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Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2013- Mod Warning Post #1
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I suppose the question should be asked, who is responsible for the planning of the fixtures? Is it up to the Cork and Limerick County Boards to decide where the game is played or is it/should it be the Munster Council?0
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I suppose the question should be asked, who is responsible for the planning of the fixtures? Is it up to the Cork and Limerick County Boards to decide where the game is played or is it/should it be the Munster Council?
Well they should all be involved, but responsibility lies with the Munster Council. In this scenario, there should be a clause whereby it is agreed that if the venue operates at a reduced capacity unable to hold the expected crowd then a the home and away agreement mean will be suspended and a neutral venue used for the final.
Of course, I would guarantee no such idea has ever even been raised. All the one now, the game is in Cork. Be hard to get tickets for but sure they won't be without support and will no doubt have a good following the next time out.0 -
Do they intend on finishing the town end bank in walsh park?0
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I cannot get my head around what reasoning (if any) underpins Derek McGrath's tactics and player selection and placement. Here we were playing Laois on our home pitch with a strongish wind behind us and we employ a sweeper (Tadhg de Búrca) behind our own half back line and a two-man (and frequently a one-man) full forward line. What was this about?
De Búrca got an ocean of free ball inside the Waterford 45 metre line but what was he supposed to do with it? There was little point hitting it long into the full forward line because time and again it came straight back, but with few other options this happened repeatedly.
Given that Laois only played with five forwards, I would have had de Búrca playing in his left half back position where he would have provided an added scoring threat (he is a fine long-distance ball striker) or been more constructive with his use of the ball.
To cover the area where de Búrca would normally be playing (left half back), Austin Gleeson - possibly our forward with greatest scoring potential - is brought back to occupy a position and play a role that is totally foreign to him, and from where he poses no scoring threat. His frustration and desperation were obvious with the two snatched second half shots which led to his substitution.
What role did McGrath envisage for Ryan Donnelly when he picked him? He has come to prominence as a goal-scoring danger man picking up ball around the goal and then using his strength and pace to get into scoring positions. Yet he spent most of his time out the field, again in a role that was foreign to him.
Replacing Donnelly with Seamus Prendergast made no sense at all. Shane Walsh had already done twice what he is very good at - scoring goals from the edge of the square. Yet the introduction of Prendergast meant that Walsh was displaced to the corner or further out the field.
Walsh and Prendergast are useful ball winners but both lack pace. In my view you can only afford to have one of them on the field at the same time. Furthermore, when they are on the field they should be located close to goal with a speedy forward always in close proximity to feed off passes or breaking ball. Pat Horgan got most of his points from play in the replay against Waterford by picking up breaking ball around the D in front of the large square and popping it over the bar. Last Saturday when high balls came into Shane Walsh he was almost always on his own apart from having two markers in close attention, one to knock the ball down and the other to clear it away.
At one stage in the first half last Saturday, Shane Walsh got the ball out near the corner flag and attempted to make his way in along the end line. There was no other Waterford player inside the 45 metre line with whom he could link up. More worryingly, there was no Waterford player busting a gut to get into the goal area to help out. And this is with Waterford playing with the wind?
McGrath's use of Colin Dunford to mark the Laois sweeper also made little sense. With his pace and close control, Dunford should have been flitting around into space or looking for passes, and then using his great strength i.e. running at defenders. It would have made more sense to me to use Jake Dillon in the sweeper-marking role (if there had to be one).
It seems to me that the key ingredient in McGrath's tactical approach is fear. His prime concern is to guard against perceived weaknesses rather than play to the players' strengths. We have players coming out of successful under-age teams being presented with this negativity and inflexibility and being asked to perform roles that are foreign to them and making no use of their capabilities. We should be building up their confidence rather than telling them that they are not capable of slugging it out, man for man, with other teams (including Laois).
Besides, McGrath's negative tactics have not prevented us from shipping several hidings already this year. Furthermore, Waterford are now totally predictable and easily targetted by other teams, as Cork showed in the replay. In any case, I believe that one of the key ingredients of a successful team is the ability of their forwards to play defensively i.e. stop the other team's defenders from hitting free ball. It is hard to do this when the other team has one (if not two) free defenders to pick up loose ball or take passes.
