Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2013- Mod Warning Post #1

hardybuck

dzilla wrote: »

Yeah I totally agree with that, but from a totally selfish Waterford point of few for the money spinning aspect I wouldn't be fussed about the cork travelling support. Are the televised revenues distributed to the competing teams do you know? Or is it centralized to head office

I'm not sure, but I think that the host venue takes a fair wedge of it, hence Waterford losing out on a source of income every year.

PTH2009

It would be weird going to a championship game in Walsh Park. There are not really that many food and drink facilties around the stadium and a lot of die hard supporters mite lose out on tickets because of the low capacity. Id imagine tickets would go on sale from Clubs rather than ticketmaster or tickets.ie

Anyway it would be good for the city if we got home advantage.

The championship structure is different next year. Only 2 of the soft teams eg loais, Westmeath, Antrim, Carlow etc will be in the round 1 draw.

Antrim, Carlow, Loais, Westmeath and London will play off in a round robin basis in the leinster championship and the first 2 teams will qulify for the Leinster Quarter Finals and the other 3 teams will exit the championship.

The 3 leinster quarter finalists, 2 Leinster Semi Finalists, the losing Munster quarter finalist and the 2 Munster quarter finalists. (8 teams) will go into the All Ireland Qulifers Round 1.

The draw will be done the following way

Bowl 1- 3x Leinster Teams and 1x Leinster Qulifer (or team beaten by them)

Bowl 2- 3x Munster teams and 1x Leinster Qulifer (or team beaten by them)

Round 1 - 4 games ,4 winners

Round 2- 4 Winners from Round 1, 2 games 2 winners

QF- 2 winners from Round 2 vs 2 Prov Losing teams

SF- 2 QF winners vs 2 Prov Winners

so getting to a munster/leinster final would be huge for any team

dzilla

Yeah thats true, but on the other side of that we have only brought
circa

6k to the Clare game last year..
3 -4 k to the Offaly game
the capacity for the KK game double header was 17k so we would have only brought 5 -7k (at the most to that)

Like some people would ultimately miss out, but would they have travelled if the game was in Thurles anyway?

1club1county

Great performance by Passage watched the deferred coverage on TG4. Killian Fitzgerald got 2 great scores his 2nd was top drawer he certainly deserves his nomination for player of the year. Eddie Lynch pulled off 3 brilliant saves and what I really liked about him is he stands up to face the shot none of this early diving, I must say Peter Queally has instilled a never say die attitude in this Passage team

hardybuck

dzilla wrote: »

Yeah thats true, but on the other side of that we have only brought
circa

6k to the Clare game last year..
3 -4 k to the Offaly game
the capacity for the KK game double header was 17k so we would have only brought 5 -7k (at the most to that)

Like some people would ultimately miss out, but would they have travelled if the game was in Thurles anyway?

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned Fraher Field yet!

premierstone

Mountainlad wrote: »

In fairness Ardmore lost Declan Prender at the start of the game and still bossed the Cork champs for a long time. Without Connors and in Limerick I didn't think Passage would stay with Na Piarsaigh but they did. And De La Salle should have put Ballyporeen away the first day.

All very valid points and besides the fact that 5 games is a redicilously small sample size that reveals very little, another factor that has to be allowed for is the disparagy and inconsistency from county to county within Munster regarding the grading of clubs.

On the issue of Walsh Park, another factor that must be taken into consideration is that anyone who has a season ticket is guaranteed a ticket for that game, and as Cork were AI finalists last year you can be guarnateed they will have a high number of season ticket holders.

I think alot of people here, and to be fair the Waterford County Board have probably allowed the misconception to grow, are very much deluded by how much money is at stake here, once the Munster Council, Gardai, security etc etc all get their cut oh and Cork, the final return to the Waterford County Board isn't as significant as is made out.

