seem to be moving towards getting rid of pre match handshakes after what's happened over the last few years. Can't see the point of bringing this in.

nice_guy80

I don't see the issue.

It is a good example for youngsters watching the tv.

Rightwing

nice_guy80 wrote: »

I don't see the issue.

It is a good example for youngsters watching the tv.

What if someone got the runs and the hands were a bit dirty ?

Al_Coholic

nice_guy80 wrote: »

I don't see the issue.

It is a good example for youngsters watching the tv.

handshakes should be for after the match when everything is done and dusted...thats the time when sportsmanship comes into things.
after you lose you have to be gracious in defeat

Syferus

This thread has given me a headache.

dobman88

I never saw anything wrong with shaking hands with the fella you were marking, if you both felt like it. Sometimes it was just to tell a big rival opponent you were going to bury him, or he would tell me first, but making it look all nice and friendly for the ref to see. Handshakes after the game are right imo, leave all the hitting and bad blood on the pitch and all that.

Lining up players and forcing a handshake is pointless when you are going out onto the pitch for a hard hitting battle. Leave the handshakes til after the match.

feargale

ethical wrote: »

Pig ignorant and barbaric would be one way of describing the actions of a player coming on and being jostled or jostling his opponent,if the referee took appropriate action and sent the offending muckspreader off it would put an end to something that has no part in the game,or at least its not in the rules.

Couldn't agree more. You wouldn't expect it from pre-teens. I'm thinking of opening a thread called " Baboon of the week" to deal with it. You don't see it in rugby. Why? Because rugby is a man's game, where men take hard knocks, but don't dish out gratuitous ones. Yes, sometimes tempers flare - not to condone it, but that will happen in a physical contact game. But this pre-game yob " I'm here" intimidation reflects no credit on the Irish character. If it were happening in English soccer or among " the other side " in Northern Ireland we would never hear the end of it. Please don't tell them it happens here. It's embarrassing enough as it is.

iDave

The Pre-match handshake has become a farce in the PL. Its become a bigger story than certain games themselves. Don't think its worth it having said that theres much bigger things about GAA to get worked up about.

premierstone

iDave wrote: »

The Pre-match handshake has become a farce in the PL. Its become a bigger story than certain games themselves. Don't think its worth it having said that theres much bigger things about GAA to get worked up about.

Has it really? There have been over 5000 games with pre match handshakes in the PL and I remember there been instances in approx two of these.

This thread is pointless it makes feck all difference, it does go to show though that GAA supporters and Irish peole in general I guess just love to complain, its a nothing issue that has fcuk all adverse affect on anyone.

antoobrien

ethical wrote: »

Pig ignorant and barbaric would be one way of describing the actions of a player coming on and being jostled or jostling his opponent,if the referee took appropriate action and sent the offending muckspreader off it would put an end to something that has no part in the game,or at least its not in the rules.

Soccer fans.:rolleyes:

ethical

no.SPORTS fan!!

antoobrien

ethical wrote: »

no.SPORTS fan!!

Sports, especially contact sports (which soccer is not any more) contain various levels of physical contact, including jostling. Nothing in the slightest bit wrong or unusual about it and you'll find it hard to point out how it breaks the rules of either code.

Nut nah calling Joey Boland, who got 620 points for his LC, or John Lee - a doctor - a "muckdspreader" for hitting somebody a shoulder is being a "sports fan".

We can do without that kind "fan" thanks.

ethical

Fair play to the lads! well done!

iDave

premierstone wrote: »

Has it really? There have been over 5000 games with pre match handshakes in the PL and I remember there been instances in approx two of these.

This thread is pointless it makes feck all difference, it does go to show though that GAA supporters and Irish peole in general I guess just love to complain, its a nothing issue that has fcuk all adverse affect on anyone.

JT v Bridge, JT v QPR, Suarez v Evra, its 3 too many and its made a shambles of what it stood for. The entire week leading to those games all the talk was of what would happen.

And the thread isn't pointless, its a new development in GAA and this is a GAA forum

Realt Dearg Sec

ethical wrote: »

no.SPORTS fan!!