In terms of playing to our strengths, I think we should be employing both Fives brothers further out the field. If/when Noel Connors comes back we should place Paudie Prendergast in the other corner, move Shane Fives out to half back or midfield and move Darragh Fives into the half forward line where we desperately need more ball-winning ability.
And what's the story with Stephen Molumphy? He seemed to be back to full fitness when he came on as a second half sub in the Cork replay. He is a player that I would always have first in the team sheet for his work rate, ball winning ability and sheer cussedness. At first glance, in bringing on both Richie Foley and Jamie Nagle with five minutes to go, I thought that Derek McGrath was just making a token gesture. On reflection, was he sending out a message to Molumphy that he is not part of his plans? If that is the case, then my estimation of McGrath's managerial abilities sinks even lower.0 -
Agree totally with the majority of above, not sure about changing Darragh Fives to half forwards, the conversion of backs to forwards seldom work and to me a strong half back line is the foundation for any team. all of the above.
I have listened with interest to Derek's interviews on radio with interest over the last 48 hours. His talk has been negative, looking for positives, trying to justify his tactics.
For a start De Burca is an excellent intelligent hurler , it is absolutely no surprise to anyone, except it appears the management, that given a free roll he would hit "a lot of ball" but as we said, because of lack of option he just hit it up to field where it came right back at us.
From his interview on WLR this morning when questioned about the possibility of drawing Offaly, Derek went on about "others" trying to draw us into things and agendas. For God sake it was like listening to Davy all over again.
You can be respectful of Offaly by saying things like "they are a proud county with a great tradition, and over the years they have pulled many a surprise, yes they have had their problems this year, but the win over Antrim will give them a boost so anyone not respecting them and taking them for granted would be extremely foolish" That is showing respect not going on about what others are trying to do.
If anyone is undermining our team at the moment it is our Management team, they are showing a total lack of belief in our players, they are undermining the confidence of youngsters and are more focused on trying to defend against other teams strengths rather than attacking their weaknesses.
I believe in the panel of players we have at the moment, I believe it is an excellent mix of youth and experience, I believe if we form a proper games plan that focuses more on our strengths and less on opposition (that is not to ignore opposition but not to the detriment of out strengths) this team can go places, if not this year certainly over the next couple of years.
Our Management needs to wake up and get some confidence, and knock that almighty chip off their shoulder.
One final question, was that Jim Greene with the team last Saturday night, there is a rumour he is acting as adviser to the management team, can anyone verify this?0 -
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Yeah it was Jim Greene0
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Really " The Greener" is the man in the stands, o for **** sake, :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:
That is really poor.0 -
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Horseboxhead wrote: »Really " The Greener" is the man in the stands, o for **** sake, :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:
That is really poor.
I would have thought Greeners record would have spoken for itself, not everyones cuppa tea but he is the most decorated club manager in the county by a distance and has won minor and U21 Munster titles with Waterford
To be honest I would take him above a couple of McGraths current backroom staff without doubt
Judging by the reaction of some of the comments there must be a few lads here who have played on teams looked after by Greener. There are not many more Waterford men that Derek could turn to with a similar or better record than Greener, anyone from outside the county would hardly take it on in an unofficial capacity0 -
the man has the same knowledge of how the game should be played as a goldfish ,the biggest joke to ever get the job,get ridGiveitfong wrote: »I cannot get my head around what reasoning (if any) underpins Derek McGrath's tactics and player selection and placement. Here we were playing Laois on our home pitch with a strongish wind behind us and we employ a sweeper (Tadhg de Búrca) behind our own half back line and a two-man (and frequently a one-man) full forward line. What was this about?
De Búrca got an ocean of free ball inside the Waterford 45 metre line but what was he supposed to do with it? There was little point hitting it long into the full forward line because time and again it came straight back, but with few other options this happened repeatedly.