1club1county

Great performance by Passage watched the deferred coverage on TG4. Killian Fitzgerald got 2 great scores his 2nd was top drawer he certainly deserves his nomination for player of the year. Eddie Lynch pulled off 3 brilliant saves and what I really liked about him is he stands up to face the shot none of this early diving, I must say Peter Queally has instilled a never say die attitude in this Passage team

hardybuck

premierstone wrote: »

All very valid points and besides the fact that 5 games is a redicilously small sample size that reveals very little, another factor that has to be allowed for is the disparagy and inconsistency from county to county within Munster regarding the grading of clubs.

I think that we've looked at this a few times, and most years we don't get any wins at all at intermediate or junior level in hurling and football.

We also have a separate issue of some huge hammerings in the senior championships, and the presence of a number of the larger senior clubs' second teams in the intermediate championships which isn't ideal.

KevIRL

PTH2009 wrote: »

It would be weird going to a championship game in Walsh Park.

In the very recent past I can remember seeing us play Galway, Antrim, and Dublin all in championship games there. Granted all were qualifiers and not Munster Championship but games in Walsh Park nonetheless.

Most memorable Munster Championship game I attended there (for the wrong reasons) was v Kerry in 1993

dzilla

KevIRL wrote: »

In the very recent past I can remember seeing us play Galway, Antrim, and Dublin all in championship games there. Granted all were qualifiers and not Munster Championship but games in Walsh Park nonetheless.

Most memorable Munster Championship game I attended there (for the wrong reasons) was v Kerry in 1993

Galway in 2006 in the qualifiers was a great game iirc.

I don't think people are deluded, its not going to wipe waterfords debt out overnight, county board is just tryin to tap into another revenue stream, i would imagine they have their maths done on this before submitting the proposal, im sure they have learned their cashflow and forecasting problems from that Jedward gig in Dungarvan.

Straight Talker

I would love to see Cork enter a home and away agreement with Waterford because there is the potential for a fairly lively bus journey from Youghal to Walsh Park or Pairc Ui Chaoimh!We all know that the old dump by the Lee is only just about able to host championship matches but would Walsh Park pass the health and safety regulations?Because i would be of the view that it's a venue that could do with a revampment before it would in a position to host Munster championship matches.

dzilla

Grassy terraces have been paved... but yes probably would relistically need another 5k seats

deiseach

dzilla wrote: »

Grassy terraces have been paved... but yes probably would relistically need another 5k seats

Does Walsh Park now have stepped terraces, or is it just a slope?

dzilla

deiseach wrote: »

Does Walsh Park now have stepped terraces, or is it just a slope?

I was at the minor semi final a couple of weeks back and it looked to be sloped terrace.... doubt they have stepped it... that would be a massive job

deiseach

dzilla wrote: »

I was at the minor semi final a couple of weeks back and it looked to be sloped terrace.... doubt they have stepped it... that would be a massive job

Thanks, that's how it looked from the few photos I've seen. I'd say the Munster Council will find it easier than falling down a slope to turn their noses up at this, which would be a pity.

Deise_2012

Would Tom Kenny's club Grenagh be strong? Playing Ballysaggart in Fraher field sunday, after seeing Stephen Bennett's display last sunday I'd have to put my money on saggart

deisedude

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Would Tom Kenny's club Grenagh be strong? Playing Ballysaggart in Fraher field sunday, after seeing Stephen Bennett's display last sunday I'd have to put my money on saggart

Just Tom Kenny from what I've heard

thinkstoomuch1

deisedude wrote: »

Just Tom Kenny from what I've heard

Well organised,and great heart,and won't roll over,and dripsey,blarney(up the road)chareville have done well in recent years so they will see they have every chance,but,id love them to win,but cant see it.

They dont have real scoring power,sean bourke is a cork minor possibly but not proflic.Kenny expierence will get him through but is not going to bag one ten etc,where any one of the bennetts could.