Maybe, but you've only ever posted on this forum four times. Three of them were on this thread where you called a jostle "barbaric" and the other was essentially just a scattered slur on Donegal and the Gooch (and by extension on the sport) two years ago, so I have a feeling you aren't much of a GAA fan. Certainly I wouldn't feel any compulsion to take your opinion seriously.

DoctaDee

iDave wrote: »

JT v Bridge, JT v QPR, Suarez v Evra, its 3 too many and its made a shambles of what it stood for. The entire week leading to those games all the talk was of what would happen.

And the thread isn't pointless, its a new development in GAA and this is a GAA forum

I've a pain in me nutz reading soccer related instances as a point of view when debating a Gaelic topic. We have 2 great sports that are distinctly ours, with our own rules - but countless times e.g last weeks tackle by Sean Cavanagh was related in some posts as a red card offence for denying a goal scoring opportunity ..wtf seriously!!! and the Suarez/Henry comparisons that have also arisen are just either poor research or lack of/no knowledge of Gaelic sports to attempt a realistic likening of one event with another.

I've no problem with the respect initiative in GAA, but there's a fawning attempt to demonstrate this ideal with the pre-match handshake lineup. I'm sure a lot of you like myself have run out of a dressing room ready to run through brick walls from the pre game gee ups from managers or mentors .. the last thing these fellas need is a love in. Ta .. not a go @ you Dave

premierstone

iDave wrote: »

JT v Bridge, JT v QPR, Suarez v Evra, its 3 too many and its made a shambles of what it stood for. The entire week leading to those games all the talk was of what would happen.

And the thread isn't pointless, its a new development in GAA and this is a GAA forum

So ban rasicts and adulterers fcuk all to do with the handshake or what it symbolises. And thats 3 out of 7980 btw (not including FA Cup) do the math, it is not an issue.

Its a new development that in the greater scheme of things means no difference to anyone or anything, it has zero impact on our games.

Realt Dearg Sec

premierstone wrote: »

So ban rasicts and adulterers fcuk all to do with the handshake or what it symbolises. And thats 3 out of 7980 btw (not including FA Cup) do the math, it is not an issue.

Its a new development that in the greater scheme of things means no difference to anyone or anything, it has zero impact on our games.

So why do it?

28064212

What's the punishment going to be? You can't have a rule without a punishment for breaking that rule. So what's the punishment for a player that decides not to take part in a meaningless charade?

premierstone

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

So why do it?

Im not bothered either way, my point is we have far more relevant and important issue within the GAA to be getting worked up about that something as trivial as this. It is the ultimate definition of a non-issue.

feargale

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Maybe, but you've only ever posted on this forum four times.

So? Maybe the man is busy. I wasn't aware that one's commitment to a cause was measured by the number of their posts here. If I'd known that I'd have posted frequently in the Christianity forum to gain a few extra indulgences.

feargale

antoobrien wrote: »

Sports, especially contact sports (which soccer is not any more) contain various levels of physical contact, including jostling. Nothing in the slightest bit wrong or unusual about it and you'll find it hard to point out how it breaks the rules of either code.

You seem to be missing the point. Ethical is referring to boorish behaviour OFF the ball.

antoobrien wrote: »

Nut nah calling Joey Boland, who got 620 points for his LC, or John Lee - a doctor - a "muckdspreader" for hitting somebody a shoulder is being a "sports fan".

I have no wish to direct criticism at either person, but you are confusing knowledge with wisdom and sporting, gentlemanly behaviour. Enver Hoxha did well in his exams too.

Realt Dearg Sec

feargale wrote: »

So? Maybe the man is busy. I wasn't aware that one's commitment to a cause was measured by the number of their posts here. If I'd known that I'd have posted frequently in the Christianity forum to gain a few extra indulgences.