Given that Laois only played with five forwards, I would have had de Búrca playing in his left half back position where he would have provided an added scoring threat (he is a fine long-distance ball striker) or been more constructive with his use of the ball.
To cover the area where de Búrca would normally be playing (left half back), Austin Gleeson - possibly our forward with greatest scoring potential - is brought back to occupy a position and play a role that is totally foreign to him, and from where he poses no scoring threat. His frustration and desperation were obvious with the two snatched second half shots which led to his substitution.
What role did McGrath envisage for Ryan Donnelly when he picked him? He has come to prominence as a goal-scoring danger man picking up ball around the goal and then using his strength and pace to get into scoring positions. Yet he spent most of his time out the field, again in a role that was foreign to him.
Replacing Donnelly with Seamus Prendergast made no sense at all. Shane Walsh had already done twice what he is very good at - scoring goals from the edge of the square. Yet the introduction of Prendergast meant that Walsh was displaced to the corner or further out the field.
Walsh and Prendergast are useful ball winners but both lack pace. In my view you can only afford to have one of them on the field at the same time. Furthermore, when they are on the field they should be located close to goal with a speedy forward always in close proximity to feed off passes or breaking ball. Pat Horgan got most of his points from play in the replay against Waterford by picking up breaking ball around the D in front of the large square and popping it over the bar. Last Saturday when high balls came into Shane Walsh he was almost always on his own apart from having two markers in close attention, one to knock the ball down and the other to clear it away.
At one stage in the first half last Saturday, Shane Walsh got the ball out near the corner flag and attempted to make his way in along the end line. There was no other Waterford player inside the 45 metre line with whom he could link up. More worryingly, there was no Waterford player busting a gut to get into the goal area to help out. And this is with Waterford playing with the wind?
McGrath's use of Colin Dunford to mark the Laois sweeper also made little sense. With his pace and close control, Dunford should have been flitting around into space or looking for passes, and then using his great strength i.e. running at defenders. It would have made more sense to me to use Jake Dillon in the sweeper-marking role (if there had to be one).
It seems to me that the key ingredient in McGrath's tactical approach is fear. His prime concern is to guard against perceived weaknesses rather than play to the players' strengths. We have players coming out of successful under-age teams being presented with this negativity and inflexibility and being asked to perform roles that are foreign to them and making no use of their capabilities. We should be building up their confidence rather than telling them that they are not capable of slugging it out, man for man, with other teams (including Laois).
Besides, McGrath's negative tactics have not prevented us from shipping several hidings already this year. Furthermore, Waterford are now totally predictable and easily targetted by other teams, as Cork showed in the replay. In any case, I believe that one of the key ingredients of a successful team is the ability of their forwards to play defensively i.e. stop the other team's defenders from hitting free ball. It is hard to do this when the other team has one (if not two) free defenders to pick up loose ball or take passes.
@ In terms of playing to our strengths, I think we should be employing both Fives brothers further out the field. If/when Noel Connors comes back we should place Paudie Prendergast in the other corner, move Shane Fives out to half back or midfield and move Darragh Fives into the half forward line where we desperately need more ball-winning ability.
And what's the story with Stephen Molumphy? He seemed to be back to full fitness when he came on as a second half sub in the Cork replay. He is a player that I would always have first in the team sheet for his work rate, ball winning ability and sheer cussedness. At first glance, in bringing on both Richie Foley and Jamie Nagle with five minutes to go, I thought that Derek McGrath was just making a token gesture. On reflection, was he sending out a message to Molumphy that he is not part of his plans? If that is the case, then my estimation of McGrath's managerial abilities sinks even lower.0 -
I'd imagine there'll be a lot of fellas around hear eating humble pie at some stage. Give the manager and team the full backing, have some faith and stop all this slating.0
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wont be gettin the knife and fork out anytime soon ,,,,,think it all started with i have a three year plan ,ffs give it a break ,and when the next fella comes in he will have a three year plan,,soon it will be 2065 and still 2 All IrelandsHamstrings59 wrote: »I'd imagine there'll be a lot of fellas around hear eating humble pie at some stage. Give the manager and team the full backing, have some faith and stop all this slating.0 -
give him a chance no problem,but the tactics are a disaster lets be honest.aimless ball hit in time and time again on saturday just because thats the tactic.whats wrong with 15 on 15 we have forwards like dunford dillion gleeson who would destroy most one on one,trust me its not going to work.0
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Hamstrings59 wrote: »I'd imagine there'll be a lot of fellas around hear eating humble pie at some stage. Give the manager and team the full backing, have some faith and stop all this slating.