Colm o neill is a good hardworking midfielder.One big plus is johnny keane their coach has success at club ,and munster and won intermediates titles as coach with Cork ,he has their great gift as a manager of getting every last inch out of any team he coached,and inspires hes teams to be better than they actually are,full of belief.A fine club coach who knows club hurling particulary at this level inside out.


They will be formiddable if its low scoring but you would imagine that ballysaggart with the bennetts and home advantage should win.
A lot of grenagh lads are doubling up as footballers and are in the knockout of the intermediate championship in cork.

Cake Man

Good result there the other day with Blackwater hammering Nenagh CBS 3-21 to 4-9 in the Harty, I think that it gives them a slim chance to get out of their group and they have Rochestown in their next (last I believe) game. Although looks like Midleton will pip them to second place, with Dungarvan topping the group.

Dungarvan doing well themselves winning 3 out of 3. They'll take beating so hopefully will go far.

DLS face a make or break game against Bandon HS next Weds, the winner going through.

Best of luck to all involved.

thinkstoomuch1

Cake Man wrote: »

Good result there the other day with Blackwater hammering Nenagh CBS 3-21 to 4-9 in the Harty, I think that it gives them a slim chance to get out of their group and they have Rochestown in their next (last I believe) game. Although looks like Midleton will pip them to second place, with Dungarvan topping the group.

Dungarvan doing well themselves winning 3 out of 3. They'll take beating so hopefully will go far.

DLS face a make or break game against Bandon HS next Weds, the winner going through.

Best of luck to all involved.

How did shane o brien,cork lad play at corner back?

Im suprised blackwater did not perform better ,i would have expected more.


They could find rochestown tricky engough next week ,a lot of douglas and blackrock lads like mark dolan,aron ward,niall cashman and daniel meaney ,good hurlers.


Dolan and ward are on their day able to score.They had a good win last week over nenagh also,and in the Corn u Mhuiri,in the football they beat a much rated Facthnas ,tuesday with a lot of the hurlers playing,so confidence is high.

Bandon have been a real suprise and a joy to watch.I saw them twice,and against flannans they were sublime.

Dara sweeney full back,chris o leary and murt kenneally in the half back line,with Michael cahalane and Trevor horgan,dual cork minors last year and great talents,cahalane in particular a serious threat up front.

Eoin reilly corner forward,savage pace,if its dry.David healy and jerry o neill(possibly cork minor)a very strong midfield.

Their full of confidence,be an interesting game.

Giveitfong

Just thinking about the likely makeup of the Waterford senior squad for next year.


Of the 15 who started against Kilkenny in this year’s qualifier I would expect all to be retained (assuming Seamus Prendergast wishes to continue). I would also expect Pauric and Philip Mahony, Stephen Daniels, Stephen Molumphy, Brian O’Halloran and Gavin O’Brien, all of whom were not available for that game, to be on board. We have also heard that Stephen Bennett, Austin Gleeson, Stephen Roche,Tadhg Bourke and Shane McNulty have been called up.


Of the named subs for the Kilkenny game, the only ones I would definitely expect to be in the squad are Ray Barry, Paudie Prendergast and Donie Breathnach. I would expect Seanie Barry to replace Iggy O’Regan as sub goalie. Shane Walsh might get back in if he can recover full fitness. The others are Martin O’Neill, Barry Coughlan, Eddie Barrett, Tony Browne, Dean Twomey and Mark Wyse.


On the basis of his county final performance Wayne Hutchinson should be in the panel, but I presume this is unlikely. David O’Sullivan also impressed in that game. Killian Fitzgerald (who was in the extended panel last year) also deserves to be tried out.


What is the story with Eoin Madigan? Before his recent injury woes he looked like a great prospect, especially for the full forward position. As a De La Salle man, I’m sure Derek McGrath will be fully aware of how things are with him. Kieran Power also deserves a look based on his performances at colleges and minor level last year and under-21 this year. Should Patrick Hurney get a run based on his scoring exploits for Abbeyside? Is there any chance that Ardmore’s Seamus Keating would be available?