True enough, but have you ever met anyone at a gaa game who would regard jostling as barbaric? Does that seem like something a fan of the sports we play, and with a feel for the spirit in which its played, would say? A jostle at the start of the game is nothing more than a statement of intent or determination. There's nothing malicious, harmful or dirty in it at all and I would suspect anyone who thinks otherwise is simply not really a fan, since such a huge misunderstanding is otherwise inexplicable. Hence, no need to take his view seriously

antoobrien

feargale wrote: »

You seem to be missing the point. Ethical is referring to boorish behaviour OFF the ball.

ethical behaviour, boorish, wtf are you on? It's not chess it's a contact sport!

feargale wrote: »

I have no wish to direct criticism at either person,

Considering neither of them have jobs that would include the spreading of muck, calling either of them a "muckdspreader" is the height of ignorance.

feargale wrote: »

you are confusing knowledge with wisdom and sporting, gentlemanly behaviour.

I think you'll find that the physical contact of a "howya" shoulder is not mutually exclusive with "sporting behaviour" in that those that are sporting do not go out to intentionally harm their competitors.

I can't remember the exact Jack Yeats quote but it goes something like:

Rugby is a game for ruffians, played by gentlemen.
Soccer is a game for gentlemen, played by ruffians.
Gaelic is a game for ruffians played by ruffians.
Hurling is a game for gentlemen, played by gentlemen.

feargale wrote: »

Enver Hoxha did well in his exams too.

Apparently so did Jack Lynch and he'd have gotten away with far worse than anything we see on the pitch today.

mooonpie

feargale wrote: »

Couldn't agree more. You wouldn't expect it from pre-teens. I'm thinking of opening a thread called " Baboon of the week" to deal with it. You don't see it in rugby. Why? Because rugby is a man's game, where men take hard knocks, but don't dish out gratuitous ones. Yes, sometimes tempers flare - not to condone it, but that will happen in a physical contact game. But this pre-game yob " I'm here" intimidation reflects no credit on the Irish character. If it were happening in English soccer or among " the other side " in Northern Ireland we would never hear the end of it. Please don't tell them it happens here. It's embarrassing enough as it is.

Just on the bolded point, you don't see it in rugby because when a sub comes on in rugby he's going to join the rest of his team on their side of the offside line.

In GAA when a sub comes on they're going to their patch of the pitch where they're going to try best the single opposition player also in that patch of the pitch ... or else they're the goal keeper

feargale

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

True enough, but have you ever met anyone at a gaa game who would regard jostling as barbaric?

Boorish is the word I used.

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

A jostle at the start of the game is nothing more than a statement of intent

intending what?

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

There's nothing malicious, harmful or dirty in it at all

So if I jostle you on the street you will respond with a friendly "howya" ?

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

and I would suspect anyone who thinks otherwise is simply not really a fan,

That's me, I think otherwise, travelled to see Kerry hurl Mayo, 100 miles hoping to see another weak county go where they hadn't gone before, went to Croke Park once to see Louth hurlers, but I'm not really a fan, huh?

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

since such a huge misunderstanding

I think you mean dissent from your view

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

]is otherwise inexplicable. Hence, no need to take his view seriously

If an Irish guy attended one bull-fight in Spain and came home saying it was barbaric he wouldn't be dismissed thus. Likewise, if ethical saw just one GAA game in his life, as a paying customer he has a perfectly valid view. It's a game, not a religion.

feargale

antoobrien wrote: »

ethical behaviour, boorish, wtf are you on? It's not chess it's a contact sport![\quote]
You are missing something again. ethical is the name of a previous poster. You should demand your money back for those speed-reading lessons.

antoobrien wrote: »

Considering neither of them have jobs that would include the spreading of muck, calling either of them a "muckdspreader" is the height of ignorance. [\quote]
Talk to ethical about that. They were his words.

antoobrien wrote: »

I think you'll find that the physical contact of a "howya" shoulder is not mutually exclusive with "sporting behaviour" in that those that are sporting do not go out to intentionally harm their competitors. [\quote]
As the fundamentalist said in defence of Khomeini, he didn'e intend to kill Rushdie, just to frighten him.

antoobrien wrote: »

I can't remember the exact Jack Yeats quote but it goes something like:
Rugby is a game for ruffians, played by gentlemen.
Soccer is a game for gentlemen, played by ruffians.
Gaelic is a game for ruffians played by ruffians.
Hurling is a game for gentlemen, played by gentlemen.} [\quote]
Good night.

antoobrien wrote: »

Apparently so did Jack Lynch and he'd have gotten away with far worse than anything we see on the pitch today.