I'll probably die of starvation first. He'll get the rest of the year to try and turn it around, and hopefully he does. He'll need to do something pretty special at this stage to pull it out of the fire though... Or something simple like play an orthodox approach, let the lads go man for man and show what they can do.0 -
well he has had Waterford Crystal,League,numerous challenges,the Munster Championship ,,The Qualifiers ,,,Give him a chance you say ,,,,,wtfgive him a chance no problem,but the tactics are a disaster lets be honest.aimless ball hit in time and time again on saturday just because thats the tactic.whats wrong with 15 on 15 we have forwards like dunford dillion gleeson who would destroy most one on one,trust me its not going to work.0 -
Bad injury to Shane Bennett tonight at a minor club game. Touch and go if he's back for the Munster final. Hand injury apparently.0
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The Irish Times today has an unintentionally amusing interview with Wexford hurler Jack Guiney. The author of the article, Gavin Comiskey, obviously used predictive text when writing it but forgot to check over what actually came out before submitting it for publication.
Jack Guiney himself becomes Jack "Guinea". Kilkenny's Cillian Buckley becomes "Ceiling" Buckley. Galway's Iarla Tannian becomes "Early Tannin". Clare's Podge Collins becomes "Dodge" Collins.
But the best of them all is Dublin's Alan McCrabbe who becomes Alan "Microbe". I know he is small in stature but that is ridiculous!
I guess in these straitened times newspapers can't afford to employ sub-editors anymore. However, when I checked just now, the on-line version of the article had been suitably corrected. I imagine there was some ribbing at training tonight in the respective camps.0 -
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Hamstrings59 wrote: »I'd imagine there'll be a lot of fellas around hear eating humble pie at some stage. Give the manager and team the full backing, have some faith and stop all this slating.
The vast majority of people on here are not idiots. The concerns are genuine. The managers philosophy is to implement a system for this Waterford team and insists that we need to give time for these players to adjust to this system. A lot of young players coming through need nurturing and development of their skills etc. To hell with systems the priority should be to concentrate on developing the players first, let the system come after. This system is doing nothing for the players individual development.
Yes it is important to have a game plan to counteract other teams and try make us hard to beat, but its obvious that so many of these players are really underperforming. Justin McCarthy's philosophy was 'hurling is a simple game, why are we try to over-complicate it?'. Fair enough, Justin had some incredibly gifted individuals at his disposal and McGrath mightend have the same quality but players need to be able to express themselves, particularly younger players. Someone here last week said they went to a training session recently and stated he noticed there was little or no time given to players practicing pucking the ball over the bar. Given the amount of wides weve been getting in games this year is that not be one of the first things we should be at? Thats a pretty simple observation I know but reading the article about the lengths mcgrath went to counteract Laois's sweepeer system he obviously has a strong eye for detail but cant help think hes completely carried away with tactics and missing the basics.
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The vast majority of people on here are not idiots. The concerns are genuine. The managers philosophy is to implement a system for this Waterford team and insists that we need to give time for these players to adjust to this system. A lot of young players coming through need nurturing and development of their skills etc. To hell with systems the priority should be to concentrate on developing the players first, let the system come after. This system is doing nothing for the players individual development.