So how about this for a basic squad make-up for 2014: Stephen O’Keeffe, Seanie Barry, Shane Fives, Liam Lawlor, Noel Connors, Stephen Daniels, Jamie Nagle, Philip Mahony, Brick Walsh, Darragh Fives, Shane McNulty, Tadhg Bourke, Kevin Moran, Richie Foley, Shane O’Sullivan, Stephen Molumphy, Gavin O’Brien, Paudie Prendergast, Ray Barry, Jake Dillon, Austin Gleeson, Seamus Prendergast, Pauric Mahony, Brian O’Halloran, Brian O’Sullivan, Maurice Shanahan, Stephen Bennett, Jamie Barron, Donie Breathnach, Stephen Roche.


That’s 30 players, all of them of good calibre and most of them of high calibre. And that excludes Shane Walsh, Wayne Hutchinson, David O’Sullivan, Killian Fitzgerald, Eoin Madigan, Kieran Power, and Patrick Hurney. This gives an idea of the depth of hurling talent which is now emerging within the county. The big challenge for Derek McGrath will be to develop a style of play and combination of players which will work to best effect. If he can do this then there is surely an All-Ireland in this squad.


I also expect the likes of Shane Bennett, Tom Devine, DJ Foran, Patrick Curran and Cormac Curran from this year’s minor team to be pushing for senior places in a couple of years time. It’s not so long ago that Waterford senior teams used to have maybe ten players up to top intercounty standard, with a tail of mediocre players and no subs. How times have changed! Can you imagine the selection problem facing the county selectors in three years time!

Horseboxhead

Barry coughlan is the most improved hurler in the county by a mile, he should be the starting full back, no question, big,strong aggressive, great hurler, and he is now hurling with that spark/chip that all the great full backs had, very mobile, and attacks the ball, Lawlor and fair play to him he keeps getting away with it, but bricks game suffers from having to cover for his lack of pace all the time, coughlan is the man, Hard to disagree with alot of the panel picked above, i would also say Mcnulty from de la salle is hugely improved, but an outside bet for a starting place midfield for waterford this year has to be Power from Clonea/ Kilrossanty. Big Strong, Very Agressive ballwinner, Looks like a clone of Ollie baker in terms of his ball winning, a better hurler than is given credit for, and this might be seen as a negative, but a clever hurler knits the game togeter well, and i do like the fact that he hurls on the edge of madness/Agression, i think six months training at top level and you could see a major piece in the jigsaw there, Love the look of tadgh burke, at every level ive seen him looks as if he was better than everyone on the field, could play anywhere full back, half back, Midfield, half/centre forward, or full forward and excel, but i think he needs to give serious consideration to where his best position is, maybe he does not know , as when i've seen him its been all the above.
Is Tony not retired?, i Can't see after seeing the co Championship how he would have anything to offer playing wise, just looked faded this year, and its to be expected Great man, but in danger of turning into your collage friend that comes to stay and stay and stay and the friendship gets soured.
Anyway i hope that the level of expectation/Hope will be matched by the effort from the players, and will be managed accordingly, also i hope that Derek and his backroom are not targeted by the usual club/county divide issues that spring up if we dont' win an all ireland every day we go out, and i hope we do win an all ireland as otherwise why bother, but if we play the game with good style, and are represented properly by the players and management, and we see progree being made, than i'll be happy[for this year].
Target should be in year two/ three at least a munster and to be considered serious contenders for the major,or outright win it, that should be the goal from this county at this present time, and we'll all do it together , thanks micheal ryan for what you did, i think safe pair of hands is the best way to put it, but even i thought we were at capacity constraint and would not improve[just an opinion], but done now and over, so lets get on with it, and our first task is hitting on the right panel , over to you Derek.
Plus i have a question- where can you get match reports / team sheets for the collage [WIT,CIT,UCC ECT] ,on at the moment ?, Specially the freshers i want to see how our boys are doing.

robopaddy

Deise_2012 wrote: »

Would Tom Kenny's club Grenagh be strong? Playing Ballysaggart in Fraher field sunday, after seeing Stephen Bennett's display last sunday I'd have to put my money on saggart

Cork junior champs usually much stronger than waterford

deiseach

Is Shane Walsh that crocked that we can't be confident of having him available in 2014?