And off the pitch too, no doubt. Those were the days!

feargale

mooonpie wrote: »

Just on the bolded point, you don't see it in rugby because when a sub comes on in rugby he's going to join the rest of his team on their side of the offside line.
In GAA when a sub comes on they're going to their patch of the pitch where they're going to try best the single opposition player also in that patch of the pitch ... or else they're the goal keeper

Tell me another sport where you see that immature "getting to know you " nonsense.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Pointless exercise, you're not giving respect when you're forced to shake hands. All it does if provide players to lay down a marker, for example what Suarez did last year.

People may argue that flash points are extremely rare, but if a pointless exercise can cause a flashpoint then it's should be done away with tbh.

There was lots of articles written last questioning the importance of the handshake, most of which were arguing against the routine. Can't be bothered to google them but they shouldn't be too hard to find.

antoobrien

feargale wrote: »

Tell me another sport where you see that immature "getting to know you " nonsense.

See it plenty in local rugby.

Realt Dearg Sec

feargale wrote: »

Boorish is the word I used.

intending what? So if I jostle you on the street you will respond with a friendly "howya" ?

That's me, I think otherwise, travelled to see Kerry hurl Mayo, 100 miles hoping to see another weak county go where they hadn't gone before, went to Croke Park once to see Louth hurlers, but I'm not really a fan, huh?

I think you mean dissent from your view

If an Irish guy attended one bull-fight in Spain and came home saying it was barbaric he wouldn't be dismissed thus. Likewise, if ethical saw just one GAA game in his life, as a paying customer he has a perfectly valid view. It's a game, not a religion.

First of all, boorish was the word you used, but I wasn't talking about you. Barbaric is the word "ethical" used, and that was who I was talking about.

Is "what would be appropriate to do to a complete stranger on the street" going to be your criteria for what should be acceptable in a sport? Applying your logic, a rugby tackle is "boorish" since it would be inappropriate to do it to someone in the street. Actually, for that matter, going up to a complete stranger in the street and shaking their hand for no reason is pretty inappropriate. Quite obviously, if you are playing a sport, you have made an implicit agreement to be a part of what goes on. If you can't take a jostle, then you really aren't going to like what comes later on in the game. Anyone playing the game knows this, so to say it isn't appropriate because you wouldn't do it to someone in the street is patent nonsense.

As for asking "intending what?"...seriously? Do I have to actually spell out that you would be giving an indication of your intention to play hard and with full intensity, that the opposite man can expect the game to be full throttle? Because if I have to explain that, then really there is no point talking at all.

Regarding your travels, good on you, keep it up. Please tell me that at the start of these matches you tell people around you that the lads jostling each other are being "boorish". I would love to see the reaction.

Regarding your last point, if an Irish guy went to one bull fight and called it barbaric without showing any understanding of the traditions underpinning it, its cultural significance in Spain, its artistic/aesthetic elements, then yes, he should be dismissed because he has demonstrated no real comprehension of it. It is just a game, and in that regard every opinion is valid, but I wouldn't argue that every opinion is equally valid. Just because I have an opinion on the banking collapse doesn't mean my opinion is worth the same as that of a university economist. In any case, I would hardly compare the killing of an animal with a shoulder before the whistle, would you?

mooonpie

feargale wrote: »

Tell me another sport where you see that immature "getting to know you " nonsense.

The only other sport I can think of that pairs up opposition players and puts them all over the pitch before the game even starts is aussie rules, and I wouldn't be shocked to hear the same stuff happens in that.

Every other team contact sport I can think of has some sort of offside line that players have to stay the correct side of before the game starts (soccer, rugby, american football, ice hockey) and for the more physical of those (rugby and american football) that offside line is between the 2 teams for the entire game. You simply don't get the opportunity to be stood beside your marker in one corner while everyone's attention is at the other end of the pitch.

And if we're talking about "boorish" behaviour off the ball, I'll comfortably say all the sports I've mentioned above have plenty examples of boorish behaviour. What nonsense happens in box before a corner is taken in soccer? How often do you see a player at the base of a ruck in rugby being held down just a little bit longer than necessary after play has moved on? How often do you see linemen in NFL do similar? And most people expect a fight in an ice hockey game.