Yes it is important to have a game plan to counteract other teams and try make us hard to beat, but its obvious that so many of these players are really underperforming. Justin McCarthy's philosophy was 'hurling is a simple game, why are we try to over-complicate it?'. Fair enough, Justin had some incredibly gifted individuals at his disposal and McGrath mightend have the same quality but players need to be able to express themselves, particularly younger players. Someone here last week said they went to a training session recently and stated he noticed there was little or no time given to players practicing pucking the ball over the bar. Given the amount of wides weve been getting in games this year is that not be one of the first things we should be at? Thats a pretty simple observation I know but reading the article about the lengths mcgrath went to counteract Laois's sweepeer system he obviously has a strong eye for detail but cant help think hes completely carried away with tactics and missing the basics.
If I'm not mistaken he said in the same article that the wides tally isn't a concern for him. For me thats been our biggest problem for the last few years regardless of the manager or the system, we dominated general play against Kilkenny and Clare in the first half of those championship games last year but couldn't buy a score, we had far too many wides against Cork in both games this year and it cost us the first game.
I'm always hearing how McGrath borrows alot form other sports, but you can't win a hurling match 1-0!0 -
If I'm not mistaken he said in the same article that the wides tally isn't a concern for him. For me thats been our biggest problem for the last few years regardless of the manager or the system, we dominated general play against Kilkenny and Clare in the first half of those championship games last year but couldn't buy a score, we had far too many wides against Cork in both games this year and it cost us the first game.
I'm always hearing how McGrath borrows alot form other sports, but you can't win a hurling match 1-0!
But you CAN win a Gaelic football 1-0! That was the score (one point to nothing) when Abbeyside beat Tramore in the 1959 county minor football final (played, if memory serves me, in dreadful conditions in Walsh Park in January 1960). Austin Cashin, older brother of Nicky, scored the point.0 -
Personally i love all this talk of a sweeper system as if it is something new to the game developed by this new bread of coach who talks about the modern game and revolutionsing the game of hurling - however I remember Shiner Ahearne amongst many others being employed as a sweeper on many an occasion for Waterford back in the late 80's especially if playing into a strong breeze, so it is nothing new.
Hurling is a unique sport in that unlike soccer football or rugby - the ball (sliothar of course) travels the length of the field at incredible speed on regular occasions, there is no such thing as offside, pitches are far bigger than rugby or soccer, players regularly score for distances of 60 meters or more, and probably 65% to 75% of frees on average from all over the field are punished with scores. For these reasons man to man marking will always be the foundation of hurling. Yes you will always get the odd team trying the sweeper, the roving full forward or the third midfielder to outfox opposition on occasion but to do it with any sort of regularity is predictable and asking for trouble
Our repeated attempts at playing a two man full forward line is predictable and naive - it does not take a genius to spot this and while management keeps talking about developing a game plan, every other manager is watching this and exposing brutally the weakness in it. One would like to think last Saturday's game plan was specifically to counteract the Laois sweeper system, but anyone that has witnessed crushing defeats in to Clare, Kilkenny and Cork know different.
I remain hopeful, but extremely doubtful that Management will change its' viewpoint - they appear too stubborn and set in their ways determined to prove everyone else wrong at whatever cost. They do not have to make massive changes to the game plan, there are certain things work well, like the way Brick and Moran regularly interchange especially when thy try and release Moran on one of his surging runs from deep, but we must vary it, we need to have more pressure applied in the full forward line, and to give our backs viable targets when the do break clear. We need to open the pitch and utilize the space to our strengths - the point I am making is that I believe Derek McGrath and Frank Flannery have the ability to deliver varied and effective game plans, but have they the mind to admit mistakes and learn form them - this remains to be seen.