Giveitfong

Horseboxhead wrote: »

Love the look of tadgh burke, at every level ive seen him looks as if he was better than everyone on the field, could play anywhere full back, half back, Midfield, half/centre forward, or full forward and excel, but i think he needs to give serious consideration to where his best position is, maybe he does not know , as when i've seen him its been all the above.

I think Tadhg Bourke could become the victim of his own versatility, in that he could forever be used to plug gaps rather than establishing a position of his own. In the 2012 All-Ireland Colleges quarter final, Dungarvan Colleges made a major mistake in moving him to the full back line to keep tabs on Kilkenny CBS's main danger man. You should never use your best player in a negative role like this. Although he did his job, he was sorely missed out the field on a day the Dungarvan team was very flat. When he was finally moved to midfield with ten minutes to go he took over the game, but it was too late to save it. I believe that decision by the selectors cost Dungarvan an All-Ireland title.

Earlier this year, in the Under-21 tournament game against Tipperary in Carrick, Bourke started brilliantly at wing back but was moved to full back where Stephen O'Keeffe was being destroyed by the Tipperary full forward. He sorted that problem, but at the expense of being removed from the main centre of the action. Ironically, Shane McNulty was moved out from the corner in place of Bourke, and proceeded to give one of the most awesome individual performances I saw anywhere this year.

Given the oversupply of top-class half backs available at the moment, I would like to see both Bourke and Darragh Fives being tried out in the half forward line. Given their hurling skill and versatility I think they would make a go of it, and good forwards are always harder to find that good backs.

I haven't seen much of Barry Coughlan in the last 12 months, but what I have seen of him has impressed me. He came on as a sub in the senior game in Carrick and did well, and also did well in a challenge against Limerick in Mallow. He was also good in the county final.

alllcounty

Horseboxhead wrote: »

an outside bet for a starting place midfield for waterford this year has to be Power from Clonea/ Kilrossanty. Big Strong, Very Agressive ballwinner, Looks like a clone of Ollie baker in terms of his ball winning, a better hurler than is given credit for, and this might be seen as a negative, but a clever hurler knits the game togeter well, and i do like the fact that he hurls on the edge of madness/Agression, i think six months training at top level and you could see a major piece in the jigsaw there.

Doesn't look like Kieran has got a call up, haven't read on here that he'll be looked at by the mgt team. He could develop alot if he was part of the set up this year, anyone else hear different.

cul beag

alllcounty wrote: »

Doesn't look like Kieran has got a call up, haven't read on here that he'll be looked at by the mgt team. He could develop alot if he was part of the set up this year, anyone else hear different.

He has been called into the squad by all accounts. Serious prospect with unbelievable wrist work with a fearless approach. I'm looking forward to seeing how he does in some of the challenge games.

Mountainlad

deiseach wrote: »

Is Shane Walsh that crocked that we can't be confident of having him available in 2014?

I believe so.

Podge Hurney really deserves another chance with the Waterford Senior team, has club form this year was incredible.

deisedude

How many is generally on the panel for Waterford Crystal games? I'm guessing its over 30 and gets whittled down?

cul beag

Mountainlad wrote: »

I believe so.

Podge Hurney really deserves another chance with the Waterford Senior team, has club form this year was incredible.

He has been tried before and didn't really cut it.Agree that he has had an incredible club championship but personally i don't think his speed of hurling will cut it at inter county level.