And ya can add to that all the smack talk and the likes of standing on a lad's toes that goes on too. It's a part of all contact sports - if I can make you play worse, I've a better chance of being better than you and if I'm better than you, my team has a better chance of winning.

Having said that, I have no issue with the organised pre-game handshake. I think it's unnecessary but ultimately it's harmless. I'll still shake my opponents hand when we get to our patch of the field and wish him luck ... then I'll put my glove back on and for the next 60 minutes I'll try to outplay him and wreck his head any way I can ... until the final whistle goes and then I'll shake his hand again and either thank him for the game or congratulate him.

feargale

mooonpie wrote: »

The only other sport I can think of that pairs up opposition players and puts them all over the pitch before the game even starts is aussie rules, and I wouldn't be shocked to hear the same stuff happens in that. [\quote] Our boys tried it against them a few years ago and got their comeuppance. Did you ever see a big, growling dog running with its tail between its legs?

mooonpie wrote: »

And if we're talking about "boorish" behaviour off the ball, What nonsense happens in box before a corner is taken in soccer?

No point in looking at the ills of soccer while Blatter is around

mooonpie wrote: »

How often do you see a player at the base of a ruck in rugby being held down just a little bit longer than necessary after play has moved on? How often do you see linemen in NFL do similar? And most people expect a fight in an ice hockey game.

Things happen in the heat of the fray, and referees deal with them.

mooonpie wrote: »

Having said that, I have no issue with the organised pre-game handshake.

Followed by a hurley jab in the ribs before the ball is thrown in? Ugh. No, i'm against compulsory handshakes, curtsies or arrse embraces. If people want to shake hands, ok, but don't add hypocrisy to the mix.

feargale

Quote anto "calling Joey Boland, who got 620 points for his LC, or John Lee - a doctor "
anto seems to imply that these two stars engage in what I complain of. I don't know if they do, but anto is upholding a good Irish tradition which says if pillars of the community do it it's ok, e.g. tax evasion for decades.

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

I would hardly compare the killing of an animal with a shoulder before the whistle, would you?

I never did so. I've expressed no opinion on the merits of bull-fighting. Keep it simple please.

Realt Dearg Sec wrote: »

Regarding your travels, good on you, keep it up. Please tell me that at the start of these matches you tell people around you that the lads jostling each other are being "boorish". I would love to see the reaction.

I have a better idea. Next time you're at a match, if you see a guy with a hand-held loudspeaker shouting "baboon" during every other substitution, come over and say hello/shake hands, but ffs don't jostle me, at least not before the ball is thrown in.

Now i've made all my points and I'm outa here. I feel like a missionary in a very remote place, sitting in a boiling pot and trying to convert the cooks.

Realt Dearg Sec

feargale wrote: »

Now i've made all my points and I'm outa here. I feel like a missionary in a very remote place, sitting in a boiling pot and trying to convert the cooks.

Yes and you've acted with all the sense of moral and intellectual superiority that this comparison implies.

Regarding bull-fighting: you were the one who brought it up, so obviously you regard it as a valid comparison. Telling me to keep it simple, as though I were the one who raised this utter red-herring about bull-fighting and not you, is ridiculous.

Why do you shout baboon over a loud speaker during substitutions? Sounds more "boorish" than any of what you've been whining about on here to be honest.

antoobrien

feargale wrote: »

anto seems to imply that these two stars engage in what I complain of.

Yes both lads do it when it is required of them, and no they are not boorish louts, but actually two very approachable guys - like many of the people that you want to tar with slurs like the utter bs that you are coming out with.

feargale wrote: »

I don't know if they do, but anto is upholding a good Irish tradition which says if pillars of the community do it it's ok

Bulls**t and other less savoury words & concepts.

I objected to calling people muckspreaders for doing something that is, not only perfectly acceptable in the game, but WITHIN THE RULES OF THE GAME.


If one doesn't like that then one should take one's business to sports where there is no physical contact.

premierstone

feargale wrote: »

Now i've made all my points and I'm outa here.

We can but be gratefull for small mercies