On the point of Greener's involvement being that i was the one who raised the question originally - I think it is a huge step backwards - no disrespect to Jim and his achievements - but Derek McGrath was appointed for his achievements as a young dynamic coach with new fresh ideas - to feel that already after only six months in the job he has reverted to Jim as an advisor is poor look out. I remember Greener criticizing Justin for his failure to win more with such a tantalized team between 2002 to 2006 while at the same time he delivered one Munster Club title with a Mount Sion team that had something like 7 current senior county hurlers or which 6 were immediate starters, at least 3 / 4 more who were playing Intermediate with the County some of whom had also been on the county senior panel between 1998 and 2000. Added to this he had several young players who had represented the county at minor and U-21 level and he spoke about underachieving.0 -
On the point of Greener's involvement being that i was the one who raised the question originally - I think it is a huge step backwards - no disrespect to Jim and his achievements - but Derek McGrath was appointed for his achievements as a young dynamic coach with new fresh ideas - to feel that already after only six months in the job he has reverted to Jim as an advisor is poor look out. I remember Greener criticizing Justin for his failure to win more with such a tantalized team between 2002 to 2006 while at the same time he delivered one Munster Club title with a Mount Sion team that had something like 7 current senior county hurlers or which 6 were immediate starters, at least 3 / 4 more who were playing Intermediate with the County some of whom had also been on the county senior panel between 1998 and 2000. Added to this he had several young players who had represented the county at minor and U-21 level and he spoke about underachieving.
I would accept your viewpoint on Greener and the Dunloy defeat would be a point of reference for sure but the club championship at the time was much more competitive than it is now, the Toom, Newtown, Adare and Sixmilebridge teams of that era would win the current Munster championship without much bother at present
I am not sure how it could be considered a backwards step, yes Derek was appointed based on the fact he is a young and dynamic (questionable) but that doesn't for a minute suggest that he should not seek an external opinion and I can't see how that could be in anyway be perceived as a backwards step. Given the close relationship Davy has with Cyril Farrell I would be surprised if in his early days he did not seek out his advise, it is common knowledge he did when manager of LIT. If you take Greeners experience into account I would see it as a positive, Derek can listen to his opinion and take it or leave it, without Derek going to another member of his generation (35 - 45) with similar management experience I don't see a lot of candidates within the county to take on this role.
Truth be told if Greener was from any other club in the county I suspect he would have been given a shot at managing the senior team.0 -
For the record, my reservations about Greener's involvement have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with club allegiances, I could not care less what club he was involved with.
We all know Davy relied on Cyril as an adviser and we experienced first hand some of the results that Davy achieved for our county possibly on the back of this advice, in my opinion the two most humiliating defeats that I have ever witnessed - The All Ireland V Kilkenny 2008 and the Munster Final V Tipp 2011 - This says a lot considering I have been following Waterford since before the 1982 and 1983 Munster Finals against Cork
Simple fact is Greener was not given the job for whatever reason, he was not on any panel that was proposed for the job, Derek was supremely confident in his own ability, sufficiently so to allow his name forward for the job, with no mention of Jim as an adviser, yet here we are now. Being frank about it indications are that his involvement is a lot more than an external opinion, but that being said, my gripe lays firmly with Derek and his immediate management team, not Greener.
Let me state quite clearly, I have absolutely no agenda against Greener, he is a really nice fella, an outstanding hurler for Waterford and Mount Sion, but while he has had success as a manager, it was limited - especially considering the depth of talent he had at his disposal. Setting aside the Dunloy result as this can happen on any given day, he had a club team that included, Tony Browne, Ken, Eoin & Roy McGrath, Eoin Kelly, Brian Flannery, Brian Greene, Michael White, Anthony Kirwan all in their prime. Added to this he had youngsters like Ian O'Regan, Kenny Stafford and Sean Ryan, and had experienced campaigners like John Cleere , Pauric Fanning and Jamie O'Meara, backed up by the massive tradition that is Mount Sion - sorry now but one Munster Championship is a poor return for that calibre of team. And as Jim always says himself, as he did about Justin, you measure success against the best and what is at your disposal.
This I feel is more the reason he never got a shot at the Waterford Senior Team rather than his club affiliation. Then again I was never involved in selecting a Waterford Manager so maybe you are right.0 -
For the record, my reservations about Greener's involvement have absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with club allegiances, I could not care less what club he was involved with.
Simple fact is Greener was not given the job for whatever reason, he was not on any panel that was proposed for the job, Derek was supremely confident in his own ability, sufficiently so to allow his name forward for the job, with no mention of Jim as an adviser, yet here we are now. Being frank about it indications are that his involvement is a lot more than an external opinion, but that being said, my gripe lays firmly with Derek and his immediate management team, not Greener.
Let me state quite clearly, I have absolutely no agenda against Greener, he is a really nice fella, an outstanding hurler for Waterford and Mount Sion, but while he has had success as a manager, it was limited - especially considering the depth of talent he had at his disposal. Setting aside the Dunloy result as this can happen on any given day, he had a club team that included, Tony Browne, Ken, Eoin & Roy McGrath, Eoin Kelly, Brian Flannery, Brian Greene, Michael White, Anthony Kirwan all in their prime. Added to this he had youngsters like Ian O'Regan, Kenny Stafford and Sean Ryan, and had experienced campaigners like John Cleere , Pauric Fanning and Jamie O'Meara, backed up by the massive tradition that is Mount Sion - sorry now but one Munster Championship is a poor return for that calibre of team. And as Jim always says himself, as he did about Justin, you measure success against the best and what is at your disposal.
This I feel is more the reason he never got a shot at the Waterford Senior Team rather than his club affiliation. Then again I was never involved in selecting a Waterford Manager so maybe you are right.
Don't know how you could include pauric fanning as a quality hurler. In fairness to Jim Greene he did a good job with Carlow but that Mount Sion team definetly underachieved. Don't think it really matters who the advisor is. More important is what he is telling McGrath. If Jim Greene is telling Derek McGrath to go play 15 v 15 and forget about the stupid gameplan we are persisting with at present then his appointment as advisor is no bad thing. The next outing will tell us a lot.0 -
Deise Hurler wrote: »Don't know how you could include pauric fanning as a quality hurler. In fairness to Jim Greene he did a good job with Carlow but that Mount Sion team definetly underachieved. Don't think it really matters who the advisor is. More important is what he is telling McGrath. If Jim Greene is telling Derek McGrath to go play 15 v 15 and forget about the stupid gameplan we are persisting with at present then his appointment as advisor is no bad thing. The next outing will tell us a lot.
In fairness to Pauric Fanning he was a fine hurler especially at club level until suffering a bad leg break, and the point being was he was one of many providing a valuable level of experience to a club team.
Agree also re advice being offered, what worries my is that Greener was there last Saturday, and was at the Second Cork Match, not sure about the first Cork Match - did he agree with running the same game plan that went so badly wrong against Cork second time out , especially have seen it collapse against Clare and Kilkenny?
If Greener can make the management see sense after last Saturday night then he will be alright with me -0 -
Giveitfong wrote: »But you CAN win a Gaelic football 1-0! That was the score (one point to nothing) when Abbeyside beat Tramore in the 1959 county minor football final (played, if memory serves me, in dreadful conditions in Walsh Park in January 1960). Austin Cashin, older brother of Nicky, scored the point.
It was played on the Saturday before Christmas 1959. Click on this link and go to page 2 under "Abbeyside hold out in defensive game":0 -
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I have read many comments made by posters relating to the system that Derek is currently working to and I agree with the majority. I simply believe the current approach is over reliant on tactics
There appears to be too much emphasis on what we are not good at and not enough emphasis at what we are good at
This may not be the case but it is not evident that we are playing to our strengths and are more concerned about our weaknesses
The only positive tactic that I see is encouraging Moran to solo at the heart of the oppositions defense
Does the management team actually know what our strengths are?
It was obvious to everyone that Ken was dominant in the air in the half back line, that Dan could get himself in positions to take goals chances, Molumphy would win dirty ball, that Seamus would win Puck outs, Eoin Murphy was a good man marker and that Kelly could hit long range points
What are Jake Dillons, Jamie Barron, Darragh fives, Paudie Penders, Maurice, or Austins strengths? will we ever find out given they all seem to just have a job in the system that they must stick to or get the curly finger.
I am not saying we shouldn't try counter other teams but until we start playing to our strengths we are at nothing, as the current crop of underage players begin to be integrated into the senior panel we want them to come on board and thinking once they play to their potential no one will beat them and not join the panel to told they must start by being part of a system to stop the opposition.0
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